385 replies to this topic

[IvyDarling]

From NBC.com

Amber and Haddie's anger threatens to tear the family in two; Crosby risks losing Jasmine and Jabbar.

[Paws]

That girl fight at the beginning? So realistic.

I wish Haddie and her dad had a nice hug. She needed to cry on his shoulder.

[Chicken Wing]

I'm sorry, did I just watch grown adults getting involved and taking sides in a romantic drama-rama between two teenage children?

[YankeesGal]

I hear that Chicken Wing. Poor Max.

[Marl]

I found the argument following the tagging of Amber's locker to be the absolute highlight of this episode. There's Sarah trying to say tagging of said locker is wrong without validating Amber's actions and Kristina with claws out ready to protect her kid. It worked perfectly and was perhaps one of the most realistic scenes in the entire show in my opinion and LG and MP played it beautifully.

[bluroses]

That girl fight at the beginning? So realistic.

Sure was. I was having high school flashbacks just watching.

It worked perfectly and was perhaps one of the most realistic scenes in the entire show in my opinion and LG and MP played it beautifully.

Totally. I've seen parents get involved in their kids fights in real life and it gets very messy very fast. And this scene captured that perfectly.

Edited by bluroses, May 18, 2010 @ 10:13 PM.

[Empress1]

I liked that Amber didn’t back down to the soccer girls, and I agreed with her that it was an issue between Hattie and Amber. I also heard Hattie tell Amber to take responsibility for her actions, which was bullshit because she DID take responsibility for them – she owned up to what she did, she knew it was wrong and said so. And I really wanted Amber to say in front of Adam and Kristina that she did not in fact tell Hattie to break up with Steve, that what happened between Amber and Steve happened when he and Hattie were broken up. I don’t know how it came to be that I liked Amber more in that first scene, but there it is. If I’m Sarah, I would have smacked the taste out of Kristina’s mouth for that “No one would write ‘whore’ on Hattie’s locker because she’s not” comment in that snide, bitchy tone of voice – the implication was very clear. I felt really bad for Adam in that scene, caught between his sister (and she seems to be the sibling he’s closest to) and his wife. That said, I didn’t assume that Hattie tagged the locker, I thought one of her friends did, probably the one who threw her drink in Amber’s face. (Re: Crosby’s question about who would win in a fight, I think Sarah wins hands-down.)

I was with Julia that begging for soup (insisting on it being homemade, no less – girl, please, if you ask me to bring you food, you eat what I give you) after a boob job is disingenuous at best.

Max’s “He said that to my face! TO MY FACE!” had me dying. Same with “Their mileage is counted, that’s what matters.” Classy of Adam to shake Mr. Lessing’s hand, classy of Mr. Lessing to clap.

Something about Sarah and Adam's last conversation bugged me. When Adam revealed that Amber and Steve were still seeing each other (and why isn't Steve speaking up for Amber in the face of all the whores and sluts being bandied around? Man up, Steve) and Sarah apologized, I was left with a bad taste in my mouth. And when she said she was sick of being the problem, that seemed kind of unfair. She's not a problem; Hattie and Amber fighting is the problem, and that's between them. I guess that's why it bugged me that Sarah apologized on Amber's behalf for seeing Steve. I think all the adults should say that it's up to the girls to work out - Kristina's ire, while understandable, is ... invasive, in a way. If Steve had slept with one of Hattie's mean-girl friends, they'd tell Hattie to take it up with the girl. And while Amber is family so it hurts more and there are more feelings flying around, I think that's the tack they should take with them.

I'm really just thinking aloud here so it may not be coherent, but I think my final thought on the matter is that all adults should butt out and let these young adults work it out themselves - or not, as the case may be. Which would be understandable and OK. If there's a family event, just tell them that they don't have to be friends but they do have to attend the event - just go and don't talk to each other.

Crosby, where you been? Everyone knows Alvin Ailey is in NYC.

Edited by Empress1, May 18, 2010 @ 10:12 PM.

[ebeth]

Yes, Chicken Wing, you did. And god was it ever dumb.

But while the hypothetical adults annoyed me, how sweet was Drew when he said he was Amber's wingman? He's got such an awesome heart. I also loved Jabbar at the Alvin Ailey audition.

I felt like Joel should develop a thicker skin about frosty glares at school. Julia can't set foot there without getting frozen out, Rockstar Dad can come back from a few days of scandal about store-bought chicken soup. (Also, I understand why Joel's not on the Angel Committee - If I thought I could get hunky ex-contractor man to bring me soup, I would be very sick indeed.)

Edited by ebeth, May 18, 2010 @ 10:16 PM.

