Jump to content

Nate and Serena: They're Mythic!


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.

25 replies to this topic

#1

Desafinado

Desafinado

    Couch Potato

Posted Jul 10, 2010 @ 2:55 PM

I couldn't resist using Blair's quasi-absurd quote from the S3 finale as the thread title. I've been wanting to start discussion threads for other couples, so, here we go. Let the conversation begin!

Nate and Serena: More than just two gorgeous heads of hair?
Nate and Serena: The Labrador Retrievers
Nate and Serena: It Started at a Wedding

#2

Tingeling

Tingeling

    Video Archivist

Posted Aug 15, 2010 @ 12:38 PM

Somebody should post in this thread... Even if it is someone who doesn't ship Serenate =)

Honestly, Serenate has kind of been grating on me this season. Which is sad really, because I always liked the idea of the two of them getting together. I've never been an outright shipper, but I thought they could be a good idea. But nothing about them together has worked for me this season.

They kind of come off as a "Wesley couple" to me, if that's an actual thing. The writers keep telling us how much in love they are and how great they are together but they never bothered building the foundation for it, or actually selling it in the episodes. I haven't seen the last two episodes of the season yet, but Blair called them mythical? Well if she meant it in the sense of "doomed for sure a la tons of couples in mythology" then sure. If not then who the heck are they trying to fool? There's nothing mythical, epic or even interesting about this relationship. They keep showing us scenes of how hot and heavy Serenate are, but there's a lack of chemistry there which makes the scenes more awkward than hot.

I'm not sure if it's the writing that ruins it for me, or if it's the acting, or both. Maybe it's the fact that not even Chace Crawford and Blake Lively seem to believe this couple is actually about true love (CC said in an interview something about how him and BL thought the relationship was just the next in the line). Or maybe it's the fact that I've never gotten any reason to invest in them. In season one we weren't supposed to root for Nate and Serena to get together, and then Nate got over his feelings for Serena and wanted Blair again. In season two there was nothing, nada, zero to indicate that there were any romantic feelings between these two. Compare this to Chuck and Blair who have always, even in their off-periods, clearly been interested in each other. Then in season three they throw in something about Nate having loved Serena since the deflowering incident and I didn't buy it for one second. I don't blame Chace Crawford for that either, I mean, if nobody told him his character was supposed to be in love with Serena in late season one and all of season two then why should he play the character that way? Then Serena goes from having strong enough feelings for Trip to want to break up his marriage, to actually loving Nate in the span of what, two episodes? I never had time to care if these two would get together or not so I didn't care a bit when they did get together. And I couldn't care less if they break up either. Which sucks, because if it had been handled differently I might have cared. I don't need a drawn out will they/won't they storyline to invest in a couple, but I do need some form of foundation. "I suddenly love you" doesn't cut it. Although it does remind me of Dug in "Up" ("I've just met you and I love you!") which I guess works with their golden retriever qualities.

I just find that their storylines bore me and I could easily skip past them. They're boring together, whether it's because of the writing or because the actors aren't sparking. Like I said above, I haven't seen the last two episodes, but I really don't care if I get spoilers about these two. When I care about a storyline I avoid spoilers at all cost, but with these two it's of no interest to me.


Sorry if this was super negative... =) And I don't mean any offense to Serenate shippers. I still like them in theory, just not the way they've been done on the show this season.

Edited by Tingeling, Aug 15, 2010 @ 12:39 PM.


#3

Wild Roses

Wild Roses

    Fanatic

Posted Aug 15, 2010 @ 2:25 PM

Random non-important thought: I do think Serenate have the most poetic sounding shipper name (leagues better than Chair which is so mundane and commonplace).

But to reply to Tingeling's post, I do think they were badly written this season. It felt haphazard rather than an a thought out journey of their getting there. I think we were supposed to believe that Serena backed off and took Trip over Nate because she was scared of what a relationship would mean with Nate especially given the type of deep feelings that Nate had confessed to her--which arguably, she had only had one guy (Dan) confess that level of feeling to her. (Aaron seemed to be just a rebound, Gabriel a fad. Carter might have in the wings as OTL pairing, but his send-off seems to indicate that he was only hoodwinking her all along--but the execution was so bad that's hard to say for Carter).

