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Speculation WITHOUT Spoilers (Promo talk goes here, too!)


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#811

ViciousCircle

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 9:51 PM

If Cora had the ability to slow or halt her aging, which wouldn't surprise me, she could be the wife who left Rumpel. We know she was originally from humble beginnings, although not as humble as Rump's seem to have been, and we know she was a highly motivated social climber. So I could see her ditching Rumpel and Bae not because Rumpel was a coward (she seems to prefer that in her men) but because he was not ever going to be upwardly mobile. So Cora could be Bae's mother. I think Bae looks ALOT like Regina, but I'm terrible with faces and possibly way off with that. I also think Rumpel had to be deliberately preparing a curse-enactor for a loooooonnng time - he just wasn't one to leave such a vital element of his plan to chance. If so, and if Cora did dump him, it would make sense for Rumpel, once he found himself powerful and in need of a specific type of future nutjob to enact his curse, to head straight to Cora as step one in those preparations, because a) she dumped him for power, and abandoned their kid, so screw her and b) he knows her hunger for power is the most easily corruptable and manipulatable trait in the world and c)he knows from his own experience how having that much power can cause a person to really screw over and/or up his or her kid, and he was going to need someone really screwed up to enact his curse. Hell, step one could have been to slow Cora's aging himself. If anyone in the realm knew how, it would be him.
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#812

funnybia

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 11:40 PM

Pretty sure that was Hanry he was talking to. Any info on the dagger he could have gotten from Mother Superior when Rumple saw him talking to her. On the other hand that could just be what they want us to think.


I actually did think it was Henry he called at first, when I watched, but having it be mother superior sounded like a cool theory, anyway, I'm cool with Henry being the person August was talking to on the phone.

As for the book, remember Blue Fairy at the end of the war meeting saying she was gathering the other fairies together to make preperations? I think they created the book.


I do think that mother superior remembers she's a fairy, I don't think she wrote the book. She has no reason not to include Pinnochio's and Rumple's story.

Also, I think the book is a device that Rumple made as part of the curse, but not that he wrote it himself. Everyone affected by the curse, except the caster and the creator of the curse, has his or her story in the book.
Since the evil queen and Rumple take part in a few stories themselves and without their presence the stories wouldn't make sense, they're mentioned, since Baelfire and Pinnochio weren't affected by the curse, they're not.

The identity of the evil queen is a given, probably the first person Henry figured out. As for Rumple, he's definately in Snow White's story (the part when Snow and James go talk to him in his cell) because Henry knew details about the curse that were only discussed there. The thing is, I bet that on those parts were Rumple is present, it's things like- Snow White and Prince Charming go to Rumplestiltskin for help and he reveals so and so about the curse; Seeing the death of her fairy godmother, Cinderella became desperate, she wanted to leave her wretched life and so she made a very regretable deal with Rumplestiltskin; Blinded by his desire of freedom, Jiminy excepts Rumpestiltskin's help, little did he know, all magic come with a price and...- The fact is, I think Rumple is mentioned, but briefly and isn't given dialogue, making him harder to identify. Which is why Henry doesn't know who Gold is yet, not because it's too hard for Henry to figure out, I mean seriously Henry matched James up to a comatose John Doe based on a scar (a very small scar), he already associates Mr. Gold with deal making, a character like that in the book, that'd be an easy match up. I think the evil queen is the same thing, maybe with a bit of dialogue, but like I said before, she's WAY too easy to figure out.

Edited by funnybia, May 3, 2012 @ 11:42 PM.

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#813

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 8:00 AM

The way I understood it about Pinocchio's story, is that Henry originally did have Pinocchio's story of the whale and becoming a boy parts, along with him helping Geppetto build the wardrobe. I think what Henry meant was that there were new parts included that he was not familiar with, i.e. the story continued from building the wardrobe and was not finished according to Henry, as if Pino had a new adventure unfinished. He didn't specifically say. That is why Emma questioned August and he replied by saying that the ending is being written right now.

