40 replies to this topic

[TheLady2]

I think at times Marlee's interpreter answers a question himself instead of it coming from her. It seems to me that's having an extra person on the team with his own ideas. Last week he was sitting in the van in back of Marlee but across the seat and he answered a question as a teammate. There was something this week also but I don't recall what it was.

[WileyCoyote]

re: that scene in the van. I saw that too, and for a moment thought it, but even if it were true (I'm not so sure now), I think he'd only stick his two cents in with something observational, not something requiring coming to a conclusion. In other words, I don't think there's be any problem with him being an extra pair of eyes (since he's already an extra pair of ears), as long as the brain work is all Marlee.

On the greater subject of Marlee overall, I saw her on The Comedy Central Roast for Trump, and she was virtually the ONLY funny thing on it.

Edited by WileyCoyote, Mar 21, 2011 @ 12:34 PM.

[beezer]

I think at times Marlee's interpreter answers a question himself instead of it coming from her.

If someone looked at him and asked a question when she hadn't been in a conversation with them he'd answer but aside from that, I think he's probably speaking for her and the camera maybe hasn't caught her hand(s), though I don't recall the scene you're referring to so obviously you could be totally right.

Native signers are uberfast and can move their signing if need be, and be very discreet about it if need be, hence I'd think he's probably mostly talking for her even if she's not obviously speaking.

Flove her - she seems to have the most sense and be the most normal person there, she looks great in a pair of jeans and she gives excellent 'I could cut a bitch, but I'm contemplating whether it's worth the jail time.' face.

[WileyCoyote]

NY Post on Marlee's observations leading to the discovery of Gary's hearing loss.

http://www.nypost.co...CBPxjUb0jmgdSyI

[beezer]

It is one of our senses and something that deaf people don't have. I certainly applaud people for accepting things they can't change and living their best lives, but being deaf certainly isn't advantageous. Deaf people can't hear sirens, alarms, honking horns and many other things that alert us to danger. There are jobs they will never be able to do. There are many experiences that they will never be able to have.

I brought this here from the Dionne thread because I think it's more a Marlee discussion, in a general sense?

As noted by a couple of people, Matlin has long been a proponent of deaf culture and ASL and, as she said in the book episode, does not believe being deaf is a pitiable thing, it just is what it is; she also acknowledged she faces barriers every day - most of the world is hearing, after all.

I don't know what jobs (besides singing) she or any other deaf person wouldn't be able to do based on their deafness or what experiences they wouldn't be able to have besides obviously hearing.

As for alarms and stuff, there are plenty of alternatives, have been for decades, and the more technology improves, the better they get. I

[LoraxGirl]

I think saying being deaf is disadvantageous is too strong a word, and maybe that is why people are disagreeing with it. It definitely creates barriers but those barriers can be worked around through the help of other people and new technology. But I don't think it is fair to say a deaf person would be better off in life if they could hear, cause that isn't true, and I think Marlee is proof of that. Besides, I can't think of a single person I know who doesn't think that if they could just change one aspect of themselves, their lives would be better.

On another Marlee related note, did anybody else notice that a couple of the other women did not seem happy that Marlee was getting praised by Gary for helping him with his hearing problems. I remember Hope having a huge smile on her face, but there was at least one other (Nene maybe?) who seemed to have a scowl on her face. I think Trump really likes Marlee, which I am hoping will offer her some sort of protection in the boardroom, but I am concerned that she is going to be targeted by some of her teammates soon. Does anyone else get that feeling?

[petramom]

I think Trump really likes Marlee, which I am hoping will offer her some sort of protection in the boardroom, but I am concerned that she is going to be targeted by some of her teammates soon. Does anyone else get that feeling?

Couldn't blame them - Marlee could be strong competition. From what we've seen so far, she's a good worker, smart and not afraid to say what she thinks. She's not as clever as Star at manipulating situations or making boardroom arguments (see, e.g., the "Dionne should be fired because she's mean to me" argument), but given the right circumstances she's the only one I see right now who has a chance of getting Star fired.

[MisMichie]

The music industry can't even assume that people who are deaf can't make a career out of 'singing': See the new Deaf Rapper Sean Forbes (http://www.youtube.c...h?v=E5l-2Jo14cQ)

That being said, I immensely am looking forward to seeing Marlee lead the team. I anticipate she'll win the task, at least I hope so. I can see her being a great PM. It just matters on whether she has a strong vision for the task.

