From the very beginning, it seems to me that Jack, as her childhood friend, is her one true love, and that they are destined to end up together. Amanda (the real Amanda) has such a powerful connection to him and a more or less pure motive for being around him.
As for Daniel, he is just part of the revenge plot. She may have developed feelings for him- and he is definitely worthy of her love- but their relationship is far too unequal for true love. He is just a beautiful pawn, and Daniel has no idea who she is!
I haven't seen every episode, so I can't comment on all the little words and glances, but as viewers I think we have been set up from the very beginning to want this. It's like Ross and Rachel on friends; from the very first episode you wanted this to happen, and after about eight years it finally did. Same thing with Amanda and Jack.
What do you think? Do you think they will end up together? Do you think they should end up together? Are they soulmates, or is Jack just another person for Amanda to use in her schemes? What clues do you see on the show to tell us whether this will happen?
Jack/Amanda: True love waiting in the wings?
Started by
Midru
, Feb 21 2012 05:55 PM
47 replies to this topic
#1
Posted Feb 21, 2012 @ 5:55 PM
#2
Posted Feb 21, 2012 @ 7:28 PM
Yes, we are meant to believe that Jack and Amanda (the real one) have a deep connection. It was clear from the first episode, and even clearer from reading the pilot script.
If Amanda had chosen to, she could have had many aspects of her old life back, including Jack, her house, and even Sammy. No, she couldn't get her childhood back, or bring her father back, but she could get back many of the things that were important to her. She could have told Jack who she was, and asked him to help her pursue legal means against the Graysons.
But this is not a story about forgiveness. She has already done some pretty unforgivable things to Jack, beginning with the simple fact of not telling him who she really is and letting him think that Amily is Amanda Clarke. He might even see not telling him her true identity and letting him help her bring the Graysons to justice as a betrayal, since he would no doubt desperately want to help her if he knew.
Furthermore, she's hurt a lot of people emotionally and placed many in physical jeopardy or contributed in some way to their death--and she's probably just only getting started. She is not the little girl he knew...she's damaged, possibly beyond repair. Would he even love her if he knew the things she's done?
In a way, she has made her relationship with Victoria more important than her relationship with Jack or anybody else. I imagine Jack will either be a casualty of her plans, whether emotionally or physically, or he'll leave in disgust.
I love Emanda's character and I still tend to root for her, but I don't see a happy ending here.
If Amanda had chosen to, she could have had many aspects of her old life back, including Jack, her house, and even Sammy. No, she couldn't get her childhood back, or bring her father back, but she could get back many of the things that were important to her. She could have told Jack who she was, and asked him to help her pursue legal means against the Graysons.
But this is not a story about forgiveness. She has already done some pretty unforgivable things to Jack, beginning with the simple fact of not telling him who she really is and letting him think that Amily is Amanda Clarke. He might even see not telling him her true identity and letting him help her bring the Graysons to justice as a betrayal, since he would no doubt desperately want to help her if he knew.
Furthermore, she's hurt a lot of people emotionally and placed many in physical jeopardy or contributed in some way to their death--and she's probably just only getting started. She is not the little girl he knew...she's damaged, possibly beyond repair. Would he even love her if he knew the things she's done?
In a way, she has made her relationship with Victoria more important than her relationship with Jack or anybody else. I imagine Jack will either be a casualty of her plans, whether emotionally or physically, or he'll leave in disgust.
I love Emanda's character and I still tend to root for her, but I don't see a happy ending here.
#3
Posted Feb 21, 2012 @ 8:20 PM
I agree with BBDi -- yes, Jack is set up as having a deep connection to Emanda, and yes, we are supposed to root for them (whether we do or not is another story). But I really don't see how they could realistically have a happy ending without Jack undergoing a major character change over the course of the series. And honestly, if that were to happen, I can't see EMANDA being happy about it: it seems very important to her to keep Jack safe, physically but also emotionally and morally. She wants him away from her revenge plans as much as possible because, it seems, it's important to her that he stay a good man with fond memories of the girl she was.
