98 replies to this topic

[TWoP Roxy]

From zap2it.com:

Grief and pressure mount for the Adamas and Graystones; Joseph confronts Daniel; Amanda makes a shocking confession.

[mustbekarma]

Wow. Amanda's confession was shocking. I get she was grieving and in shock, but was that ever not a bright decision. I felt so badly for her.

Zoe trapped in the Cylon shell was actually well done. It was just so creepy watching the shots switch back and forth from Zoe's perception to others. I wonder if all Cylons were created the way Zoe was, having a consciousness copied so thoroughly and completely it actually had its own sentience=people screaming inside metal coffins. I can guess why the Cylons eventually went cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs.

Edited by mustbekarma, Jan 29, 2010 @ 10:07 PM.

[morrigan2575]

After BSG I wasn't sure that I'd want to watch Caprica but I rather liked this episode. I'm kind of fascinated by how they're going to tie it all together.

[Wrenchwind]

Well gosh, Amanda, that wasn't very well timed at all. A terrific cliffhanger!

Was it just me, or was the camerawork more BSG-like this episode?

[Sly Librarian]

It's nice to see that even as a teenager, Bill Adama is a passive-aggressive, manipulative jerk to his family.

[Edgeoforever]

I wonder if all Cylons were created the way Zoe was, having a consciousness copied so thoroughly and completely it actually had its own sentience=people screaming inside metal coffins. I can guess why the Cylons eventually went cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs.

I am pretty sure this will not be the case. But one to control them all would be enough...
Polly Walker's character suspects Zoe's avatar exists somewhere and is trying to connect with it through Lacey.

[chancellorjake]

Very surprising ending. I was nearly screaming at Amanda to not say what she said.
Love the hug between Zoe-bot and Lacy. I thought for a second that she might accidentally snap Lacy in half, not realizing how strong she is.

Also, hate, hate, hate the opening credits. They're trying to be grand and soapy, in an 80's way, but not succeeding.

It's nice to see that even as a teenager, Bill Adama is a passive-aggressive, manipulative jerk to his family.

That kid has been studying EJO's acting style. He really had quite a few Admiral moments, tonight.

[Nightmare Logic]

Grief makes you do the wacky....

Willie was a manipulative little boy....me likey.

I like Zoe-bot and Lacy. Then again I like Lacy. There is something Boomereque about her.

I really do like Sister Clarice. Something tells me she's gonna be the villain of the story and a very compelling villain at that. (I think I have a crush)

Edited by Nightmare Logic, Jan 29, 2010 @ 10:22 PM.

[shapeshifter]

Sister Clarice's husband hitting on Lacey is uber-creepy.

So glad to have a show that doesn't make me cringe over the writing.

[Jer2002]

Sister Clarice and her marriage on speed have me intrigued.

[LunaIndigo]

So what was the point of Sister Clarice asking Lacy over for lunch? Is the whole "group" family for the "cause"? I thought she was going to go there for a STO meeting but instead it was Caprican version of Big Love. Hmm...I ponder this...

I loved the switching back in forth from the Cylon to Zoe A's POV. I felt bad for her when she was getting man handled by the lab guys. She really is like a new born giraffe. All wobbly and unsure of everything in this new world.

Someone please get Amanda some grief counceling.

[Nikki125]

Well, this ep moved at a snail's pace, just like the pilot, but I liked it. I loved the comedic touches of Zoebot breaking the bed when she sat down and the scene with Daniel pretending to be a star Pyramid player and Serge cheering him on by rote. I am also loving the look of the show, especially the costumes used during the Memorial. The costume designer deserves an Emmy.

Very surprising ending. I was nearly screaming at Amanda to not say what she said.

I really wanted to smack her. I know she's grieving and confused, but why say those things in public only a month after her death? She is just finding out about Zoe's involvement with STO and Ben. Why not try to find out more about Zoe's life before coming to the conclusion that she is a terrorist?

Also, hate, hate, hate the opening credits. They're trying to be grand and soapy, in an 80's way, but not succeeding.

I don't know, I think I kinda liked it. Yes, they are hammering away that this is a soap opera and are really trying to distant themselves from BSG style-wise and they are succeeding. Or maybe I am just swayed by Bear McCreary's awesome theme music.