I am guessing that she will be contending with Star in the end. I don't know how well Latoya will be at being a PM yet...I think she may be too soft as a leader.

[Talented Tenth]

I think saying being deaf is disadvantageous is too strong a word, and maybe that is why people are disagreeing with it. It definitely creates barriers but those barriers can be worked around through the help of other people and new technology. But I don't think it is fair to say a deaf person would be better off in life if they could hear, cause that isn't true, and I think Marlee is proof of that. Besides, I can't think of a single person I know who doesn't think that if they could just change one aspect of themselves, their lives would be better.

Marlee is an exception - not the rule. Isn't stating that being deaf creates barriers the same as saying it's not advantageous?

I don't know what jobs (besides singing) she or any other deaf person wouldn't be able to do based on their deafness or what experiences they wouldn't be able to have besides obviously hearing.

As for alarms and stuff, there are plenty of alternatives, have been for decades, and the more technology improves, the better they get.

Being deaf means one always needs to be accommodated in some way and/or on high alert.

[beezer]

Marlee is an exception - not the rule. Isn't stating that being deaf creates barriers the same as saying it's not advantageous?

I don't think so, personally. There are ways it's advantageous - besides the aforementioned loud bar, there are other ways in which sound can be distracting, annoying, irksome, etc. - and there can also be barriers.

Marlee is also a woman - which presents barriers even today in society, and which one could also argue has its advantages (and disadvantages). Both those things - that she's deaf and a woman - are just facts of her life that she doesn't let get in the way of what she wants to do. Which brings me to....

Being deaf means one always needs to be accommodated in some way and/or on high alert.

I'm really not trying to be argumentative or anything, I don't get it and hence am asking. How do the deaf always need to be accommodated or be on high alert more than anyone else?

Marlee mostly uses an interpreter in public, but she can carry on a conversation with a hearing person without him present if she wants to - it's not like he lives in her house - same as most deaf people I know (except for the interpreter part).

If it's stuff like honking cars, no, they can't hear that - they can feel cars in general though and it's not like the hearing should be wandering across the road without looking.

As for Marlee being the exception not the rule, I don't know how true that is, or in what context we're talking about really. Cochlear implants are certainly more ubiquitous now, but among people old enough to choose for themselves, they're not as popular as they are for kids who aren't making the choice. I'm sure some deaf people would take a magic pill to make them hear, but a lot would not.

Edited by beezer, Mar 24, 2011 @ 8:11 AM.

[LoraxGirl]

Isn't stating that being deaf creates barriers the same as saying it's not advantageous?

Yes, I do agree with this. The point I was trying to make was that word choice creates different emotional responses from people. For me, calling something a disadvantage is more negative and has longer lasting effects than something that is a barrier. But I understand that this is a response based on my perception of the words, and not everybody will share this viewpoint.

Back to Marlee, I can't wait for her to be a PM. I'm very curious to see how she handles Star and Dionne. I don't see her as someone who is going to crumble, but she is far too diplomatic to attack them. Or maybe Star and Dionne will realize that Trump likes Marlee, and will be on good behavior. It will be interesting to watch.

[Talented Tenth]

I'm really not trying to be argumentative or anything, I don't get it and hence am asking. How do the deaf always need to be accommodated or be on high alert more than anyone else?

Marlee needs an interpreter on the show to be understood and to understand others, for one. If there is a tornado warning, how would a deaf person find out if they can't hear a phone ring or a siren? If there's an intruder in a home, a knock or a door or a doorbell rung, a deaf person wouldn't know. That illustrates that the need for there to be other people in the deaf person's life to assist with those types of issues. A deaf person cannot be totally independent.

[beezer]

Marlee needs an interpreter on the show to be understood and to understand others, for one. If there is a tornado warning, how would a deaf person find out if they can't hear a phone ring or a siren? If there's an intruder in a home, a knock or a door or a doorbell rung, a deaf person wouldn't know. That illustrates that the need for there to be other people in the deaf person's life to assist with those types of issues. A deaf person cannot be totally independent.

I think maybe some of this is just not knowing about stuff that is very common to the deaf, because tons of deaf people live independently, take care of their kids on their own, etc.

