Jump to content

2-3: "What Is Dead May Never Die" 2012.04.15


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.

415 replies to this topic

#391

kieran555

kieran555

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Male

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 1:22 PM

I mean, there's Jaime captured, and they have that nameless cousin trotting back to Robb with bad news,

He's not nameless - in the first episode, Robb addressed him as Ser Alton Lannister.

#392

BadAndyMk3

BadAndyMk3

    Video Archivist

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 1:37 PM

Myrcella wouldn't have lived long enough to see their wedding day. Robin would have gotten upset with her for taking his favorite toy and thrown Myrcella out the moon window before Mommy could button up her shirt.


Well, I don't think that they would have just sent Myrcella up there by herself. She would have probably gone with an entourage of guards and knights and handmaidens and so on.

#393

burping frog

burping frog

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 1:55 PM

He's not nameless - in the first episode, Robb addressed him as Ser Alton Lannister.


Wow, good catch! Is it really shallow of me to wish he was Lannister-blonde? And.....prettier....?





Yeah, that's shallow.

#394

D.C.

D.C.

    Stalker

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 3:01 PM

I don't think Bronn is just about the money. That doesn't mean he's not a mercenary through and through, only that he's smart enough to realize there are times when there's more to his self-interest than cash in hand. If Tyrian were to come to him and order him to slaughter a bunch of infants and children, Bronn may very well ask how much he would be paid. But I bet he'd also ask himself if Tyrian had lost it, and if Tyrian had, what that meant for his own position and safety; whether there was more to be gained by taking the plans of the slaughter to somebody else rather than carrying it out; if ordering such an unusual massacre of the innocents was an act of panic because the war was about to be lost, which might mean it was better to skedaddle to the other side rather than waste time killing children; etc.

If it even ever gets this far. I don't think Arya would marry anyone she didn't want to, or even marry at all, unless Robb tells her she has to do it to help keep the peace. Arya already told Ned last season when he told her she'd marry a nobleman and have sons that were lords and princes, that that wasn't her.

In my dream world, Arya becomes head of the King's Guard, Robb become king, and Tyrian is his Hand. Varyias stays in place. Brienna becomes part of the Night Watch leadership and Bran is a Maester of some renown. Dany become Queen of the Desert and Essos becomes a viable kingdom under her leadership and plays well with others, namely, Westeros. Gendry...something good happens to Gendry. And the others...get on with their knitting in their respective dominions. The End.

#395

ChocButterfly

ChocButterfly

    Couch Potato

  • Gender:Female

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 3:31 PM

Sure, the Lannister soldiers may decide now to just execute that rag-tag mob of proto-Nights Watch recruits. But why would they bother? They killed the blonde boy principally because he couldn't walk and they were damned if they were gonna carry him to wherever.

But why did the soldiers take the kids anyway? They were there only to fullfil a task: Kill Gendry. They only killed Yoren, because he was opposing them. They don`t care wether the other kids live or die, and they surely don`t care that they reach the Wall. The kids are inconsecuential to them, so why take them prisioners? If they wanted to kill them alll, why didn`t they do it then? I really have NO idea what they intend to do with the kids. It doesn`t make much sense to me.

#396

joliefaire

joliefaire

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 3:45 PM

I think they had orders to go round up a bunch of peasants to serve as servants/slave labor at Harrenhal while Tywin and his troops are quartered there. This particular bunch of 'peasants' will do as well as any other, so they rounded them up.

#397

YourMomOnToast

YourMomOnToast

    Video Archivist

  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Beaverton, Oregon
  • Interests:I am a bridal consultant and I love it! Other than that, catch me in some nerdy forum that I'm sure to be in!

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 5:39 PM

While physical virginity was valued for women in medieval times, to the extent of on occasion examining the sheets after bedding for the expected bloodstains, I have not yet heard of cases where auricular virginity was demanded of a bride, with unfortunate maidens who happened to have heard a cussword being rushed off to convents.


You, dear poster, made my day (although I may be a little too medicated right now).

Poor Myrcella...two of her three "future grooms" include The Amazing Breastfeeding Boy, and the sister-fondling-Iron Price-known for their raping ways Greyjoys. Sheesh.

#398

agora

agora

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 5:53 PM

Personally, I believe Robin was the better option because he was less likely to be as abusive or predatory as Theon Greyjoy in the long run, not to mention Lysa seems to be less likely to kill an insurance such as Myrcella, like I believe other mother-in-laws would.

Myrcella wouldn't have lived long enough to see their wedding day. Robin would have gotten upset with her for taking his favorite toy and thrown Myrcella out the moon window before Mommy could button up her shirt.

I couldn't disagree more, Myrcella is way too old to still be playing with toys, otherwise Tyrion wouldn't be marrying her off.

Edited by agora, Apr 21, 2012 @ 6:00 PM.


#399

kieran555

kieran555

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Male

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 5:55 PM

I couldn't disagree more, Myrcella is way too old to still playing with toys otherwise Tyrion wouldn't be marrying her off.