Edited by Nikki125, Jan 29, 2010 @ 10:59 PM.

[AliceLee]

I really liked it. Very intrigued to see where it all goes. Sister Clarice is a villain all right. I don't trust that woman for a moment. Oh yeah, she wants access to Zoe's work. She knows something.

Lacy is Boomeresque. I LIKE THAT. She is, isn't she? She's got unwitting tragedy written all over her. Lost, lacking confidence. Thinking she compares unfavorably to others. Unwitting aid to future genocide? Perhaps. Boomer before Boomer. Whatever the cause, Zoe A has monster written all over her. She's a vengeful murderess in the making. It made me sad to see Amanda publicly declare the real Zoe a terrorist. She wasn't. She was so childish in her beliefs that avatar Zoe would change the worlds for the better, yet genocide is her legacy to the worlds. Zoe's "child" will bring death without her mother's guidance. Amanda's daughter wasn't a terrorist. Her "granddaughter" is.

Willie, Willie, Willie. You little bratling. Uncle Sam is leading you down the garden path. Did he say he was flirting with a guy when he and Joseph were young? Guess the gender equality in the society is matched by sexual orientation equality. Cool. The Adamas are more messed up than the Graystones. Glad to see that Joseph is concerned about Tamara avatar. She may not really be his daughter, but she is all alone in the dark. That's pretty terrible when you think about it. Maybe Tamara will be the cylon who takes the first shot, or inspires Zoe A to do so.

It's all so filled with promise. I love this show.

[Arminius]

I love the credits.

How is it Zoe and Lacey went to the same high school? The Greystones are the richest people on the planet and Lacey lives in what looks like at best a lower middle class neighborhood.

[swansong]

I really wanted to smack her. I know she's grieving and confused, but why say those things in public only a month after her death? She is just finding out about Zoe's involvement with STO and Ben. Why not try to find out more about Zoe's life before coming to the conclusion that she is a terrorist?

Yeah that seemed like guilt and overcompensation talking. She's definitely going to regret that decision.

[AliceLee]

Lacey must be a scholarship student.

[shapeshifter]

How is it Zoe and Lacey went to the same high school? The Greystones are the richest people on the planet and Lacey lives in what looks like at best a lower middle class neighborhood.

Yeah, I wondered about that. I thought maybe society has accomplished school integration. Or maybe they're segregated by planetary race and Lacy's family, though poor, is from the same planet as the Greystones.

Love the connection between Philomon and A-Zoey.

[renselaas]

The Academy seems to be modeled on a private, exclusive school. A poor, scholarship student Lacey would explain her infatuation with Zoe and her willingness to jump into STO when Zoe and Ben sought her out. She just wants to fit in, even if she has some reservations.

I love that Sister Clarice doesn't live at the Academy like a typical Headmistress. And, I love even more that she is part of a group marriage. The dynamics of it confuse me, though. Is it communal and everyone has an equal voice? She didn't seem to be in charge of the house either. It all felt very cult-ish to me. Is she trying to bring Lacey in as another wife so that she has instant access to her?

[EastCoastress]

2 for 2, Caprica. Keep it up. I need a something until Lost consumes me, until True Blood and Dexter return. Thank you.

Again, the Cylon-teenesque origin proves pivotal...weighty....logical. The dynamic is staggering. Love the build up (if a bit obvious- a hair more and I'd complain).

Polly Walker. Not creepy. Not at all.

Mrs. Greystone-better. Nice touch with the "godS forbid" (or somesuch).

I would prefer wee Adama to be younger but understand the dramatic edge provided with older actor. Cannot get over the Bill Adama nuances/genetics.

Love the shooting/scenes

A lot yet little happened in that hour. Felt like 5 minutes. Like a good BSG epi. Left me wanting more. Very promising.

And my GODS I love hearing Bear McCreary again. I had just listened to his Passacaglia earlier.

[shapeshifter]

Rewatching. Am I reading too much into this, or when Lacy hugs Robo-Zoey, and the camera backs out, and we see Robo-Zoey's right arm come around to hug back, is this possible because of what Philomon was teaching her right before the heartless techie guy started manhandling her?

[renselaas]

I got a VERY weird vibe from Natalie Stark. Yes, I know that they're all weird to a certain extent, but I kept thinking "she knows something about STO" over and over and over. My second viewing just confirmed that feeling.

