117 replies to this topic

[TWoP Lockley]

Episode 3 here we go!

[AimingforYoko]

Ending was predictable, if sad.
Doug Henning reference FTW!
So Liz wandered off the reservation. Repeatedly. Nice to know she wasn't always so sure about what she was doing. I was a little confused when Gregory was talking about the SCLC and Dr. King, but I keep forgetting that was only 15 years earlier to them.
Keri Russell was really good. Has she always been this good?

[benteen]

Really good episode again. Matthew Rhys has been fantastic so far and I thought Keri Russell really brought it in that final scene. So nice to see Margo Martindale again...just a note for single parents on television. Don't go near any character played by Margo Martindale.

[SzmuttyPratfall]

I thought the ending was predictable, but I thought they weren't going there for a split second when they had their hands together, and I thought we were getting end credits right there.

So, Elizabeth slept with the Secretary guy in the first episode, Phil has a moment of Jealous Reflection.
Then there was Phil with the one woman last week, Elizabeth was a little Jealous.
Then there was the shit from this episode.

Will there be sexual jealousy every episode?

Edited by SzmuttyPratfall, Feb 13, 2013 @ 11:14 PM.

[madam magpie]

Keri Russell was really good. Has she always been this good?

I haven't seen it yet, but can say with certainty, "Yes, she has."

[AimingforYoko]

So, Elizabeth slept with the Secretary guy in the first episode, Phil has a moment of Jealous Reflection.
Then there was Phil with the one woman last week, Elizabeth Jealous.
Then there was the shit from this episode.

There might have been a pang or two in the first two eps, but I don't think it was serious, because they were working. Gregory wasn't work. That was an actual relationship.

[chailey]

Yes, it was obvious that the wife was a goner. I'm glad that they didn't kill the baby. I think that Elizabeth at least, seemed to realize that the wife probably wasn't on her way to Cuba, judging by her long glance at the van. And it doesn't look like Philip is going to be playing racquetball anytime soon. The dead KGB agent would have been better off just telling his wife that if he didn't come back that he was probably dead. He pretty much signed her death warrant.

Granny is going to be a tough and wily handler, I think. Can't wait for the Reagan assassination attempt episode next week.

[Dowel Jones]

Note to Philip: If Mags offers you anything to drink, run. Just run.
I think the dead KGB guy was a company man to the end, and set his wife up that way so that if he was killed, the loose end would be tied up.
So were all those surveillance guys KGB, or just contractors of a sort? Elizabeth may be taking a real risk there, because if any of them were picked up on an unrelated charge (smoking dope was a whole lot more serious charge then), they could always spill the beans for a lighter sentence.
Edited to remove miscellaneous coding language.
Edited again because Matthew Rhys isn't Kevin anymore. Ha!

Edited by Dowel Jones, Feb 14, 2013 @ 12:15 AM.

[benteen]

I've wondered that about the other guys too. One of them was eavesdropping on the FBI so he knows what business Robert, Elizabeth, and Phillip are in.

[JenT]

Matthew Rhys kills me. I kept wanting Philip to say something along the lines of "it could have happened that way for us had you let me in", but the silence in that last scene was so much better. , I hope the ratings hold up so we can at least get to the end of the season.

What was that song at the end? A late 70s/ early 80s song I don't recognize is a rarity.

[Rickster]

So were all those surveillance guys KGB, or just contractors of a sort?

I had the impression they were "contractors" who thought they were involved in a drug deal?

My only surprise was that the baby didn't end up dead too, but maybe the writers thought that would be too cold.

Did not really like the relationship discussion surfacing in the middle of the op. I would have thought they were too professional for that. But overall, I liked this better than the second episode.

My question was, wouldn't they get some advance warning of a new handler, or some way to confirm who she was? Seems sort of risky to just take her on faith.

ETA: closed captioning said the song at the end was Roxy Music's "Sunset"

Edited by Rickster, Feb 14, 2013 @ 12:17 AM.

