Jump to content

AS-6: "Fashion Face Off" 2012.02.09


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.

147 replies to this topic

#121

circlesquare

circlesquare

    Video Archivist

Posted Feb 11, 2012 @ 12:54 PM

I can't recall anyone throwing so much shade on the runway as he did tonight.

I thought Jerrell put a polite spin on the controversy, saying they both had the same inspiration rather than accusing Michael of plagiarism.

I found it really passive aggressive and pissy and would have preferred him to just come out and say what he was hinting at. When they were asked why things were so similar, Jerrell immediately started talking about how the minute they got to the workroom he started on that coat. This is completely true and I don't have a problem with what he said. The shade I was referring to is how he was pulling a ton of faces and jerking his head around. He came across like a tattletale in 3rd grade saying, "Teacher, I won't name names, but someone who is standing right next to me did something bad!"

I actually like Jerrell so I'm not down on him for thinking Michael was copying him. I think I would have been annoyed in the same situation. I just wish he would have gone about it in a different way. Just say, "I don't know what happened. All I know is I started this coat in this silhouette the minute we got to the workroom and it is true to my original sketch."

Ultimately it all seemed stupid for the judges to bring it up since the final looks didn't look alike at all.

Jerell's coat was good, but it wasn't earth-shakingly spectacular, or unique.

I liked it, but it reminded me of an episode of ANTM when the models did a photoshoot in which they were supposed to be homeless teens (it was a cause that captured Tyra's heart for 5 minutes). I'm not saying that to be snarky either--the models were rocking a very similar look.

Edited to add, I would replace Nina with Joanna Coles. I like what she brings to the table in terms of an honest critique without the need to be nasty at the designers' expense. I like Joanna's sensibility, in all meanings of the word.

When she has been guest judge on regular seasons she totally brings the machete-mouthed bitch. Which is unfortunate because I really do like her as the mentor.

#122

screamapiller

screamapiller

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted Feb 11, 2012 @ 1:36 PM

Didn't Kenley say she was designing for someone who would go to Art Basel Miami Beach? I wouldn't be caught dead in Miami Beach in a pastel polka dotted romper like that one, and especially not around the moneyed art crowd. It was bad enough as it was, but given the inspiration it was even worse.


Good god, YES. Ryn the Tyn, Can you imagine Kenley's onesie being in the same room in with ANY of these outfits?



Notably: Her schlocky, C-list store is staffed with the nastiest salespeople, too. Which really makes my blood boil. If the sales staff can be nice to people at Harry Winston, or, you know, Commes des Garcons, the chicks should be able to muster up some politeness at Cynthia Rowley.

O/T, but you ain't kidding, Kitty Pierre. A few years ago, a friend had told us how much she loved a bag she'd seen in the store, so a couple of us decided to pool our resources and get it for her as a birthday gift. When I went in, I couldn't find the bag my friend had described, and I got as far as asking one of the sales staff "Excuse me, I'm hoping you can help me find -" when she cut me off and said in an extremely bitchy tone "I don't know what you're expecting to find her, we don't have clothes in YOUR size." [Full disclosure: I wear a size 18, but even if I did wear a size Rowley made her clothes are NOT my style.] About ready to burst into flames from my anger, I asked her to please go get the manager; when I informed the manager that I had come to the store looking to purchase a handbag but thanks to the young woman insulting me I would be taking my business elsewhere, she tried to get me to stay and after the third time she said she would be happy to help me I told her "You can help me by getting the hell out of my way so I can leave this store and never come back."

#123

BrookeM

BrookeM

    Channel Surfer

Posted Feb 11, 2012 @ 1:55 PM

I'm having a hard time being objective this season, due to personalities. I can't get past them. I really liked almost all of these people their first time around, and now this time everyone except Rami is annoying me.

My Rami...gone. :( (yes, his top and the color choice was horrid, but I don't think he deserved to be sent packing, compared to some others).

