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Raising Hope


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#2521

possibilities

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Posted Apr 11, 2012 @ 11:27 PM

But I did love the shark melon - that was awesome.

For me, it was the best thing about the episode. I was inspired.

I wonder if they script MawMaw, or if they let Cloris improvise. Cooking in the footbath was one of the grossest gags they've done so far, but I have to give it to her for commitment.

I've served octopus hot dogs and they are lots of fun, but it doesn't work if you like buns and condiments. Life is full of trade-offs.
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#2522

Last Time Lord

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Posted Apr 12, 2012 @ 11:14 AM

Fox finally added this OnDemand.

I loved it. Using the Mocumentary format really worked for this, and sometimes that can be either hit or miss.

This wasn't the season finale, was it?
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#2523

Bruinsfan

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Posted Apr 12, 2012 @ 11:22 AM

It was the first half of the season finale two-parter.

If you want to be annoyed about logic, why not about the fact that sabrina was watching it at her house at first, called them on a commercial break and somehow managed to drive over before it came back from one? It's not like the Chances have a dvr.

Natesville seems like a fairly small town, so that doesn't seem outrageous to me. I live in a small city of 67,000 people, and I can get crosstown to my parents' home in less than 7 minutes at night when there's less traffic. If Sabrina's apartment is within a mile of the Chance house (which seems likely, hasn't she walked over there before?), she could cover the distance within a commercial break.
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#2524

karra

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Posted Apr 12, 2012 @ 12:14 PM

My point was that this show has had logic leaks before. That's at least 20% of the plot of the show.
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#2525

simpleHope

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Posted Apr 12, 2012 @ 1:37 PM

I like Shelley and Sabrina as roommates.

This week seeing the wall of Frank's "ladies/dates" - I burst out laughing at the picture of him and MawMaw.
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#2526

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Posted Apr 12, 2012 @ 2:15 PM

karra, Mileage may vary, but to me it's lazy and stupid to have Lucy be alive. I sure hope (no pun intended) that there is a reason for this development in part two.
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#2527

LiberryLady

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Posted Apr 12, 2012 @ 7:38 PM

What was the instrumental playing in the background when Sim-Jimmy and Sim-Lucy were creating Hope?

Popcorn! Which I remember fondly from the early seventies.

I... am reserving judgement until next week. We'll see where they go with this whole Lucy storyline.
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#2528

karra

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 3:32 AM

Mileage may vary, but to me it's lazy and stupid to have Lucy be alive.


How is it lazy?
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#2529

AmazingGrace

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 3:50 AM

karra, Because it was already established that Lucy was executed, with Jimmy (and Baby Hope) in attendance. Also, there's a scene early on in the series which makes it impossible for the Chances to be at a prison wedding. I'm very interested to see what happens in part two, although the links provided here, don't give me much to look forward to. I usually cannot stand the "it's only a dream" trope, but if they used it here, I wouldn't mind at all. :) B/R stole the show with their tapping on the couch trying to get Martha to sit down next to her. :)

Edited by AmazingGrace, Apr 13, 2012 @ 3:51 AM.

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#2530

Microbat

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 8:54 AM

I haven't watched the episode yet, but from what you lot are saying it doesn't sound too good. I hate Lucy. She's one of those rubbish cartoon-type characters that rubbish cheesy humor shows use! I didn't min her being in the first episode because that seemed like a good way to bring Hope into the show and make Jimmy a single father in one episode. It was a good kick starter. But then she was in the finale of the first series when it showed what the characters used to be like (I found the whole episode stupid though, they shouldn't have been like that, it's not them) and in the middle of the second series to show what the characters would be like if Hope never existed (which is stupid as well for the same reasons), I couldn't handle it! She's just a rubbish character! And now she's coming back again with another stupid plot idea where she never actually died! I want here gone for good after this fianle!
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#2531

karra

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 2:53 PM

karra, Because it was already established that Lucy was executed, with Jimmy (and Baby Hope) in attendance. Also, there's a scene early on in the series which makes it impossible for the Chances to be at a prison wedding.


I disagree. They saw the execution. If the execution failed, it's entirely possible that Jimmy was just not told about it. Either way, we'll find out next week. As for the 'scene' you're referring to, I remember the scene, and I can see it being reinterpreted as them being confused that he has the baby at all, not that the baby exists. It's entirely possible that they thought Hope's parents were taking the baby, or that she'd put it up for adoption.

Shows doing creative reconfiguring all the time. It's not laziness just because you don't like it.
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#2532

Lollia Pollina

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 3:16 PM

I agree that the writing in this episode was lazy. Greg Garcia came up with an idea that was (properly) rejected at the time. It didn't (and still doesn't) make any sense for Lucy to be alive after a roomful of witnesses saw her being executed.