However, aside from the few moments in the car at the end of the Thanksgiving episode, we didn't really see Serena regretting choosing Tripp over Nate. She didn't actively leave Tripp until Maureen pulled the Jackie-Marilyn card.

I am Serenate shipper, but I do think continuity was completely ignored. They just felt...thrown together...at the last minute. I do think Nate has always continued to love Serena as a friend and respected her wishes to get over her in season 1. But nothing indicates that he has ever pined for her. Even when he kissed her at the White Party, it was make Catherine jealous not because he was trying to get Serena to fall for him.

I also feel the way they were put together furthered cheapened them. Rather than see them gradual fall in love with each other, all we got was both enjoying being serial monogamists and ending up together in a 'next in line' type way. Given their past, I can't see them actually doing that. Of course, they did, so it's now canon, but I don't think they would want to risk their friendship in such a way. I suppose the writers did attempt (roll eyes) to address it when Nate and Serena conversated about her leaving after he lost his virginity, but that speech came across as Nate not trusting Serena to be around other men as friends rather than 'will we still be able to be friends if we break up?"

I will give credit to Chace though. He did sell the confession to Serena though (where he tells her he confessed to Jenny at the masque ball that he was in love with Serena).

#4

Tingeling

Tingeling

    Video Archivist

Posted Aug 16, 2010 @ 10:10 AM

Random non-important thought: I do think Serenate have the most poetic sounding shipper name (leagues better than Chair which is so mundane and commonplace).

I definitely agree. Serenate is a lovely shipper name!

I also feel the way they were put together furthered cheapened them. Rather than see them gradual fall in love with each other, all we got was both enjoying being serial monogamists and ending up together in a 'next in line' type way. Given their past, I can't see them actually doing that. Of course, they did, so it's now canon, but I don't think they would want to risk their friendship in such a way.

For a while there I had this theory about how this is going to turn out to be part of some larger plotline regarding Serena and Nate and their views on love/desire to find love. They're both serial monogamists like you said, in love with love, both of them obviously longing to find the real thing. They were also two parts of a four person gang, and the other two found their true love in each other. My theory was that there would turn out to be a point to how quickly things moved with Serena and Nate, and how fast they said their ILYs. That it will turn out that they both on their own ends watched Chuck and Blair together and how happy they were, and came to the conclusion that it was the friendship connection that did it. That if Chuck and Blair found that love with another member of the group then that was the key, and by looking to each other Serena and Nate could also find what Chuck and Blair had. Now I'm not so sure the writers would think that far ahead and think that much about their storylines.

#5

Frelling Tralk

Frelling Tralk

    Fanatic

Posted Aug 16, 2010 @ 5:56 PM

Then Serena goes from having strong enough feelings for Trip to want to break up his marriage, to actually loving Nate in the span of what, two episodes?


The writers always seem to rush Nate's romances. It was similar with Jenny where arguably a foundation had been build up in season 1 for the possibility of them becoming closer someday, only for all of that to be thrown aside in season 2 and for them to be suddenly kissing in the space of an episode when they'd had next to interaction all season before that. Similar to season 1 teasing Nate's feelings for Serena by confessing his love at the ball, only to pretty much drop it for ages, and then rush the time when they do get together. Gossip Girl really fails at the build-up, the only couple the writers have ever taken their time with was Chuck and Blair, and that went to the other extreme with them drawing out the will they/won't they for too long

I did think that Serena and Nate had chemistry and should have been more interesting together than they were, but with the way that the writers ultimately rushed and then discarded them, it was hard to care

Edited by Frelling Tralk, Aug 16, 2010 @ 5:57 PM.


#6

paupers

paupers

    Loyal Viewer

Posted May 19, 2011 @ 10:26 AM

bring this over from the episode discussion:

The lack of interaction between Nate and Serena at the penthouse was weird. The whole globe thing with Nate kind of hearkened back to last season's finale when he wanted to forget using the hooker method. I sort of wonder if Nate and Serena had sex soon after the (terrible, egomaniac) Serena apology scene. Anyway, it's just a feeling--probably wrong. Nevertheless, I love those two together.


