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The Killing: Forbrydelsen Comes to AMC


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#3601

Addict14

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 9:39 AM

What made Linden assume Jasper's dad (blanking on the name) was both Rosie's dad and Terri's lover? They happened to be right about Terri but why did they assume he was the dad? If it was the text about the blackmail, that still doesn't fly because the first thing I would think would be what Rosie is holding over him would be the affair with her Aunt Terri.

I know this show doesn't know the meaning of the word logic, but for some reason this is the plot point bothering me.

Edited by Addict14, May 2, 2012 @ 9:44 AM.

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#3602

kbailey3131

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Posted May 2, 2012 @ 11:31 PM

As I sat and watched the episode again (ugh)...here's how they made those connections. Linden tells Holder to check all the limo companies to see who had one around out during the time of night they were interested in. Holder finds that Jasper's dad Michael took one to the ferry and then finds out that Michael had an overnight bag with him AND had purchased plane tickets to Vegas for him and Terry (this was the weird leap for me...I could see the limo driver knowing what time he took Ames there and what he had with him, but how does a conversation about taking a trip to Vegas with Terry? There's no way they could have gotten his credit receipts, in fact we know from things that happened later in the episode that they hadn't had his credit card records...smh) Anywhooz...Lindler play that nugget of info into a visit to Terry and the precise time she's at the school with the kids (weird timing, it must have been convenient that she was in Rosie's room lifting lip gloss for no reason. This was a strange scene, she was supposed to be investigating something, but she's just milling around the room like she was channeling her inner Mitch, circa the first half of season 1)...Anywhooz, so that's how they made the connection between Ames and Terry. The connection between Rosie and Ames was their discovery during this conversation with Terry (again, great timing) that the records from Rosie's Beau Soleil phone showed she sent him a text a few days/weeks before she died that seemed to suggest she was trying to extort 5K out of him or else she'd "tell his wife"...so when Lindler head back to the office they surmised that Rosie was either extorting Ames because he was her dad or her john.
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#3603

PeterWayne

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 8:19 AM

WARNING: LONG DRAWN-OUT AND PROBABLY TOTALLY WRONG THEORY

I think the killer is Terry.

I had been thinking this for a week or two, based on nothing but a guess. An informed guess, I'm hoping. But basically, even though the bulk of the rest of the season will probably revolve around high-level conspiracies with the mayor and Ames and the owner of the casino and everybody, I just can't imagine that stuff leading to the killer. It's not shocking enough. The constant MO of this show is to try swerving people: all the false leads and red herrings, Holder's a bad guy, did Richmond get shot, Stan isn't Rosie's father, etc. etc. etc.

So I can't see the identity of the killer being some long involved thing about the mayor's land deals. Plus, whatever shady things the mayor is involved with, it's going to play into the Richmond storyline too. So the mayor and his conspiracy to frame Richmond can all be exposed as part of the political aspect of the show, and that lets the murder investigation go in an entirely different direction.

The way the show seems to act, they'll want the killer to be someone shocking, someone nobody expects. And it has to be a fairly major character or it'll come off like a cop-out. So at this point, the list of people fitting all the necessary criteria is pretty short.

Mitch and Stan were on the camping trip. Richmond was trying to kill himself. Gwen was with Richmond. The major characters with no real alibi are Terry, Jamie, Linden, and Holder. We can probably eliminate the latter two. And Rosie being murdered by her own Aunt would be a lot more shocking than Jamie. Can you imagine Rosie at the ferry, leaving that fright-filled voicemail, and then seeing her Aunt and thinking everything would be okay? And then the horrible betrayal that would follow. That's the sort of ending I see them going for.

So like I said, it was just a theory. But after this latest episode, I think there's something to it.

The last ep established three pretty key things about Terry: 1) she's borderline obsessed with Michael Ames, 2) Ames was just stringing her along (he's never leaving his wife because his wife has the money), and 3) Terry has a connection to the ferry and casino on the night Rosie died.

