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Dance Moms: Miami


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#181

moreorlessnu

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 11:35 AM

I know it's the popular thing to do a more modern style of choreography these days, but I really think it works better for older kids.


I dislike when someone as young as Kimmy or Lucas performs a dance so full of angst. It's not believable. If a child that young is so distressed, an adult needs to step in and alleviate the child's pain.

Yet, they are both very talented dancers, and I would enjoy routines where they are leaping and dancing with joy.

#182

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 12:38 PM

A question for those of you with dance competition knowledge. What exactly does winning platinum mean?

#183

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 12:56 PM

When you go to a dance competition the dances are all adjudicated, given scores generally 80-100 for each judge and then you get your adjudication based on that total (which are then ranked in order for overalls). For most kids this means more than the overalls because winning the overalls with no competition (or getting third with tough competition) is about what everyone else did the adjudication score is you competing against yourself. Although some competitions have different levels (one added a titanium medal and one has first, top first and elite top first) most of them do Silver (which is never given), Gold, High Gold and Platinum (think of that like D, C, B and A). So getting a platinum is like getting an A and that's what most dancers want. You can win the overalls with a gold if you have no competition or you can be at a comp where they're only ranking the first place dancer so getting that platinum is what the dancers are most proud of (and they're disappointed when they get a gold).

Dancers are also all given written and video critiques of their dances so they can see what they need to work on to improve their score for the next competition.

Edited by meatball77, May 2, 2012 @ 12:57 PM.


#184

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 2:53 PM

Thanks, Meatball. Good for Hannah and Sammi. I'm glad they were able to do so well with all the mama drama going on around them.

#185

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 5:14 PM

I don't know what everyone's problem with Debi is. She is annoying, yeah, but for god's sakes, the other moms actually put down her daughter right in front of her! What mom wouldn't get a little shrill about that? Bad as the original Dance Moms crew can be, I don't remember them ever coming right out and saying nasty things about each other's kids - about the favoritism and impact thereof, yeah, but I don't remember anyone actually saying "nyah nyah, my daughter's way better than yours!" These bitches are RELENTLESS about insulting Hannah. Even Victor's hag of a mother, who's got no business butting in with her worthless opinions anyway. You don't even go here, lady!

I have trouble buying that Debi actually tried to sabotage Sammi and I DEFINITELY do not buy Abby's claim that Debi was thrown out of their last dance school. I just don't. Sammi is a first-class stereotypical junior high mean girl (people are always, like, judging you because you're, like, so pretty and rich? How difficult that must be for you!) and her snotty sneer when they said she had to duet with Hannah pretty much said it all. I don't exactly have trouble believing she bullied Hannah at her last dance school. I think Abby's more of the same - just an older mean girl who still picks on the chubby girl in class.

Priceless moment of the night: "Lucas, your crime is tax evasion." "Oh, like my mom!" Tears of schadenfreude.

#186

thejoysofjess

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 8:16 PM

And I really felt for Mia during the fire. Did that fire spontaneously break out? It seemed huge and relatively close to the dance studio. How did no one notice it sooner?


It probably happened very quickly. Florida is almost always in a drought situation (we're in one right now!) and that coupled with us being the lightning strike capital of the US, fires tend to break out quickly. And fires that were contained and considered "safe" can suddenly jump out of control.

#187

becw182

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 10:44 PM

A girl who dances on the comp team at stars said Hannah is on weight probation- if a company member is overweight and doesn't lose weight they will be kicked off the team. I dont like Victor/Angel so much now... way to encourage eating disorders

#188

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 10:53 PM

"Years ago I had a student who never made her former studio's comp team because of her weight. That studio lost out because she had natural talent and a strong work ethic. She was a phenomenal dancer!

I'm guessing most of the kids can turn, it's just not a focus for them. Here is Mia Diaz's (the one who was crying) solo from last year http://www.youtube.c...h?v=edZ5gP-qu3o

I think the Stars style doesn't translate well to TV with all the cut shots ect. . . and they're probably a studio that cares more about training those dancers so that they're well rounded at 18 and employable as contemporary dancers rather than pushing things that the dancers aren't ready for because it's impressive in competition. Focusing on that solid ballet technique and balance and control and artistry rather than spending the entire time working on turns. I always tell people that when they're looking at a dance studio that they need to look at the teenagers, because anyone can win in the mini and junior levels if you've got naturally flexible kids who take a lot of classes and spend a lot of time working on turns and who rehearse enough that their dances are clean. As you get to the higher levels, that's where the training really becomes evident and where the gaps start to show in the schools where the kids are being taught a dance vs those who are really focusing on technique.


Yes exactly! Abby does what is known as "competition choreography". She knows what style and elements win at the competitions she attends and wisely incorporates them into her dances. While Maddie can turn and jump, they are not always technically correct. Personally I like Stars' contemporary pieces but I really enjoy contemporary in general (it's one of my favorite styles to choreograph).

