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Buffy Season Two


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#1

Naxus

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Posted Jan 17, 2004 @ 3:45 AM

From the S1 tread:

The Annoying One was just weird. Were they ever planning on actually doing something with him? Because as it is he seems like a totally pointless addition to both seasons 1 and 2. -- Swift Shy Guy

I think they were going to do a little more with him, but apparently realized they needed to kill him after seeing the rather noticeable growth spurt the actor went through between seasons. Of course, the damage was already done, so to speak, in "WSWB" and "SH," so I wonder if they were just making sure the character didn't (literally) grow any more. If so, that's kind of funny, because I saw a movie with him in it from a couple years ago (which would have been two or three years after Buffy, unless it was a delayed release or something) and he really doesn't look or sound much different.

For some reason that even I don't know anymore, I was really pissed at Spike when he killed him. I guess I liked the character. I think I mostly liked him in "Prophecy Girl," when he was all "Help me" and stuff. But I grew to love Spike. For a couple years at least. [OT]I actually had a similar reaction the Mayor -- I hated him at first, because I think my reaction was 'He's the big bad?! He's not a vampire!' But then came the love. Which, in the Mayor's case, continued all the way through S7.

Edited by Naxus, Jan 17, 2004 @ 3:49 AM.


#2

Brahmsian

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Posted Jan 17, 2004 @ 3:15 PM

I wonder how people would have reacted to the Annointed One if Danny Strong had played him rather than Andrew Ferchland. And how later season plotlines might have gone if ME hadn't had to worry about growth spurts.

I'm not complaining about the way things actually worked out mind you, not by a long shot. But I am curious.

#3

Swift Shy Guy

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Posted Jan 17, 2004 @ 6:10 PM

I think they were going to do a little more with him, but apparently realized they needed to kill him after seeing the rather noticeable growth spurt the actor went through between seasons.

Ah, I hadn't ever thought of that, but it makes sense. When I went through my s4 DVDs, I thought that the kid who Adam kills was the Annoying One for a while, actually.

#4

marlaas

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Posted Jan 18, 2004 @ 4:59 PM

My local Fox affiliate airs a Buffy episode every Saturday night (technically, Sunday morning) at 1 AM, and, somewhat sadly, I'm always home and tucked in bed in time to watch it! I'm currently re-watching S5 on DVD and actually enjoying it more than I had remembered, but seeing the S2 shows on Fox really reminds me of how stellar BtVS was in its glory days. Last night's was "What's My Line, Part 2", and, for some reason, Kendra and Buffy's good-bye always makes me laugh and tear up at the same time. There were also so many great lines (Buffy: "Kendra shot the bad lamp.") and Willow's adorkable overalls. *nostalgic sigh* And, is it just me, or did Angel actually show more personality while Drucilla and Spike were torturing him than at almost any time other than when he's Angelus?

#5

HexLover

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Posted Jan 18, 2004 @ 5:56 PM

That's one more reason why Drusilla is cool, she possesses the ability to give really boring characters an interesting personalitys. Why were Angelus and season 2 Spike interesting cool? Prolonged exposure to Drusilla.

#6

HexLover

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Posted Jan 22, 2004 @ 5:49 PM

It's been 4 days so I'm going to post again and hope it doesn't count.

I never realised how many important plot twists and character developments are in S2 until I was watching my S1 DVDs with my dad. He kept asking questions and I was forced to keep answering "that happens in S2", "They don't arrive until S2" Angel isn't important or evil until S2". It may be one of my least favorite seasons but there is just so much important stuff going on to actually hate it.



I can't believe that Spike has been there since S2!!!!!

#7

violetoceans

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Posted Feb 9, 2004 @ 4:39 PM

Please pity me...I just discovered Buffy this past month and I'm so hooked. I'm watching season two on syndication and the episodes have all been great! I loved watching Innocence where Willow tries to make out with Oz and he says no. He says something about waiting until she really wants to kiss him; otherwise, it would be shallow. I just loved Oz in that scene.

I'm jealous of all of you who watched this show when it was still on (this also happened to me w/Seinfeld). I feel like I really missed out. If there is any other WB/UPN show as good as Buffy, please tell me. I don't want to miss out again. (I have watched all other major shows, except Joan of Arcadia, but none are as good).

#8

Swift Shy Guy

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Posted Feb 9, 2004 @ 4:48 PM

I just loved Oz in that scene.

Welcome to the club. Be prepared to fall completely in love with Oz over the next season and a half.

#9

marlaas

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Posted Feb 9, 2004 @ 7:16 PM

Welcome, violetoceans...be forewarned that your Buffy obsession is likely to deepen as you see more eps., learn more about the characters and read the humorous and insightful comments on these boards! I too was late to Buffy fandom and am now jealous of people who get to fall in love with the show for the first time :) It's interesting that your post singles out Oz---he's my favorite Buffy character of all time.
I know a lot of us love hearing input from people who have a fresh perspective on these episodes, so I hope you keep positing your comments!

#10

Endeavour

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Posted Feb 9, 2004 @ 7:22 PM

If there is any other WB/UPN show as good as Buffy, please tell me.

