88 replies to this topic

[TWoP Tennison]

A new patient exposes Arden's past; Kit learns why Grace was admitted to Briarcliff.

[carried away]

Kit's "confession" to Jude made me weep with agony. I think this has been the best episode of the series. The Anne Frank storyline, character, and actor who plays the character are really good. I was riveted. And I guess Dr. Thredson is a different kind of evil doctor, I like it! I didn't think I would get into plots changing season to season, but I am loving this now!

[hawkjs]

I'm loving the story and premise this season, and the way in which the characters and plot are unraveling. However, I really wish they would tone it down on the sexual stuff. I understand horror tends to be very sexual and I have a high tolerance for it on TV, but some of the scenes lately seem a little unnecessary.

Edited by hawkjs, Nov 7, 2012 @ 11:10 PM.

[fester01]

All right. ZQ is officially a bad guy, IMO. He actually made me think of him as a young Dr. Arden tonight when he was talking (kinda dirty) to the reporter: "I see myself in you." "We both need to jump in." And the "treatment" scene was totally screwed up. Also, he went through her house looking for dirty pictures? Bleh.

So Joseph Fiennes' character is in on it, too. I can only go ahead and assume the boss nun is as well. LOVED Franke Potente as Anne Frank. Girl's got guts (and the way this season is going, we will see them outside of her body really soon).

What is Mary Eunice up to? Just random mayhem, or is there a bigger plan with her? Curious to see.

[Nightmare Logic]

First off....murder baby? Yes please.

Second, of all the disturbing things on the 2nd installment of American Horror Story (Aliens, Zombies, Exorcism, Demons...and now Nazis) I have to say the Lana conversion therapy tops them all in my book.

Hey...anyone want some bread? That was just unsanitary.

Dr. Spock (No wait that's not right...) has to be up to something. He is being to nice to my new tv girlfriend Lana. I don't trust him. He has moved waaaay up my Bloody Face list.

[Candy Moocher]

I love Franka Potente, have since Run, Lola, Run and The Bourne Identity. Curious to see how long she survives in there.

I'm not surprised that Grace is actually guilty of her crimes: in a mental institution like that, someone has to be guilty. Lana's conversion therapy was truly fucked up, as was ...whatever had been done to Shelly. Father Fiennes is in on whatever Arden is doing to patients? Wow. I wonder if he's a Nazi, too?

[johchi]

I couldn't decide if Sister Jude believed Kit's (sort-of) confession or not.

I wish I could un-hear the word tumescence.

[burtog]

I love Franka Potente, have since Run, Lola, Run and The Bourne Identity. Curious to see how long she survives in there.

Agreed, I'm a huge fan of hers (both aesthetically, and as an actress) but I'm afraid to say that ... I talked about how much I like both Clea Duvall & Chloe Sevigny and now one is dead and the other is a legless mutant. I'm hoping that my appreciation of Potente doesn't mean that she'll be dead in 2 weeks.

I have to admit that I'm at a point that I need some more progress in the stories that they've provided us so far. I feel like every week adds another level of horror but I don't even really know what the point of it all is - there just isn't enough progression, story-wise, in any of the subplots to be truly interesting to me. If this is just a season of build-up upon build-up, leading to just a "Holy Sh~t!" ending, I'll be disappointed. At least last season had the framework of the haunted house ... this season seems to be based on how much stuff can be thrown against the wall & still stick.

I can see it being just as easy to read the reviews after the fact than it is to actually watch it transpire.

[KermitD.Frog]

So glad we got more Kit this ep. Man, that confession was hard to watch. And the "flashbacks" to his supposed crimes were unbearable. Does poor Kit actually believe Dr. Threds? He obviously sees the thing Arden took out of his neck, so how does he explain this? And his desperate sex with Grace actually made me clench up. He's so lonely in that place, he's willing to take an obviously sociopathic/psychopathic Grace rather than be alone. Her face when they were screwing was just too much. I could practically see the thought bubble over her head: "Fished in!" Wouldn't a sexually traumatized girl who's gone from being molested by her (obviously not French) dad straight to a clinical asylum be wary of sex and not outwardly looking for it? She didn't even flinch when he grabbed her neck and seemed turned on when they talked about her being afraid of him. I don't trust her at all.

I had to laugh when Dr. Arden said he was from Scottsdale. Scottsdale, dammit!