[Mars477]

Keri Russell was really good. Has she always been this good?

I haven't seen it yet, but can say with certainty, "Yes, she has."

I've only seen her in one place else (Mission Impossible 3) and all I could think was "Damn it, why couldn't we keep her?"

Oh, the Feds. US government law enforcement agencies are always way behind the curve on diversity. Among the many reasons why not having a team of all clean-cut WASPy men could be a good idea? That first surveillance scene. You could make the Feds from a mile away.

So were all those surveillance guys KGB, or just contractors of a sort?

Contractors, seems like. It seemed like Gregory was the only real asset, the others weren't in the know.

Edited by Mars477, Feb 14, 2013 @ 12:30 AM.

[Irlandesa]

I had the impression they were "contractors" who thought they were involved in a drug deal?

Yep. They thought Gregory was a drug dealer and everything related to what they were doing had to do with a drug operation.

My only surprise was that the baby didn't end up dead too, but maybe the writers thought that would be too cold.

Maybe but I actually thought it made perfect sense. By virtue of its father, that baby was Russian. There was someone back in Russia who could raise it as a Russian baby and it was too young to remember anything.

I hope the ratings hold up so we can at least get to the end of the season.

That's the great thing about cable shows vs. network. Where networks will pull a show mid-season, cable channels rarely do that regardless of how poor the ratings are.

So, Elizabeth slept with the Secretary guy in the first episode, Phil has a moment of Jealous Reflection.
Then there was Phil with the one woman last week, Elizabeth Jealous.
Then there was the shit from this episode.

I think all three of the moments are different. The first episode Phil has sexual jealousy. I didn't really see jealousy on Elizabeth's part in the second episode but rather a second of Phil almost seeming a bit shamed as if he expected jealousy and then disappointed that he didn't get it. And like AimingforYoko pointed out, this was a relationship. Sexual infidelity is part of their job but I gather he was under the impression that they at least had truth in their favor. It turns out that she was wasn't closed off all that time but rather closed off to him.

Still, I too found it a bit awkward that Gregory chose that moment to confront Phil about Liz and even that they chose to have their confrontation just a little bit later. The later confrontation, however, made a little more sense because Phillip was clearly ready to burst after discovering the truth about his wife's relationship with Gregory.

[christina_ma]

Really good ep, just about excellent. Matthew Rhys kicking ass AGAIN is a plus. "I warned them. Twice." Or whatever he said to the seller. He is KILLING it in this role. He may not get the kind of recognition that leading men on other shows are getting, who are thrust into what passes as superstardom on TV shows (examples include Ian Somerhalder, Benedict Cumberbatch, Stephen Moyer and Alexander Skarsgard) but he is really shining here. I expect a few articles to say as much in the next few months.

Keri Russell - wow. I cannot claim to know if she's always been this good but she was certainly good here. She and Derek Luke played off of each other well. I hope we see him again, but not necessarily to play the jealousy angle. Talk about making emotional decisions. Pot, I'd like you to meet Kettle.

That's my one gripe here - no I kinda don't want to see jealousy every week. Nor do I want Elizabeth and Philip, once they develop their feelings, to be the supercouple lovey dovey KGB version of Mr. and Mrs. Hart. (Which I just checked, ran from 1979 to 1984, so ha! I'm in the right timeframe.) To me, it will be REALLY easy to assume that if they make a mistake it will be because of emotion. I want to see a little more of their ability to shut it off in order to go to work.

I was looking forward to this episode knowing for a week that it was directed by Tommy Schlamme, and he did not disappoint. The camera being kept on Elizabeth when Gregory left the apartment was a very nice touch.

[ethanvahlere]

This is the first episode where Matthew Rhys' accent slipped. The whole scene where Philip confronts Elizabeth about Gregory, his real accent came out. It is justified in that his character is upset, but it was a little weird.

