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9-15: "Hard Bargain" 2013.02.14


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#1

Bleeding Love

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Posted Feb 14, 2013 @ 11:15 PM

Owen is faced with tough decisions as Seattle Grace spirals toward financial ruin; Jo and Alex try to save an infant's life; April turns to Jackson for dating advice.


Arizona was wrong to yell at Derek like that at the beginning of the episode, but I can't say how she feels is wrong. Cristina was fine physically once Mark popped her shoulder back into place in the woods and aside for the month-long traumatic state, is fine now. Meredith has no ongoing issues that we know of - you'd never know she was even *in* the crash. If Derek has regained even most of the mobility in his hand, then Arizona is the only one of the survivors that has ongoing physical trauma and the others shouldn't be taking that lightly. And she was so right in what she was yelling at Callie about their life and Sofia and talking about things together. That money is Sofia's, not Callie's, even if it's in a trust, and it should be for her (even though it's not as though they'd need to scrimp and save for her college). Don't even get me started on her offering Lexie's share to put in the hospital-buying pot. Meredith seemed more offended by what Arizona yelled at Derek then by Callie spending her sister's blood money. Who says Callie gets to make decisions for everyone?

Oh, and I don't think I'd feel comfortable meeting a lawyer that agrees to have meetings in the backseat of a van :-) Why were they having revolving door meetings in the rain?

#2

Frankie5Angels

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Posted Feb 14, 2013 @ 11:31 PM

Arizona was wrong to yell at Derek like that at the beginning of the episode, but I can't say how she feels is wrong. Cristina was fine physically once Mark popped her shoulder back into place in the woods and aside for the month-long traumatic state, is fine now. Meredith has no ongoing issues that we know of - you'd never know she was even *in* the crash. If Derek has regained even most of the mobility in his hand, then Arizona is the only one of the survivors that has ongoing physical trauma and the others shouldn't be taking that lightly. And she was so right in what she was yelling at Callie about their life and Sofia and talking about things together. That money is Sofia's, not Callie's, even if it's in a trust, and it should be for her (even though it's not as though they'd need to scrimp and save for her college). Don't even get me started on her offering Lexie's share to put in the hospital-buying pot. Meredith seemed more offended by what Arizona yelled at Derek then by Callie spending her sister's blood money. Who says Callie gets to make decisions for everyone?



Arizona was absolutely right and Callie is a disloyal bitch. How dare she just make decisions for them and their family without discussing it with Arizona first? Arizona was right to pull her card on that one because Callie does not treat Arizona as if they are married, she acts like a child, and she's going to liquidate all of their assets to buy a fucking hospital? Then she openly takes Derek's side? As creepy as it was to see Meredith not give a fuck that Callie was circling around Lexie's corpse like a vulture, it was the wifely thing to do to stand up for your spouse in public. Shonda doesn't see Arizona and Callie as married or she can't seem to write them as a married couple because they aren't heterosexual. I used to love Callie, but she's on my shit list. Arizona needs to dump her ass. Meredith stands by Derek, but Callie's nothing but a bitch to Arizona. For fuck's sake, Callie is not only spending Arizona's money without really asking her, she's giving away Sofia's money when that money was almost certainly NOT left to her for the purposes of executing Callie's harebrained scheme, and then she's going to dump all of their savings into it without talking this through with her wife? Callie scoffed and told Arizona to "slow down" when Arizona suggested buying a house, but she's willing to fly by the seat of her pants to buy a hospital? They are not co-equals in this relationship and Callie obviously doesn't consider them a familial unit or spouses. Poor Arizona.

I do think Arizona was spot on with nearly everything she said about Derek. She had him dead to rights. Derek is always trying to ride in on his white horse and be a hero. In fact, this whole lawsuit fiasco started with Derek trying to play white knight of truth. When he took his little jaunt to tamper with evidence in the airplane hangar and trespassed on federal property, he came to the grand conclusion that he needed to be the leader of the merry band of truth. He completely subverted the process and convinced everyone else to do it. Now that that idea has caused more problems, he is riding in on his white horse with another grandiose and ill-conceived idea. Derek always thinks he knows better. Now, where Arizona was wrong is that he feels guilty. Derek didn't feel guilty about shit or if he did maybe I missed it. I haven't seen any indication that he acknowledges that his bullheaded and know it all approach to things has lead them to a place they don't want to be. Yes, it is, in the cannon of the show, the fault of the hospital for their injuries, but Derek can't see that each time he subverts and undermines processes in service to his "knowing what's best," things haven't worked well for people around them. Buying this hospital is nothing more than Derek and Callie doubling down on their reckless "quest for truth" (which would have been gotten anyway from investigators from like 10 state and federal agencies). And, Arizona was not out of line. They weren't thinking about the fact that Arizona, save for the people who are dead, is the one with the gravest injuries and she doesn't get to move on like they do. She has a lifetime of bills ahead of her and insurance companies are not always good about paying for prosthetics; some amputees have to fight them tooth and nail. Prosthetics aren't cheap. Yes, they make money as surgeons, but if this thing goes belly up, they will lose all of their money and probably be on the hook for more because hospitals rack up bills like nobody's business. Of course, there is also the possibility that it may become too much for Arizona to stand in an OR forever. Her future as an amputee is not set in stone.