Marlee uses an interpreter on the show, but she does lipread, as do most all deaf people I know. Even if they didn't, a pad and paper is no big deal. However, most I've ever known can carry on conversations with someone hearing just fine, as can Marlee - she lipreads and has perfectly understandable speech. She prefers to sign, as lots of people prefer to use their native language, but she can speak and read lips if need be - or just use paper, as she did in the book episode - "Tell me what to do :)"

As for the phone, the knock, the siren, etc., ubiquitous in deaf homes are those things with a flashing light attached. Back decades ago, phones had a flashing light and a TTY box, which would allow a deaf person to see the phone ringing and type their conversation. They can (as these still exist) type on a regular analog line to anyone with a TTY or anyone without, using a relay service. Most all commercials that have a phone number in them will note they have a TTY as well.

Now, there are also video phones, which also have a little flashy light deal to alert that it's ringing, which people use with other deaf folk, and of course cell phones, which provide texting and now, with iphones, video calls in real time to use with other deaf people.

Doorbells are hooked to a flashing light rather than a sound, or both, if both hearing and deaf people live in the home, same as burglar alarms and the like.

Even cribs can be hooked up with a little flashy deal to alert a deaf parent to babies' cries. Like I said this stuff has been around for decades and technology has only improved over time.

Deaf people can and do live independently all the time and have. Matlin is married to someone hearing, and raised hearing kids, but he's a cop and thus wasn't home all day or anything. I know other deaf people raised their kids home alone all day, no big. They drive, they shop, they do what everyone else does.

I remember an interview I read with Matlin a long time ago, in which the reporter doing the piece was going around with her on an average day. She was running errands before picking up her kids, and drove them to the supermarket. They got out of the car and walked toward the market, but the reporter had to alert Matlin that her car alarm started going off halfway across the parking lot. Matlin turned to go back and hit the thing but stopped and said 'why the fuck do I have a car alarm??' The reporter reassured her that they generally only exist to annoy the hearing as well.

I know a bunch of deaf people and they all live just fine, some married (to hearing and to other deaf people), some single, etc. None of them need help in their day-to-day lives due to their deafness.

[TWoP Pembleton]

This is mostly my fault for leading us there, but we're getting quite off topic since this is really supposed to be about discussing Marlee on the show, not Marlee and the Deaf culture. I will say that there are a lot of misconceptions being posted here about the lives of Deaf people, but there is a ton of material out there (websites, etc.) if you want to learn more about how Deaf people make their way in the world and the current issues they face. Or not, it's up to you.

That said, let's try to get back to the topic of the show and Marlee's role on it. Thanks.

[masked_spangler]

I saw a show with a deaf character on it once where the character had a specially trained 'hearing dog' who alerted her to things like the phone ringing. There are all sorts of ways :)

Marlee did give an interview during Dancing with the Stars where she says she CAN get by without an interpreter---lip-read and so on---but that it makes her tired so she prefers to have the interpreter so that she can make sure she can be understand and that she can understand everything. She also talks about this in her memoir, which I recently read. She says she has to be looking at the person (obviously) to read their lips, and in a situation where there is a group, she can only focus on one person at a time. So without the interpreter, she would be at a real disadvantage in something like the boardroom on this show, where she has to juggle multiple conversations. She also says in the book that early in her career, she had a major fight with Jack Jason because she was angry at someone and about to say something stupid, and he refused to interpret it, thinking he was protecting her. She made a stand that he could never deny her communication, and that if they are working together, he has to represent her words truthfully.

She also says Jack Jason hates being on set with her because he finds taping a show really boring, so she has another interpreter she uses who is an actor. Bill something. I wonder if we'll see him this season :)

I think she'll go very far this season because she isn't stupid, and I think her people skills are better than Star's. I also think that people will either under-estimate her, or they'll be afraid to really go into things with her because, just like they don't want to go up against the 'legend' Dionne, they won't want to be known as the one who got into it with the deaf woman. And I think Marlee is smart enough to take advantage of that :)

[WileyCoyote]

I adore Marlee overall, but once more this past episode we saw that she tends to fall into a pattern of making one of her strengths into a weakness. Her passion for and loyalty to deaf culture is a huge strength in most ways. But it also makes her into a broken record. EVERY pitch from her is about it. Every. One.