As I see it now, Jack is a symbol of what her life could have been if she had chosen the path of forgiveness instead of revenge (which, IMO, is why Nolan keeps pushing them -- it's less about actively shipping his friends, and more about trying to get Emanda on the path her father wanted for her). As I see it, they were "soulmates" once, in TV terms, but I think by choosing revenge Emanda has made it impossible for their relationship to ever really work; she's changed her soul too much, as it were.
I hope that's the way it goes, but then, I like things kind of twisted and dark (and I'm also not a huge fan of soulmate ships, so I am biased). It's possible the writers are setting this up to end happily for them, but I kind of doubt it. It's worth noting that in the original Count of Monte Cristo the Count does NOT end up with the love of his life that got stolen away from him. Jack seems to be playing that same sort of role, so if they follow the logic of the original book, it won't work out. The Count does end up with someone else. IIRC she was a prostitute turned kept lover who was devoted to him. There doesn't seem to be a real analogy to that character, at least not yet, and I wouldn't be shocked if Emanda ended up alone or even dead. Dig two graves and all that.
As I see it now, Jack is a symbol of what her life could have been if she had chosen the path of forgiveness instead of revenge (which, IMO, is why Nolan keeps pushing them -- it's less about actively shipping his friends, and more about trying to get Emanda on the path her father wanted for her). As I see it, they were "soulmates" once, in TV terms, but I think by choosing revenge Emanda has made it impossible for their relationship to ever really work; she's changed her soul too much, as it were.
I hope that's the way it goes, but then, I like things kind of twisted and dark (and I'm also not a huge fan of soulmate ships, so I am biased). It's possible the writers are setting this up to end happily for them, but I kind of doubt it. It's worth noting that in the original Count of Monte Cristo the Count does NOT end up with the love of his life that got stolen away from him. Jack seems to be playing that same sort of role, so if they follow the logic of the original book, it won't work out. The Count does end up with someone else. IIRC she was a prostitute turned kept lover who was devoted to him. There doesn't seem to be a real analogy to that character, at least not yet, and I wouldn't be shocked if Emanda ended up alone or even dead. Dig two graves and all that.
Edited by Agnes Bean, Feb 21, 2012 @ 8:28 PM.
#4
Posted Feb 21, 2012 @ 10:34 PM
I really hope not. It's too much for Jack to forgive, I think. I also don't want Emanda to "sail off into the sunset and have volunteer babies."
#5
Posted Feb 21, 2012 @ 11:30 PM
Well I've never bought the true love and don't think the writers are doing that either. What I think is that Jack and Sammy remain the one link to her past that hasn't been tarnished. I love their scenes together and hope when all is said in done that Jack remains someone that pulls at her conscience. I actually prefer Jack with FauxAmanda but their will be a lot of drama there...if she survives of course. I do love the connection though. And out of the two of them FauxEmily has the most stalking tendencies LOL. But I don't mind because Jack is one of the few things that keeps her human.
I don't want Jack to become a villain (despite his convincing intensity of late) so if they do ever get together it will have to be much later in the game. But I think he will continue to play a big part in her life and they may have an ill fated fling down the road but until she is done with revenge it won't ever be. And since this show is called revenge I think it's safe to say it will continue to be the love of her life.
I don't want Jack to become a villain (despite his convincing intensity of late) so if they do ever get together it will have to be much later in the game. But I think he will continue to play a big part in her life and they may have an ill fated fling down the road but until she is done with revenge it won't ever be. And since this show is called revenge I think it's safe to say it will continue to be the love of her life.
#6
Posted Feb 22, 2012 @ 1:01 AM
When I first saw the thread title, I actually thought it was for Jack and Amily (Fauxmanda). I think the two of them have great chemistry and make a better match than Jack and Emanda.
However, as this is not my ship, that is all I will say, lest I jinx my own. :P
However, as this is not my ship, that is all I will say, lest I jinx my own. :P
#7
Posted Feb 22, 2012 @ 2:14 PM
nd honestly, if that were to happen, I can't see EMANDA being happy about it: it seems very important to her to keep Jack safe, physically but also emotionally and morally. She wants him away from her revenge plans as much as possible because, it seems, it's important to her that he stay a good man with fond memories of the girl she was.
Yeah, I think this is a very important part of the way she interacts with him. I think she'd like to keep him separate, but at that dinner party in the second to last episode (with grandpa Grayson), she also got a glimpse of how passionately he would have defended her. That must have hurt but maybe also made her feel good.