[Cassandra42]

I'm sorry, did I just watch grown adults getting involved and taking sides in a romantic drama-rama between two teenage children?

In my experience, that's pretty realistic. Parents get defensive about much smaller things concerning their children.

This was really hard to watch. I'm pretty much just a LG fan, so it was hard to see her and her daughter suffering so much. Makes me dislike the other characters even though I can see their point.

[JessieQ]

Had I done to my cousin what Amber did, I'm fairly certain my own parents would have joined in the vandalism.

[roseslg]

damn interweb ate my post!

I think it's very realistic for the adults to get involved. A lot of it has to do with wanting to protect your children and it becomes more complicated when you are related to the other parties involved. Teenage romance drama may not seem like a lot now, but when you're 16 it's like the end of the world. Combine that with the seeming betrayal by a trusted family member and well, drama, especially in a family so close. My family has had some knock down drag out fights over things that are not even that important, so I didn't have a problem with that.

I really loved the Neko Case song they played when Amber was talking to Steve. It just made the whole thing so extra bittersweet. You want Amber to be happy, but then there is the whole family drama/betrayal issue that will just make things near to impossible.

Will go and listen to the song now!

Loving this show.

[Chicken Wing]

I think it was Kristina's reaction that made this a ridiculous overinvolvement. Being angry at the person, even if it's another relative, who hurt your daughter, taking your child's side in the feud? Totally get it. However, that "What a little--" remark and demanding that Adam uninvite Amber from the walkathon? I rolled my eyes right out of my head. Kristina was acting like she was their age, it was so silly. At that point I was like, "Mind your own business and get a life."

Edited by Chicken Wing, May 18, 2010 @ 10:22 PM.

[IvyDarling]

Had I done to my cousin what Amber did, I'm fairly certain my own parents would have joined in the vandalism.

Same here. My mom would have given me the meanest side-eye ever witnessed on the planet. SMH at Amber. When she had the nerve to say that it happened because she and Steve had a connection, I was like "oh hell no!" That was so fucked up. To be sure, it was wrong of Haddie to tell her parents that Amber told her to break up with Steve (because it didn't happen), but I think Amber came off as all types of wrong in this episode.

I cannot suspend belief that Julia would take off 3 hours from work (aka, potentially 3 whole hours that she could have billed) for a non family health emergency to do something like bring soup to a woman who had a boob job. Nope, can't do it.

I think it's very realistic for the adults to get involved. A lot of it has to do with wanting to protect your children and it becomes more complicated when you are related to the other parties involved. Teenage romance drama may not seem like a lot now, but when you're 16 it's like the end of the world. Combine that with the seeming betrayal by a trusted family member and well, drama, especially in a family so close.

It was realistic to me that the family was involved too. Already, this whole situation has affected family (the Autism walk and some people not going as promised because of all of the drama), so it makes sense that they are involved.

Jasmine needs a lock on her bedroom door.

[Easyspreestep]

Kristina was so wrong for implying in any way shape or form that Amber was a whore!!! I was so upset that Sarah said sorry. What should have happened was Sarah grew a spine and said listen I DON'T CARE WHAT HAPPEN YOU DON'T GET TO IMPLY THAT MY DAUGHTER IS A WHORE. At least to my face. Then she should have walked out. I am sorry but that rubbed me the wrong way.

Edited by Easyspreestep, May 18, 2010 @ 11:08 PM.

[DragonsBack]

Sarah, I'm really tired of you being the problem, too.

What a whiny asshole. She blows of Adam and Max and the walk, then mopes about how hard it is to have Adam be the better parent... after just admitting that they didn't come because she wanted to take the path of least resistance? Own your actions.

If Amber does run off to Fresno next episode, can she take Sarah with her and never return?

[Easyspreestep]

Also not happy with Sarah giving in to the kids

Edited by Easyspreestep, May 18, 2010 @ 10:33 PM.

[ImNotLeesa]

I cannot suspend belief that Julia would take off 3 hours from work (aka, potentially 3 whole hours that she could have billed) for a non family health emergency to do something like bring soup to a woman who had a boob job. Nope, can't do it.

Oh, but Joel was the one who signed her up, so it's not a problem. Why would he have done that, when he knows Julia already struggles with finding enough time in the day as it is?

As a side note, I'm a straight woman, but I noticed that Erika Christensen looked prettier than normal this episode, especially in her scenes with Camille. Less makeup? Having her hair down, maybe? Who knows why.

Those fights between Amber and the other girls on the field and between Sarah and Kristina were so realistic it made my head hurt. Like someone else said, the fight at school made me flash back to my school years too.