If the key to winning this show was simply to represent your own experiences and causes, she'd win hands down. But its probably not. You put yourself in a box, even one of your own creation, and you probably lose. Too many of the kinds of tasks represented require an ability to appeal to people in a universal manner. A cute vignette involving some deaf person might work in some circumstances, but it can't be the go-to idea every single time.

[LoraxGirl]

There is a web clip from last nights episode on Hulu where Star has to tell Trump who on the team is the biggest celebrity. She eventually calls Marlee an "elevated" celebrity, and Marlee gives a bit of a confused "what" face which is somewhat humorous. Mainly because she is one of the few on that show that didn't become a celebrity from reality tv or talk shows. Did she really think she was on the same level of celebrity as the rest of them? Really? Granted, I don't think the general public knows her very well, and maybe that was the reason for the surprise look.

[WileyCoyote]

Yeah, its kind of dumb, because while Marlee won that Academy Award and all that, she herself knows how rare good roles have been since then. She's very very far from A-list, and I bet has the good sense to know that.

[nospin]

I adore Marlee overall, but once more this past episode we saw that she tends to fall into a pattern of making one of her strengths into a weakness. Her passion for and loyalty to deaf culture is a huge strength in most ways. But it also makes her into a broken record. EVERY pitch from her is about it. Every. One.

I see it a bit differently. Everybody wants their team to use their strengths - Star (presentations), Gary (acting), Mark (singing), Lil Jon (working the crowd), etc.
While Star, and Jon, and the rest of them can do a lot of other things, Marlee probably feels like she can't offer a lot and that her disability limits her usefulness to the team. This is why I think she is offering to use her skills whenever is appropriate. I thought it was very appropriate both times (kid's book and video phone). She's been a very hard worker so far...

[LoraxGirl]

Yeah, its kind of dumb, because while Marlee won that Academy Award and all that, she herself knows how rare good roles have been since then. She's very very far from A-list, and I bet has the good sense to know that.

I don't know if she is very far from the A-list, but I don't know what the most important criteria for being on the A-list are. I get the impression she is highly respected amongst her peers (by which I mean other main stream actors, not the people on this show), but the general public only recognizes her as the deaf actress they see on TV. But she seems to have guest starred on every major TV show in the past 20 years, so a lot of people have seen her, just not consistently.

[masked_spangler]

I think they have been given tasks that lend themselves to using it, so she has. But when it does not lend itself, such as in the pizza task, she hasn't. However, on the book task it specifically said the book had to be based on someone in the group, and that they would get points for originality. So I think it was natural to suggest it. And on the videophone task, looking at her was the first reaction everyone had. It was a natural fit. So we'll see if it comes up again in other tasks. But for now, I give a pass on the 'deaf agenda' concept.

[orionlion]

Interestingly, in this past task when they were still deciding on the PM, someone mentioned Marlee because she had used and was familiar with video phones. However, she nipped that in the bud because the phone she had used had been designed solely for deaf people or something. So there was a time when she didn't go "Hey! Let's make this about deafness!" In fact, only after they decided their original idea of using Dionne in a recording studio did they say "Oh, it's about a girl talking to her deaf mom."

Slightly off that topic, but something that came to me as I was typing this, Marlee hasn't once yet volunteered to be the PM. In fact, this time she rejected the idea. Hmmm... a strategy? Or does she know these beeyotches would eat her alive as PM?

I think she would rock as PM, but maybe she is playing it safe for now and saving her big guns for later.

[GilvearSt]

Slightly off that topic, but something that came to me as I was typing this, Marlee hasn't once yet volunteered to be the PM. In fact, this time she rejected the idea. Hmmm... a strategy? Or does she know these beeyotches would eat her alive as PM?

Marlee dodged being PM in a task about writing childrens books when she herself has written several and then dodged a task that's about acting and production when she probably has the most experience with that of anyone on the team. To me, that says that Marlee is holding out for a fundraising task. She probably has a huge rolodex from her previous charity work and her years in the industry and wants to use it when it'll help her charity. Next fundraiser I'd look for her to step up.

[DontPanic42]

You may be right! Judging from the promo, looks like next week is a fundraising task with Marlee as PM.