And, why would anyone let this lot be on the board of a hospital? None of them has any administrative or managerial experience save for Callie and Derek. Callie, I'm sure everyone will recall, washed out spectacularly as chief resident and Derek, in one of his white knight efforts to save the hospital from the chief, couldn't stand being chief of surgery once he got the job. These two have proven on a much smaller scale that they are not capable of administrative affairs. I simply cannot see Cristina or Meredith, especially when Meredith delivers, being able to juggle their careers and being administrators. Callie, because she was raised spoiled, doesn't seem to understand that things like her precious research cost money and are a huge sucking money pit until someone buys the product. She just wants what she wants and that's all she knows how to do. She's a brat. Hospitals close all the time all over the country but this lot will be able to run a research and teaching facility without being attached to a major university or medical school? If they're still looking for a name for their LLC, I hear "LOL!" is still available.

I can't care about April's love life. I can't deal with Alex pining for Jo. I want something better for Alex than these stupid "patients' lives parallel doctors' lives" contrivances. I heard that Arizona had originally been brought in as a possible love interest for Alex. I'm a lesbian and I'm all about lesbian visibility, but not in the way it is presented on this show. Alex respects Arizona and cares about her. Arizona is an adult and a good intellectual equal. Even if they aren't a perfect match, I would much rather they have them together. Calzona with its cutaway "kisses," jump-off baby, the "Modern Family," detached Callie, and physical inequality ain't it. Free Arizona!

#3

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Posted Feb 14, 2013 @ 11:40 PM

I really enjoyed this episode, and that surprised me. There was enough comedy (Derek and Meredith wincing at the numerous huge pictures of Derek, Ross being exposed at the end as the "graffiti" artist) and I liked the interaction between Derek, Meredith, and (I'm shocked I'm saying this because I usually can't stand her) Callie. I hope Derek's white horse has enough horsepower to drive them right through toward owning the hospital at this point, because Pegasus isn't right for them, and they're all smart enough to hire someone who can run a hospital. Maybe even Owen :) Of course, I'm ignoring the fact that once again, inexplicably, the chief of surgery somehow runs the hospital, but whatever.

#4

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Posted Feb 14, 2013 @ 11:42 PM

Arizona was absolutely right and Callie is a disloyal bitch. How dare she just make decisions for them and their family without discussing it with Arizona first? Arizona was right to pull her card on that one because Callie does not treat Arizona as if they are married, she acts like a child, and she's going to liquidate all of their assets to buy a fucking hospital? Then she openly takes Derek's side? As creepy as it was to see Meredith not give a fuck that Callie was circling around Lexie's corpse like a vulture, it was the wifely thing to do to stand up for your spouse in public. Shonda doesn't see Arizona and Callie as married or she can't seem to write them as a married couple because they aren't heterosexual. I used to love Callie, but she's on my shit list. Arizona needs to dump her ass. Meredith stands by Derek, but Callie's nothing but a bitch to Arizona. For fuck's sake, Callie is not only spending Arizona's money without really asking her, she's giving away Sofia's money when that money was almost certainly NOT left to her for the purposes of executing Callie's harebrained scheme, and then she's going to dump all of their savings into it without talking this through with her wife? Callie scoffed and told Arizona to "slow down" when Arizona suggested buying a house, but she's willing to fly by the seat of her pants to buy a hospital? They are not co-equals in this relationship and Callie obviously doesn't consider them a familial unit or spouses. Poor Arizona.

I do think Arizona was spot on with nearly everything she said about Derek. She had him dead to rights. Derek is always trying to ride in on his white horse and be a hero. In fact, this whole lawsuit fiasco started with Derek trying to play white knight of truth. When he took his little jaunt to tamper with evidence in the airplane hangar and trespassed on federal property, he came to the grand conclusion that he needed to be the leader of the merry band of truth. He completely subverted the process and convinced everyone else to do it. Now that that idea has caused more problems, he is riding in on his white horse with another grandiose and ill-conceived idea. Derek always thinks he knows better. Now, where Arizona was wrong is that he feels guilty. Derek didn't feel guilty about shit or if he did maybe I missed it. I haven't seen any indication that he acknowledges that his bullheaded and know it all approach to things has lead them to a place they don't want to be. Yes, it is, in the cannon of the show, the fault of the hospital for their injuries, but Derek can't see that each time he subverts and undermines processes in service to his "knowing what's best," things haven't worked well for people around them. Buying this hospital is nothing more than Derek and Callie doubling down on their reckless "quest for truth" (which would have been gotten anyway from investigators from like 10 state and federal agencies). And, Arizona was not out of line. They weren't thinking about the fact that Arizona, save for the people who are dead, is the one with the gravest injuries and she doesn't get to move on like they do. She has a lifetime of bills ahead of her and insurance companies are not always good about paying for prosthetics; some amputees have to fight them tooth and nail. Prosthetics aren't cheap. Yes, they make money as surgeons, but if this thing goes belly up, they will lose all of their money and probably be on the hook for more because hospitals rack up bills like nobody's business. Of course, there is also the possibility that it may become too much for Arizona to stand in an OR forever. Her future as an amputee is not set in stone.

And, why would anyone let this lot be on the board of a hospital? None of them has any administrative or managerial experience save for Callie and Derek. Callie, I'm sure everyone will recall, washed out spectacularly as chief resident and Derek, in one of his white knight efforts to save the hospital from the chief, couldn't stand being chief of surgery once he got the job. These two have proven on a much smaller scale that they are not capable of administrative affairs. I simply cannot see Cristina or Meredith, especially when Meredith delivers, being able to juggle their careers and being administrators. Callie, because she was raised spoiled, doesn't seem to understand that things like her precious research cost money and are a huge sucking money pit until someone buys the product. She just wants what she wants and that's all she knows how to do. She's a brat. Hospitals close all the time all over the country but this lot will be able to run a research and teaching facility without being attached to a major university or medical school? If they're still looking for a name for their LLC, I hear "LOL!" is still available.