To those who think that Blue enchanted the book to write itself is a logical explanation. I think the stories are interwoven and have Snow relations, both direct and indirect. I think the book basically derives from the most recent Fairy tale generation, though. I don't believe that Rumple's original story is in there because Blue did not know that he was instrumental in creating the curse (or did she?), so she focused the supposed 'book enchantment' on Regina and Snow. I think she probably intended for it to magically be placed in Snows possession, so as to teach Emma in her childhood, but unfortunately, that did not happen. I think the book enchantment may have also been intentionally made to make whoever read it as a child to magically 'believe'! That could explain why Henry understood it from the moment he got the book.
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#814

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Posted May 5, 2012 @ 2:54 PM

Who thinks that Henry should just start going on about how he wants Emma to have a DNA test to see that MM is her mother. That would provide, if not proof, pretty convincing evidence of the Curse, or some other bizzare circumstance. Emma could not refuse to believe it.
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#815

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Posted May 5, 2012 @ 3:03 PM

Except that the most previous DNA test done in Storybrooke was totally faked so why should Emma trust it?

However yes, that was my sister's first thought ages ago, that a DNA test would prove they were her parents. For that matter, Henry could try to prove his DNA shows he's related to David and Mary as well. Henry should definitely have some of mitochondrial DNA passed down through Mary's line.



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#816

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Posted May 6, 2012 @ 4:37 PM

Put this in speculation, because, well it is! But after watching the spoiler of the first 8 minutes. Wouldn't it be nice if Regina reformed and helped the citizens of Storybrooke, just because of her love of Henry? What a barnburner that would be!
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#817

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Posted May 6, 2012 @ 8:15 PM

Regarding the promo:

Prince Charming vs. Rumplestiltskin in a sword fight. That is all.

Also-- Magic coming back to Storybrooke? Does that mean the Lands are leaking back into our world? Veeery interesting.
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#818

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Posted May 6, 2012 @ 8:24 PM

For that matter, Henry could try to prove his DNA shows he's related to David and Mary as well. Henry should definitely have some of mitochondrial DNA passed down through Mary's line.

Mitochondrial DNA testing is prohibitively expensive. He'd better steal Mr. Gold's credit card if that's going to happen.

OK, for next episode, Henry will code and be pronounced dead, and Emma will kiss him goodbye. Henry comes back to life, and Emma believes in magic.

I don't really think that's a stretch of the imagination.
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#819

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Posted May 6, 2012 @ 8:59 PM

Regarding the promo:

Prince Charming vs. Rumplestiltskin in a sword fight. That is all.

I'm way more interested in what actually happens in Storybrooke, rather than what happens in the Enchanted Forest. And frankly, I'm tired of Rumpel winning all the time (in both places) - it's more than bit one-note. It's reasonable and logical, I'm just tired of seeing it (like I got bored with cursed David's repeated weaknesses)

Emma seeing August, Emma maybe believing, that sounds awesome. Agree with mustbekarma on the kiss. Hopefully before he's pronounced dead. Even though the kiss is predictable, any other solution would be disappointing at this point. I'm hoping that the kiss is a deliberate guesture, that she's thinking on the curse when she does it. A gesture of faith in Henry, of belief, of accepting her role. All of that. That sounds much better, more triumphant and powerful. But either way, a kiss saving Henry should keep her from reverting into denial. And once she believes, August should be okay.

Edited by Tzigone, May 6, 2012 @ 9:00 PM.

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#820

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Posted May 6, 2012 @ 10:28 PM

After watching the promo, I'm wondering if it's Regina (ironically enough) that somehow provides proof of the curse and gets Emma believing. I think Regina would do that to save Henry.