Edited by astaire, May 2, 2012 @ 11:04 PM.


#189

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 12:48 AM

She is annoying, yeah, but for god's sakes, the other moms actually put down her daughter right in front of her! What mom wouldn't get a little shrill about that?


I don't see the other mom's comments as specifically designed to insult Hannah and Debbie. I see them pointing out the obvious, while Debbie is trying to ignore the fact that her daughter is not as technically proficient as the others, specifically Sammy.
I think the other moms are trying to be diplomatic with Debbie but she can't stop deluding herself about her daughter's ability. We haven't seen many comments from the other moms WITH Debbie where they are putting her daughter down, they are mostly from the confessionals or from conversations involving Debbie trying to insist that Hannah is just as good, or even better, than the others, when the other moms know this is not true.

#190

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 10:48 AM

A girl who dances on the comp team at stars said Hannah is on weight probation- if a company member is overweight and doesn't lose weight they will be kicked off the team. I dont like Victor/Angel so much now... way to encourage eating disorders


I heartily disagree. If Victor and Angel are doing that, then it's for Hannah's own good. Debi needs a wakeup call. There is no way on earth that Hannah should be the size she is given how much physical activity she does on a daily basis unless Debi is feeding her crap. No way. Hannah is a child, and as a result can only really eat what is provided to her.

I'm guessing that, since Debi is no svelte vixen herself, they eat a lot of sugary cereals, breads, pastas, sodas and ice cream treats. Poor child doesn't have a chance...

#191

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 11:11 AM

I don't see the other mom's comments as specifically designed to insult Hannah and Debbie. I see them pointing out the obvious, while Debbie is trying to ignore the fact that her daughter is not as technically proficient as the others, specifically Sammy.


But the point is, the obvious does not need to be said. No, she is not as technically as talented as the others. But why the hell do other people's mothers need to hammer on it all the time? She's a child! "Even Hannah"? "You should be embarrassed with fourth place"? Who the hell says that? If she was slow and your kid was gifted, would you ever in a million years think it appropriate to say, "My kid is so much smarter than yours. You're just in denial about how dumb she is"? It doesn't matter and it's none of their business! And yes, I think Debi is perfectly aware of her Hannah's shortcomings; she just doesn't feel the need to voice them to these bitches on national television. There's nothing wrong with presenting a supportive front for your kid.

#192

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 1:05 PM

A girl who dances on the comp team at stars said Hannah is on weight probation- if a company member is overweight and doesn't lose weight they will be kicked off the team. I dont like Victor/Angel so much now... way to encourage eating disorders


It's encouraging eating disorders if they tell kids like Sammi or Jessi to loose weight. Telling someone whose weight is effecting their dance because they're overweight that they need to work on their weight is different. A kid who is obese/overweight dealing with that issue in a healthy manner is not the same thing as a kid starving themselves.

As for kicking her off the team, that seems excessive to me, however if her weight is holding her technique back then it's a problem she needs to address.

#193

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 2:12 PM

To me, part of what makes Hannah look bad when she dances is that stupid bun on the top of her head. Also, the hunched over, flexed feet style makes her dancing somewhat clunky looking.

Also, does Kimmy have an underbite? That might be causing her lisping, but it certainly seems that she keeps her jaw in a weird position when she talks.

#194

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 3:00 PM

I'm not sure what the problem is with putting a child on a competitive team on weight probation. Why pretend Hannah's weight is not an issue? Arguably better dancers who maintain a slender figure would kill to be on the team, I'm sure. If she wants to stay on this "prestigious" team, she should strive to personify an elite dancer. An elite dancer is not fat. With her dance regimen and a healthful diet (adopted and encouraged by her entire family) she should be able to lose her girth in no time.

#195

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 4:32 PM

I heartily disagree. If Victor and Angel are doing that, then it's for Hannah's own good. Debi needs a wakeup call. There is no way on earth that Hannah should be the size she is given how much physical activity she does on a daily basis unless Debi is feeding her crap. No way. Hannah is a child, and as a result can only really eat what is provided to her.


That's not fair. While I agree Hannah's dancing might improve with weight loss, we have no idea what her diet is like. Some kids don't have fast metabolisms. I know a kid who's father is a doctor. She's very overweight despite being active, not because of her diet, but because that's just the way she is. Maybe Debi needs to adjust her family's eating habits, maybe not. I agree that it's likely the case that Hannah's diet isn't stellar, but since we really don't know what she's eating, it's unfair to judge. Maybe Debi is fat b/c she has fat genes...or maybe it's because she likes brownies a whole lot. I don't know!

#196

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 6:08 PM

But the point is, the obvious does not need to be said.

That would be true diplomacy. The mothers comparing their children and running their mouths and tattling like children is lunacy.