They managed to make things even worse, so now this dumb hospital storyline is still going to be dragged on and continue to bring almost everyone done.

It's a step up from last week's intern's annoying antics, but I noticed the overdramatic music the 'That 70's Show' 360 camera work in this episode, so it was a little weird.

#5

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Posted Feb 14, 2013 @ 11:45 PM

I wanted to give Arizona a standing ovation during that first scene. Everything she said was so spot on. Callie needs to learn how to be a wife and think about her child too. I actually really enjoyed this episode though. I liked Stan.

#6

Chicken Wing

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Posted Feb 14, 2013 @ 11:47 PM

I noticed the overdramatic music the 'That 70's Show' 360 camera work in this episode, so it was a little weird.


Seriously. I was half-expecting a plume of smoke to appear.

#7

Machuran

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 12:04 AM

Seriously. I was half-expecting a plume of smoke to appear.


Same here, it was off-putting.

#8

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 12:18 AM

I hate Callie more and more each episode, who is she to make the decisions like that. I really wish Arizona would have stuck to her guns. I was disgusted at Callie throwing in Lexie's money. Throwing in Sophia's money?

#9

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 12:29 AM

The best part for me was to see that Shane was the one drawing on Derek's face. That was great. Even better was to see Richard on the case. Just great.

Vast improvement over the last episode. That's for sure.

I'm over Bailey. She has done nothing but whine. She has a point but it comes across as whining as she is just standing there and condescending people because it's not her way. I can't anymore with her.

Another one I can't any more is Owen. Weak weak weak. And I don't know why he still has a job when the "responsible" on the hospital's behalf is his. Then again, I don't understand anything in this lawsuit. And I don't even want to get into the whole "We have to tell Owen! We are doing this for Owen!" BS. Enough for one night.

Arizona was plain and simply wrong in yelling at Derek. Say whatever you want about Derek but in the end, Arizona made no contribution to anything. Callie took all the decisions because Arizona didn't. And now she has something to say. Too late. I understand she was going through a horrible time, but it collided with tough decision time. Her brain still works. She still could've been awfully mean to Callie with her decision to what Callie told her. I'm glad she apologized though. I also wonder if Arizona knows she is the cause of the fact that the insurance company isn't the one paying but the hospital is. Bet that'd change the tone a bit.

I liked the some comedy that happened. Does anyone know the name of Derek's financial advisor? I swear I see him everywhere.

In fact, this whole lawsuit fiasco started with Derek trying to play white knight of truth.


Yes, he got the mindless zombies of Meredith, Cristina, Callie & Arizona to go along with it. Now if he can get them to scare away April and Jo...would be nice.

Edited by AnitaMC86, Feb 15, 2013 @ 12:30 AM.


#10

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 12:36 AM

I've never really enjoyed Arizona, but she is my new favorite character. I love that she laid into Derek (and Callie), because without Mark around calling him on his sh$t, Derek has been beyond arrogant. Seriously, whoever wrote this episode is my new favorite writer cuz they had Arizona say all the things I've thought this whole season.

Someone said last week that Callie is becoming Izzie, they were right. How many stupid ideas did Izzie have? This is right up there with the Lvat wire. If Derek hadn't been a part of the group, what would she have done to convince Arizona and Cristina? Pout and whine?

I hated it last week when Meredith told Alex to think about dating Jo, but this week was worse. Of course they have her going out with some dude when Alex decides to ask her out. They always screw over Alex with the romantic SLs. To me Jo is worse than Rebecca, mainly because they basically ripped off Izzie's backstory. (I think that was her name anyway, god that was a bad storyline)

#11

Royko

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 12:40 AM

I'm pretty sick of this silly lawsuit/sale plotline. I have no empathy for the doctors facing this crisis because they themselves created it, and the means by which they created it is going to be how they save it. The problem is essentially also the solution. So the whole contrived situation is just pointless, and the end result (ownership) is something neither fans or characters really want (and will likely again be nullified by a plotline that will be equally contrived.)

What really annoys me is that this wasn't the writers writing themselves into a corner. They went through a lot of hoops to get to this. The plane crash didn't need to lead to a lawsuit, the lawsuit didn't need to be against the hospital (!), the insurance company didn't need to find a loophole.

If they wanted conflict with Owen or a way to introduce Cahill, there are far more reasonable ways to achieve that. Not sure why they thought we really were dying to see half the cast become rich and essentially revisit Derek's rise to and fall from management (multiplied by five.)

#12

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 12:59 AM

Callie and Owen need to just fuck off to the carpark of no return. He's weak and a pathetic wet blanket and Callie is just gross right now looking at Lexie's blood money.

Newsflash bitch you wasn't even there, sit your ass down!

To think people bitch about Cristina being a crass.

#13

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:03 AM

Say whatever you want about Derek but in the end, Arizona made no contribution to anything. Callie took all the decisions because Arizona didn't.


This. Thank you.

The Callie hate is kinda laughable, but to each his own. She's just trying to help, even if it is coming off as off-putting. Someone had to lead the charge to do something, because the crash survivors would just continue to keep their heads down (out of guilt? because they just want to move on?) and then - eventually - they all, hospital included, would have been assed-out.
They should have just taken the settlement to begin with, but then there'd be no central story for the season (as ridiculous as it's become).