Emma is seen descending in what appears to be the same shaft elevator in the mine that Henry and Archie were trapped in. Does she actually go to the enchanted forest and believe after seeing it? And what could remain there that would make her believe if all the inhabitants are in Storybrooke? Maybe a deserted land full of broken glass coffins and empty castles?
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#821

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Posted May 6, 2012 @ 10:54 PM

Emma is seen descending in what appears to be the same shaft elevator in the mine that Henry and Archie were trapped in.

Was it that elevator, or was it one that leads to the basement asylum?

I'm glad we're going to get a glimpse of how Snow and Charming regain their rule in the Enchanted Lands next week.

And I'm also looking forward the the Emma/Regina knockdown drag out fight, part II. This time Graham won't be there to separate them.

What was that wonky effect coming over Emma when she's holding Henry's book. Does the book magically impart Fairy Tale knowledge to her, like she suddenly gets implanted with the Enchanted Forest version of The Intersect once she believes?
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#822

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Posted May 6, 2012 @ 11:24 PM

Rumpel doesn't win all of the time. He didn't win when Regina did whatever she did with Belle. There is also some history between Regina & Rumple that we don't know yet.. their familiarity.. her walking into his castle, etc.. same with Jefferson.

I am wondering when Henry is taken to the hospital Regina refuses to allow Emma to see Henry, but only as he is about to die she allows Emma to say good-bye, breaking his sleep-coma.
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#823

Storm03

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 4:13 AM

Maybe Emma will get some memories when she touches the book? And maybe she'll go down the shaft and see the glass coffin.


Did anyone else actually want to see Jefferson and Regina go back to their world through the hat? I wanted to see how it looked now with all the people gone. Is it just one big Narnia setting now lol

Edited by Storm03, May 7, 2012 @ 4:14 AM.

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#824

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 7:48 AM

What I wonder is if the Savior's death would break the curse is why Gold han't killed her? Or would it have to be Regina doing it that would break the curse?
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#825

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 9:10 AM

There are so many more important things to get done in the finale, but does anyone think there's a chance that we might get Charming's real name? Especially if the Enchanted Forest side of things picks up chronologically where we just left off?

Also, I really want to know how Charming ended up with George's castle. George was very open to everyone that Charming wasn't his son when he was about to execute Charming, so conquest/rebellion/coup is all I can think of right now. That doesn't seem especially likely, but I got nothing else. If everyone knows Charming isn't James, why are Ella and Thomas calling him James later? That can wait until next season, though.

A kiss to wake Henry seems most likely, but does anyone have any other ideas?

We saw August talking to someone in the promo - did we see who it is? I know I thought it was Emma, but now I can't recall if I saw her, or if I just assumed? Hope we actually get to see an August/Marco scene.

I really hope we get a scene with Emma and Mary Margaret, and Mary Margaret being there for Emma regarding Henry's condition. Will Emma tell anyone that it was Regina's turnover that did it? I guess Emma could take it to the hospital with her, in case they have turnover-analyzing skills that can determine poison and antidote. Which bring us to the question of whether or not Emma will think it's just mundane poison and who she'll tell about that. Will Whale be Henry's physician?

Henry's hospitalization would provide a nice opportunity for the people Emma has helped to reach out to her. Doubly so for Ella and Michael, actually, since they are also parents and have their kids because of Emma. That said, I could understand a desire to focus on main characters. Not sure what David's storyline would be.

While I'd like to see Kathryn and her gym teacher again, that can wait until next season. I definitely do think we need to see them, though, just so we can have hope of them re-connecting.

Edited by Tzigone, May 7, 2012 @ 9:12 AM.

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#826

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 9:44 AM

OK...I think Henry's "coma" will probably be chalked up to an allergic reaction by Dr. Whale. So Emma still won't believe the curse. Until something happens - maybe she actually kisses him...or something else. Then the season will end with her accepting her fate. But there will be some sort of twist or evil on the horizon (perhaps Bae?) that will leave us with a cliffhanger...
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#827

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 10:02 AM

Also, I really want to know how Charming ended up with George's castle. George was very open to everyone that Charming wasn't his son when he was about to execute Charming, so conquest/rebellion/coup is all I can think of right now. That doesn't seem especially likely, but I got nothing else. If everyone knows Charming isn't James, why are Ella and Thomas calling him James later? That can wait until next season, though.