How so? It's not like she will actually be married straightaway, it would just be a formal betrothal along the lines of Arya and one of Frey's brood, which I would guess would not take place until whichever is youngest comes of age.

I must say, all this talk of marriage alliances and so forth has made me quite nostalgic for a return to the Twins and old Walder Frey. At this rate, we seem more likely to get a substantive scene with him than Dany.

I think they had orders to go round up a bunch of peasants to serve as servants/slave labor at Harrenhal while Tywin and his troops are quartered there. This particular bunch of 'peasants' will do as well as any other, so they rounded them up.

I guess. We know slavery is technically illegal in Westeros, but given the war and the orders from Tywin last season for Ser Gregor to 'set the Riverlands on fire from Godseye to the Red Fork[of the Trident]', I would suppose many villages of smallfolk are being pressed into various kinds of service for Lords not technically their own, and unattached smallfolk like the Night's Watch band must be especially vulnerable.

I'm still a little surprised Ser Amory Lorch would choose to do so in his brief appearence - he really pushed his sword into Yoren very slowly, sadistically, and yet seemes pretty unemotional about the whole business, whereas good old Bronn always seems much more satisified and engaged abuot his business. Different kinds of animal I guess. A reaver without charm.

Edited by kieran555, Apr 21, 2012 @ 6:05 PM.


#400

TyrionLannister

TyrionLannister

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 7:53 PM

So why exactly was Theon being baptized?

#401

joliefaire

joliefaire

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 8:10 PM

I'm still a little surprised Ser Amory Lorch would choose to do so in his brief appearence - he really pushed his sword into Yoren very slowly, sadistically, and yet seemes pretty unemotional about the whole business, whereas good old Bronn always seems much more satisified and engaged abuot his business. Different kinds of animal I guess. A reaver without charm.


Totally agree. A Mechanic.

#402

ScrubMonkey

ScrubMonkey

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 8:10 PM

I took Theon's 'baptism' as being reaccepted into the Greyjoy clan, officially choosing sides. Taking his oath as a soldier and their countryman. It did mention their "drowned god," but I think it was a soldier's ceremony.

It was probably a coming of age ceremony he never got to have, living with the Starks all those years.

By the way is their "drowned god" myth the same as Poseidon?

#403

Raja

Raja

    Couch Potato

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 8:36 PM

Poor Myrcella...two of her three "future grooms" include The Amazing Breastfeeding Boy, and the sister-fondling-Iron Price-known for their raping ways Greyjoys. Sheesh.


When the "good" option is sending her off to the folks who the Lannisters slaughtered the young children of while crossing ones fingers they won't hold a grudge they'll exact on Myrcella you know the options aren't good. And of course it may only sound good to us because we know nothing about Dorne yet.

In defense of the Robin option if he is weak and sickly there is always the chance he'll die young. Get her knocked up in a year or two and perhaps Myrcella will have the fantastic "luck" of being the next Lysa. Course given Lysa is paranoid and wants nothing to do with the Lannisters anyway a more likely option is Myrcella will end up thrown out of the normal castle door and left out on the hills for the barbarians to do god knows what or given one of the Arryn's famous parachuteless skydiving clinics.

Which of course leaves giving her over to the rapist fan club on the Iron Islands.

Maybe a Dothraki wedding might not be so bad?

Edited by Raja, Apr 21, 2012 @ 8:38 PM.


#404

Ratshag

Ratshag

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 9:42 PM

I've already discussed this on the Arya thread, so all what's left for me to say is that I seriously doubt Lord Frey negotiated the engagement between his son and a 10 year old last season, if he didn't expect someone who never heard those words for a daughter-in-law. As of this episode, Arya is no longer that kind of person.


I think you're confusing "Game of Thrones" with "The Andy Griffith Show." Lord Frey wanted Arya for one his grandsons (or sons or whatever) because she is a Stark, and that would give his family a connection to one of the most powerful families in Westeros with 10,000 years of accumulated respectability. Being able to bring a Stark into his family shows the world that Walder Frey is more than just a dirty old man who owns a toll bridge. It shows that he is a man of importance, a man who has to be taken seriously because the Starks take him seriously. The fact that the girl might have heard some bad words is nothing compared to that.

Edited by Ratshag, Apr 21, 2012 @ 9:45 PM.


#405

SpeciousLogic

SpeciousLogic

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Somewhere in Texas

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 10:17 PM

I've already discussed this on the Arya thread, so all what's left for me to say is that I seriously doubt Lord Frey negotiated the engagement between his son and a 10 year old last season, if he didn't expect someone who never heard those words for a daughter-in-law. As of this episode, Arya is no longer that kind of person.


I seriously doubt that having a chaste mind is remotely on the list of criteria that would matter to any lord in Westeros -- least of all Walder Frey.