I think it would great to see the show go in the N/S direction in Season 5. Both D/S and C/B have gotten stale imo and it needs something fresh such as N/S and D/B. I know N/S where explored one but there is still more left to explore imo.

#7

brighthope

brighthope

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Female
  • Interests:TV and Books!

Posted Jun 24, 2011 @ 11:06 PM

I think there's a chance they will return to Nate and Serena in Season 5 based on the title of this thread said in the season 3 finale by Blair. Mythic calls to mind that which has been written or legendary story.

I think Nate and Serena might be depicted as the great love story of Dan's book.

#8

merrick715

merrick715

    Couch Potato

Posted Jun 25, 2011 @ 8:12 AM

I think Nate and Serena might be depicted as the great love story of Dan's book.

Nothing about them screams a great love story. Banging your best friend's boyfriend because you are drunk and horny and he happens to be there doesn't scream true love. When Serena came back it was all about getting Blair back as a friend and truly falling in love with Dan. I really believe for Serena, Dan was the first boy she allowed herself to love. She doesn't even touch Nate in season three until her relationship with Tripp ends as badly as it did. Nate seemed to want Serena when she was light and free, but once he got her, the problems started almost right away. Serena doesn't talk about her feelings and Nate can't figure out how to break that wall and he gets rightfully upset for being shut out over and over again. Him calling the cops on her dad was the end of Nate for Serena. I always thought they enjoyed sexing each other up and keeping the relationship light. They seemed like exclusive friends with benefits, and nothing more.

#9

Can Attack

Can Attack

    Couch Potato

Posted Jun 25, 2011 @ 8:24 AM

Random, but every time I see the thread title for this thread, LMAO!

MYTHIC! LOL.

I really believe for Serena, Dan was the first boy she allowed herself to love.

I would agree if this season never happened, because Ben was the first boy she allowed herself to love (she's rejected by him, but she was in love with him. She stated that herself "I was in love with him.").

But yeah, they did keep the door open for NS with their convo at the end of S3. I can't remember the exact quotes, but it was something like "If we're ever going to have a chance, this is the only way.", very much in line with DS's 'sink or swim' convo later in S4. So, the door is open. And I do think there's a shot, because the show never did much with them as a couple, and they broke up before it got really serious anyway; so if they do revisit this, there's a lot of material they could still do and not repeat themselves.

#10

brighthope

brighthope

    Fanatic

  • Gender:Female
  • Interests:TV and Books!

Posted Jun 25, 2011 @ 12:34 PM

merrick175 I'm just going by that line mythic, the fact that Nate and Serena will be in LA in the beginning of the year and the way they kept the door open for them as Can Attack pointed out.

I just think Dan's book will probably ~reveal things to people about themselves and I could see Nate and Serena being a part of that.

#11

seethesun

seethesun

    Video Archivist

Posted Jun 25, 2011 @ 12:40 PM

I wonder if Nate and Serena will really factor as a relationship in Dan's book, since it's not immediately associated with him. Maybe only as an obstacle to his (first) dream girl.

As for the relationship itself, I always felt that Nate did try to get through to Serena and understand her. He may have failed more often than not, but I do think he genuinely cares for her and even loved her. Serena pushing him away and keeping him in the dark was emphasized more in season 3 than before, but it seems to be her mantra whenever a relationship gets too real for her.

#12

portiaslegacy

portiaslegacy

    Video Archivist

Posted Jun 25, 2011 @ 2:50 PM

I do think the show will explore Serenate again next season. one of the few things we know about the next season is that two characters will stay in LA for a bit. Serena seems pretty clear, Nate or Chuck would be up in the air. Nate seems a more likely candidate, and either way I will be wondering about Ethan Peck's character/purpose. It should be interesting if they actually let Serena be in a different head space.

Edited by portiaslegacy, Jun 25, 2011 @ 2:50 PM.


#13

merrick715

merrick715

    Couch Potato

Posted Jun 26, 2011 @ 12:56 AM

I would agree if this season never happened, because Ben was the first boy she allowed herself to love (she's rejected by him, but she was in love with him. She stated that herself "I was in love with him.").

