535 replies to this topic

[Ulle]

So, what will we do with ourselves over the long dark Winter months, when no fresh GoT episode is to be had? We will not be reading the GoT series, that's for certain, beacuse we are the brave unspoiled!

What we can do, is find other books to read, just to tide us over until Summer returns anew, bringing fresh episodes on raven wings. In this thread, we suggest, read and comment on books that can help us deal with the GoT withdrawal. But remember, all comparisons to the show are unspoiled!

My first suggestions would be the Farseer Series. It's perhaps a bit lighter than GoT (although it's hard to say, not having read the books), but while it is for Winter, it will technically be summer...

Also, for the Arya fans, I read a book about a girl being raised to become a swordfighter (unacceptable in her society) by some crazy relative who wanted a novelty, that I've been meaning to reread, I'll see if I can find the title.

Let's hear it, Winter will be upon us in mere weeks, people!

[litex]

The Farseer trilogy is funny read after GoT, because its primary character is a noble bastard with a mysterious connection to a wolf companion. Very Jon Snow.

[Maximum Taco]

If you unspoiled kids are looking for something the same general flavour of GoT (gritty fantasy) I'd suggest Joe Abercrombie's The First Law trilogy (of which I've read the first book and plan to read the second and third this summer)

And if you're looking for something with the same kind of political intrigue but more DRAGONS! (meaning real flying lizards not unburnable girls) Stephen Deas' The Adamantine Palace is a page turner. It's followed by sequels The King of the Crags and The Order of the Scales which I have not read and plan to finish some time soon.

Edit: Apparently Stephen Deas' trilogy is going by the name A Memory of Flames, although I had to go to his website to find that out (it is not printed anywhere else as far as I can tell)

I start way too many books at the same time...

Edited by Maximum Taco, Jun 4, 2011 @ 12:07 PM.

[Betolat]

Also, for the Arya fans, I read a book about a girl being raised to become a swordfighter (unacceptable in her society) by some crazy relative who wanted a novelty, that I've been meaning to reread, I'll see if I can find the title.

I think you might be talking about "The Privilege of the Sword" by Ellen Kushner. Loved that book. Also Ellen Kushner expressed her surprise when she saw Game of Thrones and Arya's first dancing lesson, because it had so many things in common with how she described a similar scene in her book.

If you don't want to abstain of all George R.R. Martin I also highly recommend Tuf Voyaging and Fever Dream. And maybe Roger Zelazny's Amber series could be a thing for fans of family feuds and intrigue.

[Ulle]

Yes! That's the one! Thank you.

Arya really made me remember that book, and make me want to read it again.

For me, I think I want to stay away from Martin. You learn a lot about possibilities I think, reading his other books. I don't want to know if he often uses fake outs and kills his "lead" characters, for example.

[Sad Doctor]

I remember reading in an interview at some point that George RR Martin decided to do the big fantasy novel thing after he read Tad Williams' Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn trilogy. It's a bit more traditional saving the world story, but it's pretty well done, and the breakdown of society is very compelling.

[Kalamity Kat]

I'd suggest Lois McMaster-Bujold's Curse of Chalion. It, too, has a lot of politics where the fantasy is low-key--a lot like GoT. Even nicer--it finishes in one book, though a sequel, Paladin of Souls, is also quite good. Bujold has won several awards--both Hugo and Nebula for her writing. Her strength is her characters and her story-telling. I heartily recommend.

[ElymianDucat]

If you don't want to abstain of all George R.R. Martin...

Even better, if you don’t want to abstain from Westeros altogether, you should look up the Dunk and Egg stories. They’re three novellas set 90 years before the setting of the main series, so they don’t spoil anything about the plot. They follow the adventures of a low born hedge knight called Ser Duncan the Tall and his squire Egg.

[Maximum Taco]

Even better, if you don’t want to abstain from Westeros altogether, you should look up the Dunk and Egg stories. They’re three novellas set 90 years before the setting of the main series, so they don’t spoil anything about the plot. They follow the adventures of a low born hedge knight called Ser Duncan the Tall and his squire Egg.

Ah ElymianDucat, you don't know these people. They don't even want names that haven't appeared in the show. Dunk and Egg are definitely out.

[majael]

For me, I think I want to stay away from Martin. You learn a lot about possibilities I think, reading his other books. I don't want to know if he often uses fake outs and kills his "lead" characters, for example.