I guess he lost Kit's transmitter again. Maybe it grew octopus arms and unscrewed the lid of its own jar?

Poor Shelley! Please tell me she gets put out of her misery soon. I can't even imagine what he did to her. And what else he would have to do to her to get her to want to eat raw meat in the woods like the other poor mutants.

Is it too early to make Citizen Toxie jokes?

Is Threds in love with Lana? He seems a bit obsessed. I thought for sure he was going to try his own tumescence for her conversion. Instead he found a girly looking guy.

Seems they're setting up Arden to be Bloody Face. Maybe he gave himself some of that "live forever" serum he gave Shelley and that's how he's still alive in 2012. Who else had the surgical knowledge to remove skin and heads? Dun-dun-dun!

Nice shoutout, using John Cromwell to play Young Arden.

Mary Eunice and the Barbed Cane. Sounds like a Dresden Dolls song.

I wish I knew how Kit was found, if he was bloody, is Alma's body was nearby, etc. He seems to think she's still alive (at least, he did). He's been there for awhile, now, it seems. Althought they didn't actually say which month Alma had been killed, the first two girls were killed in January and then March, so if that's a pattern, Alma might have been killed in May, then maybe Wendy in July. Now, it's November and we haven't had another murder. Yet.

[fester01]

Edited because it was not strictly episode-related.

Edited by fester01, Nov 8, 2012 @ 12:02 AM.

[hunterhunted]

Is Threds in love with Lana? He seems a bit obsessed. I thought for sure he was going to try his own tumescence for her conversion. Instead he found a girly looking guy.

I felt like something was off in his reactions to her. Less in his use of aversion and conversion therapy. That would have been leading edge science, but not unheard of therapy at that time. I felt like Ryan Murphy was drawing parallels to the John Money and his work on sexual identity and gender (see As Nature Made Him to understand the horrors). My weirdness meter goes off when Thredson is so effusive about offering Lana help and getting her out of the asylum. Why? He barely knows her. And why her? It's just strange that he's so invested in her.

Dr. Arden is a Nazi. Not surprised after Shelley's amputations.

Kit's confession broke my heart. Even though I think the alien thing is stupid, I want them to exist to prove that Kit is actually innocent.

[Glitterkittens]

Oooh I loved this episode.

First, Lana and ZQ: I said last week that I got the feeling he was digging her, and now that's pretty much settled. Still not sure what the connection might be with him and the murders, but he has to be connected, considering he all but admitted to Lana that he felt someone else was responsible for the crimes and then did such a mindfuck on Kit this week. Either way, it keeps going back and forth between being very creepy (that horrible aversion/conversion scene) and genuinely as though he sees himself as her savior. I was really glad the 'conversion' didn't involve him getting all rapey with her, which in some twisted way for me makes his interest in her more genuine or fleshed out.
**And then we have the hint that the cops are starting to realize it would take a skilled doctor to filet a body that well, and it's a given that Dr. Arden is way too busy with a billion other horrific crimes to be Bloody Face.

I actually LOVED the Anne Frank take. There's actually a lot of controversy at this point regarding the authenticity of the diary. I liked the idea that she survived but saw herself as a figure, and I feel like I'm probably going to very, very slowly realize it's connected/a tribute to a whole bunch of plots and ideas. Poor Franke. She never fares well in an institution and I don't see her making it very long, given the previews for next week imply the doctor is walking off his bullet wound. Also like the smooth redemption it offered Sister Jude...

Which leads me to my favorite scene, and that was her with Kit. First of all, they're the two best actors/fleshed out characters on the show (I think Evan Peters could have sexual tension with a chair) so watching them interact was a delight that we've been deprived of otherwise this season. And seeing how empathetic she actually was towards him, and how she was second guessing herself and realizing she might actually be more of a monster than he is, that was awesome.

I don't believe Grace at all. I think she tells whatever story she needs at the moment. And I think that like Sister Jude, she needs to be absolved, so she's latching on to Kit as the one innocent in the institution.

Edited by Glitterkittens, Nov 8, 2012 @ 1:56 AM.

[Snookums]

So Joseph Fiennes' character is in on it, too. I can only go ahead and assume the boss nun is in on it as well.

What I loved was the deliberate ambiguity of the phone call--"They're on to you, Arden, so if you have any housekeeping to do do it now."