[LoraxGirl]

From the promos it definitely looks like she is the PM next time. I was surprised she didn't do the childrens book, she looked so excited when it was announced. But in retrospect, I think she saw the bullet aimed at Lisa and wisely chose not to step in front of it.

She didn't do a lot with the pizza fund raising, but I think with the right activity she could make a lot. Maybe she was holding out for her own project.

[beezer]

Yeah, its kind of dumb, because while Marlee won that Academy Award and all that, she herself knows how rare good roles have been since then.

She hasn't done a lot of film, but, as noted above, she has been on television pretty consistantly for a really long time - and in generally high-profile shows.

I do think she's quite far above the rest of them, as she has an actual talent that she's parlayed into a very solid career. Lisa Rinna is like a soap actress or whatever, but she's still very D-list imo. I think Matlin has the highest profile of anyone on her team, (maybe save Warwick but what had she done besides Psychic Friends for the past 20 or so years), and the most serious career success. It may have been a while ago, but an Oscar is still an Oscar. Heck, she was nominated for a bunch of Emmys for guest roles too. No one left has a career close to that, imo.

Edited by beezer, Mar 29, 2011 @ 7:46 PM.

[MisMichie]

I see it a bit differently. Everybody wants their team to use their strengths - Star (presentations), Gary (acting), Mark (singing), Lil Jon (working the crowd), etc.
While Star, and Jon, and the rest of them can do a lot of other things, Marlee probably feels like she can't offer a lot and that her disability limits her usefulness to the team. This is why I think she is offering to use her skills whenever is appropriate. I thought it was very appropriate both times (kid's book and video phone). She's been a very hard worker so far...

I totally don't see it that way, at all. Marlee's here because she is a strong woman...and, like some of the rest of them, has some business smarts. I think Marlee merely offered her 'deafness topic' in the story situation because the assignment lent itself to the opportunity to showcase it...and, as we said earlier, she didn't even pitch the commercial idea...I tend to think it was a group decision and it had to do with getting "emotion". For the children's book, I think Marlee wanted deafness to be incorporated because it means she can represent her people, and her CULTURE into the story. She doesn't want the story to be exclusive and ignore her and her experience.

Marlee's resume speaks for itself...and, now that people have mentioned it, it makes sense why she's been ditching the other PM opportunities - perhaps she knew ahead of time the monetary prize for the task, and wanted to wait for a larger one.

[LoraxGirl]

After watching tonights episode, I really think Marlee has the most power on the women's team, and not Star. She clearly has great connections and is able to raise a lot of money. She works hard on every task and has fully supported every PM making very few enemies along the way. And, Donald Trump clearly loves and respects her. I don't think he would have kept the women's team around for their opinion if someone else had been the PM. And I think her teammates so far, at least the remaining ones, have not tried to really challenge that credibility yet. In their talking heads a couple mentioned that Marlee was frustrated, and it didn't seem like she was handling it well, but in the boardroom they had nothing but love for her. I wonder if they were trying to take Marlee's advice and end the backstabbing and hostility that had been going on, or if they were afraid to say anything about her in front of Trump. I thought her little speech at the beginning was very bold, but she does always seem to say it like she sees it. Maybe thats why Trum likes her so much.

[masked_spangler]

Oh, Trump loves her, all right. And now, so does John Rich. And Gary Busey. I'm telling you, she's either playing it or she really is THAT smart :)

Edited by masked_spangler, Apr 3, 2011 @ 11:29 PM.

[legaleagle44]

She's utterly fantastic, in my opinion. Getting rid of a potential threat before she's even on his team (while the teams don't actually merge in the classic Survivor sense, they do re-shuffle into co-ed teams several times along the way before being dissolved altogether at F4, so she'd eventually work with him on the same team)? That's a move that even Richard himself would applaud.

And since he really doesn't warrant his own thread unless TWOP Pembleton feels otherwise (because he's not actually a part of Team A.S.A.P.), I'm going to say it here: Jack is my new TV boyfriend. He's handsome, he does a phenomenal job as Marlee's interpreter, and, as we saw in the Boardroom, he's one hundred percent human. It doesn't hurt that he pings my gaydar, either -- but maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part.

Edited by legaleagle44, Apr 4, 2011 @ 6:24 PM.