You might want to give Angel a try. Although, you should probably wait until you've seen S3 of Buffy.

#11

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Posted Feb 9, 2004 @ 7:25 PM

Innocence was a great episode, but I can't believe they are chopping out Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered. They also took out Ted and Bad Eggs. As much as I love arc-y goodness, it's hard to go through straight arcs. Unless my local station is the only one that's cutting up the season for Arc-iness.

#12

KatieRose

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Posted Feb 10, 2004 @ 2:04 PM

While my Season 2 love still takes second to my Season 3 love, Season 2 is still so much fun to watch.

I loved all the cheesy episodes: Bad Eggs, Ted, and even Go Fish. Plus, the arc was just phenomenal. When Angel went bad, I was completely shocked.

On a much more shallow note, I didn't like Buffy's hair for most of the season, but I loved it during Becoming I. You know, that shot of her running in slo mo in the blue coat as she discovers Kendra's body? She had some great hair.

#13

Wolfe

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Posted Feb 10, 2004 @ 2:15 PM

You might want to give Angel a try. Although, you should probably wait until you've seen S3 of Buffy. - Endeavour

I have to second this, violetoceans. Especially, since you're in the middle of Angelus's arc.
Man, I envy you, too. I loved watching S2 for the first time!

#14

catharsis

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Posted Feb 11, 2004 @ 6:38 PM

S2 is fantastic-every ep. I can watch over and over (with the exception of Inca Mummy Girl). I like all the cheesy eps too, KatieRose (in fact, they might be my favorite of the season)- I like the gang dynamic that's shown in Ted, Bad Eggs, and Go Fish. I think the stupid monster eps. show the character dynamics off better, so I love them. I would also think it would be kind of jarring to skip Ted and Bad Eggs since they show Angel and Buffy getting closer. Without them, it goes from What's My Line Pt. II to Innocence and that leaves quite a gap-Angel and Buffy sleeping together would seem kind of sudden and out of place without those eps. showing them getting closer. So let me get this straight, they left Inca Mummy Girl in, but cut out these eps? That's just wacky.
Edited because my love of commas is being taken too far

Edited by catharsis, Feb 11, 2004 @ 6:54 PM.


#15

valeriel

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Posted Feb 14, 2004 @ 11:13 PM

Just watched "Surprise" & "Innocence" again, my 2 fave Buffy eps. ::sigh:: The relationships, the tension, the drama. Ahhh, season 2 when life was simpler. . . .

#16

marlaas

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Posted Feb 14, 2004 @ 11:31 PM

Ahhh, season 2 when life was simpler. . . .


Well, Buffy's life was pretty angst-ridden and really simple at all, but our lives as viewers were certainly a lot simpler :) It was IMO so easy to be a fan of the show back then---just pure love and enjoyment without all the disappointment over the direction the show had taken and the fear that it would get even worse (and my worst fears for the show were realized in the debacle otherwise known as S7!)

Even the supposedly bad eps. of S2 were better than nearly all of S6 and S7 for me. The only S2 ep. I really don't see myself ever watching again is Killed By Death. It was just (again, only IMO!) so treacly and self-consciously heavy-handed. I'll take the giggle-worthy cheesiness of Inca Mummy Girl and Go Fish any day over the Very Special Buffy that is KBD :)

Edited by marlaas, Feb 14, 2004 @ 11:31 PM.


#17

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Posted Feb 16, 2004 @ 7:03 PM

Ahh, season 2. I could watch 'When She Was Bad,' 'School Hard,' 'Lie to Me,' 'Surprise,' 'Innocence,' 'Passion,' 'I Only Have Eyes for You,' and both 'Becomings' every day of the damn week and never get tired of any of them. The awesome thing? The rest of the season wasn't much worse...

#18

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Posted Feb 16, 2004 @ 8:44 PM

I love 'Passion' and they showed that this weekend on my local syndicator. Boy that is such a great epsiode. Every time Ms. Calendar dies, I flinch because its such a ruthless death.

But Drusilla's dog, Sunshine, is worth it...haha.

#19

marlaas

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Posted Feb 16, 2004 @ 9:53 PM

I saw 'Passion' again this weekend too. For some reason, even though I was only a mild Giles-Jenny shipper, I choke up every time I hear Buffy say to Jenny: "I don't want him [Giles] to be lonely." (Remember back when Buffy at least occasionally thought of people other than herself?!) I then re-choke when Giles' face lights up at the prospect of going to Jenny's house later on. I guess it's just knowing what comes next.

Oh, and I'm ashamed to note that Angelus' sneering remark to Spike about taking him along in case he needs a good parking space still makes me laugh.

Edited by marlaas, Feb 16, 2004 @ 9:53 PM.


#20

Swift Shy Guy

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Posted Feb 16, 2004 @ 10:32 PM

Every time Ms. Calendar dies, I flinch because its such a ruthless death.

Ditto. What I love about Ms. Calendar's death is that it plays out like a scene where you would normally expect Buffy to show up in the nick of time and save Jenny, but she doesn't. No one does. There's no fooling the monster, no distracting him and running away, no fighting against him an miraculously coming out on top. There's just a demon chasing her and killing her.

