Jump to content

Hoarding: Buried Alive (TLC)


  • Please log in to reply

3527 replies to this topic

#2251

stephf13

stephf13

    Couch Potato

Posted Mar 11, 2012 @ 10:38 PM

Yeah, Tonya should've stayed gone. I remember being on her side on the sister's first appearance on the show. She showed her ass tonight. What an astounding bitch.


I liked Tonya in the original episode, I thought she was looking out for her sister. She was just a bitch tonight, though. I get that she felt she needed to reserve her accolades until she saw that her sister really followed through, but she has done some of the work, throw her some support!

Line of the series: "Do you want to call your sister?"


I cannot believe Gene hasn't left that crazy bitch. She made up a sister! A twin, no less! Then said, on national television, that Gene had an affair with her! That is all kinds of crazy. Did you hear her complain when she was in the bathroom, about him calling her out on her sister lie? I think she should thank the Lord every day that Gene and the kids want to have anything else to do with her ever, because if I were them, she and all of her stuff would have been out on the curb long ago.
  • 0

#2252

AngelaHunter44

AngelaHunter44

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 11, 2012 @ 10:51 PM

I cannot believe Gene hasn't left that crazy bitch.


He says he's asked her twice to leave and she said she would but of course she hasn't. Where else could she go where she could pile shit up to the ceiling?

As for painting after the cleanup: Bennie and others like him with rundown shabby houses with filthy could easily go to Home Depot, get a gallon of colored, returned paint for about $10, and buy a roller for a few bucks more. Most of the hoarders we see are perfectly capable of painting a wall and for a lot of them the exercise certainly wouldn't hurt them any.
  • 0

#2253

stephf13

stephf13

    Couch Potato

Posted Mar 11, 2012 @ 10:55 PM

He says he's asked her twice to leave and she said she would but of course she hasn't. Where else could she go where she could pile shit up to the ceiling?


I did hear him say that, but what's stopping him from taking the kids and going to an apartment? I know there's the principle of the matter, but what's principle when it comes to the well-being of your children? Frankly, I would change the locks while she was at work one day, and I wouldn't care where she went, as long as it was away from me.

Edited by stephf13, Mar 11, 2012 @ 10:55 PM.

  • 0

#2254

funky rat

funky rat

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 12:26 AM

OH! I SO want to beat the ever-loving crap out of that sister! I too felt some sympathy for her in the first show, but now, she's just psycho. And that house could be absolutely spotless - she'd still try to gain custody of that child for another reason.

My husband's aunt lost a son in a tragic accident. She then convinced my late mother-in-law to send my husband's brother (younger) to the same private school that her daughter went to and live with them during the week (because it was a long drive away). She even paid the tuition for him because my in-laws could not afford it. Then - out of the clear blue - she served my late MIL with legal papers to take custody of my BIL because he was being abused and neglected. Sadly, my late MIL was abusive and a control freak, but the aunt was absolutely no better. She just wanted my BIL because she lost her son, and my BIL somewhat looked like her son. She had him sleeping in his old bedroom but he wasn't allowed to change anything about it.

So methinks that the evil sister may have something similar going on in her life. If I had money, I'd bet it. Perhaps she didn't lose a child but doesn't have any. Another of my husband's cousins put her daughter up for adoption, and I offered to take her (and allow her mother to see her) because we are unable to have children, but when the cousin's mother took the child, I left it drop. I didn't go to the ends of the Earth to attempt to take her away. I'd have loved to have her, but as long as she was in a safe area, I was ok with it.
  • 0

#2255

the macguffin

the macguffin

    Couch Potato

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 6:04 AM

I'm curious whether that one woman, Amy, who claimed her boyfriend (the love of her life) the pilot that was killed in a training exercise over Viet Nam ever existed outside of her mind

Yeah, I didn't believe this as the cause of her hoarding, either. The original VO said she left home and was a teacher, then returned when her parents got sick, and that was when the hoarding began. But the Vietnam war has been over for 40 years, so unless the guy died at the same time as her parents, this seems bogus. They also never explained how (temporarily, IMO) cleaning her house up is going to solve her debt problem.
  • 0

#2256

linderhill

linderhill

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 7:48 AM

I agree macguffin. That debt was never addressed again after the beginning voiceover. With the mysterious "love of her life", Amy seemed so very evasive about it. If the guy even existed, I wonder if he even knew she existed.