Michael is really the only person on the show I have never liked. I think he's phony (who can cry harder without ever shedding a tear, or squint his eyes and tip his head to such effect when taking advice or criticism from Joanna/Tim/judges?), but I agree with Joanna, that I don't care where you get your inspiration, even if it is "to the left of you." Just do it better than the other guy.

Why does Jerell care so much? As the tired old phrase goes, "rise to the occasion, put your big girl panties on and accept the challenge to do something to make yours stand out". Which he did, but with a lot of moaning along the way.

Also, they apparently judged and came to their conclusions for best/worse before talking to the designers?

Edited by BrookeM, Feb 11, 2012 @ 1:57 PM.


#124

klarsonovsky

klarsonovsky

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Feb 11, 2012 @ 2:18 PM

So it's an insult to say you could find Kara's stuff on Madison Ave, but it's a compliment to say Jerrel's looks straight out of Anthropologie? I mean, I'm an Anthropologie kind of girl, and I liked the coat, but there's nothing fashion-forward about it. I really don't see how Kara's outfit is any "less designed" than a lot of what Michael Kors puts out, or what Mizrahi churns out in bulk. Her outfit perfectly reflects her signature style and point of view-- easy, simple, comfortable ready-to-wear that is universally flattering. Even Georgina said she'd wear it!

The judges were clearly not in agreement this episode, and I agree that the addition of Cynthia Rowley threw things off. Did it seem like there was a real age divide? I felt that Isaac and Cynthia seemed to have a very different idea of what is stylish than Georgina and Angela-- perhaps the former don't quite have their fingers on the pulse these days, hmm?

If you watch Michael (both in his previous season and now), you would see how he creates. Some of the designers draw a detailed sketch and never deviate from the design. Some of them (like Michael), prefer to work more with the fabric, playing with it on the dress form and changing it to suit what works.


I agree. Some designers start with a "vision"; Michael starts with a vague idea and revises as he goes, relying on his excellent sense of fabric to determine what works. If he'd been making Mila's cape, for instance, he would have scrapped it as soon as he saw how poorly the fabric draped at the shoulders, and would have understood that the leather piping would only exacerbate the problem. I agree with Georgina that it's hard to imagine what a "Michael collection" would be (whereas we know exactly what a Kenley collection would look like, for better or worse), and I think that comes from working primarily for private clients-- he doesn't start with an overall inspiration that can be translated into a range of garments, he starts with the specific needs of the client (or the challenge), and produces beautiful, flattering clothes piece by piece. I can see him having a very successful career working under a top designer-- using his creativity and innate talent for fabric, silhouette and proportion to execute someone else's inspiration beautifully.

#125

xfuse

xfuse

    Couch Potato

Posted Feb 11, 2012 @ 8:58 PM

I agree with Georgina that it's hard to imagine what a "Michael collection" would be (whereas we know exactly what a Kenley collection would look like, for better or worse), and I think that comes from working primarily for private clients-- he doesn't start with an overall inspiration that can be translated into a range of garments, he starts with the specific needs of the client (or the challenge), and produces beautiful, flattering clothes piece by piece.

I think because he is so used to working with clients needs is why he is one of the few people that seem to 'get' what the challenges is even if the results sometimes turn out like last weeks. I don't think he should get a negative because of it.

His style is more like the black opera gown and that style is hard to put into some of the challenges. If you go to his site and see his work you will instantly know it.

This is something that bothers me on top chef also. They make people do a certain type of challenges and then because they follow challenges to letter they then get dinged for it.

#126

Teagan1

Teagan1

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 12, 2012 @ 11:46 AM

Cynthia Rowley really is the worst. Her designs suck so hard.

I just checked out her 2012 Resort collection and you aren't kidding! Ugh.

I wasn't overly impressed with any of the designs this time around. I don't really have an opinion of the Michael/Jerrell controversy, but I ended up liking Michael's jacket better. I could see how well made Austin's pants were, but didn't like them. I didn't, however, think the top and cardigan were that bad at all. Shocked that Rami went, but aside from his jacket, he really fell short this week. I do like cowel necks, but his was a little too much--not to mention the seams and construction of the rest of the shirt.