Cristina and her laughing at the idea to buy the hosptial and then suggesting "The Bitter Pills" as an LLC was golden.

#14

Frankie5Angels

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:09 AM

Arizona was plain and simply wrong in yelling at Derek. Say whatever you want about Derek but in the end, Arizona made no contribution to anything. Callie took all the decisions because Arizona didn't. And now she has something to say. Too late.



She did go along with Derek's brilliant scheme, but seeing as it turned into a shit show, she had every right to voice her objection to going forward with this. One thing about being the ringleader of a group is that when you convince people to get on board your plan, you have to own some responsibility when it goes awry. Saying, "You didn't have to go along" is the sort of cowardly and pissant thing Derek would do.


I

also wonder if Arizona knows she is the cause of the fact that the insurance company isn't the one paying but the hospital is. Bet that'd change the tone a bit.


I don't think any of them know that, but it is quite a stretch to say that any of this is her fault. First of all, Owen should have known that and told her she couldn't get on the plane. If we're going to go along with the show's cannon that Owen is negligent, he should never have let her get on the plane because he should have known their insurance company wouldn't cover it. It isn't Arizona's job to know that. But, I think the fact that she lost her leg is punishment enough for having gotten on board that plane in a moment of anger. I'm sure Arizona wished that Owen had not only not hired a company with a history of mechanical problems, had not made the dumb decision not to answer his phone all day or check on their flight, or to yank her off the plane because he should have known about their insurance policy. I bet that if someone were so base and low as to throw the insurance thing in her face, she would say that no one more than her wishes that Owen knew the rules and yanked her off of that plane because she'd still have her leg.

Yes, he got the mindless zombies of Meredith, Cristina, Callie & Arizona to go along with it.


The choice to take the original settlement had to be unanimous and everyone was on board with it except Derek. Even if they hadn't gotten aboard his plan, it wouldn't have mattered because there would have been no deal without Derek and things would have gone his way anyway. I don't know if you're being sarcastic when you call Meredith, Cristina, Callie, and Arizona "mindless zombies" in an attempt to make some sort of fatuous point, but I think it is safe to say that Arizona and Cristina, at the very least, were emotionally beaten down. Both of them were traumatized and in no condition to be making decisions. They wanted it to be over but even if they had the strength of mind to push back, it wouldn't have mattered because the original deal had to be unanimous and Derek the Wise had decided he wasn't going to settle. Their objections would have been moot. It would be good, however, if he could get someone to scare off April, Jo, and possibly Jackson. I hate that Tina Majorino gets no screen time when that simpering waste of space Jo does. Majorino is a far superior actress and the character is interesting. Meh.

Another one I can't any more is Owen. Weak weak weak. And I don't know why he still has a job when the "responsible" on the hospital's behalf is his. Then again, I don't understand anything in this lawsuit. And I don't even want to get into the whole "We have to tell Owen! We are doing this for Owen!" BS. Enough for one night.


You hit the nail on the head! He's supposed to be chief of surgery, but in Shonda's world that position is the same as chief of staff. I wanted to choke Cristina with this "we're doing this for Owen" BS. Dude, within the cannon of the show, he placed you all on a plane with a shitty safety record and he turned his phone off all day. The last person anyone should feel indebted to is Owen. I wanted to puke the 70th time I heard it. And, they weren't doing it for Owen, they were doing it because they didn't want to deal with changes at their workplace. They want their way, not redemption for Owen. This whole thing sucks.

Oh, Shonda said that Arizona and Callie would get their romantic mojo back on or before Valentine's Day episode. Well, it's Valentine's Day, so where was it? Was that peck that she didn't get to see supposed to be it? Why is it that April the re-virgin and her virginal boyfriend or the divorced Crowen get onscreen action but not Callie and Arizona? Tonight's portrayal of them really made me wish they'd killed Arizona. They've been written in an extremely offensive manner since season 7 when Arizona did what no male character would ever have been expected to do by accepting Mark's baby. It has been stuck between insulting and outright homophobic since then and I wish it would end.

#15

Machuran

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:10 AM

I'm pretty sick of this silly lawsuit/sale plotline. I have no empathy for the doctors facing this crisis because they themselves created it, and the means by which they created it is going to be how they save it. The problem is essentially also the solution. So the whole contrived situation is just pointless, and the end result (ownership) is something neither fans or characters really want (and will likely again be nullified by a plotline that will be equally contrived.)


This storyline is bringing all the characters down: Owen's incompetence as Chief is further magnified and he's a terrible leader, constantly letting people walk all over him, Bailey is becoming more and more bitter, Callie is being too involved and she's brought everyone down with her crazy plans that only made things worse, etc.

Oh, Shonda said that Arizona and Callie would get their romantic mojo back on or before Valentine's Day episode. Well, it's Valentine's Day, so where was it? Was that peck that she didn't get to see supposed to be it? Why is it that April the re-virgin and her virginal boyfriend or the divorced Crowen get onscreen action but not Callie and Arizona? Tonight's portrayal of them really made me wish they'd killed Arizona. They've been written in an extremely offensive manner since season 7 when Arizona did what no male character would ever have been expected to do by accepting Mark's baby. It has been stuck between insulting and outright homophobic since then and I wish it would end.


For a supposed season of love, this is very disappointing, most of it is a joyless mess because of the hospital storylines.

Edited by Machuran, Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:17 AM.


#16

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:17 AM

Alright, seriously. What was up with the underscore for tonight's episode?