I do wish the dialogue of the show weren't as on-the-nose as it's been at times, but other than that, I thought this was a pretty good episode. It was nice to see Derek Luke again, and while I could predict Margo Martindale was going to be Philip and Elizabeth's new contact just by the way her character was introduced, I liked her in the role ultimately.

[Anthony W]

Soooo...Phil paid all that money for the plans to our missile defense system? Jokes on him, that thing doesn't work. :)

[larapu2000]

I think the dead KGB guy was a company man to the end, and set his wife up that way so that if he was killed, the loose end would be tied up.

Maybe...but if he was a company man to the end, why did he jeopardize his own KGB operations when he married her, got her pregnant, and moved to Philly instead of operating out of Boston? I think he thought Phillip and Elizabeth would be able to protect her somehow. What he should have done was left her with a boatload of cash and told her to get the F out of town if he went missing.

I LOVED that confrontation scene between Phillip and Elizabeth, the heartbreak and anger was really palpable. Matthew Rhys really killed it in this episode. That blind spot ass whooping was a thing of glory.

I also thought it was crazy they weren't told they had a new handler. I don't know who that old lady is, but I can dig on a character that is so violently contradictory (seemingly sweet to the wife when she's just going to murder her.)

[Mars477]

Soooo...Phil paid all that money for the plans to our missile defense system? Jokes on him, that thing doesn't work. :)

Hah. But imagine what the Soviets must have been thinking. The Americans developing a big fucking laser that can shoot down every ballistic missile over an entire country? That must have been scary, at least until they found out it was just a pipe dream. Oh, the eighties.

Edited by Mars477, Feb 14, 2013 @ 1:33 AM.

[vadare]

Loved this episode!

How much am I loving this show? At some point during Lent, I'm going to have to go to Confession. One of the things I'll have to confess is tonight, as I was in church singing in the choir, I was thinking in the back of my head, "Damn! I didn't record The Americans...now I've got to be home before 10!" (I made it with 10 minutes to spare!)

I pretty much knew that the spy's wife was toast...and I'm sure the KGB killed her, not so much because she was inconvenient, but as a message to the FBI "we got her".

I am liking the Elizabeth/Phillip dynamic. Are they in love or aren't they? This is the most intriguing thing about the show...not so much the espionage.

My question: Did Phillip and Elizabeth pretty much know the KGB was going to kill the wife and are they trying not to think about it?

Phillip kicking ass was kick ass!

AnthonyW said:

Soooo...Phil paid all that money for the plans to our missile defense system? Jokes on him, that thing doesn't work. :)

Well...that was hardly common knowledge back in the day...Gorbachev was certainly buying it when he met with Reagan at Reykjavik and that's a long way's away.

[shockey80te]

Derek Luke and Margo Martindale? Of course I was going to love the ep.

I didn't foresee Derek Luke and Felicity being a couple while she was married. I thought he was excellent in the ep, but I'm biased. I've been a fan of his since Catch a Fire. Their chemistry made it easy to believe their past relationship.

Regarding Joyce, I initially agreed with Gregory and Elizabeth that she had to die. Then I hoped that she really was going to get to Cuba although the rape van was a bad omen. Joyce ending up with a fake O.D. and Oskar being shipped to Russia was ice cold. It was also the best way to show the real consequences of this life.

I think he thought Phillip and Elizabeth would be able to protect her somehow. What he should have done was left her with a boatload of cash and told her to get the F out of town if he went missing.

I agree. I also think they might've actually done it if they'd known about the marriage/baby from the beginning and didn't have it dumped in their laps. The only part of the ep I didn't like was that it seemed Joyce picked up on the "her husband is a spy" thing too quickly. That seems like a big leap IMO.

[Mary Jane Fields]

What was that song at the end? A late 70s/ early 80s song I don't recognize is a rarity.

I know Bryan Ferry's voice anywhere but I couldn't make out if it was Roxy Music or Bryan Ferry solo.

