31 replies to this topic

[SnarklePuss]

300th episode. Does anyone know which episode the archival footage (of Olivia and Munch) came from?

[Scorpiosrule]

300th episode. Does anyone know which episode the archival footage (of Olivia and Munch) came from?

Definitely from the first season. At first, I thought they were just editing scenes from first season into this one, but the conversation between Cragen and Munch in the flashback, nipped that theory in the bud.

I can't seem to recall which episode it was...and imdb is no help. Nothing clicked when I searched through the episode summaries.

Not sure how I feel about this one, though. Again, so sex crime, and so...why SVU?

[Brina24]

That was pretty good actually. I wonder what they are trying to do with Cragen though? Is it meant to be that after te scandal then he is being careful? But last week he let the squad interfere with a terrorist plot so...
To me he came across as more onstructive(if that's the word) than careful. When they were putting the pieces together he was absolutely adamant that the boys father took him in the original case, he wouldn't even consider the possibility, even when more similarities started showing up. Yeah, the two amcasea couldve been coincidence but at least investigate before shutting it down.I half expected him to start going 'lalala can't hear youu!!'. If they are trying to say he's wary of getting into trouble again, then that's understandable but it came off as over- stubbornness, especially in light of last weeks,' if they want to fire me, they know where to find me.'
In other news, yay Munch and Young!munch. Always a pleasure seeing him.
Olivia was really pretty back in the day wasn't she? I almost forgot that she had that length hair before she went short and fabulous. .
Love Rollins too, is she like the tech girl now? She seems to always have a laptop in her hands giving information on case of the week.
Fin: was there.
Amaro: snore....

[kirinan]

My favorite line of the night (heck, of the whole one-plus seasons I've been watching), from Amaro in the cold case storage room: "There's something to be said about working Cold Case..." Nice nod to Danny Pino's signature role. As an ardent CC fan, I felt like I was in on a private little joke. Okay, not so private, but still, I enjoyed it. And I was very happy that there were no Scotty-style blow-ups this week.

The episode itself I thought was very well-done, very tense, and my heart broke for Hector's mother. The actress did a wonderful job. I love seeing Nick and Liv partnered up again, and everyone got a fairly equal part of the spotlight. I'm really happy that they're using Munch more this season. His character's great, and he was in it very little last year so these episodes are really the first chance I've had to see him in action. Oh, and Tom Sizemore was a great bad guy. I know who he is, and I remember hearing about all his personal troubles, but I haven't really seen him in much. Excellent actor.

[Bunny LaJoya]

Hamish Linklater was the father! I'm such a fan of his from New Adventures of Old Christine. He plays Julia Louis Dreyfus's brother.

When it came to the acting choices of Hamish (as Wyatt's father) and Mili Avital (as Wyatt's mother) I experienced a range of finding them interesting to strange to funny. They really took these acting parts seriously.

When I read the credits, it was really obvious that Tom Sizemore was going to be the suspect. Oh well.

Edited by Bunny LaJoya, Oct 25, 2012 @ 9:47 AM.

[Brina24]

Been thinking about the flashback scenes and unless they are from a genuine season 1 episode which I don't think they are, then I think they must have taken scenes from season 1 and just dubbed over them with stuff about this case. I don't recall any character saying any thing about the case in a flashback scene while the camera was on them. Just general stuff. If that's the case then it looked good, like the clips were from an actual past episode. If not and it is an actual episode then, I wonder which one?

[Scorpiosrule]

That's what I thought--that they just took scenes from season one and edited it in--but they had Munch say Hector's name in his flashback with Cragen, and then Olivia tacking the picture of Hector on the board.

Granted, I don't remember this case at all from the first season, and I've watched the first season episodes at least three times, though it's been awhile since the last rewatch.

[natalie wood]

This epi was one of the best I've seen in a while. Even if the clips were edited I thought they were great. It's really too bad there was no Huang. I always liked him and think his observations would have helped this case. I really miss the court side of the show. I can just imagine Alex with this case and Judith Light as the judge. Definitely not going to happen with Stephanie March on another show but I would have enjoyed seeing that esp if that was a case from season 1. Alex would remember that case even if it went unsolved.

Edited by natalie wood, Oct 25, 2012 @ 11:44 AM.

[Scorpiosrule]

Alex would have been the prosecuting attorney then.

Nope. Stephanie March didn't joint the show until Season 2. Season one didn't have an ADA. We saw Angie Harmon's Abby Carmichael, and a couple of other rotating ADAs.

I think they should just remove the SVU from this show, because clearly, it seems this unit can do any and all kinds of cases. I don't ever recall this unit being filled with so many detectives before. And when I say that, I mean, the precinct was bursting with cops. Isnt' this supposed to be an Elite unit, with only a chosen few?

It doesn't resemble SVU in any shape or form--with the looong cold opens, and that moaning/groaning music that is more Criminal Intent than SVU or even the mothership.