#17

cycworker

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:18 AM

Oh, Shonda said that Arizona and Callie would get their romantic mojo back on or before Valentine's Day episode. Well, it's Valentine's Day, so where was it


Shonda was asked about that on Twitter, oh, last week? It's coming.... she admitted she made a mistake saying it was before Valentine's Day, as she didn't know air dates at the time. I am thinking it'll be 9x17 or 9x18

Can someone explain the LLC stuff to me in layman's terms? Are they going to be able to continue to be doctors?

#18

Apocolocyntosis

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:42 AM

Alright, seriously. What was up with the underscore for tonight's episode?

It was shockingly bad. The opening scene was really difficult to watch. It was so jarring that I thought for a moment that something was wrong with my sound system and the music was playing from some other program or device, because no one would do that on purpose, right?

#19

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 1:55 AM

She did go along with Derek's brilliant scheme, but seeing as it turned into a shit show, she had every right to voice her objection to going forward with this. One thing about being the ringleader of a group is that when you convince people to get on board your plan, you have to own some responsibility when it goes awry. Saying, "You didn't have to go along" is the sort of cowardly and pissant thing Derek would do.


Here's the thing: this is not just Derek's brilliant scheme and Arizona isn't going into anything forcibly. Callie came up with the idea of buying up the hospital, not Derek. Up to that moment, the only thing Derek did was support the idea. And I doubt Arizona went along with anything until she felt like getting involved. She hardly seemed involved in the lawsuit until the resolution of it all and now, until she saw something that would affect her. Neither Derek or Callie tried to convinced her after that to join their plan.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic when you call Meredith, Cristina, Callie, and Arizona "mindless zombies" in an attempt to make some sort of fatuous point, but I think it is safe to say that Arizona and Cristina, at the very least, were emotionally beaten down.


I was being sarcastic but mostly to go on point that they have also been a part of it, not just Derek. I apologize if it was thought to be mean intended but I don't get why Derek is singled out as the one at fault here when others also took part of the decision. Meredith could've easily convinced Derek to suck it up and take the airline's settlement. Callie could've stand her ground. Arizona could've not apologized and not do anything. Things could've been made to not get where they are by the others but didn't happen. He's not alone in this. Others have made conscious decisions to go along. That was my whole point.

I hate that Tina Majorino gets no screen time when that simpering waste of space Jo does. Majorino is a far superior actress and the character is interesting.


I second this motion by all means. I was very happy to see in the promo that she may have a lot more to do so next episode but it's such a shame that her character is being wasted away for Jo and April? No.

I don't think any of them know that, but it is quite a stretch to say that any of this is her fault.


But it is. It's the reason the insurance isn't paying out, causing the hospital to have to pay out therefore having to go bankrupt. This whole thing is a stretch honestly, but going by their logic that's how it seems to be. Sure, she got the worst end from all of the survivors but she has also a part to blame in this big scheme of things, along with Derek not taking the airline settlement, negligent Owen, and the lawyers switching the lawsuit to the hospital. It's a part of it. I'm sure her rant at the beginning of the episode would've been different had she (or anyone) know that part of it. She has all the right in the world to voice concerns but blaming others when she has a slight part of the consequences that happened?

I absolutely 100000% agree with you on the "Owen-can't-read-safety issue records." That still irks me.

Edited by AnitaMC86, Feb 15, 2013 @ 2:17 AM.


#20

TheTwoWorlds

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 3:08 AM

I was actually entertained.

The whole storyline is still ridiculous but it reminded me back in season 2 when the interns tried to cover up for what they did to Denny. Its nice to see doctors band together, especially when it creates drama with other characters. I just wish the beginnings of this lawsuit was done in a different way.

Overall, I like Arizona and Callie. And I think all of their points are valid.

Still just dont care about April and I wish she would be written out. Her christianity has always come off as over the top to me in the show and she's just annoying. And most of the interns can go still.

#21

Susan47

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 3:53 AM

Can someone explain the LLC stuff to me in layman's terms? Are they going to be able to continue to be doctors?


LLC stands for Limited Liability Company - as I recall (without rewatching that scene with the spinning camera again), the doctors can't directly buy the hospital *and* be employed there, but they can align with another company (profit or non-profit...whether this is a dummy company and what they're trying to name at the end or not I'm not sure), then THAT company hires them (directly or via the LLC they were thinking of names for?) to basically be the managing board of the hospital. I'm not 100% clear, but it seems like a pretty bad investment for them to pay for an asset (the hospital) that a company other than their own would technically own. But it also doesn't sound right that their own LLC would buy the hospital then hire themselves to the board.

But yes, with technical distance, they could manage and still work at the hospital. I'm just not clear at this point how it's an investment vs a donation if it's an unrelated company aligned with them that will technically be the buyer/owner.

In terms of Arizona to Derek - she was rude about it, but apologized sincerely the next morning so I don't have issue with it. It's more that her real beef is with Callie ringleading this plan; Derek's just agreeing. It's rubbing me the wrong way how adamant Callie is about issues relating to the lawsuit and money when she's the one who wasn't on the plane - obviously she's serving a plot purpose, but I'd think she should kind of take more of a backseat here. She and Arizona presumably have fairly joint finances, but Shonda said at the time of their wedding that they couldn't be legally married - so Callie is only advocating spending Arizona's $15m and her daughter's inheritance, not money that's actually her own (save the $700k).