The principle of "double jeopardy" has no application here - it refers to the concept that an accused cannot be tried twice for the same crime. It is possible if the execution failed that the governor might commute a prisoner's sentence to life in prison rather than the death penalty, but not possible that said prisoner would just be allowed to stroll out off the prison free as a bird. And of course, such an incident would receive PLENTY of press coverage. In Raising Hope, of course, not even Lucy's parents know that she is alive.

In the screwed-up world of Natesville/Camden County, the much more likely scenario of a failed execution would be to wait until everyone had left and try again in secret.

Basically, it's lazy because Greg Garcia is dusting off an old failed idea rather than coming up with a new one. It's lazy and it's cheap because Garcia can't be bothered to stick the history he himself established.

Of course, if the storyline delivers huge laughs, all will be forgiven. I doubt that it will.

Edited by Lollia Pollina, Apr 13, 2012 @ 3:18 PM.

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#2533

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 4:25 PM

If the laws of Earlhopiverse followed human earth laws:

1. Earl wouldn't have gone to prison at all, since they could've easily proven he was lying and Joy couldn't have been retried anyway. Double jeopardy.
2. Hope wouldn't have spent the first six months of her life in prison.
3. The Chances also wouldn't have been able to get sex offender status removed by doing community service. That's not how that works.
4. Lucy's father would not be allowed to practice medicine.
5. Burt would still be in jail for pretending Hope was kidnapped.

edit: wtf, forum.

Edited by karra, Apr 13, 2012 @ 4:26 PM.

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#2534

AmazingGrace

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 4:27 PM

Spoiler photo for Part 2.
Courtesy of: @RaisingHopeFOX (on Twitter)

Edited by AmazingGrace, Apr 13, 2012 @ 4:28 PM.

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#2535

LTG

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 4:42 PM

This does explain how Jimmy legally got Hope, and Lucy's grandparents didn't.

The marriage doesn't really matter for that. So long as Jimmy was listed as the father on Hope's birth certificate, his claim to parental rights is very strong.

#2536

karra

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 5:06 PM

This is true, but without a marriage, the parents could make a case that there's no way she could know who the father is, since they were together once, and she'd run away from another boyfriend she'd been sleeping with.
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#2537

icyblue

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 6:51 PM

Aargh, this story frustrated me so much that I wanted to comment right away but couldn’t (password problems)!

If this is not Jimmy's dream then for me it will seem like a cringe-worthy jump over a certain predatory sea creature. The entire thing makes no sense, start to finish.

He married the serial killer and it’s never been mentioned before? (Played tonsil-hockey with her through the prison glass when she proposed? They had a fun reception in prison? She survived an execution, then was released – but no one knew? Even the idea that they’d let the baby watch the TV program – nah, no way.

I was always a little icked-out by the killer/execution angle. But they committed to that storyline long ago – can’t do a 180 now.
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#2538

randomchance

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 8:46 PM

My conspiracy theory is that he thought this would be the series finale, so he figured why not do what he wanted to do in the first place (evidently) and have Lucy survive the electric bye-bye chair.
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#2539

AmazingGrace

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 8:56 PM

randomchance, (Love your user name). That could be true as well. Yes, it's just a sitcom, a TV show for our entertainment, but there are certain realities that one would like kept in place, such as Lucy being six feet under. I hate when characterizations are ruined, such as Burt's story in Kidnapped. Maybe GG did think they weren't getting renewed and hence this Lucy-Returns-from-the-Dead storyline. If that is so, it should make for an interesting season 3 opening.

Edited by AmazingGrace, Apr 13, 2012 @ 8:57 PM.

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#2540

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 9:21 PM

How [snip] was Burt's characterization ruined?

Edited by TWoP Howard, Apr 13, 2012 @ 10:00 PM.
Tone

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#2541

Cherith

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Posted Apr 13, 2012 @ 9:41 PM

How was Burt's characterization ruined?

He intentionally got his fifteen year old girlfriend pregnant without her knowledge. And then ran away when he couldn't take it. And only came back because no girls would have sex with them.

Edited by TWoP Howard, Apr 13, 2012 @ 10:00 PM.
Quoted post was edited

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#2542

LiberryLady

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 1:04 AM

My conspiracy theory is that he thought this would be the series finale, so he figured why not do what he wanted to do in the first place (evidently) and have Lucy survive the electric bye-bye chair.

Well, he did get screwed with My Name is Earl. It was a cliffhanger he thought would be a season finale, but it ended up be the series finale. Maybe this is a little poke at that. (We saw Earl on the show, after all.)
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#2543

karra

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 1:21 AM

He intentionally got his fifteen year old girlfriend pregnant without her knowledge. And then ran away when he couldn't take it. And only came back because no girls would have sex with them.