#127

Edsel Love

Edsel Love

    Video Archivist

Posted Feb 12, 2012 @ 12:51 PM

Honestly, the whole Jerell/Michael drama would never have happened if the judges had done their job and auf'd Jerell last week for that ridiculous African take on Carmen Miranda. It was everything but the hatful of fruit.

#128

Isuzu

Isuzu

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Male

Posted Feb 12, 2012 @ 6:12 PM

Finally saw the episode and good golly, were Michael and Mondo supremely whiny and annoying this week. I generally like Mondo and was SHOCKED that he didn't win his season, but they both seemed to have bought their own hype a little too much and have such a chip on their shoulder. First Mondo: that whole display was ridiculous and it was clear for everyone that Michael at least inspired himself from Jerell, if only on a subconscious level. Don't try to make it as of the others are jealous of him (because bitch, please). And that whole thing with your mother reeked of camera-whoring and emotional blackmail. Pull yourself together, because you're on a slippery slope.

And Michael. Urgh. I think if he was the same on S8 as he was these past few episodes, I totally get why he was so hated by most of the others. Still dosn't excuse some of the most hateful behaviors of Ivy and Gretchen, but being paranoid and bitchy when you think someone is copying you (to do the same thing three challenges later), talking and whispering with others about someone else's work, trashtalking people with your buddy (when you have no leg to stand on) and those smirks, sighing, eye-rolling... No wonder people don't like you, is what I'm saying. I can't wait to see him get the boot and take his Kardashian-inspired fashion with him./rant over.

I love Mila's. I thought she should have won this week, although I enjoyed Jerell's as well. Kenley's was weird, but I kinda liked it in a weird way. Both Kara and Austin made shitty garments. I'm very sad to see the back of Rami (and of Rami's sweet, sweet arms) but that top may have be the most heinous thing on that runway this side of Season 9, so I don't think his Shmauf can be argued, sadly.

Edited by Isuzu, Feb 12, 2012 @ 6:14 PM.


#129

KittyPierre

KittyPierre

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Feb 12, 2012 @ 8:52 PM

Screamapiller: I so hear you, on your O.T. Rowley experience! The people in the Cynthia Rowley store I see and loathe daily once offered the (unsolicited) information that size 10 is their cut-off size. (I work in fashion, so I'm very well acquainted with the size-ism issues in the industry. But, hello, Cynthia Rowley? Are you aware that your potential customers now have yet another good reason to wander over to someplace chic-er? say, Marc Jacobs?) Cynthia's so tasteless. The meanness comes off her in waves.

Designers with a sideline selling polyester bridesmaid dresses for Dessy shouldn't be casting stones.

I mean, Michael Kors isn't exactly a design genius, either. But stand him up against Rowley and at least he's got a solid schtick going. He's got a point of view, anyway.

Someone put a sock in that woman's mouth.

Joanna Coles, on the other hand, has definitely grown on me. She's been droll, and it's appreciated.

#130

Laney123

Laney123

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Feb 12, 2012 @ 9:39 PM

The head-to-head aspect ensures that the best outfit winds up in the top and the worst outfit winds up in the bottom, which is really what matters. You can argue about which was actually top or bottom, of course; it's a weekly ritual to question the judges' decisions.


I disagree. The head to head aspect forced a winner and loser within each pair, even if both entries would have otherwise been winners/losers. Without the head to head judging, I think Michael and Jerrell would have both been at the top, or at least both would have been safe from elimination. I think both Kara and Austin would have been in the bottom. Austin's was dreadful, but Kara's was not stylish or interesting in the least. She's been a major disappointment on All Stars, and I am someone who really liked her in Season 2. Without the head to head judging, I think Rami would have been safe, possibly bottom 3, but surely not out.

