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Titanic in 3D


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#91

mmecorday

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Posted Apr 28, 2012 @ 10:46 PM

I saw the movie three times in 1997 while I was working on a book on Jack Phillips, Titanic's chief wireless operator. (He's seen for a few brief seconds in the film when Captain Smith tells him to send a CQD -- Require Assistance Immediately.) Back then, I felt I was watching the film for research and this time I could sit back and view it purely as entertainment. After fifteen years it does hold up surprisingly well and the 3D effects brought freshness to the movie. The enhanced sounds of the ship creaking and giving way to water made it an especially vivid experience. I still think that too much time is devoted to Jack being handcuffed below decks and Rose rescuing him. There are too many scenes already that illustrate the callousness of the crew's indifference toward the steerage class and Rose's new-found courage.

#92

katsullivan

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 3:33 AM

That's a very interesting perspective especially since a lot of material ended up on the cutting room floor that would have dramatically increased the length of the post-iceberg half. There's even a long scene of Jack and Lovejoy duking each out in the flooded dining room.

#93

lastdaughterfk

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 8:49 PM

I've had male colleagues who complained because they bought dinner for a girl and she didn't put out - I can quite see them sympathizing with Cal here.)


Plus all this guys that dated this girl http://blog.yourmone...free-meals.html

#94

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Posted May 8, 2012 @ 5:30 PM

Something I've always wondered: Did Rose sleep with Cal on the ship, or maybe even before that?

I wonder because when he has a fit and knocks the table over, he tells her she is his wife "in practice, if not by law". Also, the look on his face when he gives her the diamond necklace, but maybe I'm reading too much into that moment.

#95

katsullivan

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Posted May 14, 2012 @ 9:43 AM

In the original treatment, Cal makes a horribly creepy remark to Rose about he's going to be the first when he slips between her sheets. (I kid you not). So, it can go either way, keeping to the spirit of the original treatment or not, depending on your interpretation. Sometimes, I think they did and sometimes, I think they don't. I can imagine Cal trying to get her into bed and Ruth either pressing on her daughter to sleep with Cal or making sure that her daughter doesn't so she doesn't lose her "value" as a bride.

#96

Zanne

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Posted May 16, 2012 @ 8:59 PM

Something I've always wondered: Did Rose sleep with Cal on the ship, or maybe even before that?

I wonder because when he has a fit and knocks the table over, he tells her she is his wife "in practice, if not by law".


Reading some of the other posts, I'm shocked that people thought Rose and Cal were NOT already sleeping together. It seemed obvious (to me!) that they had been sleeping together for a long time and mom knew about it; anything was okay as long as it kept Cal interested! Rose and Cal only had separate cabins for propriety's sake. The "in practice" really cemented that for me.

#97

Princess Aldrea

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Posted May 17, 2012 @ 12:27 AM

But Rose clearly didn't want him and she was so rebellious so why would she sleep with him without even bring married? It's not like it would have been expected of her back then.

#98

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Posted May 17, 2012 @ 6:27 PM

But Rose clearly didn't want him and she was so rebellious so why would she sleep with him without even bring married? It's not like it would have been expected of her back then.


I agree that Rose did not want to be with Cal in any form, and that society would have expected her to remain chaste until marriage. But there are a couple of lines that hint that perhaps they have been intimate. There is that line about her being Cal's wife "in practice, if not law", and there is another line, earlier in the film, where Cal tells Rose that he had "hoped you'd come to me last night", the implication clearly being sleeping together. And the way Cal said it, it didn't sound as if that would have been the first time, at least that is how it sounded to me. Cal is certainly no romantic, but I gotta think even Cal would find it rather gauche to bed his fiance for the first time on a cruise ship. That seems hamfisted even for Cal. They are coming back from a trip to Europe, if she wasn't in the mood during that, I don't see where being on a ship, even one as grand as Titanic, would change her mind.

Personally, I think we are meant to think Rose is a virgin, but the poor dialogue in the script causes confusion.

#99

Princess Aldrea

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Posted May 17, 2012 @ 7:18 PM

I think if they had slept together it wouldn't have been a matter of Rose coming to him.

#100

Zanne

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Posted May 17, 2012 @ 9:57 PM

But Rose clearly didn't want him and she was so rebellious so why would she sleep with him without even bring married?


Rose would sleep with him because she needed to keep Cal happy. Rose's mom pretty much sold her to Cal for money and status, a plan that Rose was following because she felt she had no other options. Her mom was more than willing to barter Rose's virtue for a guaranteed name and bank account while turning a blind eye to any sexual shenanigans. Rose's acting out was pretty petty stuff, but she hadn't told her mother "no" regarding any of her future plans. She was acting like the teenager she was - rebel in the little ways you can (smoke, read Freud), even if you can't fight the big stuff (marrying a rich jackass). Cal was perfectly aware he had Rose in a weakened position, and I have no doubt there would be subtle pressure to reward him for his understanding. He was marrying a girl with a name, but no money. Rose had no power, while Cal had everything she/her mother thought she/they needed.

I think if they had slept together it wouldn't have been a matter of Rose coming to him.


