116 replies to this topic

[DoctorDogBoy]

Let's begin.

[rbrtposteschild]

No way they all have actual checkbooks.

That's all the effort my brain cares to make right now, because my god.

[Milburn Stone]

When everyone came in with their checks at the end, I cried.

[DoctorDogBoy]

Sloan is rapidly becoming my favorite character.

Along with Jane Fonda she seems the only sane female on the show.

Edited by DoctorDogBoy, Jul 22, 2012 @ 10:36 PM.

[ToniW]

Maggie is protesting too much. Everyone in the office, including her boyfriend, can see it. Who talks to their boss that way?

As soon as Amen pulled his scarf down, I knew that he was in trouble. I'm glad that he turned up okay.

I've never seen Rudy, but I was very touched by that final seen.

No way they all have actual checkbooks.

One of the men in line had an envelope of cash.

[lovinbob]

I didn't hate that. And I've hated most of them. I groaned when I saw that the Rudy thing was happening, but something about it worked. Not sure why.

[Breaker]

That was the first classic Sorkin moment and climax of the series. It was worth the wait.

I will even refrain from mentioning the couple of wtf moments, because I can live with them if we get solid endings like that.

Congrats to everyone involved with the show, because that was awesome.

[OptimisticCynic]

Did I hear it right, is Neal not a college graduate? I can't realistically see him working on the show without one.

Edited by OptimisticCynic, Jul 23, 2012 @ 2:05 AM.

[angelita100]

When everyone came in with their checks at the end, I cried.

I didn't cry but I got a little schmoopie. I LOVE LOVE LOVE Rudy and actually saw it on cable not long ago.

If I could just like Maggie the show would be perfect for me. But even with her I quite enjoy it.

I still have a checkbook even though I use online banking for almost everything. It may take awhile to get through 50 checks but I do get through them.

[iPad]

I loved Dana on Sports Night and CJ on The West Wing so I'm missing a favorite female on this show; seems like Sloan is smart and strong maybe she'll be it but the previous for next week have me worried, is she going to royally fuck something up?

Anyway, I liked this episode... I loved the scene at the bar where Will almost bought the "reporter's" silence. That was awesome.

[Spare me]

Okay I like the show but I'm not a tough critic and don't try and take fictional shows too seriously which is why I was very very impressed with the West Wing (which totally delivered) and why I can really like this show (because although it's not the West Wing the writing obviously brings us a similar dynamic so I'm happy). However the whole Maggie bossing Jim around thing is getting very very ridiculous. It was really pushing my "I'll let it go" button I allow for shows I like or want to like. I still can't understand how she thought it was a okay for her to make her dysfunctional and boundariless relationship with Lisa Jims problem. Not only did she do that out of thin air but for some reason she did it as if she had some sort of leverage in the whole matter. I totally did not understand it at all.

Also, I'm not one to really nitpick but what the hell is the purpose of making Mac an economic moron? I hate to admit it cause I'm not one to get all into the whole gender thing but Geez Louise Mac really is being painted into a complete mess which I wouldn't care about except she's suppossed to represent a very strong and accomplished woman. The best. It's annoying that she's being portrayed as such a scatterbrained, distracted at every non working moment and a lot of working moments by what Wil is, isn't doing, where he is, who he's dating and what everyone thinks of him. I mean honestly, we get it, they had a complicated past that has, can and may present issues in the work place but it's already been overdone in every friggin' episode. Enough already oh and can we maybe have Mac stop looking so damn wounded all the time? Even Maggie doesn't seem as pathetic anymore. MAGGIE!

[DrivingSideways]

I thought this episode was soooo corny. The final scene just made me roll my eyes, but it sounds like it worked for a lot of other people. The TMI chick being an evil blackmailer was really contrived too. When Will was bloviating about how awesome his staff was by detailing their litany of injuries, it just highlighted how dumb these people are (the embedded journalist excepted of course).

And it wasn't until I started following the comments on this board that I really noticed how often these people speak to each other in threats of physical violence. Mackenzie McHale (still can't get over that name, along with Sloan Sabbith) threatening to punch Will was one instance tonight. Is this something people do often? I can't remember the last time I threatened to kick somebody's ass, even in jest.

[kelkon]

Mac being an economic moron = CJ not understanding the census.

People can hate on this show all they want, I cried at the end. Brilliant.