[May 29 1453]

The 'shell' perspective with Zoe worked about as well as anything I could have expected.

The small bits of humor were much-needed and very well written.

Polly Walker has a character she's going to run with in an awesome way, plus I loved Sister Clarice's declared fondness for younger men!

The Tauron mafia thing is lazy writing, but overall, the acting is good, and the writing is good.

This is show is going to be good...and I haven't watched a darn thing since The Wire went off the air!


renselaas: Clarice wears the pants in the group marriage, I thought the line by the other husband and wife saying..."we all know hard you work" (or something like that) was the key line. As of now, however, her control isn't very overt, at least not yet.

Edited by May 29 1453, Jan 30, 2010 @ 12:30 AM.

[benteen]

Above Average.

It took me a little while to get into it but it got stronger as it went along, particularly in the second half.

-First off, I absolutely loved the credit sequence. A great introduction into the world of Caprica.

-Speaking of Caprica, I love the look. From the futuristic design to the Pyramid games.

-Zoe A is a fascinating character and the constant switching from Zoe to the Cylon works. It is something when you realize that she is the beginning of the end for humanity.

-Nice to see Scott "Jason Street" Porter but God, he's a real creep on this show.

-Sam Adama's line to Bill (I'm calling him Bill) about running away, didn't the future Admiral Adama once use that on BSG?

-I was spoiled on the ending but it still very effective. Amanda Graystone really needs to think before she does stuff like that.

I think this series works. It juggles a lot of different themes and genres and does it well.

[ReflexOne]

You know, Zoe-bot fulfilled one of the darker fantasies I've ever had when stuck in a chair and confronted with a dentist's drill coming at my face.

Also, does anyone else think that the lab guy who's "feminizing" the Cylon is Zoe-bot's first crush? I did find the whole Zoe-bot/Lacey "ZOMG, do I look MALE?" conversation giggle-inducing. But I was probably still set off by the breaking bed. I mean, GEEZ, Zoe, you're skulking about the house trying to avoid the parents knowing you're doing it. You can wipe the entry records to let Lacey in, you can probably even wipe-or-misdirect Serge. But I'm not sure you'll be able to replace a bed frame on short notice. They might also notice gear-grease on the lovely bedspreads.

While I find Uncle Sam's "mob school" less than enthralling (except I kinda feel like the actor actually has great rapport with the Young Adama actor, and really comes across as a caring uncle, so at least that's good), I did sort of do a cheer at the mention that when he and Yussif would go out he'd be hitting on the brother while Yussif would end up with the sister. But, then, I have a thing for tattoos.

I'm not sure if all of Sister Clarice's co-spouses are in on the operational side of the STO. It felt more to me like they were for the cause, but not informed of/aware of the level of Clarice's ... cell? Which, personally, I like better than if they were all essentially putting on a fake-show lunch for Lacey. As it was I felt that Clarice and her nearly-cradle-robbed co-husband were so anvilicious with their eye-communications that I'm surprised Lacey didn't walk away with a ton of bruises on her head instead of a leftovers plate.

Mrs. Greystone is obviously not one of those people who thinks before she acts. But then, I suppose we knew that from the second she slapped Zoe.

Did anyone else think that (from all the telegraphing) Yussif/Joseph is going to be using "my daughter was a terrorist" as a way of getting into see Tamara? Also ... shudder. What is essentially sensory deprivation for an extended period of time? Thinking her father had just up and left her for however-long, not even remembering how long that is exactly?

I'm starting to think that it might not be Zoe-bot that's the End of the Colonies. If Tamara is left in the virtual space under those circumstances for an extended period and ever gets put in a Cylon, she may well come out shooting and never look back.

[zelmia]

Did he say he was flirting with a guy when he and Joseph were young? Guess the gender equality in the society is matched by sexual orientation equality. Cool.

I definitely caught that too and thought simply "FINALLY!!"

Though I also thought, "Why is that child's father allowing him to run around unsupervised with his gangster uncle?" Did he know William was with the uncle?

I think overall I appreciate the technique of this show (camera work, lighting, editing, etc) more than the actual story, but I'm sticking with it for now. I agree about the POV stuff with Zoe and the way everyone else saw her was nicely handled.