Cal was also conceited. I'm sure he liked to think that there was some actual attraction toward him on Rose's part. Plus, it was a facade of being a gentleman by giving her the illusion of having a choice in the matter.

Edited by Zanne, May 17, 2012 @ 9:59 PM.


#101

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Posted May 18, 2012 @ 2:12 PM

I didn't know it was common knowledge that Rose had no money anymore. I kind of thought they were keeping it from Cal, though I'm not sure how.

#102

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Posted May 19, 2012 @ 2:32 PM

All of this fanwanking could have been avoided if they had just admitted that Rose was married. Of course, then she would have committed adultery with Jack and not been as much of a sympathetic character.

#103

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Posted May 21, 2012 @ 4:19 PM

It was my understanding that Rose was sleeping with Cal. That speech he gave her when he presented the necklace to her, (paraphrasing) "There is nothing I would deny you so long as you don't deny me...", combined with his "I thought you would come to be last night." lead me to believe that Cal in not so certain terms told Rose that if she was free with her sexual favors before and after marriage he would be an especially sweet husband. Jmo.

#104

Princess Aldrea

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Posted May 21, 2012 @ 4:39 PM

If Rose was married and Cal survived Rose would have been more than an adulterer. She would have committed bigamy with her new husband.

#105

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Posted May 23, 2012 @ 5:33 AM

I think it was clear from the shabby way that Cal treated Rose that he felt that he "owned" her. He didn't treat her like someone who had a choice in the matter, like someone if he displeased could just say, "the Hell with you" and fling her ring in his face and walk away. He treated her like someone who he had already "bought and paid for" now he only needed to bring her "to heel."

I can imagine him being conceited enough to expect her to come to him willingly and that could be the meaning behind the "I had hoped you would come to me last night" but it could also mean the opposite. It is all very confusing.

#106

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Posted May 27, 2012 @ 6:43 PM

I watched this recently on TV and I kept thinking its a great disaster movie but not a great love story. I just never bought them as a couple. Jack seems like her younger brother for most of the movie. I believe that she would want to escape from her life badly enough to run off with him, but I think that if he had lived they would have broken up pretty shortly after.

It is funny though, that particular line made me realize something when I saw it last week. When she says she is going to get off with Jack, the ship was still a few days away from New York. What was Rose going to do during that time?. She had made her decision to go with Jack, so staying with Cal and her mother didn't seem feasible. Was she going to stay with Jack in his steerage cabin, alongside Fabrizio and the two Swedes? Of course the iceberg rendered the situation moot, but I am curious as to what she was going to do. That would have been an awkward couple of days.


Hmm, I remember noticing that Rose told Cal she was going to leave him and go off with Jack. I can't remember if she told him that before or after she knew the ship was sinking for sure, but either way, I remember thinking that if she just hadn't told him, they all probably would have lived. I might be wrong on the timeline but I think that if she had just kept her mouth shut, no one would have had a motive to handcuff Jack belowdecks, and they could all have gotten on lifeboats and then she could have left Cal once they got on land. Much easier to escape once you're not on a ship, anyway. And I know it would have been repugnant to stay with Cal those last few days, but since they were only engaged, its not like she was expected to sleep with him. She'd just have to keep up a polite face for a few days, sit quietly at dinner, and then disappear once they were on land.

"To me it was a slave ship, taking me back to America in chains." Yes. Because imprisonment, rape, and unpaid forced labor are just like having to marry Billy Zane and live in a fur-lined bon-bon palace for-literally-ever.


Its not the same as a slave ship, for sure. But throwing the word rape in there just made me think that actually, being forced to marry a violent man that you hate IS pretty much going to lead to being raped. Even if they wouldn't have called it rape in that era. So I think both sides are wrong here - its not right to say that its the same as a slave ship, but its also not right to say that she was being taken to the lap of luxury. She was being taken to a gilded cage where she would be emotionally and physically abused by her husband.

#107

lastdaughterfk

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Posted Jun 28, 2012 @ 12:40 PM

HOW TITANIC SHOULD HAD ENDED
http://www.youtube.c...=em-uploademail

#108

FirstMateCooper

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Posted Dec 10, 2012 @ 2:34 AM

Mr Plinkett Review

#109

Tableau

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Posted Dec 18, 2012 @ 4:13 PM

I gotta say I agree with a lot what he mentions. Cameron is a good action director who can write a well structured script but his characters have always come off as 1 and 2 dimensional to me. Watching this review really helped me pinpoint my main problem with almost all of Cameron's stuff.

A good movie can be made strictly on the strength of a good villain or an interesting protagonist and that's something pretty much all of Cameron's movies lack, relying instead on plot and action to pull things through. Apart from the guy himself being an arrogant prick, he always forces his characters into categories and restricts them that way. Law enforcement and the military are always stupid and/or evil, those the rich are pompous assholes, the poor are perfect. Multifaceted characters don't exist in anything he has a hand in. I think the closest we got was the re-programed Terminator in T2 making him the most interesting character in that movie! This is exactly what chaps my hide about Cameron's movies, so thank you Red Letter for pointing that out to me! It explains why I find his stuff unsatisfying or just annoying.

Edited by Tableau, Dec 18, 2012 @ 4:20 PM.