[OptimisticCynic]

I feel like the whole Maggie/Jim dynamic would be more tolerable if they were professional peers rather than boss and subordinate. It's just unbelievable that no matter how close they are as friends (which is suspect anyway given their length of time working together), that she would act that way to HER BOSS. Whereas if they were both the same job title, it would be annoying but not nearly as hard to suspend disbelief. Either way this whole storyline is incredibly forced. I also hated her roommate's insertion into the office - another hysterical, insecure woman who is so wounded by romantic rejection (on Valentine's Day, of course!) she goes on a screaming tirade.

I understand Lisa has a right to be pissed being stood up, but really?! She just showed how pathetic she really was by going to his place of work and cause a huge scene about it. But perhaps that was Sorkin's point, to show how Maggie and Jim are so perfect for each other.

I love John Gallagher Jr and Alison Pill as actors. It's really a shame what shit Sorkin has saddled her with. And I can't say he's given JGJ much better. He's completely spineless, I would have bitched out both Maggie AND the roommate. And Maggie should have taken the fall at the end, anyway. I would probably love them as romantic interests, but the writing is so terrible. So incredibly terrible.

[LADreamr]

What's with everyone trying to force Jim into relationships? Leave him alone and let him do his job!

[ThatPoshGirl]

I liked this episode. I haven't seen Rudy, but I liked the ending. The ending was also the first time I've felt like there was chemistry between Mac and Will.

If they were going to take on the Egyptian revolution I really wish they had addressed the Lara Logan sexual assault and fall out. I guess that would be difficult to do without it being exploitative, but journalists and politicians saying a woman deserved to get beaten and gang raped was so appalling.

Did I hear it right, is Neal not a college graduate? I can't realistically seeing him on working on the show without one.

While it may be difficult, I don't see it as impossible. I assume that was part of the point of his 7-7 story. That under all of that pressure he managed to get compelling footage from the inside.

[charmante456]

I thought it was very good until the end. Just too much.

If you're looking for the recycled dialogue, that was whoever William Macy played's speech to the suits when they were going after Issac -- but "spend the rest of my life ruining the rest of yours" is still a great threat.

AS seems to really have it in for the Koch brothers and Limbaugh. They might deserve it, but it's bordering on overkill. And while i'm at it, I would like to see Will portrayed as the moderate Republican he's supposed to be -- a lot of this stuff might not fit my politics, but he could be offering counterpoints instead of just following his liberal staff's ideology. A lot of these issues -- including the Wisconsin standoff -- do have two sides to them (I wonder if he's going to delve into drone attacks or whistleblower prosecution, just to balance things out a bit).

The interpersonal stuff was better -- I like Maggie being satisfied with Don much more than her being pulled in two directions. Still can't quite see what's he's working with Mac, but Sloan's a good balance, and she got a lot of lines tonight -- clearly the smartest person in the room. Of course so was that never-seen-again intern who interacted with Sam, or Winnie Cooper so that's often par for his course.

[thuganomics85]

It was kind of strange; it had all of the stuff that I normally dislike about this show, but I actually enjoyed it. It is probably my favorite episode so far. I guess I just thought all of the positives outweighed the negatives. While him punching the computer screen was over-the-top, I'm glad they had Neal do more then just be geeky and even gave him some background info. It was nice seeing Dev Patel actually have some kind of material. Sloan continues to be awesome, Charlie seemed much calmer (maybe Sam Waterston was tired and didn't feel like hamming it up this time), Will was entertaining in his dickish ways, and Don was the highlight. I actually thought he was being an asshole in the beginning, but I liked that he acknowledge it at the end. I don't know; he just feels human compared to some of the others.

But there still fucking Mackenzie and Maggie. Poor, poor Sloan. The fact that Sloan didn't just lose it at any point and tell Mackenzie to go fuck herself, is amazing to me. What an annoying character. Honestly, I might dislike her more then Maggie. Oh, I find Maggie annoying to the extreme, but at least she's apparently suppose to be young and inexperienced, and kind of lucky in a lot of ways. Mac is suppose to be some kind of genius (the best EP, according to Will) and experienced, but I don't see it at all. She's just annoying and kind of idiotic at times. And all the Sloan/Mackenzie scenes just take things into bizarre land, because Olivia Munn is out-acting Emily Mortimer in my eyes, and I never, ever would have predicted that. Not saying she's a stronger actress; but I think it's a combination of better lines and that Munn seems to have a much better handle of her character then Mortimer does with hers.