[Gatesgirl]

The first flashback scene (Olivia looking up at the window) was when she was looking for her father in season one. She then went back to the car and tells Elliot that the guy she was looking up at is not her father (the picture in her hand was a picture of her father). I don't remember which episode it was. The second flashback scene is from Nocturne. Munch was watching footage of the pedophile piano teacher abuse student after student. The last flashback with Olivia putting the picture on the bulletin board is from Hysteria. Olivia stays up all night and strings together a series of dead prostitutes holding hands like paper dolls. There was some fancy editing and dubbing over original photos and dialogue--and for that, I think they suck big time. Leave season one alone! Re-writing history to serve your story line is just lazy writing. And of course, not a single mention of Elliot. It was the giant elephant in the room. Just mention him and move on.

I did like the story (aside from the crapping all over season one). I actually cried for Hector's mom and was worried for Wyatt. It's been a long time since this show made me feel anything but embarrassment for it.

[Scorpiosrule]

Thanks Gatesgirl. I thought I was going crazy, because when I saw the first flashback, I said, WAIT! Liv was looking at a guy she thought might be her dad, not Hector's mom!

I don't understand why Olivia couldn't just say she was working with Elliot back then. No, she had to say she was a newbie and "we all" worked on it. Who all?

[natalie wood]

Wow Scorpiosrule,

You have a terrific memory. I had totally forgotten that. I loved SM's Alex so of course I would think it was her. Although AH's Carmichael was a hard ass so I liked her, too. I always liked the hard ass ADAs esp on SVU b/c the crimes they investigate are heinous. Being a mother I'd want the ADA to be a freakin pit bull.

On a truly superficial level MH looked great in those flashbacks.

Edited by natalie wood, Oct 25, 2012 @ 1:22 PM.

[TD3000]

It doesn't resemble SVU in any shape or form--with the looong cold opens, and that moaning/groaning music that is more Criminal Intent than SVU or even the mothership.

This, especially the last 2 minutes or so with the happy music when the kid was reunited with his parents and also the vigil scene afterwards.

I don't remember which episode it was. The second flashback scene is from Nocturne. Munch was watching footage of the pedophile piano teacher abuse student after student.

I recognized that episode right away, which left me confused. Also knew the other 1st season clips, but couldn't place them until you reminded me.

Why couldn't Olivia just say "my old/former partner"? Oh well.

[MurlocGurgle]

Wasn't Milli Avital in the very first episode - she was also on other L&O episodes. I remember her as the architect who had been one of many military gangrape victims.

ETA: absolutely no mention or kudos for that poor noncop who figured it all out - I thought he was a darling for doing it.

Edited by MurlocGurgle, Oct 25, 2012 @ 6:56 PM.

[txhorns79]

Definitely from the first season. At first, I thought they were just editing scenes from first season into this one, but the conversation between Cragen and Munch in the flashback, nipped that theory in the bud.

I think they just re-dubbed whatever conversation Cragen and Munch actually had at the time. I noticed when Munch specifically referenced the case from 1999 in the flashback, they only showed the back of his head, so you wouldn't be able to tell he was really talking about something else.

On a truly superficial level MH looked great in those flashbacks.

Seriously. It's a shame whatever she's done to herself, because the way she looks now has zero to do with her simply aging.

I thought it was a good episode. There was some real emotion, a decent storyline. I'd say the only weakness were the flashbacks. They were unnecessary, and I felt like they could have had the same storyline without actually needing to see the younger version of the characters dealing with the case.

[Penny Robinson]

My favorite line of the night (heck, of the whole one-plus seasons I've been watching), from Amaro in the cold case storage room: "There's something to be said about working Cold Case..." Nice nod to Danny Pino's signature role.

LOVED the Cold Case shout out! Weeee!!!

So Tom Sizemore molested the other kids, but didn't molest Wyatt?

[KSCeres]

I thought this was one of the better episodes lately. The pacing was good and the flashbacks didn't take up too much of the story.
Hector's mother was great and I really felt for her. Wyatt's parents, not so much.

[OUCellogal]

I'm almost positive the music at the beginning and the end was another Cold Case shoutout; that show always began its episodes with a flashback (featuring music from the time period du jour) and ended with a musical montage showing the various key players being all thoughtful and reflective. YMMV as to whether or not that worked, and ditto with the flashbacks. A former Cold Case die-hard, I followed Danny Pino to SVU, so I quite enjoyed the Cold Case sort of feel to this episode, but it's true, it didn't truly feel like an episode of SVU.

I thought not mentioning Elliott was weird enough to be seriously distracting. You can mention the guy's name, people.

So glad they found Wyatt alive.

Edited by OUCellogal, Oct 25, 2012 @ 9:40 PM.

[alynch]

I immediately recognized the Munch flashback because I remembered that line, "I got two more tapes to watch." It was one of Belzer's best acting moments. That was the only dialogue he delivered camera on within the flashback; everything else was dubbed over with his back to the camera.

[melissa1925]

When I saw Olivia in those flashback, the first thought that came to mind was that she looked so much like the beautiful Selena.

I remembered right away that Olivia was looking up at her 'father' in the window.

[Princess Lucky]

I immediately recognized the Munch flashback because I remembered that line, "I got two more tapes to watch." It was one of Belzer's best acting moments.