Maybe they aren't going to end up with George's castle. Maybe they are trying to overthrow the Queen and take back Snow's kingdom?
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#828

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 10:17 AM

Maybe they aren't going to end up with George's castle. Maybe they are trying to overthrow the Queen and take back Snow's kingdom?

If you check the set in "The Shepherd" where they meet with Midas and the set in the Pilot where the war council meets, you will see it is the same room. Same floor, same table, same pillars, same stained glass window, etc. If they try and say that's Snow's castle in the pilot, I will be very peeved. That table, in particular, in very distinctive and no attempt was made to make the rooms look different.

Screencaps (you can see the table, windows, and chandelier):
The Shepherd
Pilot
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#829

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 10:31 AM

Ah okay, then this should be very interesting.

I think I really need to re-watch all the episodes. I have missed so many little things!

Edited by SiobhanJW, May 7, 2012 @ 10:35 AM.

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#830

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 10:39 AM

Yeah, I'm particularly caught on that one because it's one I noticed myself, instead of having it pointed out to me by someone else (which is what usually happens).

Unfortunately, I paid no attention to the castle during the castle attack last night. So I don't even know if we saw a good exterior shot or whether or not it matches the castle in the Pilot. Nor do I remember if we saw a good exterior shot of George's castle in any other episode. Honestly, I only noticed because of the table - like I said, it's distinctive.

If the outsides show two different castles, then I'm not sure which way I'll go with it.

ETA: Just checked - outsides seem to match, too.

Edited by Tzigone, May 7, 2012 @ 12:36 PM.

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#831

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 2:34 PM

David almost has to be another fairy tale character.. one with a name that would be a dead give-away. That is the only reason I can think of why we have not been given his name. Jack (as in Jack & the beanstalk) would fit.. a very poor farm boy with only a mother.. but then he would have a golden magic harp and the goose that laid the golden egg (and would no longer be poor) .. unless that is coming up? (seems unlikely)

No one can prove that Regina made that turnover.. will Regina try to blame it on Emma? Say that Emma was leaving town & didn't want Regina to have Henry? What would they find in an analysis of that turnover?

And where has Kathryn gone? Will her gym teacher/prince story finish up next season?


Regina paid King George off.. maybe all is well again? (although I would not expect that from Widmore)
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#832

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 3:11 PM

OK, for next episode, Henry will code and be pronounced dead, and Emma will kiss him goodbye. Henry comes back to life, and Emma believes in magic.

Yup, this is my guess too - Emma's kiss will break Henry's spell and make her a believer.

We've always read in all the fairytales that "true love's kiss" will break the spell. However, my guess is that the show is going to take some liberties with the definition of "true love". Is it always constantly defined as the love between husband/wife/lovers? Is it always necessarily romantic love? Or could a broader definition of "true love" be the love that a parent has for a child (non-romantic, of course, because otherwise, that would be wrong!)? If there's anyone in Storybrooke who is truly Emma's "love", it's Henry. I'd bet anything that Emma leans over his hospital bed to kiss him on the cheek or the forehead, maybe a few of her tears falling on his brow for good measure, and bam! The kid wakes up.

Edited by LisaNewYork, May 7, 2012 @ 3:16 PM.

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#833

metaphysicist

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 4:59 PM

I will be very interested in Gold's reaction to Henry's plight, if there is any such scene.
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#834

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 5:03 PM

I will be very interested in Gold's reaction to Henry's plight, if there is any such scene.

I think he'll be happy? Regina's plan to stop Emma failed and with Henry in a coma, Emma would want to believe for the first time to wake him up, so the curse would be broken just like Gold wanted.
I wonder if only Gold knew Henry was Emma's son when he brought him to Regina or if Regina knew too. I think only Gold knew and did this to insure Emma would have a reason to arrive to Storybrooke to break the curse, but I'd like confirmation for this.
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#835

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 5:07 PM

I think he'll be happy?