Want to give Mac a few brownie points to trying to poke fun with Will, but making fun of him for crying during Rudy is not the way to go. That's like one of those movies were people find it OK for a guy to cry to (others include Field of Dreams and Brian's Song.) Now, if he cried during Titanic, I would have found it more believable.

As for Maggie, I just don't see how she still gets away with treating Jim like that. She really should have been fired several times over. Of course, Jim became a spineless wimp in this episode, especially trying to hide under the desk. Come on now, dude.

OK, I've kept up with the most of the real stories they're covering, but I never saw that Rush clip and I'll admit that did floor and anger me. Why in the hell was he happy over what happened to the reporters? Was it some kind of "They're liberal elitists so they deserved it!" thing going? Or because it proved that Egyptians are violent in his eyes? Or should I even bother trying to figure out what is going through the head of a guy who recently claimed that Christopher Nolan picked Bane as the villain in The Dark Knight Rises so he could hurt Romney because people would think of Bane anytime they hear Bain Capitol?

Edited by thuganomics85, Jul 23, 2012 @ 2:24 AM.

[Milburn Stone]

Of course, Jim became a spineless wimp in this episode, especially trying to hide under the desk.

Which of course echoed her hiding under the bed of her boyfriend's dorm room in college. Which Jim condemned her for. So this was ironic. (In a fashion that I appreciated.)

I've seen Rudy, but it's been so long that I had forgotten how it ended (and maybe I wasn't paying enough attention to Will's synopsis)--so I didn't even realize the check-giving ending of last night's episode was a reference to it. As I say, not knowing that, it worked for me. (I know when something's honestly funny because I laugh, and I know when something's honestly touching because I cry.) I like the irony, if that's the word, of Will being "called out" for his silly, unmanly crying over the movie, and here I am crying over this.

Edited by Milburn Stone, Jul 23, 2012 @ 9:44 AM.

[andsods]

So much for Will getting fired, but his conversion of faith and Mac as lightening rod for past and present scandal made for a classic tribal choice: Does the team rally 'round the leader or do they flee like rats before the ship sinks?
I always thought Sorkin could sell goodness as well as anyone. And he's done it with less perfect vessels than Capra while understanding the present better than Spielberg and more willing to reveal his allegiance than Coppola or Scorsese. And the challenge to win an episode at a time is a lot tougher than canning one one film and walking away. No, this isn't the end or the beginning of the end and hell, it's' not the end of the beginning.

The critics may have good reason for their stomping but this was only episode five and this deal has gotten from new to familiar and set the hook as quickly as possible. I think the most cynical will be around for #6 and loyalists have been locked in at a record pace.
I also thought it a neat trick to suggest that 'Rudy' was more than the tale of an individual, usually ignored by those who think people make it on their own?

Even if the staff is more united (and I think a mole or Judas is still in their midst) they're on the downside of winning friends and influencing everyone else including those in their own company. They proved the can prove their point and in doing so there seem to be more people investing in their failure. These aren't quite Pyrrhic Victories but it would be good if they could staunch the cost of winning.

[CapsChick]

Which of course echoed her hiding under the bed of her boyfriend's dorm room in college. Which Jim condemned her for. So this was ironic. (In a fashion that I appreciated.)

Hmmm...maybe. But Jim was ducking a half-crazy woman he's very casually dating and was essentially forced into a V-Day date with, while Maggie hid from her bf's ex and wound up staying hidden while they had sex...demonstrating an utter lack of self-respect.

Speaking of which, I wonder how Jim feels about being bullied into a V-Day date so that Maggie and Don can enjoy their evening uninterrupted? Seems like Maggie's using him, and I'm not sure how that fits in with her jealousy.

I don't know what Don or Jim sees in Maggie. She's shrill and unprofessional and inappropriate and I can't stand her.

[catrina]

In a weird way I think I'm more invested in Dev Patel's success than his character. There just aren't many parts for a Indian actors which is why I'm almost like his mom rooting for his success. Now we just need any other character of color to get a character instead of just lines (Gary Cooper?)

I might have been aware of that Rush Limbaugh clip before but seeing it in its full horror, ugh. I wonder if Newsroom will go over the Sandra Fluke stuff?

[The Solution]

I love this show, but there were three things that I can't suspend disbelief over in this episode:

1. Mackenzie doesn't understand Economics. At all. How can a responsible journalist in this day and age not understand Economics? Economics is at the bottom of everything that happens today.

2. Random people can just waltz into this office any time they choose. There's no security in this building? Visitors don't have to be called in to the person they want to see?