I think item #3 is the big one. Terry seemed possible to me at first just because she had no clear alibi, and now she's actually tied in with the area where Rosie came into contact with her killer. If you didn't catch it, Terry told Linden and Holder that she was supposed to pick up Ames at the ferry that night, and then they were going to Vegas. But he cancelled the trip, so she had no reason to pick him up.

Except she's obessed with him. She thinks Ames is going to leave his wife for her, she'll be rich and happy, and her dad won't be telling her "I'm sorry you're so pathetic and alone" anymore. But we know Ames isn't serious about her. And from the show's timeline we can probably surmise that Ames had broken things off with Terry by Rosie's wake, so cancelling their trip to Vegas might have been part of an ongoing process of Ames getting rid of her.

So if Terry thinks Ames is brushing her off, and she knows where he is, it's not much of a stretch to think that she'd have gone to the ferry anyway. Check up on him, make sure he's not with another woman, that sort of thing. And while there, she would have seen Rosie.

This fantasy of being with Ames seems to be all Terry has in her life, so they just need a reason why Terry would think Rosie was in the way of it. The obvious one would be if she thought Rosie was "seeing" him. Maybe she thought Ames was pushing her away because of another girl, and she got the impression that the girl was Rosie. Or maybe it could involve that text with the blackmail threat, if Terry thought Rosie was ruining things for her. Who knows? There's several more episodes left to fill that in.

But I think Terry fits all the important criteria: major character, shocking ending, and it's fairly tidy. When someone asks "So who killed Rosie Larsen?", there's not some drawn-out answer about land deals or conspiracies or secret fathers with hidden identities. "Rosie's crazy aunt deluded herself into thinking she'd have a new life with her rich sugar daddy, and she thought Rosie was preventing it." Pretty straightforward.

There are problems, though. Like why would Terry have been driving a car from Richmond's campaign? I've always thought, assuming the killer wasn't Richmond or someone in his campaign, that they would just say the car was already there at the casino. Like maybe Richmond had driven it there while meeting an escort or something like that. Lame, but I tend to doubt they'll have much of a reason. And for the bloody backpack, they could just say Terry accidentally dropped it or something.

Terry being the killer could also explain her role on the show. She's largely been the rock of the family, cooking meals and taking care of the kids while Mitch and Stan try to cope. Well, maybe there's a reason why she can be so detached. And I always thought the thing at the wake was curious. Terry's there mourning her niece, yet seemed more concerned with Ames than anything. Obviously that would play into things.

So that's my theory. I humbly offer you a virtual handshake and/or hug if you took the time to read all that.
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#3604

shegunner

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 11:09 AM

I know it's part of his personna, but I think Stan's sideburns are hideous.
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#3605

maculae

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 11:27 AM

So that's my theory. I humbly offer you a virtual handshake and/or hug if you took the time to read all that.

Wow, that's a fantastic write up PeterWayne. It's quite plausible and along the lines of what I've been thinking, of course yours is much better thought out. But this show has had so many red herrings that I wouldn't be surprised if Linden did it to keep herself in Seattle.
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#3606

Snookums

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 12:54 PM

I think your theory is quite good and possibly correct, PeterWayne! It would also cover the whole "family member did it" thing that the original had, without it being the killer (obviously) from the first version.


The only thing that's sticking is, as you said, how did Terri get a hold of a campaign car, and, if it was her, chase, catch, knock out and carry Rosie to the trunk, then sink it in the pond? I guess it's possible but it does seem to be a two person job.


Oh, and speaking of Terri: Hey, Ames. Someone who dogs around as much as you should know--when you're breaking it off with a crazy chick, don't call her and make arrangements to pick her up in your car to tell her to quit bothering you. She's going to take it as a sign of encouragement, dumbass. IGNORE HER. Unless we weren't shown this (something quite possible for this show, alas) Terri seemed to be leaving Ames alone. She ran into him at the wake and was all brokenhearted about it, and called someone who could have been him once last season, but this season she seems pretty focused on being Awesome Rock Aunt Terri. So when he called out of nowhere to thank God break up the Worst Makeout Session Of All Time, it just put hope right back into her deluded little heart.