It's simple, brutal, and not something usually seen on TV or in movies when it comes to a character that's been developed for one and a half seasons.

And sigh, poor Giles. He never seemed as happy as he did when he was around Jenny in s2, and that's sad.

Bad Ass Giles going after Angelus is probably one of my favorite moments of the series. Wish he would've kicked his ass.

#21

LMS

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Posted Feb 23, 2004 @ 4:02 AM

So I've been trying to get a friend of mine who was visiting hooked on Buffy and showed yesterday we reached Surprise/Innocence. I discovered this funny thing...

"Surprise" is harder to watch than "Innocence". Why? Well...
In this episode everybody is adorable and HAPPY. Willow and Oz ("I said date"), Cordy and Xander (heh), even Giles&Jenny and Spike&Dru were there looking happy.
And of course, Buffy and Angel. In the opening scene, with the heavy making out, and the Love Theme playing in the background, I was cringing with pain. They looked so HAPPY and IN LOVE! I had almost forgotten that. Knowing what's gonna happen, the pain that will come and seeing the total cuteness (okay, heavy gag-inducing sappiness also) that was these two pre-nookie, breaks my heart.

#22

babybluez

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Posted Feb 23, 2004 @ 6:46 AM

All the happiness in Surprise kills me too. And this is kind of embarrassing to admit, but every time I watch it I hope that magically the end will have changed and Angel won't lose his soul.

#23

LMS

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Posted Feb 23, 2004 @ 9:23 AM

babybluez I know! When Angel's all like: "I love you, I try not to, but I can't stop." I have a tendency to yell out "Try harder!" :P

*sigh* Ah...rewatching s2 is so much fun (or more like angst, but whatever).

#24

Bishop2

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Posted Feb 23, 2004 @ 10:03 AM

As bizarre as this may sound, I always thought that "Surprise" was a weak entry despite my love for "Innocence." Something about it just felt very "off" to me. Maybe it's because of all the happiness?

#25

LMS

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Posted Feb 23, 2004 @ 10:19 AM

Well, since I'm currently riding my "Season2-Train"...
I agree with your statement, Bishop. It WAS weak compared to Innocence, and yes, Innocence is the superior in every way.
But the happiness was sort of necessary in order for Innocence to so completely heartbreking as it, IMHO.
Also, I had just forgotten how IN LOVE Buffy and Angel looked. I mean, seeing the way those two characters have...eh..."evolved" in terms of love-lives, it's sort of like watching the prelude to a train-reck you know is gonna happen. Which makes it sort of sad, IMO.

#26

brave little toaster

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Posted Feb 23, 2004 @ 2:15 PM

I always have thought that "Surprise" was kind of cloying and uneventful, and the stunt doubles are horrendously obvious in that scene in the ship yards. It always takes me out of the moment of that scene. But I've never been a big fan of the Buffy birthday episodes. "Innocence" on the other hand--one of my all time favorites. Definitely in my top 5.

I do like the teaser to "Surprise," with Buffy's creepy dream sequence.

#27

1formybaby

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Posted Feb 23, 2004 @ 10:39 PM

Funny that in Surprise Buffy and Angel were all tearful about having to separate for a couple of months while he took away the judge part, and by the end of the night they would be separated for much longer, but for different reasons. And for Angel, much much longer.

#28

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Posted Feb 29, 2004 @ 11:16 PM

I'm in the same boat as all of you who find Surprise so upsetting when you know about the events of Innocence. They were SO happy! I could see how people could find it corny, but I thought the details made it seem like they were really in love- when there's a shot of Giles talking at the party, they're in the background smiling and talking to each other. When they're walking to the boat, he bends down and kisses the crown of her hair. The details in the ep. are so very well done, it makes them seem like a happy, normal (as normal as A Jossverse ship can be) give and take couple. I love it. So much so that I can't watch Innocence right after it - the way Angelus talks to Buffy is just too awful after all that schmoopiness in Surprise.

Edited by catharsis, Feb 29, 2004 @ 11:19 PM.


#29

pootlus

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Posted Mar 1, 2004 @ 2:54 AM

babybluez said:

All the happiness in Surprise kills me too. And this is kind of embarrassing to admit, but every time I watch it I hope that magically the end will have changed and Angel won't lose his soul.


Oh dear, you uncovered my guilty secret.

I never had the pleasure/pain of watching Surprise without already knowing the painful consequences, so I can't say whether it would have come off as overly saccharine (I doubt it - I have a very high tolerance for B/A sappiness *g*). As it is, it just heightens the pain. Sigh.

#30

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Posted Mar 1, 2004 @ 3:38 AM

Spike and Dru are still the only things I find worth watching in this episode, and it's been six years. I especially like the part where Buffy and Angel have the same 10-minute conversation 3 TIMES. Just fuck already, geez. That's the main event. Everything else, from Buffy's seemingly meaningless dreams ("We never saw a body!" No shit, Buffy) to the unveiling of the Smurf, is clutter.