And asking for Lexie's money?! It doesn't bother me as much that Mer's reaction was sort of played for humor - she and their dad are obviously problematic, and since he and Lexie were in later seasons I can see the assumption being that Lexie would approve of that use, but seeing as their dad lost his wife *and* daughter via the hospital I can't imagine it would be reasonable to ask him. (For what, a $15m donation? A spot in their LLC?) But Callie going for her share so casually bugged. I had wondered about an award to Lexie's heir, though, so appreciated finally having that mentioned.

Loved how cute Meredith and Derek were, horrified by the giant pictures and the exchanges with the male intern (Ross?).


ET correct quote tags.

Oh. And the original 90210 already did that "the guy I have to tell I'm saving myself/ready to lose my virginity to surprises me with the same beliefs" thing, so I saw that coming. April's far more tolerable than last season, just not sure how far they'll take Jackson's lingering feelings.

Edited by Susan47, Feb 15, 2013 @ 3:51 AM.


#22

Frankie5Angels

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 4:22 AM

But it is. It's the reason the insurance isn't paying out, causing the hospital to have to pay out therefore having to go bankrupt. This whole thing is a stretch honestly, but going by their logic that's how it seems to be. Sure, she got the worst end from all of the survivors but she has also a part to blame in this big scheme of things, along with Derek not taking the airline settlement, negligent Owen, and the lawyers switching the lawsuit to the hospital. It's a part of it.


I agree with you now. You have brought me back around to my original opinion on it when I first saw them tell Owen that. The first thing I posted was, "Wow, I wonder what the others are going to say now that they know the hospital is on the hook thanks to her hotheaded move!" Then I came around to the idea that it was Owen's job to know how many attendings and residents were on board to ensure compliance with the policy. But, do we have any indication that he knew that she replaced Alex? There's a chance that as far as Owen knew, the passenger manifest never changed. Now, it is obvious that Owen didn't know about the rule because he was blindsided when the lawyers told him about it, so it is unlikely he would have stopped her because he had no idea that it would matter. Regardless, in terms of simple cause and effect, Arizona's decision to pull Karev is the reason why the hospital has to pay the judgment. That's what I thought when I heard it the first time on the show and you've brought me back around to it.

Here's the thing: this is not just Derek's brilliant scheme and Arizona isn't going into anything forcibly. Callie came up with the idea of buying up the hospital, not Derek. Up to that moment, the only thing Derek did was support the idea. And I doubt Arizona went along with anything until she felt like getting involved. She hardly seemed involved in the lawsuit until the resolution of it all and now, until she saw something that would affect her. Neither Derek or Callie tried to convinced her after that to join their plan.


I was referring to their initially agreeing to do it Derek's way when they rejected the first settlement offer, not this. The "brilliant scheme" I was referring to was that, not this. You're right when you say it isn't Derek's idea because it was Callie who came up with it. Derek got on board and they became co-captains of the crazy ship. They did try to convince Arizona when she was speaking sense and rejecting the idea. That had her meet with Derek's financial advisor. But, she came around to the idea for her own stupid reason. She, like an asshole, decided to risk her security and her daughter's security because they couldn't get someone else's kid experimental therapy for his cancer. She lots of points with me for using her money, going along with Callie using Sofia's money which is not theirs at all, and liquidating their other savings to sink into this. They don't even have a house with a yard for their daughter, but Arizona decides that she's going forget her objections because Bailey was mad over the fact that they were turned down for an experimental treatment? I can see the business model of this hospital already: no expense is too big even if it's an experimental treatment your insurance company probably won't cover! I will say, though, that since Arizona was obviously going to have to change her mind to allow this inane plot to play out, I'm glad she did it for reasons of her own. I'm sick of her acquiescing and changing her mind to want what Callie wants. If she was going to do such a stupid thing, it's refreshing to see her do it on her own terms. Now they'll have an extra set of reasons to explain to Sofia why they thought it would be a good idea for them to essentially steal from her in order to buy a fucking hospital.

I totally forgot the most ironic part of the episode. So, after all season ignoring every single law, rule, regulation, civil procedure, and any real life rule that might hamper their ability to tell this ridiculous story, I love how they had Derek bring in a guy to explain all the intricate rules governing the purchase of a hospital by doctors, the rules about setting up a corporation, etc. Right before that moment, the law never came into play, was never discussed, and was totally inconsequential, but when it became useful to the plot, they were all on it. But, they actually weren't. Hilariously, as they were showing us how complicated and fraught with intricate legal briar patches, they make a huge error: the lawyer/advisor told Derek and the others that if Owen found out about their coup and didn't report it, he could face jail time. Um, he would be in breach of contract. The government does not incarcerate people over civil matters between private citizens. Oh, Grey's! The irony it burns.

Can someone explain the LLC stuff to me in layman's terms? Are they going to be able to continue to be doctors?


An LLC is a limited liability company. It is a combination of aspects of a corporation in that the owners are only financially liable for their stake in the company (meaning, if the company incurs debts or other liabilities, the personal funds of the shareholders cannot be sued as individuals and their personal money outside the corporation is not a valid target for creditors) and a partnership for the purposes of income taxes. I've simplified it as much as possible but there's no real "layman's term" way to explain it. What I've given here is bare bones. For the purposes of this all you need to know is that should something happen to the hospital, the surgeons' creditors can't go after their homes or personal bank accounts because of money the hospital owes.