Jesus, all the bad guys on this show are so sucky at being assholes! Honestly, this is Heartless Cad 101, you idiot.

Edited by Snookums, May 3, 2012 @ 12:54 PM.

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#3607

novhappy

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 2:03 PM

I'm enjoying the theory and will add that perhaps Aunt Terry, through BeauSoliel, had an in with the Polish mafia. So when she was after Rosie she somehow got a second person, from the mafia, to help her. Perhaps she was sleeping with one of them. Perhaps he gets a campaign car from somewhere, (maybe he is part of the vast seattle conspiracy to make a land deal, kill seals and 86 Richmonds campaign), aids and abets Terry's killing of Rosie. He keeps the backpack dropping it off later to intimidate the Terry and the family.
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#3608

ChipBach

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 2:08 PM

So I'm confused. Is the script padded with Botox or Collagen?
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#3609

maculae

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 3:33 PM

So I'm confused. Is the script padded with Botox or Collagen?

It's being kept afloat with all that Seattle rain.
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#3610

shegunner

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 4:33 PM

Great wrte up PeterWayne. I'm sure they'll be able to explain the car thing somehow.

Until this season, I liked Holder for the murder...though without any real basis except that he'd be out-of-the-blue and is a major character. I could go with Linden if she did all this as a way of getting past the OTHER case that she didn't solve.

It's generous (too generous) of viewers to excuse all the incessant dragging out of this plot by pointing out that it's only been 20 days in the show's time. If you are going to do a day-by-day thing for TV you have to make it compelling to the viewer. Stretching this plot over two years is inexcusable, IMO.

The whole point of this show was to show how a killing impacts everyone around it, but the writers gave no consideration to narrative economy.

Anyhow, hope you're right PeterWayne. I can't stand Terry.
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#3611

Kolaka

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 6:39 PM

Nice write up, PeterWayne! I was wondering about Terry and I like your logic.

I'm enjoying this season; the pacing doesn't bother me. I still don't have any interest in Richmond though.

Edited by Kolaka, May 3, 2012 @ 6:39 PM.

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#3612

stillshimpy

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 10:38 PM

I really like your theory, PeterWayne! It would also help explain why Terri has never tried to willingly offer up any information to the police. She talks to them when they speak to her, but when it was believed that Rosie was missing, vs. dead, I couldn't believe (after the whole thing played out) that Terry wouldn't have been a) having a private conversation with someone like Liden, "Please don't tell my sister this, but..." or running all over, looking for her privately. It's just that Terry would have had reason to believe something bad had happened to her (someone from Beau Soleil beating her up, or whatever (Terry knew about the creeps reported on their online forum).

As for how she got a campaign car, I don't know, but it's the best theory I've seen on who did it. Well done!
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#3613

kbailey3131

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 10:40 PM

I like your Aunt Terry theory PeterWayne and agree that explaining how she'd have the car will be the key. I think the endings I'd believe would be her or Jamie(or generally someone from Richmond's side of the election, but Jamie is the only one realistically still in play). Anybody else and I'll call BS.


I thought it was weird that she kept Rosie's books all that time and never spoke to the police about anything. I blew her off as the killer last season because they just kept her so fringe that she barely even registered to me when she was on screen. But her just managing to have the backpack would tie to having her books in her car too, so I like your theory even more.
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#3614

Snookums

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Posted May 3, 2012 @ 11:16 PM

The backpack would say that either Terri had a partner or someone witnessed the murder. I can't see Terri dropping off that backpack--what possible reason, even using this show's tortured logic, would she have? It only brings up more theoretical police attention (hah) and pain for the family. If Terri did this, I feel it would have been a spontaneous lashing out at Rosie, possibly out of jealousy or protection of Ames: she and Rosie are in the car driving back to Seattle, Terri says/does something that scares Rosie, Rosie runs off and Terri chases her, and grabbing her too hard or something that knocks her out cold.