One way to split the difference is to read the Wild Cards shared-world superhero anthology series, which Martin edits and sometimes contributes to. (He hasn't chipped in with any writing on the most recent books.) They really are excellent, and you can't tell anything about Martin's story tendencies from it because he's collaborating with other writers who also get a say in what happens.

[Cardie]

I'm in the middle of Hilary Mantel's Wolf Hall, a non-fantasy historical novel about the machinations of Thomas Cromwell on behalf of Henry VIII as he sought to divorce Katherine of Aragon and wed Anne Boleyn (and how that didn't turn out so well). It's kind of like reading GoT entirely from Littlefinger's perspective, with a touch of an average-sized but lower-class Tyrion thrown in.

[TudorQueen]

Loved "Wolf Hall", and those of you who like "The Privilege of the Sword" should try Kushner's earlier novel, "Swordspoint", which stars Richard van Vlier and Alec as younger men. Kushner, in the earlier work, establishes an entire world with the same depth and attention to detail as Martin does with Westeros.

I'm also very fond of Stephen Donaldson's "Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, Unbeliever", which comes as two trilogies (years later, he issued the first volume of a third trilogy, but I haven't gotten to that).

Also, George RR Martin has written some amazing short stories, many of which are collected in the book "Sandkings". Non-SOIF, and very very good.

[Darmys]

you could also try Patrick Rothfuss "The Kingkiller Chronicles" The Name of the Wind and The Wise Man's Fear

This is a link to his blog and this is a link to Worldbuilders ok that was actually a link to Heifer International where all the money raised by World Builders goes. This is World Builders 2010.

[ElectricBoogalo]

Yay, thanks for all the suggestions! I just started reading GoT but I am finally at the point where I've caught up with the show, so I'm afraid to read any further. I need other books to distract me so I'm off to check out these books.

[velo]

I shall nominate Daniel Abraham's series "The Long Price Quartet" if non-readers want something else wtith a fantasy tinge. It's made up of 4 books, though each has a fairly complete story arc at different points in the protagonists lives.

He's collaborated with GRRM before, and GRRM's endorsement adorning the front cover of the book is probably a better selling point than my attempts to do so.

"A poignant human tale of power, hearbreak, and betrayal" ~ GRRM

It's beautifully written with a set of really well rounded characters, can't recommend it enough ""

Edited by velo, Jun 5, 2011 @ 6:39 AM.

[Eegah]

A lesser-known fantasy series that I heartily recommend is Codex Alera by Jim Butcher. It's about descendants of Roman legionaires that fell into another universe, who all have Avatar: The Last Airbender-esque elemental powers, and their fights against various and equally awesome enemies. It has a good share of emotional moments, but is mostly just about fun and action, and will probably be a great breather after Martin's far darker and more serious take on fantasy. The series is now finished at six books.

Edited by Eegah, Jun 5, 2011 @ 2:17 PM.

[Lily Patil]

If you're interested less in the fantasy aspects than in the ginormous cast of characters engaged in complicated political machinations aspect, I highly recommend either of Dorothy Dunnett's series, The Lymond Chronicles or The House of Niccolo. The first is set in the 16th century, the second in the 15th century, and both of them range all over Europe, the British Isles (especially Scotland) and the Middle East. The level of historical detail is astounding, and each of them center around completely fascinating heroes. The series are loosely connected, but can each be read on their own. And they're LONG - they will without a doubt keep you occupied until the next GoT season.

[fallingfortruth]

For rollicking good fantasy firmly rooted in historical reality that isn't afraid to get dark, I'd also recommend Neal Stephenson's Baroque Saga, the first book of which is "Quicksilver." They're incredibly good, and some of his characters remind me quite strongly of a few of GRRM's.

(Also: if we bookwalkers promise not to talk about ASoIaF at all, can we play in the great inter-season read? I love doing book discussion, and I think that fans of GOT would be a great group to do it with.)

[ipj]

One of my favorite books ever is The Curse of Chalion by Lois McMaster Bujold. Epic fantasy loosely based on Medieval Spain at the time of Ferdinand and Isabella. A veteran, Caz, drags home from the wars to beg a place at the table of the house where he once was a page, and winds up tutor to the Princess Iselle. She's a pawn, to start, and so is he.... both of them far more so than they can realize.