That could mean getting rid of his a) Nazi memorabilia, b)really disturbing pictures, or c) his latest victim at the asylum. The whole "watch me smoke a cigarette like so many Nazis in the movies" bit may have been a hint, but it really could be any one of those three possibilities.

As far as the Mother Superior is concerned, I'd say she's not. She pretty openly held the men of the church in contempt, right up to the pope; "their first concern is to protect themselves." She seemed impatient with Jude for investing so much in a weak, fallible man, and feeling a mere man could have given Jude a "sense of mission."

And speaking of, what the hell is the Monsignor's mission anyway? The only thing he seems involved in is "exposing" evil, and if he's best buddies with a NAZI WAR CRIMINAL then he's doing it wrong, to say the least. Jude has really dumped her entire sense of well being into this man's lap and it's not clear why at all.

Jude got a bit of redemption with Kit's anguished confession and her latest humblings thanks to the local demon. She wants so desperately to believe God can forgive her she's even willing to help out an inmate without caning!

Poor Kit. He's fallen for the oldest inmate trick in the book--I Believe You No Matter What. It helps that Grace could pose for Zooborns without the slightest adjustment of hair and makeup--she couldn't look more helpless/fragile/innocent if she tried. Is it wrong that I want her bunny slippers?

Anyway, between Kit being clutched in her velvety paws, Arden's little hissy fit/nude slapping session and Thredsen taking time out from his "It's used at Harvard!" techniques to totally fuck with his head, no wonder Kit's a wreck. I doubt I could stand up to any one of those things, let alone all three!

Possessed Eunice seems to be dialing it down a bit this week. Just a few cane suggestions and descreetly dropped folders.

Framing story? What framing story?

Edited by Snookums, Nov 8, 2012 @ 2:20 AM.

[neptune36]

After all of the sinister promos (and last season with her being a total evil and amazing bitch) I will love if Jessica Lange ends up the (fucked up) hero of this season.

Edited by TWoP Tennison, Nov 8, 2012 @ 11:24 AM.
Boards on boards

[Snookums]

And that was considered "humane!" As I seem to be saying every episode, THIS is why civil rights are important!

The real horror behind this season isn't the fucked-upness of the asylum, it's the society that cheerfully allowed shit like this to go on. "Anne" ended up dumped there by cops who didn't want to deal with paperwork on an "involuntary hold"--basically, fuck your basic human rights, you are a prisoner at the mercy of complete strangers.

[Glitterkittens]

[Removed boards on boards quote.]
[I]it is the most horrific and disturbing because unlike all the insanity going on, we know this was a real torture inflicted on people. People shouldn't feel uncomfortable; they should feel empathy, compassion, and disgust. The same thing the holocaust is supposed to evoke.

Additionally:
Grace is based on Lizzy Borden, who also murdered her step-mother and father. Lizzy Bordon also changed her story a bunch of times. And in a weird way, she was sort of a doe-eyed nymph as well.

Edited by TWoP Tennison, Nov 8, 2012 @ 11:25 AM.

[Iriegirl]

What I loved was the deliberate ambiguity of the phone call--"They're on to you, Arden, so if you have any housekeeping to do do it now."

That could mean getting rid of his a) Nazi memorabilia, b)really disturbing pictures, or c) his latest victim at the asylum. The whole "watch me smoke a cigarette like so many Nazis in the movies" bit may have been a hint, but it really could be any one of those three possibilities.

As far as the Mother Superior is concerned, I'd say she's not. She pretty openly held the men of the church in contempt, right up to the pope; "their first concern is to protect themselves." She seemed impatient with Jude for investing so much in a weak, fallible man, and feeling a mere man could have given Jude a "sense of mission."

And speaking of, what the hell is the Monsignor's mission anyway? The only thing he seems involved in is "exposing" evil, and if he's best buddies with a NAZI WAR CRIMINAL then he's doing it wrong, to say the least. Jude has really dumped her entire sense of well being into this man's lap and it's not clear why at all.

Jude got a bit of redemption with Kit's anguished confession and her latest humblings thanks to the local demon. She wants so desperately to believe God can forgive her she's even willing to help out an inmate without caning!

Poor Kit. He's fallen for the oldest inmate trick in the book--I Believe You No Matter What. It helps that Grace could pose for Zooborns without the slightest adjustment of hair and makeup--she couldn't look more helpless/fragile/innocent if she tried. Is it wrong that I want her bunny slippers?