Terri thinks she's dead, panics, calls unknown person to help her hide the body. They put her in the trunk and sink the car. Terri has Rosie's stuff from the car, and unknown person takes the backpack, dropping it off later as a threat or warning. That's why Terri had the schoolbooks she gave Mitch last season.

I just can't see her doing it alone, not with the way things have been presented. That's assuming Terri did it at all, of course.
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#3615

kbailey3131

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 12:07 AM

I was about to say that this show isn't sophisticated to have Terry-based conspiracy, but I take that back. They have gone through GREAT LENGTHS thus far this season to demonstrate how much work Janek is willing to go through to cover things up. So he's already been cleaning up Beau Soleil mess, Terry's accidental murder would merely be one more thing checked off his to-do list.

I think we might be able to stop watching this show now....lol!!!

ETA...I'm also going with a Janek connection because he dropped a line early on to Stan this season about "they lied to you about how she died...she was alive in the trunk blah blah blah" I yelled at my tv..."DOESN'T STAN ALREADY KNOW THAT?!" and then thought to myself, that's a weird bit of info for him to have.

Edited by kbailey3131, May 4, 2012 @ 12:13 AM.

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#3616

stillshimpy

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 10:07 AM

I yelled at my tv..."DOESN'T STAN ALREADY KNOW THAT?!" and then thought to myself, that's a weird bit of info for him to have.


That was something that bothered me too, kbailey because Stan absolutely knew that, both Mitch and Stan did. It was kind of a big scene and one that really worked last year (before there was a monsoon of coincidences we were supposed to buy as being plausible in this gritty reality). Linden had told Mitch that Rosie did not suffer, they came into the police station to talk to Linden. She had to leave the room and they both spotted the photographs of Rosie on Linden's cork-board of unhealthy obsession.

They were both really upset with Linden for having lied to them and knew that Rosie was alive when she went into the water.

However, in a rare instance of cutting the show a break and thinking that they may be going somewhere with this, whereas Janek goes out of his way to tell Stan that, trying to make sure he's outraged...Stan doesn't actually react as if he didn't know that. He has a sort of blank look on his face. He doesn't flip out entirely, or break down crying or give much evidence of distress at the news. He just looks pained, but not the pained expression of "WHAT?!? Oh my God! This is soooo much worse than I thought!" ...and that is just not how a feeling being would react to the thought of their child dying in pain and horror. Yes, I know "Rosie isn't your baby!" and all, but Stan clearly considers her his daughter.

So credit where it is due, Stan reacted as if he knew that already, I think. I think it was in the show to illustrate how much Janek is trying to manipulate Stan...because only a completely heartless bastard would go out of their way to say, "Oh yes, she died horribly. Please, by all means, never sleep again because this should haunt your nightmares from now until eternity!" Who the hell torments a grieving person like that? Yes, I know, Janek is part of the Polish Mob and therefore might actually believe in street justice at that level. He also wouldn't be known for a tender heart.

Here's the thing that is sort of interesting to me -- Janek seemingly did not know that prior to telling Stan. That information seemed new, not to Stan, but to Janek. So he whereas he is clearly connected to Beau Soleil and knew that Rosie worked for them, it seems he really had nothing to do with killing her. Or at least, that's how it should work with what we've been shown so far. I know, I know, but I can dream, right?

I just can't see her doing it alone, not with the way things have been presented. That's assuming Terri did it at all, of course.