I do think that with Jack she's looking at what she could have had, but wouldn't let herself have, and what she could have been, but wouldn't let herself be. I think their Facebook status would be "It's complicated."
#8
Posted Feb 22, 2012 @ 4:42 PM
Well, the show had been dropping anvils of "Jack/Amanda 3evah!" since the first show. I have to say, I don't think they make a good pair. He has more in common with FauxAmanda than with Emily. (Even though their entire relationship is based on a lie and his crush as a CHILD).
I like Emily. I'd like to see her take out Victoria and Conrad and the others and sail away, either alone or with someone - but not with Jack. I don't see her in Haiti and I don't see him being the husband of a rich woman.
I like Emily. I'd like to see her take out Victoria and Conrad and the others and sail away, either alone or with someone - but not with Jack. I don't see her in Haiti and I don't see him being the husband of a rich woman.
#9
Posted Feb 23, 2012 @ 11:14 AM
I have to admit, I am a man and I busted out in tears last week when Nolan suggested she get on that boat and sail away with Jack. And I agree that it is possible that Jack represents what she could have but never will. But as long as people can grow and change, she still has a chance to choose Jack. And it may be sappy, it may be unrealistic, it may be impossible, but to my mind Jack is the man for her.
Of course Jack and the real Amanda can only be a couple when she is done with revenge and ready to be happy. As others have stated, that may never happen. And the fact is that right now she doesn't deserve someone as good as he is.
But as long as I watch this show I'm going to be rooting for Amanda to grow up enough to let all this shit go, so she can be ready to embrace Jack and a normal healthy life.
Of course Jack and the real Amanda can only be a couple when she is done with revenge and ready to be happy. As others have stated, that may never happen. And the fact is that right now she doesn't deserve someone as good as he is.
But as long as I watch this show I'm going to be rooting for Amanda to grow up enough to let all this shit go, so she can be ready to embrace Jack and a normal healthy life.
#10
Posted Feb 23, 2012 @ 12:55 PM
Jack and Sammy (as far as we know) are the only living beings who really remember Emanda as she used to be before her father's arrest, apparently a sweet, cheerful, loving girl. That person, the unspoiled Amanda, exists only in their memories. I think it is extremely important to Emanda that Jack continues to remember her that way...even if it means not disclosing her true identity to him.
So not just does she want Jack to stay uncorrupted, she wants his memories of her to stay uncorrupted. For me these are reasons why they will never get together.
So not just does she want Jack to stay uncorrupted, she wants his memories of her to stay uncorrupted. For me these are reasons why they will never get together.
#11
Posted Feb 23, 2012 @ 1:48 PM
That would mean that Emanda would basically get away with everything and destroying innocent people in her quest to take down the guilty and I really don't want that.Of course Jack and the real Amanda can only be a couple when she is done with revenge and ready to be happy.
And I think it would ruin Jack's character if all of a sudden he's okay with everything Emanda's done and it would ruin the relationship if he doesn't know.
#12
Posted Feb 23, 2012 @ 4:10 PM
I agree with the majority of posters here - I don't see Jack, as he is right now, ever truly accepting the damaged person Emanda is. She's already indirectly caused his injuries, both physical and mental, lied a lot, and this is only the beginning. OTOH, it's possible that Jack is set up as a "love martyr" type of character, whose pure unconditional feelings will ultimately prevail over the darkness in the hero's soul and they will get together and be happy, but it won't be a very compelling story (and definitely not a compelling character - wasn't Heidi in Count Monte-Cristo basically the same character type? I always cringed reading about her) However, I don't have much faith in the writers (after all, they wimped out of killing Daniel), and, considering the anvil-sized hints of "Jack/Emanda = OTP!" in the first few eps I think this is a pretty likely scenario.
Personally, I would prefer Jack either to develop his relationship with Amily or to turn dark as a consequence of Emanda's actions and ultimately commit something truly drastic. Actually, he's already becoming a bit darker, but I'm not sure he'll ever stop being the uber-nice guy.
Personally, I would prefer Jack either to develop his relationship with Amily or to turn dark as a consequence of Emanda's actions and ultimately commit something truly drastic. Actually, he's already becoming a bit darker, but I'm not sure he'll ever stop being the uber-nice guy.