Same here, I immediately remembered that. That was such a soul-crushing moment and Belzer was so good. Ah, old school SVU, making us experience powerful emotions.

That said, who am I kidding, I still enjoy the show. I was a big fan of Criminal Intent as well so the shift in tone doesn't bother me. I do agree that it doesn't quite feel like SVU but still, in my opinion, the show in its current state is more enjoyable than the more out there "monkey in the basketball"/"that's not an objection you're raising" last couple of seasons before Stabler left. Even though some of those episodes were freakin' hilarious.

I liked the edited moments from the first season, firstly because it was awesome to see young Olivia and younger Munch again but also because I found the closing moment with young Olivia quite impactful. There she was, back in 1999, holding the picture of that kid, and we knew that she wouldn't get an answer for 13 years. I liked that moment not in an emotional way, more like in the way I felt when I watched The Constant (the Lost episode). It was cool.

I'm almost positive the music at the beginning and the end was another Cold Case shoutout; that show always began its episodes with a flashback (featuring music from the time period du jour) and ended with a musical montage showing the various key players being all thoughtful and reflective. YMMV as to whether or not that worked, and ditto with the flashbacks.

Well, I only watched Cold Case casually but I must say that every single time I watched a CC episode I found myself weeping at the closing montage. Every. single. time. Without fail. It was the music, I think. And the fact someone was always dead. This episode's closing moments with the family didn't quiiiiiite succeed at tugging at my heartstrings (all I could think of was how smooshed people's faces were getting).

When it came to the acting choices of Hamish (as Wyatt's father) and Mili Avital (as Wyatt's mother) I experienced a range of finding them interesting to strange to funny. They really took these acting parts seriously.

No kidding. I love both actors but come on. Linklater looked good with shorter hair though.

Oh, and Tom Sizemore was a great bad guy. I know who he is, and I remember hearing about all his personal troubles, but I haven't really seen him in much. Excellent actor.

I've always thought he's an amazing actor and he delivered yet again in this episode. It really sucks that he's had all these issues to work through because he could have been one of the greats, in my opinion. I've always thought he stole Heat right from under Pacino and De Niro's noses.

[MurlocGurgle]

It's funny that they made "Girls" regular, Auxiliary Officer Lohmantin from Brooklyn but he likes Morningside Heights and showed his working class house in Brooklyn when his regular show "Girls" is all about make believing that they haven't all signed leases in the wrong borough.

Edited by MurlocGurgle, Oct 27, 2012 @ 1:44 PM.

[glitterintheair]

From which episode is the 'I still got two more tapes to watch' quote?

[PictureItSicily]

From which episode is the 'I still got two more tapes to watch' quote?

Nocturne. The piano teacher liked to tape his 'lessons'.

[Morbs]

There was some fancy editing and dubbing over original photos and dialogue--and for that, I think they suck big time. Leave season one alone! Re-writing history to serve your story line is just lazy writing.

They didn't re-write history. It's not like they used major retconning to make a plot work, they just created a new case, I think it is safe to say the show doesn't depict absolutely everything the detectives are working on. And lazy writing? I thought it was a clever way to mark the 300th episode, and getting the old footage to work so seamlessly must have been a bitch.

[vinyl]

There's a lost episode?

[LeGrandElephant]

When I saw the promos I thought they were going to choose a specific episode from season 1, and revisit that case. Not sure whether that would have been better or worse than what they actually did, which was repurposing old scenes to create a new case that was never in season 1.

[ladydayN]

I think I missed something. Didn't they say that dying the kid's hair blond was a detail they left out of the press on purpose? So then how did they explain the red herring cop wannabe knowing about it?

[Gatesgirl]

They didn't re-write history. It's not like they used major retconning to make a plot work, they just created a new case, I think it is safe to say the show doesn't depict absolutely everything the detectives are working on. And lazy writing? I thought it was a clever way to mark the 300th episode, and getting the old footage to work so seamlessly must have been a bitch.

I could not disagree more. Those moments they chose to repurpose from season one weren't throw-away moments. They meant something to the storyline and the characters that lived them. It is re-writing history, and as a dedicated watcher since the beginning, I find it offensive. Liv's quest for her father in that episode, and subsequent conversation with Elliot, shed light on her character and their partnership. Now it didn't happen? Munch's disgust watching those tapes in season one gave us insight into who the man is. The last scene with Liv staying up all night depicted how dedicated she was to the actual victim of that particular case--a young girl murdered by her boyfriend. Why erase all that? Why have those moments now belong to something else?

Edited by Gatesgirl, Nov 4, 2012 @ 10:17 PM.

[Scorpiosrule]

Why erase all that? Why have those moments now belong to something else?

Because Warren Leight is a fucking hack and most of his writing before he became showrunner of CI were almost always co-written by Rene Balcer--and it was the latter's contribution, that made the episodes so riveting.

At this point, I don't know why they didn't just cancel SVU and say, hey! We've got Leight back, so Criminal Intent is being resurrected, even though it did the worst in the ratings between the three shows. And I say this as someone who really enjoyed the first six/seven years of Criminal Intent.