ETA: closed captioning said the song at the end was Roxy Music's "Sunset"

Thank you, Rickster. I knew that was Bryan Ferry.

This is the first episode where Matthew Rhys' accent slipped.

Actually, in the pilot it slipped when he pronounced 'electricity' as EL-ek-tricity and last week he pronounced 'secretary' as SEK-reh-tree. I missed it this week so I'll have to watch again. Maybe a Matthew Rhys' Welsh is Showing thread is in order?

[dezi]

Another awesome episode. Matthew Rhys killed it, again. No surprise. Keri Russell brought it too. It was good to see the brief role reversal where Phillip shut Elizabeth out and she had to work her way back in; which she did well. Nice to see that he's not in this alone and she is approaching the same level of investment as he has had for a while.

I am ready to see them do something utterly reprehensible now. I was hoping they would be forced to kill Robert's wife and baby. Unfortunately, they continued to keep their hands clean. Too clean for it to be realistic.

[benteen]

Going to Cuba must be the Russian eqivulent of "We sent the dog to a farm in upstate New York."

I didn't think they would kill the baby. There was no reason to, it wouldn't remember anything. I figured they would dump it off at some orphanage out of the country but giving it to the grandparents made a lot more sense.

I don't know what Robert was thinking. I think he thought too that Elizabeth and Phillip would protect her. They both wanted to but they were going to have no choice but to follow orders. Talking with Margo Martindale's character about it first might have given Phillip the relief he needed to deal with it but he's just fooling himself.

[Rickster]

Unfortunately, they continued to keep their hands clean. Too clean for it to be realistic.

I don't know. I'd think the KGB would make every effort to protect assets like Philip and Elizabeth, who are so deeply placed and keep their hands as clean as possible. Every dead body results in an investigation that could lead back to them.

[madam magpie]

Oh boy! Another great episode. The wife was obviously toast from the start, and I think that realistically the baby should have been too, but that might have been hard for the audience to stomach. Also, I can buy that the Soviets want to bring up the next generation as good communists, so taking the baby home was all right.

I kept thinking too that, on the one hand, it was nice to see that Elizabeth did something stupid because she was human. Recruiting and falling for Gregory was a huge risk, and I don't trust him. He's too emotional. But on the other hand, I like her ruthless and badass. I hope she doesn't go too soft. She was awfully soft-hearted in this episode. I want to see her as fully realized and having many emotional layers to her personality, but I really like the gender flip of her having more traditionally masculine traits and Philip being the more showy "feeling" one. I hope the writers keep that up.

The FBI stuff is kind of slow for me because all I want to see is more Philip and Elizabeth, but they need a foil. I get it. And I am worried that they're going to get caught. Stan and John-Boy and the rest of the Feds are so close!

When all is said and done, if this show succeeds, it'll be because of the strength of the lead actors. Mathew Rhys was fantastic, and I just love Keri Russell to pieces. It's so cool to see her get another meaty role where she can really shine. That last scene in the kitchen was lovely and heartbreaking. You really feel how trapped they are. They couldn't get out of this if they wanted to, and it seems like they're now both starting to want to.

ETA: I didn't get the feeling that Elizabeth and Philip knew the KGB was going to kill Robert's wife, so I wonder how they'll react when they find out. It seems like this is being set up for them to turn: either to become double agents for the US, or become more mercenary-like, out for themselves. With the rape and then this, they've suffered two huge betrayals by their country now, so it seems like they'd be ripe for switching sides...or at least, in Elizabeth's case, becoming less dedicated to the Soviet cause.

Edited by madam magpie, Feb 14, 2013 @ 10:32 AM.

[chailey]

Recruiting and falling for Gregory was a huge risk, and I don't trust him. He's too emotional.

He's in love with her, but outside of that, I dunno about the emotional part. He was the one who first matter of factly brought up that the wife and kid should be killed. He's a recruit and a true believer, which probably means that he is even more devoted to the cause than she is. I agree that, down the line, he may be trouble in one way or another. He's actually a good recruit in the sense that the FBI probably wouldn't think of an African American working for the KGB, though perhaps I'm wrong on that. It wasn't that many years before that they saw communist infiltrators in every civil rights and anti-war group out there.