Anyway, between Kit being clutched in her velvety paws, Arden's little hissy fit/nude slapping session and Thredsen taking time out from his "It's used at Harvard!" techniques to totally fuck with his head, no wonder Kit's a wreck. I doubt I could stand up to any one of those things, let alone all three!

Possessed Eunice seems to be dialing it down a bit this week. Just a few cane suggestions and descreetly dropped folders.

Framing story? What framing story?

I thought I heard the doctor say something about "other travelers" during his paranoid musings about the origin of the chip/bug that was in Kit's neck, is the doctor a weirdo nazi shape shifting alien?

[karra]

Interesting that the only CLEAR bad guy are Arden and the Monsignor. The sister is a product of her circumstances, and I have no trouble believing she thinks she is helping. Mary is possessed. Thredson is a product of the era.

[JakeyIsSusan]

I think it's interesting that Sister Jude is slowly finding herself in the same situation as Kit and (to an extent) Lana: Everybody else is dismissing her crazy story, and she's beginning to question her own sanity and reasoning as a result.

I really hope the trend of "let's end the episode with a horrifying shot of Shelly!" ends at two consecutive episodes. Other than the shot of Kit beating Alma to a pulp, it's the most uncomfortable stuff to watch for me.

And I'm a horrible person (or don't know enough about conversion therapy, or was overthinking that this was a Ryan Murphy show), but I really thought that Dr. Thredson was just trying to convince Lana to have sex with him.

[Candy Moocher]

And I'm a horrible person (or don't know enough about conversion therapy, or was overthinking that this was a Ryan Murphy show), but I really thought that Dr. Thredson was just trying to convince Lana to have sex with him.

That's precisely what I thought he was going to do as well. She does what he wants, he'll deem her sane, and she gets to go home. I think I've seen too many movies.

[piya]

That's precisely what I thought he was going to do as well. She does what he wants, he'll deem her sane, and she gets to go home. I think I've seen too many movies.

I want to believe that it's a bit more complex than that, if only because I really like ZQ. I think his character really wants to believe that he is helping Lana because of he is a good doctor. I don't think he has faced his own desire for her.

He really is a product of his time and I don't think he is really a bad guy, just misguided.

OMG Shelley! I really want her to die now - a painless death, because it's obviously too late for her now. And I hope the nazi asshole gets a really agonizing death. And Joseph Fiennes' character could join him too. He is just as bad.

Surprisingly, Sister Jude was sympathetic this episode. Now if she'd just keep trying to do the right thing and take up the Mother Superior's offer. But she is still a self-serving woman and I have to wonder how far her redemption would really go. If her position is threatened, will she buckle?

Grace is obviously disturbed. But I am not sure if she really was a victim of parental abuse or was it just another story to get Kit's sympathy. At this point, it could go either way.

Edited by piya, Nov 8, 2012 @ 6:57 AM.

[KermitD.Frog]

(I think Evan Peters could have sexual tension with a chair)

Sing it, sister!

I love that, in the beginning, it seemed like most of the inmates who were innocent are now being proven as guilty and the craziest ones (head banger and chronic masterbater, et al) were actually quite sane before they arrived. And now we're finding out that everyone running the place is evil, with only Sister Jude as an exception. Even though she's guilty of a crime, she sees her guilt and feels real remorse towards the girl, unlike the Mons., Arden, and now Mary Eunice. I wonder ir poor Eunice is in there, aware of what the devil is making her do?

And speaking of, what the hell is the Monsignor's mission anyway? The only thing he seems involved in is "exposing" evil, and if he's best buddies with a NAZI WAR CRIMINAL then he's doing it wrong, to say the least. Jude has really dumped her entire sense of well being into this man's lap and it's not clear why at all.

I think he must have seen her possibilities at some point when she was just a Private First Class Nun, and offered her the job as caretaker at the asylum as his "partner". Who knows, maybe he was under the impression that she would be easy to manipulate?

I think it's interesting that Sister Jude is slowly finding herself in the same situation as Kit and (to an extent) Lana: Everybody else is dismissing her crazy story, and she's beginning to question her own sanity and reasoning as a result.

I bet she'll be an inmate before the season is out, too. Makes you wonder just how many real supernatural events get swept under the rug as insanity, even today.