I think her feelings about Ben are more complicated than that. Ben was the first man who saw that she had potential to be more than a party girl, and actually did the right thing by her. I can't imagine how many older men a drunk/drugged up Serena slept with. Here comes Ben, who recognizes that she is a messed up girl and instead of taking advantage of that, he did the right thing a rejected her advances because she is a screwed up teen girl. I think the fact that he put her well being first before his need for sex was something that Serena had never experienced before. There is that gorgeous scene between Dan and Serena in 1.07 where Dan takes the time to make over his room for their first time, and while they are naked Serena tells Dan that no one has every looked at her like that before and then goes on to say that she thinks no one has ever looked at her at all. Serena opening up like that to Dan showed me a level of trust that Serena never had with Ben. So I do think that Ben might have been the person that allowed Serena to believe that she was worth more than her body, Dan was the one that she shared that knowledge with first.

I find it interesting that she thinks Nate never saw her at when they first had sex, which leads me to believe that Serena never really trusted Nate enough to allow herself to be that vulnerable in front of him. I'm not getting true love from Serena's side of the relationship.

#14

kschica

kschica

    Fanatic

Posted Jun 26, 2011 @ 1:18 AM

I find it interesting that she thinks Nate never saw her at when they first had sex, which leads me to believe that Serena never really trusted Nate enough to allow herself to be that vulnerable in front of him. I'm not getting true love from Serena's side of the relationship.


I think that she likely was stuck with same question that will always come from a relationship that begins through cheating: How do I know this person who is cheating on someone to be with me won't turn around and do the same to me later? I would think this is magnified here because Nate is cheating on Serena with the most hurtful person he could ever cheat with. It's not a good beginning if you're trying to build a relationship based on trust.

#15

Light of Night

Light of Night

    Fanatic

Posted Jul 9, 2011 @ 10:27 PM

Can Attack wrote (in the Hopes and Dreams thread);

In fact, it was odd how they depicted Serena as having no feelings toward Nate at all in S1, despite having taken his cherry while he was dating Blair.

As I said there, I don't agree. I think of the unguarded moment in the Pilot, when Serena sees Nate for the first time. I also think that, paradoxical though it may seem, Serena would have felt less guilty if she hadn't had real feelings for Nate; she could have told herself "I was drunk, I didn't really mean it." - but drunk or not she did really mean it. In fact Serena seems to have thought that the feelings were mostly on her side; not until much later did she realize the depth of Nate's feeling for her, and how much her rejection hurt him.

catmax99 wrote:

I don't remember the name of the episode, but I thought the one where Serena was drunk in the flashback and she and Nate had the water fight that it was pretty clear they had feelings for each other.

That was 1.09, Blair Waldorf Must Pie. Yes, I agree; also I like how that flashback is paired with the scene in which Nate, feeling lonely, considers calling Blair, then Serena, and in the end doesn't call anybody.

The writers actually put a good deal of effort into keeping Nate and Serena apart, while tantalizing us with the possibility of them getting together. What would have happened, say, if Nate had kissed the right blonde at the masked ball (1.06)? Even earlier, suppose they had actually gotten a chance to talk in 1.02. Or suppose Nate hadn't left the Ivy Week mixer (1.03) before Blair pulled her surprise.

I find it interesting that she thinks Nate never saw her at when they first had sex, which leads me to believe that Serena never really trusted Nate enough to allow herself to be that vulnerable in front of him. I'm not getting true love from Serena's side of the relationship.

I hate to say this, but it's possible that Serena was less than honest that time - with Dan, and maybe with herself.

#16

Can Attack

Can Attack

    Couch Potato

Posted Jul 11, 2011 @ 2:46 PM

That was 1.09, Blair Waldorf Must Pie. Yes, I agree; also I like how that flashback is paired with the scene in which Nate, feeling lonely, considers calling Blair, then Serena, and in the end doesn't call anybody.