The scene between Adam and Haddie kind of bugged me...it started out ok, but when he ever said "It not about you, it's about Max. Do this for me and for him." I wanted to throttle him. Haddie's been hearing that her whole life and it must really be getting old. I understand asking her to suck it up and go to the stupid walk, but Adam could have been more in the moment with her right then.
(And what's with his obsession with having the whole family there for the walk? He sounded like he was twelve every time he went off about it)

[aclockworkred]

If Amber does run off to Fresno next episode, can she take Sarah with her and never return?

And could she take Julia with her? Since she literally does nothing every episode but be obnoxious while trying to prove to everyone how great she is.

What a whiny asshole.

How is she whiny or an asshole? For genuinely apologizing to Kristina for her daughters actions while Kristina just called her daughter a whore. Or for apologizing to Adam for the problems her moving back has caused?

Edited by aclockworkred, May 18, 2010 @ 10:37 PM.

[Cosmos2]

I have to take Sarah's side on this one. Staying home for waffles and spending quality time with the kids and mom is better than going to a walk where Max gets another trophy that his daddy won for him.

[DragonsBack]

It was realistic to me that the family was involved too. Already, this whole situation has affected family (the Autism walk and some people not going as promised because of all of the drama), so it makes sense that they are involved.

Agreed. This isn't two mothers who have never spoken getting into a fight after running into each other in the school parking lot. Their being related means 1) that what Amber did was especially "gross", as Kristina put it, so she and Adam have all the more reason to worry that Haddie will internalize really unhealthy lessons about trust as a result of all of this and 2) the two families can't avoid each other.

It would be weird if they didn't get involved.

[Seal]

Also not happy with Sarah giving in to the kids

I don't think she would have had her mother not taken the kids' side - it seems like Sarah just gave up at that point rather than gave in.

[mother of 4]

Amber looked really pretty this episode. I felt sorry for her but there are plenty of boys in the school so why have sex with Hattie's ex? Adam was unfair to Hattie. How many times does she have to do it for Max? Nice to see Max when he's not having a tantrum.

Don't you think Grandma shouldn't have interfered when Sarah wanted her kids to go to Team Braverman?

Julia is always saying she wants more time with Sydney. Really!!!!! She wasted 3 hours with the boob job lady when she could have been with her daughter. Plus Sydney is adorable and IMO the show is much better when her daughter is on.

Julia and her mom's scene was sweet. Joel and Julia were also cute together. He needs to be less caring about what he assumes people are thinking about his wife. Get a pair, Joel

Sarah should stop apologizing.

Camille got even so maybe she should take Zeek back.

Is Crosby moving to New York? Bye, you won't be missed.

[ImNotLeesa]

Don't you think Grandma shouldn't have interfered when Sarah wanted her kids to go to Team Braverman?

It was strange how Camille floated in and said "we're not going; I'm making waffles."

It seems like anytime there's conflict or even heated or serious discussion, Camille either changes the subject, says "I'm not going to talk about that", tells other people to leave the matter alone or gets up and leaves. There's conflict avoidance, and then there's CONFLICT AVOIDANCE, and Camille seems to have a serious case of the latter. Though sometimes I can't tell if she's avoiding conflict/stress or if she just doesn't want to be bothered. It's amazing that her kids are such jabber-jabbers, busybodies and oversharers. They certainly didn't get that from their mother.

[HeyJuliet]

I don't think she would have had her mother not taken the kids' side - it seems like Sarah just gave up at that point rather than gave in.

Agreed. I think she would have stuck to her guns and eventually had them go if Camille hadn't declared it over, that they were definitely staying home. I feel really bad for Sarah and I'm tired of her being the screw-up, too. The whole Saint Adam thing and all is really starting to grate on my last nerve. I agree that the tension between Kristina and Sarah, getting personal about their kids fight, was totally realistic. But I still didn't like it. Especially Kristina going so far as to imply that Amber was a whore.

Loved, loved, loved the scene between Amber and Sarah. LG and MW were terrific in it. Mae's acting chops are making this storyline tolerable. She's so vulnerable that I think it's easy to be sympathetic towards her even though her actions were pretty messed up. The sad thing is that the girl who plays Haddie isn't anywhere in the same league, so the character is coming across, to me anyway, as annoying and bratty even when she's justified in a lot of her emotions.

I thought Julia was incredibly restrained with the boob-job mom, all things considered. And I liked that the second time they were together, they got it all out there instead of just being completely passive-aggressive. I love that they ended up talking seriously and kind of having a moment.