Edited by FurryFury, Feb 23, 2012 @ 4:12 PM.
#13
Posted Feb 24, 2012 @ 12:00 PM
Well... Jack is ok leaving his brother and running away with someone he thinks committed murder and arson.
#14
Posted Feb 24, 2012 @ 12:46 PM
No, Jack is okay with leaving his brother and going off to help children in Haiti. He is also okay with taking someone that he thinks committed arson with him. He didn't think she killed a man until he saw her standing over Tyler's body but she sort-of denied it and he just wanted her out of there so she wouldn't get arrested and he could ask what happened later. And if she does say that she did it but she gives a good reason for it (he was trying to kill Daniel and she was worried about Emanda because he hated her) then that would be very different than outright murder. There's also no guarantee he'd be willing to stay with Amily if he still thinks she killed someone.Well... Jack is ok leaving his brother and running away with someone he thinks committed murder and arson.
#15
Posted Feb 25, 2012 @ 9:53 AM
I actually like Jack and Amanda (Real Emily) slightly more than Jack and Emily (Real Amanda). The thing is both women have genuine feelings for Jack and both of them have been actively lying to him. When Jack learns the truth, it's going to sting like hell for him.
#16
Posted Feb 25, 2012 @ 7:33 PM
It's been a while since I read the book, but as I recall it, the young girl (I want to say she was late teens/early 20s) was the daughter of the man that Fernand Mondego betrayed for money while serving in the military. I think that betrayal was how he became wealthy, and ultimately a Count. I want to say the young girl was sold into slavery, and Dantes saved her, but I don't recall the details. I didn't think she was a prostitute, and I didn't think they got romantic until the end of the story.IIRC she was a prostitute turned kept lover who was devoted to him.
In any case, I agree with others that currently, it's just not feasible for Jack and (real) Amanda to come together romantically. This is a soap opera, though, so I wouldn't be surprised if a redemption arc for Amanda is in the making.
#17
Posted Feb 25, 2012 @ 7:52 PM
I really hope Emily isn't "redeemed"; I like her character as is. I'd want her to go forward with someone who can accept her, not want to change her. I don't want her to become a Good Woman.
And I just don't buy Jack as that person. Nor do I buy him as some sort of "moral center" of the show.
And I just don't buy Jack as that person. Nor do I buy him as some sort of "moral center" of the show.
#18
Posted Feb 25, 2012 @ 9:45 PM
Well somebody should try to change her as she's practically a sociopath. I think anyone that loves her would want her to change. Nolan certain tries. And I think Jack would try if he knew. I wouldn't want anyone to just embrace her as is.
I don't know if I'd say Jack was the moral center but this show is full of immoral characters. His sense of right and wrong is certainly not a wrong way to go as far as moral centers go ha ha. His righteous rant at the dinner party really cut to the heart of the matter for me. All of these folks with secrets and plots. It did my heart good to see someone just lay out some truth on the table.
But it's the RealAmanda side of the equation that interests me. I love that she cares about him so much. To see those little glimpses of her sadness and caring that her human.
I like her character as is as well, but eventually, 3/4/5 years down the line she will reach a point where she will have her revenge or she she will be dead. She's not going to spend the rest of her life plotting revenge. I can see Jack playing a part in that change as well as other characters like Nolan, Charlotte and even Daniel depending on where they go with that character. I'm not a shipper. I just love the character of Jack. I prefer him with RealEmily and I can see that playing out for a season or two and I'm just fine with that. But Jack and Amanda will be addressed at some point -- probably when Jack finds out the truth. That could be seasons away.
I'd probably take the soap path that has them having a torrid short term affair while he's still in the dark. I could also just see them becoming each other's BFF. That would work for me as well.
I don't know if I'd say Jack was the moral center but this show is full of immoral characters. His sense of right and wrong is certainly not a wrong way to go as far as moral centers go ha ha. His righteous rant at the dinner party really cut to the heart of the matter for me. All of these folks with secrets and plots. It did my heart good to see someone just lay out some truth on the table.
But it's the RealAmanda side of the equation that interests me. I love that she cares about him so much. To see those little glimpses of her sadness and caring that her human.