The judging seemed structured to force a controversial elimination - to knock out someone who otherwise was poised to make it to t he end. They won't ever learn that what viewers really want to see in a talent-based reality show is TALENT, not manufactured tension and drama.

The only good thing is that now that Jerrell has won a challenging, it will embolden him to really ramp up the crazy, so he'll likely be exiting next week.

#131

swanpride

swanpride

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 2:37 AM

As long as Project Runway exist, bad designers have been in the competition way longer than they were supposed to be, because they got lucky and someone else did a worse garment or ignored the rules. I was actually impressed when they eliminated Anthony, who provides much better TV. And as long as it exists, good designer had to go because they didn't manage to deliver in a single round.
Honestly, no matter what Rami can or can not do, this garment was just bad. The colors were clashing, there was way too much going on, it bulked because of the double drapped collar - that thing was just crazy. If a less popular designer had send this out, I don't think that the decision would be controversial at all.

#132

CatsWithAxes

CatsWithAxes

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 2:57 AM

The head-to-head aspect ensures that the best outfit winds up in the top and the worst outfit winds up in the bottom, which is really what matters.


I disagree. The head to head aspect forced a winner and loser within each pair, even if both entries would have otherwise been winners/losers.

I think the first poster was saying the challenge's overall winning design and overall losing design would still wind up in the right respective places (top or bottom) though - but I don't think that's necessarily true either, really. The scores that determine the top 3 and the bottom 3 don't also determine the ultimate challenge winner and loser - the judges' discussions with the designers and among themselves are what decide that, and I don't know that the winning design is always necessarily the one that got the highest score when it first appeared on the runway (it would be nice to know the method they use for those scores, actually). So if a really good outfit has to be relegated to the bottom just because of the way the challenge is set up, it's automatically denied the chance to be part of the "designs we liked" discussion, and thus robbed of the shot at being the winner that it might otherwise have had.

Edited by CatsWithAxes, Feb 13, 2012 @ 3:03 AM.


#133

swanpride

swanpride

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 8:16 AM

I disagree, since they spoke with the pairs. If you ended up in the bottom, you were already considered worse than someone else, if for nothing else, then for the first impression. And that's what counts. Yes, by talking with the jury they might decide that a garment isn't as bad as they thought, or not as good as it originally seems to be, but a garment which doesn't get the good attention immediatly is bad or not so good by default, because normally nobody would bother to take a second closer look unless there is an inicial interest.

Edited by swanpride, Feb 13, 2012 @ 8:17 AM.


#134

CatsWithAxes

CatsWithAxes

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 12:59 PM

If you ended up in the bottom, you were already considered worse than someone else, if for nothing else, then for the first impression,

But that's only because one garment had to be considered "bad" and one had to be considered "good". In reality they might have been very close (as seemed to be the case with Michael and Jerell). And the discussion might have steered the win to one or the other.

And that's what counts.

That's not all that counts though. If the challenge winner and the eliminee were based only on first impressions, there would be no need for the judges to discuss anything - they could simply look at who has the highest score and who has the lowest and decide right away based on that.

Edited by CatsWithAxes, Feb 13, 2012 @ 10:28 PM.


#135

IttyBittyFlavur

IttyBittyFlavur

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 3:46 PM

The scores that determine the top 3 and the bottom 3 don't also determine the ultimate challenge winner and loser - the judges' discussions with the designers and among themselves are what decide that


Even after discussions, it's only the top 3 that are considered for the win and it's only the bottom 3 that are considered for the loss. We've never seen something switch from one category to the other.

The judges have more than just a "first impression." They have time to study each outfit as it goes up and down the runway (perhaps multiple times) and in this case, they got to see the two competing outfits side-by-side. These are fashion professionals who are accustomed to sizing up a look. Discussing a designer's approach or intentions might change their opinion of the designer, but it's not likely to change their opinion of how well a look works. (Getting an explanation of Elisa's intentions didn't raise her in their opinion, for example.)