I had to laugh about the other woman, Vicky of the giant tiger, talking about her "female surgery." Seriously woman, you had a hysterectomy didn't you? That and your mother's death and bad marriage made you a hoarder?
  • 0

#2257

Toaster Strudel

Toaster Strudel

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 8:04 AM

What's the big deal about a hysterectomy that's hush-hush?

Tiger Woman was working at cross-purposes. She hoarded her home trying to make it welcoming for her family (seven Xmas trees), scented candles and cushions... in trying to make the house "homey" she made it unlivable. She must be uber-rich, that hoard was $$$$$.

Quite shocked that she cleaned up herself after the crew left.
  • 0

#2258

AngelaHunter44

AngelaHunter44

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 9:28 AM

Okay, so have we seen the outer limits of excuses for hoarding now, with a woman who is still devastated over the death of a boyfriend about 40 or so years ago? Probably a friend of her brother or a neighbour's son she had a crush on. It's amazing the lengths these people go to in trying to make others feel sorry for them.

I did hear (Gene) say that, but what's stopping him from taking the kids and going to an apartment?


Of course he could do that, but why should everyone else lose their home and be uprooted because of that manipulative, selfish cow?

As for the Tiger Lady, I really liked her home "After". I would never have such decor, but it looked pretty cool.

Edited by AngelaHunter44, Mar 12, 2012 @ 9:29 AM.

  • 0

#2259

DoraSuarez

DoraSuarez

    Channel Surfer

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 9:31 AM

eta:, seriously, pinking shears? She has a fit over pinking shears being thrown away? And someone offered over a $100 for that basket? I don't believe that at all.


Actually, I have a few pairs of expensive, high-quality scissors that I would be really, really upset to see in the trash (or to see used on paper or anything non-fabric). It's kind of frightening how much I identify with the hoarders' protectiveness of their needlecraft supplies. Apparently I'm a little selectively OCD myself. (I remember cringing when, on either this show or Hoarders, an organizer asked a hoarder "How many knitting needles do you really need?" and I had way more than the hoarder did :-(.)

And yeah, that looked like a Longaberger basket, and if she had stored it somewhere other than her dusty hoard it might actually be worth that much. They're expensive to begin with, and also collectible since the company only does limited runs of each style. (I have a friend who's really into them and she spends beaucoup bucks on them; it's much easier to rationalize since their actually is a re-sell market for them. Search eBay for Longaberger and see for yourself). I wanted to somebody to tell her it had no resale value because of the haphazard way she had stored it, though, not because one of the helpers had "broken" it.
  • 0

#2260

Hamhock96

Hamhock96

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 9:31 AM

Those re-visits were just sad!
  • 0

#2261

Suz at Large

Suz at Large

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 9:37 AM

OH! I SO want to beat the ever-loving crap out of that sister! I too felt some sympathy for her in the first show, but now, she's just psycho. And that house could be absolutely spotless - she'd still try to gain custody of that child for another reason.

Yes! I hate to admit it, but I yelled at the TV after one of her many snarky nasty cracks about her sister. I hope she was just choking inside when she actually SAW her niece's room. Which was nicely furnished and decorated, and probably tidier than the average kid's room. She could only mutter some sort of grudging comment, but it was clear that the "unsafe" conditions she kept ranting about, didn't exist in the rooms of that house the family were living in. Sure, there was a hoard outside and that was bad, but fer pete's sake, it was OUTSIDE. The kid had a very decent and apparently clean place to live INSIDE. And her mom was working on the outside. You don't get to a major hoarded condition overnight, and it takes time to get it cleaned up. But I gotta give that woman props for hanging in and working on it.That "former military" sister? Should get herself a life and leave that little family ALONE. What a crazyass ugly control freak!