I hope they get at least a couple of those children into speech therapy STAT. I have to fast forward through Kimmy she's so irritating. I'd be worried more about a lifelong impediment with her than her dancing at this age.

I showed one of my daughters a couple of the last episode dances. She said thank you for never allowing anyone to even ask me to dance like that or dress like that in a dance. She said she'd have lasted about one lesson with either Abby or the two guys in Miami.

#197

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 8:29 PM

Apparently Sammy has an orthodontic piece that causes the speech issues I wonder if it's the same with Kimmy.

#198

appledumpling

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 9:44 PM

But the point is, the obvious does not need to be said. No, she is not as technically as talented as the others. But why the hell do other people's mothers need to hammer on it all the time? She's a child! "Even Hannah"? "You should be embarrassed with fourth place"? Who the hell says that? If she was slow and your kid was gifted, would you ever in a million years think it appropriate to say, "My kid is so much smarter than yours. You're just in denial about how dumb she is"? It doesn't matter and it's none of their business! And yes, I think Debi is perfectly aware of her Hannah's shortcomings; she just doesn't feel the need to voice them to these bitches on national television. There's nothing wrong with presenting a supportive front for your kid.





You took the words right out of my mouth it's none of the other mother's damn business and Debi doesn't need to focus on every fault and shortcoming of Hannah's it's her job to build the confidence and self-esteem of her child, like every decent parent should. There are enough wackos in the world whose parents have destroyed their self esteem.

#199

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 8:11 AM

You took the words right out of my mouth it's none of the other mother's damn business and Debi doesn't need to focus on every fault and shortcoming of Hannah's it's her job to build the confidence and self-esteem of her child, like every decent parent should. There are enough wackos in the world whose parents have destroyed their self esteem.


I agree with this to a point- it definitely isn't the other moms' problem unless somehow Hannah's ability and weight are costing the GROUP points, etc. However, I think that Debi is not doing Hannah any favors by putting her on this show at all. It's obvious to anyone watching that Hannah, despite her admirable work ethic, is no where near the dancer that any of the other girls are. Heck, Nia and Mac could likely dance circles around her. Also, putting her in a group with other very svelte dancers (in a svelte gendre like dance) cannot make her feel good about herself. The style of dance is just not good for Hannah's abilities either. I feel like if you put her in a hip hop style dance or something she would do much better, because bless the child, she has little to no natural grace.

I enjoy the fact that these girls have better technique than the DMP girls (my 6 year old who dances one hour a week can go into releve -MADI) but I just don't enjoy the style of choreography they do, the lack of camraderie, and the over the top cruelty of the moms. I think I'm done with this show.

#200

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 9:07 AM

I agree with this to a point- it definitely isn't the other moms' problem unless somehow Hannah's ability and weight are costing the GROUP points, etc. However, I think that Debi is not doing Hannah any favors by putting her on this show at all. It's obvious to anyone watching that Hannah, despite her admirable work ethic, is no where near the dancer that any of the other girls are. Heck, Nia and Mac could likely dance circles around her. Also, putting her in a group with other very svelte dancers (in a svelte gendre like dance) cannot make her feel good about herself. The style of dance is just not good for Hannah's abilities either. I feel like if you put her in a hip hop style dance or something she would do much better, because bless the child, she has little to no natural grace.


Her weight isn't going to effect how they score at all (unless her weight is effecting her technique which is could be). One of the good and bad things about competitions is that kids aren't judged like they are in a professional audition. No one is given extra points because they're pretty or have great hair or a nice body and they don't loose points because they don't have the typical look for the genre. This is great for dancers who don't have typical bodies who are able to do competitions and be judged only on their dance but also leads kids to not realize that those looks matter when it comes to booking professional jobs.

#201

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 9:56 AM

Ok, Kimmy officially creeps me out. I feel bad, she's just a little girl but she does. Her stiffness when she talks, her head always tilted up (like her mother). When she talks in her one on one interviews she looks like she's tied up. Very odd. Plus her teeth are super sharp and pointy and that freaks me out.

Poor kid.

#202

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 10:00 AM

I think Hannah is a beautiful little girl ( especially in her THs when her hair is down, she is probably the cutest of the girls, imo) and she dances with a lot of feeling and heart, but she doesn't seem to have the natural grace of the other girls. I agree that the other moms shouldn't make the little comments about her, but I also think her mom needs to quit telling everyone that Hannah is a good as the other girls. If she really was, then mom wouldn't need to keep announcing it. I think it annoys the other moms and draws attention to the fact that Hannah is a different dancer from the others. Also, it seems like her mom resents Sami more because she is everything that Hannah isn't ( specifically thinner, more graceful, and a more natural dancer) than because Sami ever did anything that bad to Hannah. (not that I think Sami is as great as she seems to think she is.) I am concerned that dancing this style of dance, with this group, is hurting Hannah's self-esteem and love of dance, and that would be a shame because I think she could shine in the right circumstances. Jmo

#203

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 10:05 AM

A girl who dances on the comp team at stars said Hannah is on weight probation- if a company member is overweight and doesn't lose weight they will be kicked off the team. I dont like Victor/Angel so much now... way to encourage eating disorders


That's pretty normal. I was a dancer from the age of 3 until college. We were weighed in every week. Maintaining our weight was extremely important. This was standard for competition dancers. You could take classes and be as overweight as you wanted, but to be on the teams you had to keep your figure slim.