If the challenge winner and the eliminee were based only on first impressions, there would be no need for the judges to discuss anything


Other than prolonging the outcome and boosting the drama. It's a TV show, not a televised competition.

Edited by IttyBittyFlavur, Feb 13, 2012 @ 3:49 PM.


#136

Paula in Playa

Paula in Playa

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 5:58 PM

I just remembered what Mila's cape reminded me of:

Scout's ham costume from To Kill a Mockingbird.

#137

meepster

meepster

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 8:01 PM

You are so right! If only the model had put it over her head.

Why does Jerell care so much?

Because this challenge was head to head. I think normally his reaction would have been, who cares. But this one time, he and Michael were going to be judged against each other. And he felt, with some justification, that Michael had scrapped his own design and started over by copying his coat.

Michael is a draper. But, almost every episode, he is shown sketching out a design on his tablet, before they go to Mood. He did one for this challenge also. And it didn't look like what he produced for the runway.

#138

CatsWithAxes

CatsWithAxes

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 13, 2012 @ 11:06 PM

Even after discussions, it's only the top 3 that are considered for the win and it's only the bottom 3 that are considered for the loss. We've never seen something switch from one category to the other.


Yes, I get that. But something may switch from being "second favorite" (i.e. second-highest scorer) to favorite/winner - we don't know. Because of the nature of this challenge, it's possible that something that would normally have been in the top 3 (if the designs were all being judged against each other across the board), and would possibly have gotten the second highest score overall, didn't make even the top 4. So it wasn't even considered as a possible winner.

Normally the top 3 are the top 3 out of all the designs. But in this case, in order to get into the top 4 and be considered for the win, a given design only had to compete against one other design.

Discussing a designer's approach or intentions might change their opinion of the designer, but it's not likely to change their opinion of how well a look works.


Maybe not, but getting a closer look at some the details of a design might nudge someone's opinion of a design one way or another within the top or bottom. The judges' discussing the designs among themselves could possibly do the same thing.

If the challenge winner and the eliminee were based only on first impressions, there would be no need for the judges to discuss anything


Other than prolonging the outcome and boosting the drama.

Or, more likely, reaching a consensus, since judges' first impressions may not all have been the same. This group in particular seems to have more disagreement than usual, which, personally, I like.

It's a TV show, not a televised competition.

I was under the impression that it was both.

Edited by CatsWithAxes, Feb 13, 2012 @ 11:16 PM.


#139

swanpride

swanpride

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 14, 2012 @ 5:47 AM

The thing is: Even in a normal judging, in which Kara might have ended in the bottom instead of Mondo and Michael, for producing a garment which exactly fullfilled the challenge but was totally boring, Rami was the only one who had produced a total disaster. They might have send Kara home instead, just because Rami has shown more talent beforehand - they have done so before. But to be honest: Rami did a misstep. In a normal season he most likely would have slipped through at this point, because someone else had produced something worse. But in the field of "All-Stars", second chances are rare.

#140

WearyTraveler

WearyTraveler

    Couch Potato

Posted Feb 14, 2012 @ 9:13 AM

Based on the judges' comments, I would say that if this had not been a side-by-side challenge, the results would have likely been as follows:

- Top Three: Jerrel, Michael, Kenley
- Bottom Three: Austin, Kara, Rami
- Safe (middle of the pack): Mondo, Mila

I also think, again based on their comments, that the winner and loser would have been the same.

They liked Jerrel's outfit better than Michael's in the side-by-side, and better than Kenley and Mila's in their Top 4 analysis, so, Jerrel would have still been the winner.

They liked Kara's outfit better than Austin's in the side-by-side, and they disliked Rami's more than Austin, Mondo and Michael's designs in the Bottom 4 analysis.

So, while we might not have gotten Mondo's tears over criticism, or the copycat drama from Jerrel and Michael if the challenge had been structured differently, I don't think the outcome would have been any different.