For me, the flashback only made me think the show was establishing what kind of a friendship BSN had before Serena went away. There wasn't some flashback weird moment where Nate and Serena had weird side eye moments or was hiding some kind of a crush, they were legitimately good friends and Blair was very much a part of that dynamic. And the flashback does pair off with Nate feeling conflicted between the two girls in present times (well, S1 present times), but again, I already bought Nate had feelings for Serena, so that portion of the episode only strengthened that view. It's Serena's POV with how she felt for Nate that's been missing, and in the same episode, we never see Serena even thinking about any of that. The show was knee deep in DS by then anyway.

And I can infer that Serena probably had feelings for Nate, because otherwise it is really shitty of her to just sleep with Blair's BF for no reason at all, my problem is the show never actually showed it in S1. Canonwise, Serena did sleep with Nate without them ever establishing she had any real interest in Nate. We get a retcon for Serena at the end of S1 that she didn't just run away because she felt guilty (or perhaps was nursing a Nate crush and had to stay away), it was because she felt guilty over killing a man ("I KILLED SOMEONE!" heh). We get another retcon in S4 showing us Serena in boarding school, where there's definitely no pining for Nate, only guilt over Pete and Blair and fun party times, and then it was all about Ben.

What would have happened, say, if Nate had kissed the right blonde at the masked ball (1.06)? Even earlier, suppose they had actually gotten a chance to talk in 1.02. Or suppose Nate hadn't left the Ivy Week mixer (1.03) before Blair pulled her surprise.

These moments gave me Nate's POV again, and I wished the show could have put in a few beats for Serena's POV regarding them having slept together instead. There's never a moment where we see Serena being conflicted at all, not even just a little. So while I doubt the show was trying to show that Serena slept with Nate for no reason at all, for me, it's only inference. Canon (or maybe the acting? Perhaps those conflicted feelings were there on the script, but the actor didn't play it right?) doesn't actually support it. I was shown "I feel guilty because I slept with my best friend's BF." but none of "I feel guilty because I fell in love with my best friend's BF, which is why we slept together."

Edited by Can Attack, Jul 11, 2011 @ 2:54 PM.


#17

kschica

kschica

    Fanatic

Posted Jul 11, 2011 @ 3:28 PM

Considering they were 15 years old at the time, I think it's somewhat understandable that Serena's emotions would be conflicted. I think in their 1.02 interactions that we see that Serena feels something for Nate, but I think it's also clear those feelings don't come close to how she feels for Blair.

I kind of get the impression that Nate might have been one of the only guys she'd had sex with at this stage that she even knew halfway well and who had feelings for her. I think Serena's line to Dan about him really seeing her is key here, because I think in the moment Serena got caught up in not just being another girl, even if was with Blair's boyfriend.

I definitely don't think she was in love with Nate. We have zero evidence that she was pining for him at all.

#18

wickedthirst

wickedthirst

    Channel Surfer

Posted Jul 29, 2011 @ 1:17 AM

Serena never hesitated in telling Nate that she loved him, but I wish that we could see her pining for Nate, that's an excellent point. It would be nice to see her longing after him a bit if this relationship is ever revisited.

#19

Light of Night

Light of Night

    Fanatic

Posted Aug 3, 2011 @ 1:15 PM

I definitely don't think she was in love with Nate. We have zero evidence that she was pining for him at all.

In the Pilot, at least, I think there's clear evidence that she was. First we saw the look she gave him when they first saw each other, before Blair literally came between them. That's not much, but consider also what she said, and didn't say, outside the Palace Hotel. What she said was "Blair's my best friend, and you're her boyfriend, and she loves you". What she didn't say was "... and I don't".

#20

Can Attack

Can Attack

    Couch Potato

Posted Aug 4, 2011 @ 11:09 AM

What she said was "Blair's my best friend, and you're her boyfriend, and she loves you". What she didn't say was "... and I don't".


True. But it all goes back to the same point, that the show never gave any indication of Serena having any feelings for Nate in S1 - it's only by conjecture that the audience supposes Serena did have feelings for Nate because the alternative would make Serena into a pretty shitty person (and even if we supposed she did have feelings for him, they've obviously evaporated pretty quickly since DS got together very early on in S1), whereas we get multiple scenarios in which Nate was clearly portrayed to be conflicted over his feelings for Serena.