Oh, Shelley, Shelley, Shelley. More damn purses than ever in that hoard. Including her "favorite," a toad purse. With the tags still on it. A toad purse. Really. That she's never carried. But it's a favorite and she can't part with it. Oh, yeah, maybe really it belongs to her twin sister. See, all that stuff really is her sister's that she's "storing" because sis doesn't have room. Yes, her twin sister. The one her husband had an affair with.

But, yeah, that's right. She doesn't have a twin sister. She doesn't even have a SISTER.

The amount of crazy on display is just staggering. Is her presence really helpful to her brain-damaged son? Or could hubby find a way to live with that son and without crazy Shelley, that might be better for both of them?

Frankly, I think that living in a homeless shelter might be preferable to the physical mess and mental craziness those men endure in that house.

Of course, I'm no expert and I could be wrong. Shelley may be delusional, self-obsessed, selfish and unpleasant but somehow the world's best at taking care of her special needs son.

About Amy. I didn't catch her age if stated, but she could have been about my age (63) and if so could have lost her "true love" in the Vietnam war. A lot of my generation died there, and others came back badly damaged. However, I didn't quite buy the "dead soulmate" story even if the chronology made sense. I wonder if she was a good Southern girl of her generation who might have been attracted to women, and sublimated that unthinkable feeling as she got on with her life. But anyway, whether she's spent a long life running from sexuality issues, other deep feelings that run counter to what is (or she thinks is) expected of her, or even some hidden trauma? The waste of all that time and money on pointless shopping and hoarding is just so sad. Especially because I saw Amy as being intelligent and educated, and someone who could have made a decent life for herself.

And good Lord, how many of these hoarders have INHERITED perfectly nice houses - only to hoard them (at a minimum) or trash them entirely (worst cases). I've busted my butt to buy modest houses. I'm working toward mortgage freedom, but if I ever got a free and clear house as a gift, I don't claim it would be a House Beautiful spread, but I wouldn't hoard it.

Edited by Suz at Large, Mar 22, 2012 @ 8:30 AM.

  • 0

#2262

WerWerWer

WerWerWer

    Channel Surfer

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 10:12 AM

That "former military" sister? Should get herself a life and leave that little family ALONE.


I think that remark by the vindictive sister really said it all. There's pretty much nothing Lorena (that was the hoarding sister's name, right?) could have done that *ever* would have been good enough to satisfy her sister as far as seeking custody of Alexia because the sister just didn't approve of Lorena or how she lived, period. Unless it was a sparely furnished room with hospital corners on the beds and no "clutter" anywhere in sight--i.e., the way the sister herself lives--it would always have been found deficient.

and

Line of the series: "Do you want to call your sister?"


Could not agree more. This one actually had me LOLing and cheering at the same time. I think, of all the "hateful hoarders" featured on these shows, putting aside the animal cruelty ones, Shelley ranks right at the top for me.
  • 0

#2263

annetteFHorn

annetteFHorn

    Loyal Viewer

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 10:32 AM

Suz at Large:

And good Lord, how many of these hoarders have INHERITED perfectly nice houses - only to hoard them (at a minimum) or trash them entirely (worst cases). I've busted my butt to buy modest houses. I'm working toward mortgage freedom, but if I ever got a free and clear house as a gift, I don't claim it would be a House Beautiful spread, but I wouldn't hoard it.


I wonder if inheriting a house doesn't make it worse. You've got all the parents' stuff, and all the memories, plus the house is actually worth less to you precisely because you didn't work for it.

I too wish they'd followed up on Amy's debt problems. Cleaning up and not re-shopping, even assuming it sticks, at least will stop the debt getting worse. But it won't pay it off.

I wonder how much of Gene's reluctance to leave his wife is connected to the situation with the brain-damaged son. I can't remember if Shelley works outside the house, or how much time she spends caring for the son. If Gene left on his own, I guess he could give Shelley money to help with the son, but she'd probably just spend it on toad purses. If Gene left with the kids, he'd be a single dad with one child who is always going to need care, and that would be a tough situation. Either way, he's heading for a heart attack or some other serious health problem, what with all that anger.
  • 0

#2264

stephf13

stephf13

    Couch Potato

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 10:39 AM

Of course he could do that, but why should everyone else lose their home and be uprooted because of that manipulative, selfish cow?