I'm sorry to see Rami go, but that shirt was awful, the design was bulky in the neck, and the color combination was bad. That's three out of three. I do think that if we had the regular judges, the outcome might have changed. The regular judges NEVER forgive "boring", it's the kiss of death, so, I think they would have sent Kara home, but we don't have those judges now, so, it's a moot point.

#141

Bungalow Joy

Bungalow Joy

    Stalker

Posted Feb 15, 2012 @ 5:13 PM

Rami also compromised his own good design, the jacket, by belting it. A poor styling decision that had to count further against him in the judging. I wish it were Kara that had gone, but that's too many check marks on Rami's scorecard.

#142

micat

micat

    Channel Surfer

Posted Feb 15, 2012 @ 7:36 PM

Really. I'm sure he loves her, but the woman obviously dropped the ball big time when teaching that kid how to eat with a fork.


Priceless.

My favorite part of the episode was during the dinner when Michael started to explain how he made his coat, and Jerrell said: "Well, clearly I know how it's made...I did it first." Deadpan, but with a touch of exasperation. I couldn't stop laughing. I know Jerrell annoys a lot of people but I think he is hilarious. YMMV.

#143

tabbygirl521

tabbygirl521

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 15, 2012 @ 7:49 PM

No one, and I really mean, no one that I know would Ever wear Kenley's outfit. One, few women would pull it off and two, it is not funtional. I couldnt believe her when she tried to comfort Mando by repeating the judges opinion of Austin's model right in front of him and laughing like its the funniest thing. She is so tackless (and annoying). Can't believe she is still there and Rami isn't. I'm beginning to really question the judges tastes based on this episode alone.

I didn't like Kenley's romper (at least not for a grown woman) and I really liked Mondo's look...but I thought it was a bummer that she felt she needed to soothe Mondo instead of being able to, rightly, enjoy her win.

Edited by tabbygirl521, Feb 15, 2012 @ 7:49 PM.


#144

Canada

Canada

    Couch Potato

Posted Feb 16, 2012 @ 4:04 AM

I think this is the first time, in all the episodes that I've ever watched of this show, that I didn't like any of the looks. I think they all looked terrible, some moreso than others. Both Austin and Rami should have gone home! Mondo is annoying me more and more. Kara is boring as hell. Michael is still a useless toad. I really hope that the winner (it was all so crap that I can't even remember who won!) didn't get immunity. I can't believe that these people are all-stars; they're not impressing me at all.

#145

CatsWithAxes

CatsWithAxes

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 16, 2012 @ 1:48 PM

I really hope that the winner (it was all so crap that I can't even remember who won!) didn't get immunity.

They haven't been granting immunity on any of the challenges this season. Any designer who wins a challenge can conceivably be eliminated the following week. It hasn't happened yet, although Michael came close to being auf'd on the "muse" challenge after winning the previous two in a row. (Jerell was the winner this week, and he certainly didn't deserve immunity - he's been turning out stinkers all season, and undoubtedly will do so again on the next challenge. He needs to be the next to leave, IMO.)

Edited by CatsWithAxes, Feb 16, 2012 @ 6:42 PM.


#146

Numb Nut

Numb Nut

    Couch Potato

Posted Feb 16, 2012 @ 3:21 PM

Delurking b/c I just came across this while shopping and had to post the link. Could this have been Kenley's inspiration?

http://www.shopbop.c...p;colorId=11192

#147

Lamb18

Lamb18

    Fanatic

Posted Feb 16, 2012 @ 9:11 PM

I just saw this episode again and now I don't think Rami should have been eliminated. I noticed the jeans he made this time and they were just right, and his jacket was really beautiful. I guess the awfulness of the shirt overpowered the rest of his outfit. I supposed Austen should have gone instead.

#148

Lady Cathcart

Lady Cathcart

    Channel Surfer

Posted Feb 18, 2012 @ 5:54 AM

Drove past a Wendy's Restaurant the day after seeing this episode, and the first thing that popped into my head upon seeing the "Wendy" character on the sign was: Kenley's garment! Must be the baby-blue background with white polka-dots, and the Peter Pan collar!