The more we get of Crosby and his instant family, the less hope I have of this show ever tackling the mountain of issues they should have. If we do ever get to it, I think it might be a matter of too little, too late. Seeing cute scene after cute scene when they have really yet to resolve anything is bothering me. I'd like to think that her considering moving to New York with Jabbar, without thinking about what that would mean to Crosby, will bring stuff to a head, but I have the feeling it's going to be more about Crosby considering the move, too. I'm having a hard time caring about this storyline because it's so frustrating and incomplete.

[CaseStudy]

This show is so well-acted (Lauren and Mae were great tonight), but the shifty, thin material is not worthy. Besides, didn't Jason Katims already do the 'tormented whore' storyline with Lyla on FNL?

[izabella]

I'd like to think that her considering moving to New York with Jabbar, without thinking about what that would mean to Crosby, will bring stuff to a head, but I have the feeling it's going to be more about Crosby considering the move, too. I'm having a hard time caring about this storyline because it's so frustrating and incomplete.

Oh, I thought that was all a set up for Jasmine moving and leaving Jabbar with Crosby. You know, like it's his turn now while she follows her dancing dream.

I have to take Sarah's side on this one. Staying home for waffles and spending quality time with the kids and mom is better than going to a walk where Max gets another trophy that his daddy won for him.

Especially when Max's mom pretty much called Amber a whore. Hell, no, not going to support you now.

I still think Amber was wrong in sleeping with Steve, but that does NOT make her a whore or anything of the kind. Kristina was way out of line with that comment.

Edited by izabella, May 18, 2010 @ 11:34 PM.

[shtyrayumsugs]

Ok, so I get that what Amber did was a bad thing. What's pissing me off here is that Haddie lied about the situation and because of Amber's guilt over it she's not setting the record straight so Haddie is able to play the victim. Amber did NOT tell Haddie to break up with Steve and then jump into the sack with him. Haddie and Amber talked about it AFTER she dumped Steve.

I get that Haddie is hurt and feels violated but here's the thing. Haddie dumped Steve so that makes him fair game. Granted you don't want your cousin to start dating your ex, but it happens. It does not make the cousin a whore. It shows bad judgment on the part of the cousin sure, but she's 16. She is in no way shape or form capable of making the mature and difficult choice to deny the heart what it wants. Hell women, and men for that matter, much older have difficulty with that decision. Ask Camille.

I'm not defending Amber here, but I think she's getting a bad rap. I also think that it's an entirely different situation and conversation when the truth (that Amber did not talk Haddie into dumping Steve so that she could sleep with him) comes to light.

[omgsowicked]

As a side note, I'm a straight woman, but I noticed that Erika Christensen looked prettier than normal this episode, especially in her scenes with Camille. Less makeup? Having her hair down, maybe? Who knows why.

I thought she looked pretty as well... I thought it was because her hair was down. They should have her like that more often.

Sarah needs to grow a backbone and stand up to/for her kids and to her siblings. She was right to apologize for her daughter's behavior the first time but to keep on apologizing? The adults had their words, now it's time to back off and let the girls handle it. Kristina and Sarah's interaction was amazingly acted... I thought Kristina was a major bitch with her "well, because Haddie's not a whore" comment. I thought she should have apologized first, not Sarah. Haddie's not perfect and if they weren't so focused on Max, they'd know that (anyone remember the weed? Of course not, it only matters if she's sexually active). When Camille came in and told them they were staying home and the kids left, I expected Sarah to fall to the floor, defeated. Instead, she asks for pancakes. Eh.

Loved Drew in this episode. Love Drew in every episode. Moar Drew.

Jasmine... she bugs me (for numerous reasons), going to an audition for a job that's in NY and refusing to discuss what they'd do if she got it. What a schmuck. I wonder if Crosby will get a custody agreement because he's not going to NY.

I still don't understand Joel. And I've ceased to care, at this point. And Adam is grating me a bit with his smug perfection.

[thejustink]

Do we really know that Amber did have sex with Steve? It seems like it didn't go that far. I don't know. I love that actress

This show is just acted really really well.

[IvyDarling]

I'm not defending Amber here, but I think she's getting a bad rap. I also think that it's an entirely different situation and conversation when the truth (that Amber did not talk Haddie into dumping Steve so that she could sleep with him) comes to light.

I actually don't think the situation is that different. To be sure, it would be worse if Amber encouraged Haddie to break up with Steve and then slept with him. But, to me, the present situation still comes off badly. Here's Haddie coming to her [first] cousin (and friend) to confide in Amber about her breakup with her first serious boyfriend--a breakup that happened because Haddie wasn't ready to have sex--and Amber tells her she did the right thing. Then Amber goes and sleeps with Steve. To Haddie, it probably comes off as Amber agreed with her decision just so she could sleep with Steve.

IMO from the outside, either way Amber looks like the bad guy.