They will still be able to be doctors. In real life, even though congress shut down physician owned imaging practices and laboratories because of the conflict of interest in the '80s, a loophole in the law allows for doctors to own hospitals. And, if you want to read how well that has gone, I encourage you to read this short article about the demise of Century City Doctor's Hospital. It isn't included in this article, but in an article written right around the time the group of Beverly Hills surgeons were buying it from an ailing healthcare group, they were crowing about how much better doctors know how to run hospitals because they know what's going on and they know what it takes (we heard our beloved Seattle Grace doctors saying these exact words). They plunged $100 million into that hospital only to find themselves, three years later, $60 million in debt and unable to find a buyer to take it off their hands.

#23

Happy Harpy

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 4:59 AM

I'm really ready for the hospital sale storyline to end.
The only good thing about it was the over-the-top humor in the meetings.
Callie is going over the top, too, and not in a good way. When it comes to her couple, though, I remember how Arizona was in the beginning of the season and how Callie had to take everything in charge, so I see how it could have become an habit to make decisions. And at least yes, she's trying to help.
Arizona had a good point, too, too bad she expressed it in such a bitchy way. Derek used to be insufferable at times, but imo he has been quite great in this storyline. He tried to help everyone the best he could, doing things he wasn't comfortable with for the team and staying in the "middle". So I don't see him as deserving people venting their frustrations at him.

Did my ears betray me, or the first thing Cahill thought about when the shit hit the fan was her reputation in the business? Way to go, girl. I can't stand her and I don't care about her backstory. She is so going to make a move on Owen (and oh, he's just in the middle of a Big Misunderstanding with Cristina!). Yuck.
By the way, who was this character who made every decision according to her ex-husband's situation...I wondered if she was going to ask the interns to hold hand and sing Kumbaya. Paging the real Dr. Cristina Yang, please.

I liked what Stephanie said to Cristina, and Ross cracked me up. I like very much his relationship with Derek. And phew, Bailey is back! I found her more likeable than she's been in ages.

I loved the Alex and Jo interactions. Of course, Alex had to have his heart broken...sigh. I hope it's only temporary. And in spite of my poor Alex, at least it's clear that Jo does see him as a brother and doesn't have some ulterior motive when it comes to doing things for him.

I agree about April's christianity and its over-the-top representation. I don't want to think about what her "revirginization" was, exactly, but something tells me that the nice paramedic might not be very understanding, then. I did like, though, her interaction with Jackson. I like them as friends, too. I have the feeling that I'll see Jackson and Alex drowning their sorrow in alcohol together a lot, in the near future.

#24

Chicken Wing

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 8:10 AM


I don't think any of them know that, but it is quite a stretch to say that any of this is her fault.


But it is. It's the reason the insurance isn't paying out, causing the hospital to have to pay out therefore having to go bankrupt. This whole thing is a stretch honestly, but going by their logic that's how it seems to be. Sure, she got the worst end from all of the survivors but she has also a part to blame in this big scheme of things, along with Derek not taking the airline settlement, negligent Owen, and the lawyers switching the lawsuit to the hospital. It's a part of it. I'm sure her rant at the beginning of the episode would've been different had she (or anyone) know that part of it. She has all the right in the world to voice concerns but blaming others when she has a slight part of the consequences that happened?


It all comes down to one Dr. Arizona Robbins getting on that plane, yes, that is the fact of why the insurance company isn't going to pay, because the hospital broke their contract terms by allowing that. Not going to argue with that point, because it's the truth. But ... I can't say that it's Arizona's "fault" or that she should feel responsible if she/they ever learn these details. She didn't know that. None of them knew that. I can't blame her or even comfortably say that this is her "fault" when she didn't even know she was breaking a rule by taking Alex's place on the plane. She didn't know there was anything to it. She didn't know that would cause anything. I can't really hold someone responsible when they didn't even know they did anything wrong. It's not like she was breaking the law or something. There is nothing wrong, in itself, with having three attendings on a plane. Snakes, yes. Attendings, no. It's just a concept. They're all people on the plane. Attending, resident -- they just have titles. It was incorrect for Arizona to get on after Derek and Mark were already on because a random, obscure rule in the hospital's insurance policy for medevac flights forbade it. How the heck would she know that? She has nothing to do with the hospital's insurance contract. It's not her responsibility to know that rule. If this detail has to be anyone's fault, it would be Owen's. It is his job to know these things. (Because at Seattle Grace, Chief of Surgery runs the hospital.) But I still don't blame him either. He didn't know that. It doesn't look like anyone on that whole board knew that until the insurance company came back to them and explained their refusal to pay out the claim. No one knew.

As to Arizona's rant at Derek, it was both spot-on and somewhat out of line. This whole situation isn't all Derek's fault -- this thing has spiraled way beyond anything any of them thought would ever happen. But the fact is, it was his bright idea to reject the settlement and pursue a lawsuit. None of them had to go along with it. They were all set to settle; he was outnumbered. They could have stuck to their guns and forced him to go along with the majority and be done with it. The fact that they caved isn't Derek's fault, but the fact remains that this was his idea and he was the one who started the ball rolling. So I think that's what Arizona is driving at. I don't think she's right about Derek trying to solve everything out of guilt -- I don't believe Derek feels guilty that he can move on relatively unscathed while Mark and Lexie are dead and Arizona is minus a leg and so is now trying to compensate by solving everyone's problems. I think he's just trying to fix everything because that's what he does -- the person who needs to solve everything for everybody. But Arizona's kind of done with Derek swooping in and trying to get everyone on board with the latest scheme, because it was his first bright idea that got them to this point in the first place. Maybe a little unfair, but not entirely untrue.