The books have magic in the form of theology, but it's well thought-out theology. Their beliefs feel broad and real, and there are very tight rules on what's possible. There's no 'I'll just whip out a spell that will save us' or 'well, why didn't god just intervene on page 40 then' deus ex machina stuff. The crux of the story is the political intrigue, and it's all complicated by the layer of theological intrigue further screwing with things. Bujold is great at plot, and this one winds tighter and tighter in a very satisfying way. It's even more rewarding on reread, when you can see all the tiny details laid out that will be crucial later on.

Crucial theological distinction: A saint is not a good person. They may not even be a nice person. A saint is a tool the gods can use for a task, and if it breaks they'll discard it with all the grief you'd feel over a broken paintbrush.

Bujold is also outstanding at characterization, especially the minor characters who feel full and realized and in possession of their own stories. In fact the sequel, Paladin of Souls, follows several of the minor characters in a different adventure.

[stillshimpy]

(Also: if we bookwalkers promise not to talk about ASoIaF at all, can we play in the great inter-season read? I love doing book discussion, and I think that fans of GOT would be a great group to do it with.)

Gosh, I think you guys should be welcome to join in, as long as you don't do comparisons or spoil us on the other books.

We're all going to be in the off-season together, after all :-)

Edited by stillshimpy, Jun 5, 2011 @ 10:53 PM.

[Sad Doctor]

Bujold is also outstanding at characterization, especially the minor characters who feel full and realized and in possession of their own stories.

The odd thing I've always found with Bujold (and maybe this is only true of me) is that, as well as she writes most of her male characters, her females seem to invariably turn into Mary Sue's of the first caliber. I always feel like I'm reading a self-insertion character. Miles Vorkosigan's mom as exhibit A, B, and C.

[Estelindis]

The odd thing I've always found with Bujold (and maybe this is only true of me) is that, as well as she writes most of her male characters, her females seem to invariably turn into Mary Sue's of the first caliber. I always feel like I'm reading a self-insertion character. Miles Vorkosigan's mom as exhibit A, B, and C.

Cordelia might be exhibit A, Sad Doctor, but Ekaterin is probably B and Ista makes C. That said, I love them all. They may be awesomer than average in most respects (and do have certain characteristics in common that one might identify in Bujold herself too), but they're far from unflawed and unblinkered, and they go through fantastic dramatic arcs. Anyway, I... *counts* ...third the suggestion of Bujold's books, whether the Chalion ones or the Vorkosigan ones. (Didn't much like the Sharing Knife series - not bad, just boring - but that might be up the street of any reader who enjoys slow-paced romance.) Bujold's talent for writing page-turners that act simultaneously as past-paced adventure stories and deep character studies is second to none.

[ipj]

I didn't enjoy the Sharing Knife series: I don't normally mind sex scenes, but every time I came to one I found myself saying "yawn, no plot, time to page ahead." And Fawn grated every time she scurried. Third Chalion book had a similar problem with the generic heroine, plus the magic was getting strained and simplistic, which was bizarre given how incredible I found the first two books in that series.

But as a female reader I think she creates good female characters. Taura, all the Koudelkas, Ekaterin and Helen, in the Vorkosigan series. Elli Quinn, especially in her stand alone. And Ista, especially, in the Chalion series.

If you read the Vorkosigan series start back toward the beginning: the most recent is the weakest of the series. Miles has an incredible run as a squiggly-minded man on tops of varying heaps of trouble, stumbling from frying pan to fire to woops that's a furnace.

[Ulle]

Gosh, I think you guys should be welcome to join in, as long as you don't do comparisons or spoil us on the other books.

I second this, as long as you please remember to not spoil us! No "And didn't the death scene in chapter eight remind you of when Tyrion pushed Joffrey down the stairs!", please. Not even if it's really funny. Not even just this once. Just, not, OK?

I'm not going to voice any opinion on the suggestions made (yet, I mean, there are still a couple episodes left of the show), but I'd like to sound off what we're all looking for. I would like:

• Not a series as the first book we tackle (at least not beyond a trilogy). Let's find our legs with something simpler?
• If it winds up being a series, absolutely not one that isn't finished yet.
• Honestly, I'd prefer something on the lighter side. It's summer, and I know the ending of the show's season will probably depress the bejeezus out of me... I cry easily. Very easily, people...
• I'm not a big fan of historical fiction, myself. It always feels like I'm supposed to believe it's real, just because the time and place is. I'd prefer fantasy. (Or some science fiction, but I can't manage to find a way to make Ringworld tie in with the show, so... Hmmm, maybe some of the early Discworld, though! :-) )
• I would like to avoid Martin, and any Martin-affiliated things. Just because of the rather huge *whooops*-spoiler risk. You know you'd do it. Come on, admit it.
• I think TV-shows and movies are also a possibility, right? (*going through my dorama-fixation in my head* Nope, I got nothing.)