I agree with you, Snookums, the physical logistics make that unlikely, but the only thing I can think of is that Ames wanted Rosie killed for whatever reason. That an accomplice for Terri might have been provided by Ames. That would also go a long way towards explaining why Rosie was seemingly not bound, or restrained and that whoever had her felt free to stop for gas. That seems to imply that there was a point in that car that Rosie thought she was safe.
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#3617

FreakyBunny

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 11:49 AM

Great theory, Peter Wayne. I can see your logic, and it makes sense on the level that the killer should be known to us right from the beginning in order to be shocking, and not some random character invented to solve the murder. Your process of elimination works for me.

However, I think Terri may have had an accomplice. Did she do it for love? Did she participate in placing Rosie in the car? Was she the one with the flashlight chasing Rosie through the woods?

That last part is the where I have trouble believing that she was alone. Rosie appeared uninjured when she was running away from who I assume to be the killer. What could her aunt have done to make her so terrified? Unless Terri and Rosie had a history of Terri abusing her and scaring her, a hell of a violent outburst would have had to have happened to make Rosie so afraid.

If Terri was the lone killer this would have to be the scenario: 1. Terri confronts Rosie. 2. Terri threatens Rosie. 3. Terri loses her shit on Rosie. 4. Terry attacks Rosie the first time. 5. Run Rosie Run!!!! 6. Terri finds Rosie in the woods (what kind of footwear would Terri be wearing to chase her down?). 7. Terri finally incapacitates Rosie(wasn't Rosie alive when she entered the trunk?) 8. A campaign car is found/stolen/lent to her. 9. Terri drags Rosie to the car and places her in the trunk. 10. Terri dumps the car in the water by pushing it in because I doubt she would risk driving it in there and escaping before it sank.

I may be off on a few of the above points, and it would be fun for me if others (I'm looking at you stillshimpy) would point out where. If you can convince me that the above it plausible, I am down with the Terri being the killer. For now, though, I don't think she could have done it alone. That means my bet is she was in it with Ames for some reason probably involving sex and jealousy.

I agree with you, Snookums, the physical logistics make that unlikely, but the only thing I can think of is that Ames wanted Rosie killed for whatever reason. That an accomplice for Terri might have been provided by Ames. That would also go a long way towards explaining why Rosie was seemingly not bound, or restrained and that whoever had her felt free to stop for gas. That seems to imply that there was a point in that car that Rosie thought she was safe.


I guess someone could have "rescued" her from whomever was chasing her. Maybe just maybe the car went into the water by accident and those in the front tried to save themselves and swam away.

Oh. My. God.

You don't think her death was an accident, do you? Doesn't explain the bloody back pack, but it doesn't have to. The pack may have been bloodied before she was whisked away.

Seriously, if she died by accident, how would that make you feel?

Edited by FreakyBunny, May 4, 2012 @ 12:33 PM.

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#3618

BBDi

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 1:25 PM

I always thought it was possible that Rosie's death was an accident; however, I thought it was established early on that her body had somehow been scrubbed down--a chemical that was erroneously linked to Bennett's home. Or something. We learned later that Rosie had been pursued through the woods and then ultimately put into the trunk--one of the things that Holder and Linden finally figured out--but don't seem to have pursued lately--is that someone must have brought the tools needed to cleanse her body of evidence and then presumably transported those tools and the person who was driving the Richmond campaign car away from the crime scene. Or something. I dimly remember this from one of those episodes where Rosie and Linden actually gathered and thought about evidence.

I do think Terry is a decent suspect. I hadn't really considered her seriously before, as it is so much to just make fun of what a loser she is.
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#3619

stillshimpy

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 3:14 PM

I may be off on a few of the above points, and it would be fun for me if others (I'm looking at you stillshimpy) would point out where.


Heh, yeah I do have a tendency to fixate on the small things from time to time :-) Hey, we all need skills! Hee. Anyway, that only point that I could spot, FreakyBunny was that when they stopped for gas, they were already in that campaign car. The way the Gas Station Misanthrope was located last year was Holder sitting there with his notebook, doing math over and over again about how no one stops for gas until their tank is empty (and I think of him fondly each time in the intervening months where I have put gas into my car at points where it was nowhere near empty...apparently I am a psychological puzzle the likes of which Holder has yet to encounter). What led Holder and Linden to the gas station was a study of the drowned car, its odometer and its gas tank reading...so that was the car that was filled up and the car from which Rosie escaped.