I agree that the FBI part isn't as compelling, but I'm glad that they aren't being made out as keystone cops level incompetent. It is going to get tiring though, if they get foiled every single episode. Hopefully, we'll see some more progress with the tips that the embassy woman is providing them.

Philip's fight scene was awesome, but went by a little fast for me. How did he get hurt? Was it a knife wound?

Things to ponder. If Philip and Elizabeth got nabbed/killed by the FBI, but the KGB swooped up the kids first, would they send them off to Russia?

[attica finch]

Until we learn what Margo's character is called, I'm calling her Magski. Magski Bennetova.

I don't really think a white FBI guy in 1981 would call inner-city Philly 'the hood', but I fully enjoyed the Doug Henning shout out.

I always enjoy watching spy tradecraft. The scene when Gregory picks up Joyce was therefore catnip to me.

I wish I could do what Philip does to folks who get in my blindspots. "I warned them. Twice." Hee! I also liked that the guy behind the desk agreed with that so amiably.

[madam magpie]

He's in love with her, but outside of that, I dunno about the emotional part.

He's a huge risk to her, I mean, not necessarily to the KGB. If he's willing to out her right there to her husband/partner/cover in the middle of a mission, who knows what else he'll do. That makes him unreliable, in my opinion, because he loves her and is willing to let his emotional investment in Elizabeth the person get in the way of the job they're doing. Elizabeth falling in love with Philip is also a huge risk and, from the perspective of "being a good spy," is also stupid. (Though, of course, that's the story we're watching so I'm invested in it; when it comes to Gregory, I'm invested more in Elizabeth and Philip than him.) That's why I think they'll bubble to a point of having to change what they're doing. You can't go around killing people and risking your life and risking your partner's life if you love him; love makes you vulnerable. The kids are already risky enough, but at least they aren't doing anything dangerous and I think that's one reason Elizabeth was somewhat detached from them at first too.

I always enjoy watching spy tradecraft. The scene when Gregory picks up Joyce was therefore catnip to me.

That bit was SO COOL!

Edited by madam magpie, Feb 14, 2013 @ 10:45 AM.

[dezi]

I don't know. I'd think the KGB would make every effort to protect assets like Philip and Elizabeth, who are so deeply placed and keep their hands as clean as possible. Every dead body results in an investigation that could lead back to them.

In this case it would have been an unnecessary risk, but I would like to see them in a position where the big bad KGB can't swoop in and eliminate potential risks while the Jennings get to be blissfully (wilfully?) ignorant as to the extent of their collateral damage. The benevolent spy routine can only be interesting for so long. IMO, the first few episodes have done a good job of setting up their motivations and showing that they are not evil just for the sake of it. So I think there is room for some more ruthlessness and pragmatism without making them unrootable (of course that's a word).

[ElectricBoogalo]

I don't think that Elizabeth and Phillip were necessarily being benevolent and soft by not killing the wife right away. They are given leeway to handle situations on the fly but I think that they were following protocol by not killing her without authorization, especially since it wasn't clear what she knew at first. It wasn't until Phillip talked to Magski (ha, great code name until we get something more than Phillip's "granny" nickname) that they had any guidance in the situation. It's like any other job where you're authorized to make certain decisions to a point and beyond that you need your supervisor's approval. In an emergency situation where their cover is about to be blown, they will be given more leniency if they have to kill someone but the wife wasn't initially a threat to their cover so no need to kill her at that point.

The KGB keeping the kid alive made sense. They get to bring home a Russian child who will grow up being told that his KGB father died bravely in the line of duty by the terrible Americans which will make it that much easier to recruit him later.

Edited by ElectricBoogalo, Feb 14, 2013 @ 11:08 AM.