I, too, am getting tired of Callie being the ringleader in this. (And to that Derek point, this latest brainchild was her idea, not his, so that's another part of why Arizona was a little unfair to him.) I really, really want someone to slap her and scream "You weren't there!!!" I really want that to happen. This affects her, yes, but there is no getting around this -- she's not one of them. It's not the same. She's not a real part of the horror and tragedy and haunting memories. And so I'm really over her inserting herself as part of "we" and leading their decisions as though it's the same. I want her to go away now. And how dare she suggest using Lexie's share, which now belongs to Thatcher, and Mark's share, which is being kept in a trust for his daughter, for this wacky idea. Arizona was 100% spot-on to call her on that one.

All that being said, I've never burst out laughing harder in my life than at the sight of the defaced Derek posters.

Those pictures are obnoxious. They do not belong there lining the hospital walls. If they want to clutter every wall with promotional pictures, they should be of happy, healthy patients -- little kids in the peds unit, a cancer patient comfortably being tended to by the smiling doctor. Not one random doctor smiling straight at the camera like a psychopath. A hospital is supposed to say "Patients matter here. We'll take care of you," not "Look how cool our doctors are! Don't you wish he was your doctor?"

Edited by Chicken Wing, Feb 15, 2013 @ 8:18 AM.


#25

Deanie87

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 9:22 AM

I loved the Alex and Jo interactions. Of course, Alex had to have his heart broken...sigh. I hope it's only temporary. And in spite of my poor Alex, at least it's clear that Jo does see him as a brother and doesn't have some ulterior motive when it comes to doing things for him.


I think it will be temporary. I get the feeling that Jo does think of Alex a little bit in that way, but doesn't want to jeopardize their friendship. I just don't want him to chase her for too long. It also looks like he has shared his long, sordid love life with her, at least to some degree (I hope we get more of that actually on screen). As far as I'm concerned Jo can have all the screentime she wants as long as all of her scenes are with Alex. But I do really wish that April and Jackson would get back together just so we can combine their stories into one fast forward session.

Alex waxing poetic about MerDer's SoulMate MFEO status made the bile rise in my throat a bit, but I loved Jo's response: "Do you have a blog that I could follow?" Ha! More of this Jo please, and less Simpering Sob Story.

I still couldn't care less about the lawsuit/hospital purchase and I still don't understand what the hell Cristina and Owen are doing.

Edited by Deanie87, Feb 15, 2013 @ 10:26 AM.


#26

Chicken Wing

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 9:49 AM

I still don't understand what the hell Cristina and Owen are doing.


Me neither, but whatever it is, can they please cut it out? I don't know how much longer I can take of Cristina all up in Owen's ass.

#27

Erratic

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 10:20 AM

Oh, Shonda said that Arizona and Callie would get their romantic mojo back on or before Valentine's Day episode. Well, it's Valentine's Day, so where was it?

She tweeted about this last week and said that she got the airing dates confused, but it is coming soon.

#28

WindSprints

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 10:55 AM

Overall I find the hospital lawsuit storyline boring and it drags the shown down (have felt like this all year) but there were some parts of the episode I enjoyed. I liked the way the giant face Derek played out throughout the episode. Richard's "I didn't do it" was priceless.

As far as I'm concerned Jo can have all the screentime she wants as long as all of her scenes are with Alex.

Agree. I liked Alex's scenes, but I always do. I like when he gets a mix of doctoring and personal (or at least hints of the personal) so it all worked for me last night.

Alex waxing poetic about MerDer's SoulMate MFEO status made the bile rise in my throat a bit, but I loved Jo's response: "Do you have a blog that I could follow?" Ha! More of this Jo please, and less Simpering Sob Story.

Agree! The propping of MerDer or Meredith by another happens a few times a season so it was just Alex's turn. It was brief and I was happy that Jo replied as she did since I was half expecting her to give a speech about wanting a love like that cause she lived in a car. She's grown on me since the start of the season.

I still don't understand what the hell Cristina and Owen are doing.

Me either.

I didn't like the scenes in the car/rain. If they set up an LLC, own the hospital and appoint either Owen or Richard as chief then what really changes? A few arguments about hospital admin next season? The entire "who is at fault" among them is grating, whether it be about the crash or the settlement. Yes, Owen signed the company. Yes, Arizona took Alex's spot. But in the end the plane crashed due to it not being properly maintained. The hospital had to pay because of the terms of the insurance and if they had such loopholes, which none of the doctors seemed to have any idea about. I'm hoping they buy it next episode then if fades into the background and rarely seen, heard from or spoken about again. Like they do with the show's babies.

I don't mind April when she is teaching the interns or in some other scenes but I hate all her "I'm a virgin!, I'm not a virgin!" storyline. I also hate how temporary love interests on Grey's are handled. Its so clear from the first second that they're there just to waste time that they shouldn't even bother with them.

Does anyone know the name of Derek's financial advisor? I swear I see him everywhere.

I don't know his name but he reminded me a lot of the actor who played Stuart on LA Law.

Edited by WindSprints, Feb 15, 2013 @ 10:58 AM.


#29

CED9

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 11:14 AM

Does anyone know the name of Derek's financial advisor? I swear I see him everywhere.


Eddie Jemison. I personally recognize him from Hung.

#30

nivea

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Posted Feb 15, 2013 @ 11:33 AM

Oh, Shonda said that Arizona and Callie would get their romantic mojo back on or before Valentine's Day episode. Well, it's Valentine's Day, so where was it?

God I hope not. Considering how dismissive Callie is towards her wife these days, Arizona shouldn't touch her with a ten foot barge pole. Callie having sex will just make her more smug, arrogant and insufferable.