Whoever killed her, had that car for the get-go.

Edited by stillshimpy, May 4, 2012 @ 3:15 PM.

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#3620

FreakyBunny

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 5:28 PM

From The Killing Wiki


I don't know how the body could have been scrubbed down if Rosie was alive when she entered the trunk if it is safe to presume she drowned after failing to get out of the trunk.
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#3621

Cardie

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 7:20 PM

I definitely think Terri was driving the campaign car when Rosie fled at the gas station and that she chased Rosie down and with the help of an accomplice got her into the trunk of said car. I just don't think it was all done out of jealousy of Rosie. Rosie was already freaked out on the night of the murder. There's got to be something sinister involving Ames going on and Rosie knew enough to blow the lid off. So I can see Ames telling Terri to deal with her niece. Terri would have been angry because Rosie's sleuthing was imperiling Ames and, in Terri's mind, their future together.

So Terri gives a ride to freaked out Rosie in the campaign car. How Terri has it, whether someone else is in it as well, is a big question. (If it was set up from the beginning that Terri was to lure Rosie to her death, then she'd be in a campaign car so that Richmond could be implicated--two birds one rock.) Terri tries to talk Rosie out of revealing the secret but slips up somehow so that Rosie knows Terri is allied with Ames and the other waterfront conspirators. Rosie bolts out of the car and runs. Then either the other person in the car or someone Terri calls goes after Rosie and the two of them put her in the trunk and sink the car. It works a bit better if the accomplice comes in another car because then he can give Terri a ride away from the crime scene.
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#3622

FreakyBunny

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 7:27 PM

So Terri gives a ride to freaked out Rosie in the campaign car. How Terri has it, whether someone else is in it as well, is a big question. (If it was set up from the beginning that Terri was to lure Rosie to her death, then she'd be in a campaign car so that Richmond could be implicated--two birds one rock.) Terri tries to talk Rosie out of revealing the secret but slips up somehow so that Rosie knows Terri is allied with Ames and the other waterfront conspirators. Rosie bolts out of the car and runs. Then either the other person in the car or someone Terri calls goes after Rosie and the two of them put her in the trunk and sink the car. It works a bit better if the accomplice comes in another car because then he can give Terri a ride away from the crime scene.


This could work. There's no reason to rule out Rosie being in the car more than once...the first time willingly with someone she trusted (Terry), and the second time either to hide or to be hidden by someone else...we don't know if the chaser was the one who put her in the trunk for sure. I still think the accident theory is plausible, but man would that make me mad. A lot of folks are going to be way disappointed if the answer to who killed Rosie Larsen is "no one, at least not directly".

My current guess is: Ames (or a henchman)with Terry trying to prevent it.

Edited by FreakyBunny, May 4, 2012 @ 7:28 PM.

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#3623

stillshimpy

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 10:02 PM

Admittedly, if Ames was involved on any level and we're assuming that Terri is the killer...then wouldn't she have threatened the absolute stuffing out of Ames when he dumped her? Terri doesn't seem like the type who would fail to bring up something like that when under pressure, so when Ames was telling her it was over, if they had colluded to murder Rosie (for whatever reason) I'm assuming there would have been a lot more, "I'll go to the police!" and less "We're good together!"

I agree that Rosie's killer needs to be someone we met in season one, or at least for it to be an even-close to satisfying conclusion it needs to be. I think Terri is an excellent choice, simply because we've never actually seen her feeling sad, or grief-stricken about Rosie, have we? She got blasted at Rosie's funeral, but that didn't seem to be about Rosie, that seemed to be about Terri.

