161 replies to this topic

[name234]

Not spoiled but willing to hazard a guess based on what you have seen Julian Fellows produce over the first two seasons?

Talk about it here.

I am thinking Robert, Lord Grantham, will continue to isolate my last nerves and jump up and down on them a lot as he, as Martha suggested, opts to go the way of the dodo in his management of the estate, only to have the 1929 (years later and off screen) finish the job.


ETA to correct oddly placed end parenthesis.

Edited by name234, Jan 9, 2013 @ 8:33 PM.

[callietwo]

My speculation, based on a conversation that passed between O'Brien & Thomas in S2, while sitting on a staircase, is that O'Brien killed off Vera.

She is VERY protective of Cora now that she knows she (O'Brien) killed off the little male heir and feels guilty as hell about it. When she found out about the mess with the turk maybe getting out and hurting Cora via hurting Mary she took matters into her own hand. And if I'm recalling things, she is behind the reason Vera showing up again so feels responsible to get rid of the woman. That Bates is accused and convicted only slightly weighs on her conscious since she never liked the man to start with. I also think Thomas knows all this, so she's walking a thin line in her retaliation against Thomas for his treatment of her nephew Alfred.

Edited by callietwo, Jan 10, 2013 @ 2:04 PM.

[geillis]

Since this does appear to be a period soap opera:

Mary has become insufferable. Matthew is supportive of Edith and her writing prospects. One can almost see the groundwork being laid for a Matthew/Mary divorce, which would be scandalous because the Anglican Church is not any more approving of divorce than is the Roman Church. However they get through that, I see Edith and Matthew forging an alliance and a romance that leads to a very happy, productive marriage and partnership that continues the line of succession, and results in the estate becoming prosperous for family and tenants alike. (Although with the scandal, it may be difficult for the family to be accepted by the "proper" members of society.)

Or maybe the ground will open up and swallow Mary. I wouldn't miss her. Her character has beome very unlikable as opposed to Edith who has grown and has become a likable character. For crying out sideways: At Sybil's deathbed, when Edith tries to reconcile their relationship, instead of saying they can try to get along better, mary just says something to the effect that it won't be happening.

Cora will never forgive Robert. He may as well move out of the dressing room and make his nighttime domicile in another bedroom suite on the other side of the house and be comfortable.

[Jschoolgirl]

Based on the anvil that Our Lord Creator dropped when Robert said he was so happy that his head or chest or whole self could "explode" on Mary's wedding day, I think he will die.

I also think Carson and Mrs. Hughes will marry after a slow, sweet building up of their relationship. There have already been several quiet and endearing moments between them.

Robert will try to raise, if not adopt, the baby as his own and raise her in the Anglican faith. In return for Tom's consent (fat chance!), he will promise the best education and other advantages, perhaps even considering a university education for her. But only in the arts and humanities -- political science and economics, heaven forbid!

After Robert's death, Matthew and Tom will try to manage the estate in a way that maximize's quality of life for the tenants and villagers.

Edited by Jschoolgirl, Jan 29, 2013 @ 10:37 AM.

[megsara]

I am really wondering what O'Brien's endgame is with Thomas and Jimmy. I fear she's setting up Thomas to be caught in a compromising position, even better if Jimmy is resisting, by Carson, Mrs. Hughes, or even one of the Crawleys. I can't see why else she would be pushing Jimmy to remain friendly with Thomas. It is obviously more than setting him up for a broken heart. In her mind that wouldn't equal Thomas causing the whole situation with Cora.

[randomchance]

I think that Alfred will turn out to actually be O'Brien's son, and that's why she's so fierce about him.

[TVLady]

I think a good topic for Lady Edith's first column (if she takes the job) would be how it was a group of men that had decided the fate of Lady Sybil while she was in labor and in distress. This group of men included Lord Grantham who didn't want to hear any of the details of childbirth, either because he thought it too impolite to talk of such things or he was simply squeamish. And he was the person basically calling all the shots because he was head of the estate and had paid for the good doctor to come. He didn't even bother to ask the opinion of his mother or his wife who had actually gone through childbirth multiple times. Cora had to insert her opinion into the conversation and it was still discounted.

[MiniDriver]

I'm wondering if Daisy and her father-in-law aren't getting a bit too fond of each other. I can't see her with Alfred or Jimmy.

[Sunshine55]

I'm wondering if Daisy and her father-in-law aren't getting a bit too fond of each other. I can't see her with Alfred or Jimmy.