He shouldn't. I addressed that in the sentence after the one you quoted. Of course, they shouldn't HAVE to leave, but, short of taking some sort of legal action to have her and her crap kicked out of the house, that's his only choice. He can choose to stay there, and be miserable, or he can choose to leave, and be happy. She isn't going to get better, he needs to realize that and take some kind of action.
  • 0

#2265

Green

Green

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 10:41 AM

The vast amount of amusement I have gotten from "Do you want to call your sister?" could fill the Grand Canyon. I laugh every time I think about it, which is a lot. And the way he and the son busted out laughing when he said that was just awesome. I couldn't see her face, and I wondered if she sort of couldn't help but laugh a little, too, in that "hee hee hee I mean STOP IT I AM MAD!" kind of way.

I hope Benny did end up painting his kitchen. I love that he considers it paradise now, and that his sweet friend gave him new appliances, but I wouldn't be able to spend 10 full seconds in that kitchen the way it was, and don't like to think of Benny preparing food in there. Like the kind doctor, I want better for him than that. I loved his granddaughter to bits.
  • 0

#2266

Ketzel

Ketzel

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 12:22 PM

So, is lying an irresistable symption of OCD, too? The hoarder who promised to stop shopping for a year and swore she had stuck to her promise, as her daughter turned up package after package from TV shopping shows with dates within the year? The hoarder who claimed to have an imaginary twin sister, with whom her husband had an affair, no less? The hoarder claiming no one offered her help, followed by screen clips of multiple people offering her help?

I remain fascinated by the facial expression all hoarders seem to display when someone is telling them something, obviously true, in plain words, that they simply do not want to hear. The eyes go dead.The facial affect becomes wooden.

That therapist who took the "special" pen away from the hoarder and basically dared her to remember he had taken it seemed really clueless. First of all, how was she supposed to " track how long it took her to forget" he had the pen? Seriously, doc, was she supposed to wake up every morning and check to see if she'd forgotten it yet? And even if that made any sense at all, you had basically dared her to forget the pen and she was clearly determined to rise to your challenge and NEVERNEVERNEVER forget you had it. And, of course, in the end, she "won" and felt completely validated in her need to keep all of her stuff as a result. Stupid.
  • 0

#2267

Grommet

Grommet

    Couch Potato

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 12:30 PM

I was just telling a friend about "Do you want to call your sister?" and I laughed so hard, I had tears in my eyes. It was such a wonderfully spontaneous remark! For an angry guy, he was pretty gentle with her.

I too hope Benny keeps making progress. Such a sweet guy, and his grandchildren were both lovely.
  • 0

#2268

NoPity1066

NoPity1066

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 12:39 PM

But, yeah, that's right. She doesn't have a twin sister. She doesn't even have a SISTER.

The amount of crazy on display is just staggering.


Yep, Suz at Large, "staggering" is the perfect word. But I can't quite put a finger on the brand of crazy she was selling. She's not just a garden-variety liar, there's something WAY worse than that going on. I went to high school with a girl who used to make up such outrageous lies, like being repeatedly kidnapped, mugged, attacked, getting pregnant and having a miscarriage just about every three months, etc, etc, that by 10th grade no one believed a single word she said. Shelly and her "twin sister" story reminded me of her, but I still wonder what it is exactly that's wrong with her.

She's certainly not in Ted Bundy/Diane Downs territory, but it's way beyond the lies told by the nerdy kid with the proverbial "girlfriend in Canada".

I just don't know - is "weird and creepy" a clinical diagnosis ?
  • 0

#2269

ScrubMonkey

ScrubMonkey

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 1:59 PM

"Snapped" - Shelley snapped and her rubber band hasn't been repaired yet. I don't know if that's clinical, NoPity1066, but I think it's accurate.