Oh my word, just how insane would Mitch actually become if it turned out to be Terri? That would be one impressive level of nuts.
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#3624

Cardie

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Posted May 4, 2012 @ 10:24 PM

I can see Terri protecting Ames without his knowledge, so that perhaps the henchman is from the mob or the Mayor's staff. That way she could hardly be blackmailing him and she's certainly not going to tell him what she did.

On Cold Case, which Veena Sud showran, the murderer often turned out to be a friend or family member with a grievance.
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#3625

PeterWayne

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Posted May 5, 2012 @ 1:37 AM

It's good to see I wasn't totally crazy about the Terry idea. Thanks for all the great comments, everybody. From what some of you have said, it seems like there's a thought that Terry would have needed someone to help her.

Personally, I think she could have done it alone. Terry seems fairly gritty to me. There have been several examples of this, but like when she was trashing Mitch a few episodes ago, or when the one brother locked the little one in the trunk and she grabbed him and shook him without much thought. I don't think she takes much crap (unless it's from a rich older man). So if provoked, could she be running after Rosie in the woods and all that? I think so.

And Rosie seems petite, so I don't think the physical act of Terry putting her in the trunk would be much of a problem. I imagine her doing it alone, but obviously another party would open up all kinds of extra possibilities.

BTW, the best idea I've seen for why Terry would have one of Richmond's cars is that, at some point, Richmond mentioned the campaign cars -- all just sitting there with the keys in them -- to one of the Beau Soleil girls. Maybe she'd been in a fender bender and was complaining that her car was in the shop. "I know where you can get a car for a few hours, just gas it up and have it back by the next morning".

Then the girl posted about it on the Beau Soleil message board, tipping off the other girls to the available wheels. So if Terry goes to the ferry to spy on Ames, she doesn't want to use her own car in case he spots her. Mitch and Stan are off camping. Rosie rides a bike. So Terry borrows one of the Richmond cars, fully planning to take it back when she's done.

And Richmond, if he even remembered that he once told an escort, wouldn't mention it to the police because he's not going to volunteer that he pays for prostitutes.
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#3626

FreakyBunny

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Posted May 5, 2012 @ 7:30 AM

Personally, I think she could have done it alone. Terry seems fairly gritty to me. There have been several examples of this, but like when she was trashing Mitch a few episodes ago, or when the one brother locked the little one in the trunk and she grabbed him and shook him without much thought. I don't think she takes much crap (unless it's from a rich older man). So if provoked, could she be running after Rosie in the woods and all that? I think so.


This is where we disagree. There has been no mention of Terry being physically violent toward Rosie or anyone else for that matter. Rosie was not injured in addition to the drowning and clawing off her finger nails. What could Terry, her trusted aunt, have done to engender such fear in Rosie without first harming her? It doesn't make sense to me that Rosie would be so panicked. I am not discounting Terry's involvement; I just don't think she could have or would have acted alone.

Admittedly, if Ames was involved on any level and we're assuming that Terri is the killer...then wouldn't she have threatened the absolute stuffing out of Ames when he dumped her? Terri doesn't seem like the type who would fail to bring up something like that when under pressure, so when Ames was telling her it was over, if they had colluded to murder Rosie (for whatever reason) I'm assuming there would have been a lot more, "I'll go to the police!" and less "We're good together!"


Sure, she could have mentioned that, but that would spoil the big season seven reveal :) Just kidding. It could be she is so in love with him that she wouldn't bring it up for fear of finally driving him away. Plus, if she does report him she would be completely alone, cut off from her family forever. Ames is rich, so at some point his money would come into play and his lawyers would make short work of a stalker prostitute.

Edited by FreakyBunny, May 5, 2012 @ 7:33 AM.