So, what are you guys looking for?

[ipj]

Idea from the episode thread: Aubrey/Maturin series by Patrick O'Brian. Early 1800s (or around there) life of a sea captain as told by his Darwinish friend. Very solid grounding in real history and a great swashbuckling adventure. Ep thread compared Aubrey to Ned, intensely devious in battle and then painfully straightforward out of it.

We did these books on tape for car trips, and they work very well. Will warn that you want the old guy narrator, who is telling a riproaring tale of men at sea, and not the younger guy who is trying to Shakespeare in a bored voice.

I suppose I should also toss in a plug for His Dark Materials by Philip Pullman, outstanding alternate world series. Our souls are visible and near us in animal form. Changeable in children, settled and revealing in adults. The heroine, Lyra, is a fierce little monster who grows into a capable girl on the verge of womanhood. And this is outstanding as a book on tape for long summer road trips, performed by British actors, keeps kids way too young for this as a bedtime story happily enthralled as you drive along. Check your library!

[Eegah]

For a standalone one, I definitely recommend Dune. Yeah, there's sequel books, but the first one easily stands on its own (and in fact many fans prefer to think of it that way). I actually think it's even better than its reputation as the Lord of the Rings of science fiction; rather than a Big Important Work like LOTR, it's a fascinating and fast-moving epic battle between one guy and pretty much the whole rest of the universe.

[fallingfortruth]

God, I love Dune. It was one of the formative books of my childhood.

As to short works and/or lighter works, I am faced with a quandry. Because I feel as if Robin McKinley's "Sunshine" is basically completely aces as far as standalone books go, but it is emphatically not light.

And the Codex Alera, which Eegah recommended, is kind of hard to beat for rolicking adventure with satisfying ending, as far as I'm concerned, but there are six books in the series. Not six particularly long or difficult books, but six nonetheless.

Can anyone else think of a book that satisfies the standalone + not depressing requirements?

[Ulle]

God, I love Dune. It was one of the formative books of my childhood.

As to short works and/or lighter works, I am faced with a quandry. Because I feel as if Robin McKinley's "Sunshine" is basically completely aces as far as standalone books go

fallingfortruth, we must have been separated at birth! I love Sunshine! (and Dune, I'll even watch that... movie when it's on TV) I'm not sure if going in the vampire-direction of fantasy is where we're headed, though? (Although it's not the Twilight-style of vampires, they're pretty much inhuman monsters, and the take on magic is in my opinion the more interesting part.)

, but it is emphatically not light.

It's not? In that case I may be willing to relax my "must be light"-declaration. I don't mean I must laugh the whole way through, just please don't have the book end with a quadruple suicude, after the family legacy has been burned to the ground, with the sole survivor a crying infant on the ground surrounded by hungry wolves...

Can anyone else think of a book that satisfies the standalone + not depressing requirements?

Yeah, "not depressing" was perhaps more what I was going for.

However, you don't have to aim at satisfying my list, that's just one opinion. What do you want?

[fallingfortruth]

I was thinking of Sunshine being similar to GOT in that it is obviously based on a period of Earth history but subtly twisted, with a lot of clever deconstructions of traditional storytelling tropes. It doesn't let the viewer rest easy on the assumptions you bring into a story knowing "what kind" of story it is, and in that respect I think that McKinley has a lot in common with Martin.

If you don't think Sunshine would be too much of a downer I would TOTALLY be behind using it as our first read, if only because I love Robin McKinley more than I love most things. (Although if we decide we don't want to go in the "clever deconstructions and grit" direction but rather the "pseudo-historical ass kicking" one, we could always read The Blue Sword.)

[Ulle]

it is obviously based on a period of Earth history but subtly twisted, with a lot of clever deconstructions of traditional storytelling tropes.

Good point. And I too am a complete sucker for McKinley...

I thought of another book that could be fun, although I can't really think of any way to twist it to fit with GoT (have at it!). It just lends itself pretty well to a discussion, I think. Jasper Fforde's The Eyre Affair, where the protagonist is a kind of police/beauraucrat in England-as-a-police-state (haven't read it in many years, sorry) responsible to guard books against change. It's fun and complicated, and deals with the book Jane Eyre, for the history fans. It's the first in a series, but I think one can read it as a stand alone.