3. No one in that newsroom was broke as a joke and couldn't contribute to Amen's release fund? Please.

[Milburn Stone]

Another thing I liked: Sorkin actually made the parallel work between Mackenzie cheating on Will with the boyfriend she knew was no good, and The Glass-Steagall Act!

[Hanahope]

I'm still waiting for the "show" that Mackenzie is the greatest EP of all time, rather than the "tell" of it. Seriously, each week is another notch in the 'how do we show Mackenzie is a freaking idiot, but continue to tell everyone that she's the best EP around'? At least Maggie was slightly, and I mean only slightly, placed in a better light this week, by at least showing she has something of a spine, although I still think its ridiculous that anyone would talk to their boss that way.

Don continues to be awesome. He should be the EP.

Sloan, good as usual. She must have sucked up all the 'good' genes from the women.

Will, slightly, and I mean slightly, less antagonistic than last week.

But there were some good nuggets, the explaining of conflict of interests of Citizens United with certain Justices, the Koch brothers' influence, explaining Glass-Steagall, punching Rush Limbaugh....

[edhopper]

Mac was stupid about Economics so that Sloan could carefully explain how the removal of regulation and Glass/Steagel screwed the country. Something even Obama and Geithner don't seem to grasp. It was a contrivance for Sorkin to give the views a little knowledge.

BTW, no Union editor would ever allow a producer to editor a story, never happen, not during 9/11 and certainly not during the Wisconsin protest.

But we probably need a "this isn't a real Newsroom" disclaimer for this thread.

Edited by edhopper, Jul 23, 2012 @ 10:56 AM.

[jtenny123]

Overall, I liked the episode, but I can't get over the horrible portrayal of Mackenzie (the writing of her character, not necessarily the acting). How does someone in her position not know the information she supposedly does not know? Sloan is the one shining spot for women and I think Olivia Munn is doing a nice job with the character.

[Lila82]

Things I find unbelievable, besides Mac failing to understand economic basics: that any man, let alone two relatively intelligent, attractive, competent men would be interested in Maggie. She's insecure, immature, neurotic, needy...the list goes on. And while I like Alison Pill, she's not pretty or sexy enough to justify either man's investment. By their late twenties, men tend to be over Maggie's personality, unless she's twenty-two, smokin' hot, and puts out. Lisa, while not the sharpest tool in the shed, mostly fits the bill.

The names: Maggie, Don, Jim...are these people escapees from the 1950s? Who named them?

On TWW and SN, I was as invested in the characters' inner lives as their work lives. Here? The news stuff is interesting. The rest? Yeah. it's been said.

Finally: I don't mind female characters who can't get their lives together -- see: Day, Jessica -- but as much of a mess as they are in their personal lives, I need them to be professional in the workplace. Which...again, it's been said.

ETA:

It's difficult to get a reservation at Dell'Anima on a normal day, let alone Valentine's Day. UGH.

Edited by Lila82, Jul 23, 2012 @ 11:27 AM.

[Heavy]

[quote][/Mac being an economic moron = CJ not understanding the census.

quote]

Yet another rehashing of a West Wing storyline by Sorkin. Is he out of new material, or does he think nobody notices?

[smwurr]

This show continues to be so strange for me. It's like Sorkin took what people liked about the West Wing (the snappy banter, the heart, the feeling of good people doing important work) and took it all way over the top in an effort to recreate that magic.

I did like the bit with the checks. That's a moment that makes it worth sticking around. But the rest of the episode was just so damn overwrought that I couldn't help but roll my eyes at a lot of it.

-- When will Sorkin create a male character that has to be implausibly ill-informed about something so that another more informed character can teach them, and the audience, all about something very important? We had 7 years of Donna the Exposition Fair, CJ fucking Cregg claiming to know nothing about why we need the census. Now we have Maggie not only not having any idea what the Glass/Steagall Act is--are you kidding me? Oh and she has to do simple arithmetic on her fingers. *headdesk*

-- Once again, we have Will refusing to display a single shred of evidence that he was ever even a moderate Republican. If he could espouse a single solitary viewpoint that isn't completely left of center I might one day believe it.

-- In show time it's now been nearly 4 years since Mack and Will broke up. Time to move on, people! Mack blubbing to Sloane (who is the only good female character, unless the lady from True Blood starts talking more) about cheating on Will with her crappy ex boyfriend made me want to scream. It's been YEARS. Get over it!