I had that same thought. I hope they don't go there, though, not after William's dad gave that speech about Daisy being his daughter. And I don't think Alfred or Jimmy have any interest in her, although that may change after her foxtrot lessons.

[Jschoolgirl]

Based on the scene where Matthew and Mary come in to see the baby, and Tom hands her to Mary, I think the baby could end up being raised/adopted by Matthew and Mary. Tom, too, could die or be off crusading, writing, and trying to make a living.

[MsLark]

I think Daisy will go to the farm and Tom, based on his talk with Matthew, will wind up there eventually, helping her manage the farm. Don't see a romance there.

[laward]

Yeah, Matthew and Tom touring the farm from last week with Tom revealing some knowlege of farming, looked like a set-up for Tom assuming that tenancy.

That's not the same farm as Daisy's father-in-laws though, is it? And I do think she should snap up her father-in-law's offer.

[MsLark]

No, not the same farm. On more thought, it's probably two different farm story lines. Agree, Tom will either take the tenancy of that farm or partner up with Matthew, and Daisy will go to her FiL's farm. One hopes. She's rather dim, so it's hard to say which way she'll go.

[AliasBatro]

I have this odd feeling that Daisy reluctantly accepts the farm offer, and that James will somehow be linked with her--whether through sincere feelings for her or just to take advantage of her good fortune--after O'Brien's scheme not only gets Thomas fired but forces James out the door as well (to Alfred's benefit).

Edited to eliminate redundant words.

Edited by AliasBatro, Feb 4, 2013 @ 11:26 PM.

[Scoutlet]

I can't see a Tom/Daisy romance. He is pretty well-read and she is sweet but probably has no education. They would have nothing to discuss.

As for Tom giving the baby to M/M, didn't he tell Matthew he would not be separated from her because she is all he has left of Sybil?

[Jschoolgirl]

Tom did say that, but he could also die.

As to Daisy, I know that either Jimmy or Alfred said they thought it would be nice to be your own boss. Whichever one it was will start latching on to Daisy when they hear about the farm.

[Scoutlet]

Sure, Tom could die, I guess. But why? Wouldn't it be a bit much for him to die too suddenly? I mean, anyone can die, but there's no reason to think he will any time soon. He is not going back to Ireland. He said he'll go to Liverpool. What dangers await him there?

And I am sure he would not kill himself. He might have, if not for the baby, but for her sake he won't. She is his life line.

[exzim]

What's the situation with Dan Stevens. I know he's doing a play in NYC, but is he going back to S4. and if not, how will JF deal with his absence. Will he go off to India to manage his inherited estates and only show up when Mary needs to have a baby. Or is a divorce on the way.

[Contralto]

Thinking about how Upstairs, Downstairs wrote Elizabeth out and why Lady Marjorie was on the Titanic . . .

Would Edith's editor be able to reestablish his career in America? He'd be able to get a divorce and marry Edith there, but in England the divorce wouldn't be valid and the marriage would be bigamous. They'd never be able to go back. After the way Robert sabotaged his undervalued daughter's marriage to a neighbor, it would serve him right if he lost her to distance.

[olivia1]

I've only been able to find information that a law passed in 1937 changed grounds for divorce to include that if a spouse had resided under care as insane for five years was legal grounds.I don't know for sure if 1937 is the first time those were legitimate grounds, but if so Edith will have to wait a while for her editor to be free to marry.

I forgot about Edith kissing married farmer guy, so maybe she won't care that he isn't free.

Edited by olivia1, Feb 11, 2013 @ 1:25 PM.

[kathe593]

I'm not sure I believe what he told Edith was true? I really could be wrong, but the hair on the back of neck stood up. Especially after her advice to Rose about married men? Either way it will be fun to watch and see how this plays out.

[Scoutlet]

I don't feel like he was lying, if only because it is an awfully elaborate lie to concoct. But of course I don't get the best feeling from the situation either.

[exzim]

This link takes you to a Daily mail report about Mary's future.

IT COULD BE SEEN AS A SPOILER, so go to the link with caution

http://www.dailymail...rticle-2280708/

[PRgal]

The above article has an error. Mary has a son, not a daughter!

[exzim]

Its the Daily Mail !!. Accuracy doesn't matter, the number of readers any report attracts is its only measure.

[Sunshine55]

I know there's lots of speculation that Rose is going to hook up with Branson next season. But since she seems to be Sybil 2.0, I could see them putting her together with Jimmy as another class-crossing love relationship. That would cause all kinds of tension, upstairs and downstairs, and it would likely get Thomas plotting new nefarious schemes.