#204

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 12:28 PM

Weigh in's with dancers who haven't gone through puberty are terrible and completely different than working with a child who is significantly overweight. Weigh in's are the type of thing that create eating disorders. The specific focus on numbers and when you have girls that are having growth spurts and hitting puberty. . .

#205

Three Foot Six

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 2:19 PM

I agree with this to a point- it definitely isn't the other moms' problem unless somehow Hannah's ability and weight are costing the GROUP points, etc.


Ever had a class with a really slow kid who dragged the pace of the whole lesson down? Yes, it sucks, and it's annoying. Tough shit, suck it up, they have every bit as much right to be there as you do.

If Hannah's dancing with the wrong level group, or they paired her in a duet with someone she can't keep up with, that's on the instructors and their poor judgement. And if the other moms don't like that, they need decide if they want to take THEIR children out of the equation and find a better fit. They don't get to decide they want someone else's kid out of it (or just pick on her incessantly, probably hoping she'll leave). That's none of their business.

#206

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 4:12 PM

I don't know why everyone is so mean about Hannah! She may not be the best dancer, but she really seems like a sweet kid. You have to admit she tries very hard.

#207

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 7:22 PM

I don't know why everyone is so mean about Hannah! She may not be the best dancer, but she really seems like a sweet kid. You have to admit she tries very hard.


Who is being mean? All the other moms are doing is pointing out that a young girl who is a member of a competitive dance team happens to not be as good as the others. This is just stating the obvious. No parent likes to hear that about their child but as a parent, you also have to be mature enough to recognize your child for what she is and not try and heap on laudatory comments when they are not deserved.

I think the other moms DO get tired of hearing about how good Hannah is from Debbie. After all, they are the ones who see her in the studio practicing with the other dancers and they are the ones who see her at competitions. After sitting next to Debbie and listening to her go on and on it is probably hard NOT to get her to acknowledge what all the rest of them can see.

It's wonderful that she seems very sweet and that she tries hard but that doesn't mean she is as good a dancer as Sammie or Kimmie or the others.

#208

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Posted May 5, 2012 @ 4:56 AM

She's definitely a weaker dancer, but Debi is right, Hannah performs the hell out of Sammi. That said, technique goes a lot further when it comes to winning awards. I think Debi knows Hannah isn't as good, and gets defensive when the other mothers comment on it. It's not necessary to repeat over and over, just as it's not necessary for Debi to keep talking about how great Hannah is. I'm sure the moms are doing it to bother her and create drama. Debs is deluding herself if she thinks Hannah will ever beat Sammi though. Sammi is so much better than Hannah technically. Even Hannah knows that! I'm glad Hannah at least has confidence in herself and her abilities. Of all the kids she seems the sweetest and most interesting (Kimmi is sweet, but she's sort of a robot) I also agree with the poster who mentioned that she's adorable. She's a very pretty kid, even with the extra weight.

#209

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Posted May 5, 2012 @ 8:32 AM

What gets me, though, is that with the exception of Jill, you generally don't even hear comments like that from the DMP moms. Mackenzie's mother didn't fuss about her being paired with Vivi-Anne, and Mackenzie, even a year ago, could dance circles around Vivi-and did.

How hard is it to understand that when your child's on a team,you support the teammates, even if they're not as good as your child?

The idea that Hannah is watching this show and hearing those comments makes me sick-and that goes for her mother's defensive ones as well as the other moms. Hannah is out there, working hard, doing her best, and celebrating accomplishments like finally making the top 5-and that's what she SHOULD be doing.

#210

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Posted May 5, 2012 @ 9:00 AM

What gets me, though, is that with the exception of Jill, you generally don't even hear comments like that from the DMP moms. Mackenzie's mother didn't fuss about her being paired with Vivi-Anne, and Mackenzie, even a year ago, could dance circles around Vivi-and did.

How hard is it to understand that when your child's on a team,you support the teammates, even if they're not as good as your child?

The idea that Hannah is watching this show and hearing those comments makes me sick-and that goes for her mother's defensive ones as well as the other moms. Hannah is out there, working hard, doing her best, and celebrating accomplishments like finally making the top 5-and that's what she SHOULD be doing.


Well said!