In my dream world, Arya becomes head of the King's Guard, Robb become king, and Tyrian is his Hand. Varyias stays in place. Brienna becomes part of the Night Watch leadership and Bran is a Maester of some renown. Dany become Queen of the Desert and Essos becomes a viable kingdom under her leadership and plays well with others, namely, Westeros. Gendry...something good happens to Gendry. And the others...get on with their knitting in their respective dominions. The End.


LOL, too bad GRRM is opposed to ASoIaF-based fanfic.

#406

ThatPoshGirl

ThatPoshGirl

    Stalker

  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Phoenix

Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 10:55 PM

The concept of Arya being unmarriable because she heard naughty words in this episode just blows my mind. How would they even test for that?

#407

Aftendor

Aftendor

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 12:08 AM

I'm imagining whacking my thumb with a hammer, saying 'ferfukzzsakessgeezkrap' and thereby condemning all the girls in the vicinity to spinsterhood.

How would they even test for that?


And is there a sort of sliding scale, like is 'fuck' unacceptable, 'intercourse' okay, and where does 'hump', 'play hide the salami', 'taking the skin boat to tuna town', 'bumping uglies', and so forth fall?

#408

agora

agora

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 1:43 AM

Personally, I believe Robin was the better option because he was less likely to be as abusive or predatory as Theon Greyjoy in the long run, not to mention Lysa seems to be less likely to kill an insurance such as Myrcella, like I believe other mother-in-laws would.

Myrcella wouldn't have lived long enough to see their wedding day. Robin would have gotten upset with her for taking his favorite toy and thrown Myrcella out the moon window before Mommy could button up her shirt.

I couldn't disagree more, Myrcella is way too old to still be playing with toys, otherwise Tyrion wouldn't be marrying her off.

How so? It's not like she will actually be married straightaway, it would just be a formal betrothal along the lines of Arya and one of Frey's brood...

I thought the idea was for Myrcella to marry straightaway, not only because I don't see how the likes of Theon Greyjoy are going to wait, but because it explains to me why is that Cercei was so mad about the whole idea.

*ETA:

Maybe a Dothraki wedding might not be so bad?

Not even Tywin himself would marry Myrcella to the current Khal in my opinion. Lannisters may be a lot of things, but they sure seem to love their children.

Edited by agora, Apr 22, 2012 @ 2:02 AM.


#409

thuganomics85

thuganomics85

    Stalker

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 4:52 AM

Lannisters may be a lot of things, but they sure seem to love their children.


Unless you happened to be born as a dwarf. Then your fair game for some hatred curiosity of Daddy Tywin. Then again, that could just be him, because it seemed like he really wasn't nice to any of his children.

#410

SpeciousLogic

SpeciousLogic

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Somewhere in Texas

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 7:35 AM

And is there a sort of sliding scale, like is 'fuck' unacceptable, 'intercourse' okay, and where does 'hump', 'play hide the salami', 'taking the skin boat to tuna town', 'bumping uglies', and so forth fall?


I suppose those poor ladies at Lysa's court during Tyrion's "confession" are all Silent Sisters by now.

#411

burping frog

burping frog

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 9:29 AM

Then again, that could just be him, because it seemed like he really wasn't nice to any of his children.


Yeah, he wasn't exactly warm and fuzzy with Jaime, either. He left him feeling crushed and belittled. Although it seemed like Tywin wasn't really trying to be nasty just for the sake of it - he was trying to get Jaime's head in the game. Maybe he just doesn't have much of the milk of human kindness in him to begin with.

We really, really need more Tywin, btw. I miss that Magnificent Bastard.

#412

kieran555

kieran555

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Male

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 9:40 AM

We really, really need more Tywin, btw. I miss that Magnificent Bastard.

Seconded. I may be getting anxious at only getting five minutes of Dany all season so far, but I love me some Tywin scenes.

#413

agora

agora

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 9:57 AM

Unless you happened to be born as a dwarf. Then your fair game for some hatred curiosity of Daddy Tywin.

Love is not to pamper, for one Tywin did name him Hand in his absence and, in a world where babies are killed every day, Tyrion is very much alive because of his father.

Edited by agora, Apr 22, 2012 @ 9:58 AM.


#414

everstar

everstar

    Video Archivist

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 2:25 PM

too bad GRRM is opposed to ASoIaF-based fanfic.

He's probably worried something good would happen to someone if he's not in charge.

(But I kid GRRM.)

#415

cyberducks

cyberducks

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 2:53 PM

He's probably worried something good would happen to someone if he's not in charge.

(But I kid GRRM.)


Ha! You may be onto something there as the only way most of our POV characters are getting a HEA is through the wonderful world of fan fiction.

#416

Scoutlet

Scoutlet

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 22, 2012 @ 5:07 PM

I actually have no problem with the concept of the Iron Price. It make sense in the context of the Iron Islands culture. I don't take it to mean that one shouldn't work for anything at all, but rather that the jewels you wear, etc. signify what a Badass you are. They're like war medals. It's a seafaring society, so it values th ability to build ships, plow the seas and fight and take. I have no more problem with this than I do with the class-bound martial culture of the rest of Westeros.