I can't imagine what they went through when their son was permanently injured - I can't let myself go there. I'm sure the well of grief would be endless. But Shelley doesn't seem to realize that it happened to them, as a family - to Gene also, and to his (ETA: their injured son's) brothers. Not just to her! Gene needs to get himself into some counseling and whatever else, to relieve some of that stress. Maybe take himself and the sons out for some camping trips, or bowling or whatever the heck recreation they enjoy, and let Shelley stay at home with her toad purses. Or maybe join her sister for some Canasta. But just get the hell out. If not all the time, some of the time is good too.

What happened to them was tragic, but, life's harsh. Maybe they should sell that house, buy Shelley one condo and the men another and get on with life.

The other twisted sisters - Lorena and Tanya. Tanya just needs to butt out and get her own life in order, she isn't Queen of Everything and it's none of her business. Period.

Edited by ScrubMonkey, Mar 12, 2012 @ 2:00 PM.

  • 0

#2270

AngelaHunter44

AngelaHunter44

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 2:02 PM

Shelly and her "twin sister" story reminded me of her, but I still wonder what it is exactly that's wrong with her.


I think when it comes to not giving up one item of their hoards, people like Shelly will say anything, no matter how ridiculous or outrageous it sounds. When she was being told to get rid of some of her hundreds of handbags, I'm sure her brain was whirring through a list of reasons why she couldn't and the "sister" story popped up. After all, no one could tell her to get rid of someone else's stuff, right? I think that's a good example how really messed up these people are.

Two great lines from hoarder episodes stay with me, and they also highlight the madness:

"I'll find a way to cut the mold off."

And my favorite (courtesy of the batshit crazy "Jahn" to the Got Junk guys): "HONOR the STUFF!"
  • 0

#2271

ScrubMonkey

ScrubMonkey

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 2:24 PM

I thought Lorena seemed like an obvious PTSD victim due to what happened to her. I actually sympathized with Tanya the first time around, when Lorena was sarcastic to her, and wouldn't let Tanya even go wash her dishes. Which made me have two reactions: one was that editing can make things look a certain way, so I say all this with a grain of salt in my mind, though I really disliked Tanya this time and the second reaction, that the reason some of these hoarders might be nasty to some of their family or friends could be that they are sick of being patronized, judged harshly to their faces, or other manipulations going on behind the scenes.

Tanya seemed to be very sugary sweet to Lorena's face, or in front of others, what with offering to wash dishes or clean a toilet or bringing her a 'Scooby snack.' But in fact it was all about collecting evidence to take Lorena's daughter away for good. In that light she just started to seem evil, to me.

Two words for Lorena (regarding Tanya): Restraining order.
  • 0

#2272

Major Misfit

Major Misfit

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 3:06 PM

But, yeah, that's right. She doesn't have a twin sister. She doesn't even have a SISTER.

The amount of crazy on display is just staggering.

What was so awesome about the twin sister story was the Shelley told the lie so effortlessly and sincerely to the organizer. Not only that, but she had to know her husband was within earshot of that conversation. So, when he inevitably overhears her, then confronts her with the lie, she doubles down on it by claiming that not only does she have a sister, but the husband slept with her! What was she expecting the husband to say, "Oh, Shelley, don't bring that up on camera?" like he'd suddenly remember the affair he didn't have with the person who doesn't exist?

I couldn't figure out whether she was a delusional shrew or a narcissistic nutcase. Then I realized she could be both.
  • 0

#2273

ScrubMonkey

ScrubMonkey

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 3:08 PM

That was so bizarre. I am not sure she knows the difference between reality and fantasy any more. If she does, that was no proof of it.

Imagine what she claims when he's not around. I'd be worried if I were Gene. She could fall and claim he beat her, or any number of things. Heaven help him if he tries to divorce her.

What was she expecting the husband to say, "Oh, Shelley, don't bring that up on camera?"


(Not only that,) I think she actually told him not to bring it up, later, in the bathroom. Why she thinks she's still in charge of anything, is beyond me.
  • 0

#2274

aliyameadow

aliyameadow

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 4:41 PM

I've been reading the posts and I think I'm lost. Who had the fake twin sister? Is this from a new show or a repeat? It sounds like you guys are talking about the family that a son who was damaged years ago and things went downhill from there. I recall a therapist with a pen and some stupid animal purses. The husband was about fed up with it all and was one step from divorce. The wife was a bit of a bitch. Is this the person? Did I some how miss that she said she had a sister and that same sister didn't exist? I mean really, where do you go from there?
  • 0

#2275

AngelaHunter44

AngelaHunter44

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 5:05 PM

I recall a therapist with a pen and some stupid animal purses.