It's just a really odd choice for the show to be so evasive about Serena's maybe feelings for Nate (perhaps the show didn't want that to conflict with DS? In that case, wish they could have just handled it better. Then again, these writers), which calls into question as to why Serena even slept with Nate in the first place, and yet lay it out so plainly from Nate's POV in S1.

#21

merrick715

merrick715

    Couch Potato

Posted Aug 5, 2011 @ 3:31 AM

My simple explanation is that maybe Serena did have feelings for Nate, but her feelings for Blair trumped Nate. Serena is still trying to atone for her sins against Blair in season one. She isn't going to screw up her most important emotional relationship(ie Blair) or ruin something that has quickly developed into love(Dan), for a hookup that happened a year ago and also led to her almost having a coke fueled threesome with Pete and Georgina. I've always thought she subconsciously associated Nate with Pete's death.

Edited by merrick715, Aug 5, 2011 @ 3:32 AM.


#22

DontStopBelievn

DontStopBelievn

    Just Tuned In

  • Gender:Female
  • Interests:Gossip Girl , Skins,Merlin, Game of thrones , Dexter, True-blood,Buffy the vampire slayer. reading :) and of-course shopping

Posted Aug 26, 2011 @ 3:37 AM

My simple explanation is that maybe Serena did have feelings for Nate, but her feelings for Blair trumped Nate. Serena is still trying to atone for her sins against Blair in season one. She isn't going to screw up her most important emotional relationship(ie Blair) or ruin something that has quickly developed into love(Dan), for a hookup that happened a year ago and also led to her almost having a coke fueled threesome with Pete and Georgina. I've always thought she subconsciously associated Nate with Pete's death.


Where do I begin , I 97% agree with you. What held Serena back from Nate was Blair and their friendship. She was so focused on correcting all of her wrongs to Blair , Eric and so on that Nate kinda fell by the waist side. I dont think she associated Nate with Pete as much as she associated over all to her old lifestyle . She came back clean and changed I think seeing him reminded her of the old her and she wanted nothing to do with it .What really hurt me was I waited for ever for them to finally be together just to have Jenny fuel there break up. Now i wont completely Blame her because she had help from a certain Bass but ultimately It was there mistrust or one of another that Put the final nail in the coffin :( I Still feel they have a lot of potential and Im hoping the writers bring them back togther!

#23

Sara2009

Sara2009

    Stalker

Posted Mar 30, 2012 @ 11:09 PM

To be honest, I actually miss these two a little bit. I know that the endgame is probably Dan/Serena, but I still think Nate/Serena are more suited for each other.

#24

Light of Night

Light of Night

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 31, 2012 @ 11:02 AM

I miss them a lot.

#25

Light of Night

Light of Night

    Fanatic

Posted Apr 26, 2012 @ 11:14 AM

From the synopsis for 5.23:

Nate (Chace Crawford) makes a decision about the future with Diana Payne (guest star Elizabeth Hurley).



From the synopsis for 5.24:

Meanwhile, Nate (Chace Crawford) invites Lola (guest star Ella Rae Peck) to move in with him,



I thought Nate and Serena were mythic long before Blair said so, but I fear they have (let me put it this way) passed the point of no return.

#26

catmax99

catmax99

    Couch Potato

Posted Apr 26, 2012 @ 9:10 PM

The scene to me that showed more then anything that Serena had feelings for Nate before their hook-up was the flashback scenes in the Thanksgiving episode. Whether it was love, I can't say, but they were clearly really attracted to each other, and had probably been fighting that for awhile. At the Shepard wedding they both got drunk and gave into their attraction.

I always liked the idea of them together, but the reality (as often seems to happen on this show) to me was pretty boring.

What really hurt me was I waited for ever for them to finally be together just to have Jenny fuel there break up. Now i wont completely Blame her because she had help from a certain Bass but ultimately It was there mistrust or one of another that Put the final nail in the coffin


I thought they mostly broke up because Serena was obsessed with finding her dad and wouldn't share that with Nate, but did with Carter (Oh Carter, please, please come back!) I don't remember Chuck being involved at all.