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#3627

Inquisitionist

Inquisitionist

    Stalker

Posted May 5, 2012 @ 8:35 AM

Admittedly, I have not been tracking all the details of purported clues on this show (for one thing, I'm sure I've missed a lot of them through the murky lighting and muddled sound*), but the fact that someone in the police dept. went to the lengths of forging a time on that photo of Richmond on the bridge or whatever, plus the recurring ominous tones of the casino and the head lady of the tribe, suggests to me that there is a high-level conspiracy going on that transcends Rosie's aunt. Also, I find the circumstances of Rosie's death difficult to reconcile with the aunt as perpetrator.

*Plus, to be brutally honest, I'm always doing something else while this show in on in the background, 'cause if I try to focus solely on it, I fall asleep.
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#3628

FreakyBunny

FreakyBunny

    Video Archivist

Posted May 5, 2012 @ 11:56 AM

I tend to get caught up in theories, too. I think Terry knows more than she is letting on. I also find it plausible that she was somehow connected to the car at one point. I agree that if she was involved it was only in association with the people or person who really wanted to kill Rosie.
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#3629

Snookums

Snookums

    Fanatic

Posted May 5, 2012 @ 12:14 PM

Inquisitionist, good point. The problem with coming up with a theory for one person is that it leaves out a whole bunch of other stuff that's been introduced. As you said, someone in or using the police department(s) went to a LOT of trouble, both to frame Richmond with that photo and lie about the backpack. Plus, we saw Bad Bald Mentor of Holder guy coming out of the new Liutenant's office all smirky and smug, so he's obviously up to something or other. If Terri acted alone or with the mob's help, why would all that stuff have gone down?

Even with the Red Herring Factor (and there's so many of those it might as well be a Red Herring Factory), the viewer can't be expected to discount over 50% of what's shown out of hand. It's like trying on a bathing suit that almost fits--you pull it up and it rides up your butt, pull it down and whoops there's a lot of boob!


Admittedly, if Ames was involved on any level and we're assuming that Terri is the killer...then wouldn't she have threatened the absolute stuffing out of Ames when he dumped her? Terri doesn't seem like the type who would fail to bring up something like that when under pressure, so when Ames was telling her it was over, if they had colluded to murder Rosie (for whatever reason) I'm assuming there would have been a lot more, "I'll go to the police!" and less "We're good together!"


Exactly. Even if she's held back for fear of losing Ames to prison/implicating herself, Ames made it very clear during that little tete a tete that he's finished with her. Terri doesn't strike me as the kind of stable, rock-solid person who would just say "oh, well, live and learn, huh?" She saw Ames as her soul mate and thier fantasy life together as a way out of her sad existence, not to mention a Fuck You to her parents and everyone else who saw her as a perpetual fuck up.

Man, how sad was it when she was trying to defend herself to Linden? To Linden. When you are trying to back up your relationship choices and Linden is looking at you with mingled pity and disgust, it's time to take up needlpoint and volunteer at the animal shelter.
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#3630

kbailey3131

kbailey3131

    Channel Surfer

Posted May 5, 2012 @ 8:10 PM

One of the reasons why I don't think Terry would have done it alone is because of the ammonium hydroxide. What I felt at the end of last season was the key to solving this case would be figuring out who Rosie first would have gotten into a car with without much thought, and then would later run from fearing presumably for her life. We might be shown another step happened in between, that's where I was focused all last year. That's why the Terry angle reasonated with me, that and the fact that she's one of the few people left we haven't been told much about. I have Jamie as the other. My wildcard is them doing another 180 and the killer having been Richmond all along.

Back to the ammonium hydroxide tho...for Terry to have done it alone, she would have had to have had a campaign car AND a stash of the chemicals with her when she went to the ferry to pick Ames up. If the idea is that she went crazy seeing Rosie and Ames together. That's why I like Janek for this role. We've seen how his goon squad has commandeered or otherwise had one of Stan's vans and Stan finds traces of gasoline and a detonation device.

I'm guessing there will be another magical security camera video that will help pinpoint (finally) when and where the campaign car surfaces in the timeline in relation to a place Rosie was that night.
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