There's something about Stoltz's Stoltzyness that takes me out of it. They should have gone with a more unknown, I think.
On the other hand we have the incomparable Polly Walker. (Is it just me or have we never heard of plural marriages in the BSG world before?) I adore her. Not really sure what's going on there with all the wives etc, but I also thought that she was trying to get Lacy to come to one of their meetings. Colour me surprised that it was something else entirely.

I can totally see the Boomer in Lacy as well.

Interesting cliffhanger. Not the smartest move a person ever made, grief-stricken or not. Did Stolz know about that stuff? Is that why he didn't want the wife to speak at the memorial? We saw the investigator talking to the wife, but did he ever question the husband/Stolz?

*Sorry, I don't know everyone's names yet.

[ReflexOne]

Zelmia:

Though I also thought, "Why is that child's father allowing him to run around unsupervised with his gangster uncle?" Did he know William was with the uncle?

I think the basic outline was that William was SUPPOSED to be in school (hence the INCREDIBLE Adama-stare and stern-talking-to). I DON'T think Joseph had figured out he was with the gangster uncle. Although I'm not sure if even all the ganster-hush will keep that little escapade from reaching Joseph.

Interesting cliffhanger. Not the smartest move a person ever made, grief-stricken or not. Did Stolz know about that stuff? Is that why he didn't want the wife to speak at the memorial? We saw the investigator talking to the wife, but did he ever question the husband/Stolz?

I don't think he knew about Zoe's STO connections. But he was already concerned she would somehow make a scene or do something socially inopportune for him.

I can already see how this is going to complicate his defense contracts, though. "Your daughter was linked to terrorists, so we're going to be taking our big defense project with the killer robots to someone whose political loyalty isn't so questionable, 'kay?"

[wrathfulgrape]

OK, so hear me out-
Seems like Zoe A is the creator, the one true god, the trinity, etc.
- she was decreed/inherited from/taught by Original Zoe to make the world recognize its sins.
- she was Real (Original), A Ghost (Avatar Zoe) and made flesh (Cylon)

If this is the case, she will eventually make man (Cylon man) in her own image after she learns of the evil of humanity. Her wrath (the Cylon War) will the The Great Flood. Makes me wonder how the final 5 fit in.

I can almost bet now that Lacy is Boomer. And I am sure we will meet others who later become the copied counterparts, like who would eventually be Boomer's body (opens up guest spots on the show too). Wouldn't it be a bang to see Grace Park pop up and shock the world like she did in season 1 of BSG?

**Edited to Add**
it would also make sense that Zoe A , who was brought up monotheistic by Original Zoe, would take all of the best parts of the Caprican monotheistic religion, without the corruption, and base her Cylon monotheistic religion on love---what the Original Zoe probably wanted most.

Edited by wrathfulgrape, Jan 30, 2010 @ 2:01 AM.

[TheGreaterFool]

This may sound like a nitpick, but it might actually be important -- did I miss how Lacey was able to get into Castle Greystone? Serge was told to take her off the welcome list, and we know he's pretty good about annoucing visitors. Zoe hackery? Or maybe Serge recognizes the robot as Zoe... or maybe it does have a crush on her... or maybe it will end up in the very large filing cabinet of Ron Moore plot holes...

Also, anyone else get the feeling the dog knows the robot is Zoe? He seemed very comfortable by her feet.

Edited by TheGreaterFool, Jan 30, 2010 @ 2:33 AM.

[dalek sec]

One nitpick I had during the episode was when the Robo-Zoe sat down on the bed and broke it, that's not exactly something you can fix with duct tape not to mention those cylon style footprints her "feet" must have left in the carpet. Also as TheGreaterFool just said but how did Lacey sneak into "Castle Greystone" without Serge either telling the parnets or calling the police? He seems like a smart little butler robot they have. I did giggle when Daniel made Serge do that little "And the crowd goes frakking wild" bit, like this wasn't the first time he was made to do it.

Edited by dalek sec, Jan 30, 2010 @ 6:15 AM.

[ShaniquaVan]

1. Mmmm ... hobo stew ... in three varieties!
2. The Colonial Anthem. "Sooooo saaaaay we allllllll..." Sing along everybody! At least we know the chorus.
3. "These are my wives..."
4. The crowd goes frakking wild, sir."