If Henry's father is who I think he might be, then Gold's reaction may be far from happy.
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#836

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 5:23 PM

I think it's more than Emma simply kissing the kid. I think she has to WANT to believe that kissing the kid will wake him up. Right now, the issue is that she doesn't want to believe, so she can't see the proof in front of her (ex. August's leg). Therefore, the wanting has to come first. She has to take a leap of faith. No proof will make itself visible to her until she jumps of her own free will.

David almost has to be another fairy tale character.. one with a name that would be a dead give-away. That is the only reason I can think of why we have not been given his name. Jack (as in Jack & the beanstalk) would fit..

You know, I hadn't even realized that we haven't learned David's name yet until I came to this thread. I'd just been thinking it was James, but right. That's the dead guy. So yeah, he definitely has to be someone else. Exciting! Boob Fairy told Baelfire it was the last bean (and that was hundreds of years ago), so I'm not sure about Jack of the Beanstalk. But maybe they lost a bean, and little Charming found it? However, I think Jack & the Beanstalk will probably be a separate story; Charming doesn't act like someone who has been to another world. But I've been excited about a potential Jack flashback ever since the beans were introduced.

Now I'm going to go crazy wondering who he is...

I used to think Regina had had a fling with dead!James, but the way she reacted to Charming wasn't in the way of a woman who was seeing the twin of her dead fling. Ah well. I still think dead!James has some good juicy story left in him for next season.

I think Henry's "coma" will probably be chalked up to an allergic reaction by Dr. Whale.

I'm also interested in what Dr. Whale will say about Henry's condition. I want to know what the real world explanation for magical apple poisoning is. Ha! Just like how Graham apparently had 'a heart attack'. I don't think there's much reason for Regina to trick him or force him to lie for her; if the doc says it's poison, she could just deny having given Emma the pastry. Henry was in Emma's house when he ate it.
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#837

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 6:52 PM

she could just deny having given Emma the pastry


How would that matter to Emma? I for one am looking forward to Emma and Regina's throwdown. Here is possible lead-in dialog:

Emma: "Regina do you know what I was in jail for when I had Henry?"

Regina (sneeringly): "Hooking?"

Emma (dead serious): "Assault."
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#838

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 6:57 PM

I'm also interested in what Dr. Whale will say about Henry's condition. I want to know what the real world explanation for magical apple poisoning is. Ha! Just like how Graham apparently had 'a heart attack'. I don't think there's much reason for Regina to trick him or force him to lie for her; if the doc says it's poison, she could just deny having given Emma the pastry. Henry was in Emma's house when he ate it.

The thing with this scenario is if Henry lives, he'll tell the truth; that the pastry was made by Regina. If Henry dies.. Regina can frame Emma, but then.. Henry is dead.

As for Jack & the Beanstalk.. as I said that wouldn't work unless it hasn't happened yet?.. because in the end Jack was rich, and obviously Charming was not. Still, I think he must be another character since they have been so coy about his name.

metaphysicist..lol

Edited by MorninStar, May 7, 2012 @ 6:58 PM.

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#839

funnybia

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 9:28 PM

Emma: "Regina do you know what I was in jail for when I had Henry?"

Regina (sneeringly): "Hooking?"

Emma (dead serious): "Assault."


Haha metaphysicist that totally made my day! Now I REALLY hope she says something similar to that.
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#840

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Posted May 7, 2012 @ 10:51 PM

OK, for next episode, Henry will code and be pronounced dead, and Emma will

...call House.
Or, given that he's a child actor, maybe the season will end with him in a coma, and the next season begin with him 6 years older, awakened by Twu Wuv's kiss. If so, will she be a vampire in Fairy Tale Land? Or maybe Jasper's daughter?
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