As for Kit's "memories" of killing Alma (or just what he imagined that he might have done) - he was the one who wanted to tell everyone, she wanted to keep quiet. Why would she suddenly be running to the door to confess their love to his asshole friends and Kit be so freaked out by it that he killed her? Seems like it would have been the other way around.

If Grace really did feel guilt and remorse for what she'd done, I don't think she would have pulled her own sister and her boyfriend into her origianl story to Kit. She would have blamed a random stranger (a la In Cold Blood). But she blames the actual person who saw her commit the murders, making her the guilty party instead of the innocent victim?

[Nightmare Logic]

[Remove boards on boards quote]

I'd agree with you if this was one of Ryan Murphy's over the top moments but he was strangely subtle in this and that made it all the easier to identify with Lana (even my straight friends found it horrifying). I think that Kit and Grace have gotten too much attention on this show and I think the show is at its best when it is telling Lana's story and how she wants so much to get out and tell her expose but how little by little the asylum is seeping into her. I think Lana at this point is the most solid character and that has alot to do with Sarah Paulson.

Edited by TWoP Tennison, Nov 8, 2012 @ 11:27 AM.

[mochamajesty]

Was there any.significance to the creepy whistling that Anne used too divert Jude's questions in the opening scene? Jude seemed scared and couldn't get out of that room fast enough.

[blackburn]

But she blames the actual person who saw her commit the murders, making her the guilty party instead of the innocent victim?

Maybe she hates her sister for not believing she was abused? I am not sure I buy her story too, but if it was true that's the most rational explanation I can think of. I'm just perplexed why Grace is committed to an insane asylum rather than being given the electric chair. Based on sister Jude's reaction it looked like she confessed to committing the murders.

I wonder why the devil hates Grace/is so interested in separating her and Kit.

[Miles Prower]

Yay Franka Potente! I love her and always love when she gets work. So sad that she isn't more famous in the states. For the longest time it seemed like only muscle packed morons from germany/austria could get any tracktion over at your side of the pond. Now at least we have Christoph Waltz. Maybe Franka Potente can get a second chance as well. :)
I think the first time I saw her was in Anatomie (didn't see "Lola rennt" until much later), which ties in quite nicely with what the good doctor is doing in the asylum right now.


So our doctor is a Nazi war criminal and probably the actual bloody face. Interesting. The Nazi war criminal thing just makes sense. Even though I did not put that together myself. I just didn't realize, that this would be set just 20 years after the Nazi regime fell. Seems like ages between those times.

Sister Mary Satan continues to be delightfully mischievous. I look foreward to what she's going to set in motion next episode.

Edited by Miles Prower, Nov 8, 2012 @ 9:15 AM.

[annalisa]

I liked this episode. I would like the series much more if they lost the mutants and the aliens.

The cruelty that humans inflict on one another coupled with religious fear, mental illness, medical experiments and the ignorance of that time period are enough horror for me.

Just blaming some things on aliens and crawling microchips makes me lose interest.

[KermitD.Frog]

I wonder if Kit's confession to Jude made her feel better or worse after seing an alien herself?

I wonder why the devil hates Grace/is so interested in separating her and Kit.

Good question. Could be something as easy as "they're happy together so seperate them to make them suffer" or it could have deeper meaning. I thought Sister Mary Satan (great name, blackburn!) was going to rape Kit when she brought him back to his cell.

I was also on board with those who thought Threds was going to try to "convert" Lana with his own genitalia. See what you're doing, AHS? You shove so much sex in my face (no pun intended) that I expect it at every opportunity. Then, when there's none, I'm just that much more confused.
Reason #129 on why I love this show.

Edited by KermitD.Frog, Nov 8, 2012 @ 12:01 PM.

[circe221]

I can't STAND Chloe Sevin-whatever her name is so I am thrilled to pieces (no pun intended) that she is finally locked in a closet without any way to get around. Hopefully she'll be put out of her misery soon never to be seen on AHS again.

I definitely got the Lizzie Borden reference, which got me wondering if each character is supposed to be an alternate universe version of someone else (i.e. LB, Anne Frank).

[blackburn]

I weirdly don't want Grace to be evil. It's been there done that with AHS Horror House, and if she lied it'll just make her Tate 2.0 and Kit as Violet 2.0.

But I do like the direction the show is going. Sister Jude might not be so evil after all. I know she believes in corporal punishment, but that's not uncommon for those times and it's nothing compared to what Arden is doing.