I like her character as is as well, but eventually, 3/4/5 years down the line she will reach a point where she will have her revenge or she she will be dead. She's not going to spend the rest of her life plotting revenge. I can see Jack playing a part in that change as well as other characters like Nolan, Charlotte and even Daniel depending on where they go with that character. I'm not a shipper. I just love the character of Jack. I prefer him with RealEmily and I can see that playing out for a season or two and I'm just fine with that. But Jack and Amanda will be addressed at some point -- probably when Jack finds out the truth. That could be seasons away.
I'd probably take the soap path that has them having a torrid short term affair while he's still in the dark. I could also just see them becoming each other's BFF. That would work for me as well.
#19
Posted Feb 26, 2012 @ 3:48 AM
The thing is, though, that while Emanda might never be a normal person (I highly doubt it, actually) she will have to change.I really hope Emily isn't "redeemed"; I like her character as is. I'd want her to go forward with someone who can accept her, not want to change her. I don't want her to become a Good Woman.
Once she gets her revenge then she can no longer live a life centered around revenge and destroying other people and change is simply inevitable.
Edited by Princess Aldrea, Feb 26, 2012 @ 3:51 PM.
#20
Posted Feb 26, 2012 @ 2:22 PM
The thought of Emanda having a happily ever after after destroying the Graysons doesn't sound very appealing to me. It has to be bittersweet, otherwise it would feel like a cheat.
#21
Posted Feb 26, 2012 @ 3:52 PM
How about Emanda achieving what should be a happily ever after but being unable to enjoy it because of how much she's changed and how far she's gone? I think that would be poetic justice.
#22
Posted Feb 27, 2012 @ 9:52 AM
Then it wouldn't be a true happily ever after, would it? :)
#23
Posted Mar 11, 2012 @ 3:26 PM
Having just rewatched the pilot, I go back to the quote that opens the show, about if you want revenge, start by digging two graves. As much as I want Amanda to have revenge and somehow redeem herself (because otherwise she doesn't deserve Jack), I suspect that somehow she will not survive her own plot.
My guess is it won't be a fall from grace; either she gets away with it or she dies!
My guess is it won't be a fall from grace; either she gets away with it or she dies!
#24
Posted Apr 21, 2012 @ 12:21 AM
I personally prefer Jack with Amilly as they not only have great chemistry together but Amilly has had a pretty shitty life since her parents died and Jack is one of the first decent people she's encountered, I for one would like to see a happy ending for Amilly and Jack.
#25
Posted May 17, 2012 @ 8:03 AM
Well, regardless of how much I ship Nolan and Jack and how my heart skipped at the "I care about you" ... I have to say that that kiss was smoking hot!
#26
Posted May 18, 2012 @ 9:05 AM
I just don't see Jack and Emanda going very far. If he actually knew who she was and what she's done, he'd be horrified by her. No matter his sympathies. And I think she would like to be the girl Jack loves, but she'll always be too angry for that.
#27
Posted May 19, 2012 @ 12:25 AM
I'm sure that's true but I hope to continue to see movement now and then and I look forward to the big reveal/blowup/heartbreak next season or the one after.
#28
Posted May 19, 2012 @ 2:04 AM
I don't really care for the Emanda/Jack kiss, it struck as being a bit weird, I just would like to Amily and Jack together for good. Jack is probably the first decent man Amily has had a relationship with.
#29
Posted May 23, 2012 @ 5:28 AM
I think this is where the big twister is going to come from. Jack found out that Amily burnt down Writer Creep's house, or at least he strongly believes she did, and he even suspects that she might have killed Tyler to frame Grayson but he seems surprisingly cool about that. As far he's concerned, being screwed over by Victoria Grayson makes that understandable. And he doesn't even know the whole truth. He doesn't know that the Graysons framed David Clarke. Jack just thinks that Victoria had an affair with Clarke and abandoned his daughter to rot in the system because of the scandal. Imagine how he would feel if he finds out the truth and he's already in love with Emanda already.
#30
Posted May 24, 2012 @ 1:30 PM
Personally, I kind of want Amily to really be pregnant with Jack's kid and not some one-night stand she's passing off as his kid. Mainly because having it not really be his kid would be taking the easy way out.
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