He came back because the guy he left with tried to make out with him, if I remember right.
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#2544

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 1:47 AM

Wow. That was really bad. 1. I cannot believe that Jimmy and Lucy would have gotten married in the prison and it never be mentioned in the intervening years. 2. Lucy being alive is just dumb. This idea needed to stay in the writers' room trash bin.
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#2545

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 1:47 AM

Wow. That was really bad. 1. I cannot believe that Jimmy and Lucy would have gotten married in the prison and it never be mentioned in the intervening years. 2. Lucy being alive is just dumb. This idea needed to stay in the writers' room trash bin.
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#2546

randomchance

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 1:54 AM

Maybe GG did think they weren't getting renewed and hence this Lucy-Returns-from-the-Dead storyline. If that is so, it should make for an interesting season 3 opening.

Well, he did get screwed with My Name is Earl

And from what I've read Yes Dear was jerked around the same way, so I could understand it if his approach to season finales was kind of "might as well go out with guns blazing." But hey writers, don't turn the guns on the people who were watching! Even so, it shouldn't be too hard to recover from it - it's not a Gilmore Girls situation where it would take months to fix. Hell, just kill off Lucy and voila.

Edited by randomchance, Apr 14, 2012 @ 2:18 AM.

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#2547

kmg

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 8:52 AM

So when I first started watching this show, I could've sworn I read an interview with Greg Garcia where he said that part of the reason they killed Lucy is that they didn't ever want there to be a custody battle. They wanted the show to be about the Chances actually raising Hope, so didn't want there to be a question over custody. I wish I could find that interview now. I wish they had stuck to that frankly.
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#2548

HickoryColt

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 9:52 AM

I don't like the plot, but its not a tough situation to fix.

Hopefully they wrap this up so its not lingering over the show next season. SO maybe she is still alive, maybe she tries to go back to her "old ways" and gets killed in the process. Something. I hope this doesn't turn into the Earl "coma" situation, because that killed the show, IMO. Those episodes were bad.
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#2549

Trini Girl

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 10:05 PM

2. Lucy being alive is just dumb. This idea needed to stay in the writers' room trash bin.

It is very rare that this type of plot twist ever works out in a satisfying way. Why did they think it'd work here?

So when I first started watching this show, I could've sworn I read an interview with Greg Garcia where he said that part of the reason they killed Lucy is that they didn't ever want there to be a custody battle. They wanted the show to be about the Chances actually raising Hope, so didn't want there to be a question over custody. I wish I could find that interview now. I wish they had stuck to that frankly.

It was a really bold (and controversial) move to kill off the mother of a baby (onscreen!) to start out this sitcom; and now they want to take that decision back??
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#2550

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Posted Apr 14, 2012 @ 10:36 PM

Why did they think it'd work here?


Granted I can see here that it hasn't worked for some people, but given that this is only part ONE of the season finale we don't even know how this story plays out this season, let alone what might happen next. It seems a little cart before the horse to be declaring it a failure already.

I loved part one. I thought it was hilarious. I saw the Lucy being alive thing coming as soon as the show started and something huge and shocking was promised to happen. I have no problem with it. Maybe it's because I've spent a good chunk of my life watching soaps, but back from the dead stuff doesn't shock me. I don't think this show should abandon logic completely and be able to get away with anything, but this is not a show that I come to for or expect strict adherence to the logic of the real world. Given the nature of My Name is Earl and Raising Hope and how wacky the legal system is there I can actually see an explanation that really doesn't require that much of a leap to explain why Lucy's still alive. Now if she actually isn't in jail that will require a bit more of a leap, but I'm not going to jump to any conclusions until all is explained. Lucy was only in one episode, in any significant way, and I had no real problems with here, other than her being a psycho. Jimmy and Lucy having gotten married and no one bringing that up is odd, but they did think she was dead.

I hate Nancy Grace and her performance was a little too wooden for the most part here, but there were some funny parts with her. I thought the Maw Maw cooking in her foot massager was gross, but other than that all of the sight gags worked for me. I always find it so off-putting and unnatural in newsmagazines and the like, when they film people doing those weird mundane establishing shots where they people pretend they're not being filmed. I loved those moments on the show with Frank watching the camera and Sabrina not knowing how to act naturally. Loved Burt and the sunglasses with the lenses removed so he could appear smart. I loved all of the cast pictures from when they were younger. Loved Virginia's middle name being Slim and why. I don't really buy them letting Hope watch the program, but it's not something that kept me from enjoying the show.
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