Yes, that's Shelly, with the imaginary sister who she was saving a ton of purses for since her imaginary sister didn't have room for all the purses at her house. She was being revisited and had re-hoarded the whole house again, but it wasn't a problem since there was room for two recliners and the requisite big screen TV in the living room. Behind the recliners there is again a Mt.Everest of crap piled up nearly to the ceiling.

The wife was a bit of a bitch.


You have a talent for understatement.;)
  • 0

#2276

NoPity1066

NoPity1066

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 5:47 PM

Wow. Watching a repeat on the H:BA marathon, and holy shit (!) did Susie of the "Oh My Gosh" episode royally screw her kids !

She emptied their trust funds ?! How in the hell did she do that ? I've set up and administered trusts for minor children in my family, and if they're established properly you just can't do that. They must have had a lousy lawyer, a lousy court administrator, and some seriously questionable morals.

This epi was a real blood boiler for me. She was just so...casual about the whole thing, like "Yeah, I spent all of their money on stupid shit and oh, woe is me."

It makes me think that I almost don't mind a solo hoarder, but when they rob their own children, both literally and fuguratively, through their hoarding, it makes me want to throttle them. Boo hiss.
  • 0

#2277

JudyObscure

JudyObscure

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 6:20 PM

Aliyameadow, they had a "Where are they now?" episode
at 8 o'clock Sunday night, just before the regular new episode. I almost missed it myself.

I sometimes find Dr. Beaton a little hard to take so I was happy to see the new dark haired doctor. She reminded me of pre Weight watchers Marie Osmond.

I also liked Carol's big, tail flagging dog. The hoarder's dogs always seem so pleased to be showing the camera people around. I imagine them thinking, "Now under here is where I keep all my left over floor meat," and, "Back under that stack of clothes lasagna is a sailcat, but I didn't do it, I swear."
  • 0

#2278

RudyRayMoore

RudyRayMoore

    Fanatic

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 7:17 PM

What was so awesome about the twin sister story was the Shelley told the lie so effortlessly and sincerely to the organizer.

I know! And when her husband contradicted her she gave him a look that would curdle milk. "Well, you slept with her!" BWAAAH!

The vast amount of amusement I have gotten from "Do you want to call your sister?" could fill the Grand Canyon.

Green, I am still reduced to giggles every time I think about that. But as funny as it is, her complete obliviousness to the feelings of her husband and sons still depressed me. I wish they could have made her move out, but I know she would never leave her priceless Toad Purse.

For me, the Mary episode was one of the most horrific I've seen. She's a vicious, mean-spirited hag who bore a frightening resemblance to a senior Cruella DeVille.

It drove me crazy to see everyone trying to be nice to that nasty old crone. "Are you a computer expert?" No, bitch, I'm someone who knows that a hard drive from 1992 that's rotted away from rat urine and dog poop is completely unsalvageable. Her poor sister Penny...I'm sure the situation now in that house in Florida could come out of "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane?"
  • 0

#2279

johnny larue

johnny larue

    Channel Surfer

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 8:24 PM

Shelly, with the imaginary sister who she was saving a ton of purses for since her imaginary sister didn't have room for all the purses at her house.


In Shelly's defense, imaginary houses are notorious for lacking closet space.
  • 1

#2280

Rhettwoods

Rhettwoods

    Couch Potato

Posted Mar 12, 2012 @ 8:36 PM

I looked at the description on my Dish T.V. and it was a completely different episode! Since my DVR is only set to record "new" episodes, this did not get recorded, and while the real "new" episode is being repeated several times this week, the one with the follow-ups is not. Waaahhh. I hope I can get to see it sometime. I'll look for the name "Shelly" in the descriptions and hope that it is the episode you all are talking about.
  • 0