[Pallas429]

That's a sensational idea, Sunshine55. "Silly and vain," said Mrs. Hughes about Jimmy (and the court will hear no further testimony), and Rose is a just a breathmint away from that depiction. Then too there's what's implied about Jimmy's eye to bettering himself through the favors of susceptible ladies.

Who would be more aghast: the Dowager Countess, Cora, Carson or Bates? While, as Thomas agonized and schemed, the only person more delighted than the couple themselves with their shenanigans would be O'Brien.

[Constantinople]

In Season 4, Baby Crawley will have a health scare, thereby causing everyone to fret that Downton will pass to even more distant, downwardly mobile relation, only for the baby to recover miraculously.

In fact, I'm surprised Mary didn't have twin boys so that Fellowes could off one of them. He's averaging about 1.5-2 each onscreen characters each season. Even more if you include people who never appeared on screen such as James & Patrick Crawley, William's mother, Reggie Swire's first two heirs (for that matter, I can't recall if Reggie every appeared on screen).

So someone will have to buy the farm next season (that's a hint, Daisy, to decline Mr Mason's offer). In fact, now that I think about it, Mr Mason probably will die next season, thereby forcing Daisy to choose between farm & kitchen.

[not Bridget]

Hmmm... I gladly spoiled myself at UK websites & have posted in the UK thread, even though I didn't actually see this series/season until PBS ran it. The mods would have (rightly) given me the heave-ho for posting in this thread. But the cat is out of the bag, in a manner of speaking....

Remember the Duke who visited in series 1? Who was really only interested in Mary's huge fortune, although he took the opportunity to steal incriminating letters from Thomas? Who left when Robert said the entail would stand--to Mary's huge disappointment?

What if, after the mourning is over, Mary meets another Duke? A decent fellow with a grand, well-run estate--who falls head over heels in love with her. She's quite beautiful, after all--and fertile. Would Mary take a chance to move to an even grander pile, hobnob with the very best & don some really excellent family jewels--or give it up to stay at Dear Old Downton? I think she'd leave in a minute. Matthew Jr (or whatever they name him) can spend lots of time with Grandma & Grandpa--after all, the staff does most of the child raising. And he can be shipped off to school in a few years....

Whatever does happen, Mary will still not have an independent fortune; it will be tied up with the estate. I'd love it if she could at least spend time in London--but I fear she may remain entrapped in The Downton Triangle....

[kostgard]

I know there's lots of speculation that Rose is going to hook up with Branson next season. But since she seems to be Sybil 2.0, I could see them putting her together with Jimmy as another class-crossing love relationship. That would cause all kinds of tension, upstairs and downstairs, and it would likely get Thomas plotting new nefarious schemes.

I like this idea a lot better than any Branson/Rose speculation. While I think Branson may be attracted to Rose's spirit, I think he needs someone a bit more mature now. I could see Branson either falling for an upper class woman (who many may see as above him) or a working class woman (who many would see as a step down from his current position and may alienate him from the family further) and he's gotta figure out which direction he wants to move in.

But Rose and Jimmy are really on right about the same level and I could see them attracted to one another and both are silly enough to go for it and try something. I think Thomas would try to genuinely help Jimmy by warning him away, but Jimmy would probably blow him off, telling him he's just jealous (probably true) and would cite Branson as an example of a relationship like that working out (Jimmy never seemed all that in love with work and he'd be more than happy to trade his livery for white tie and tails and join the family in the dining room). Thomas would then probably turn to scheming to keep them apart, and it will probably blow up his relationship with Jimmy since Thomas' schemes generally go awry, but Thomas will also somehow find himself promoted to co-butler or something since failing upward also always seems to be an outcome of his schemes.

While Branson will obviously play a larger role in helping Robert run the estate, I'd kinda like to see Mary try to take Matthew's place at the table. That would be more interesting than just seeing how quickly she remarries. She's smart and obviously eager to keep Downton afloat, so I'd like to see her try.

ETA: Alfred really needs to become Isobel's new cook. He's got the makings of a true foodie (though it was odd that when the servants got to eat all the food meant for Edith's wedding he was thoroughly unimpressed and just wanted some cheese. Maybe that meal woke his palate up). I would love him Alfred to become a better cook than Mrs. Patmore, only to see the look on the DC's face when she realizes that Isobel managed to land a better cook than even the main house.

Edited by kostgard, Feb 19, 2013 @ 5:35 PM.