134 replies to this topic

[TWoP Roxy]

From zap2it.com:

Demetri and Mark disregard Wedeck's orders and pursue a woman claiming to have details of Demetri's fate; Zoey learns the meaning of her flashforward.

[NickNightmare]

We have to wait until March 2012 for new episodes?!?!

AHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Hightide]

Just when things are getting good again, we have to wait 4 months. Boo!

[AimingforYoko]

They don't let anyone become an FBI agent, right? I mean, there has to be some basic level of education to join the bureau, right? Because I've seen more intelligence shown from Barney Fife than Mark tonight. Unless this is some type of long con, this was some of the dumbest actions I've ever seen.
So Nadra was running some sort of Dark Mosaic or something? And D. Gibbons works with her?

[lilith1930]

Damn, Demetri's folks are some stone cold bitches. Pretty, smart successful woman like Zoe and they hate her so much they won't come to the wedding? I mean, I know she's kinda bossy, but as long as he's happy - I'll never understand parents who object to a spouse solely on skin color, which seems to be the factor here.

Knew it was a memorial service! They better figure out how to change this. If Mark's assy self does kills Demetri, I'm going to cut a bitch. I can't imagine how he'd get mad enough at Dem to do that, unless someone forces him by threatening something. Who could get mad at John Cho?

I'm not happy we have to wait til March either. But lots of nice cliffhangers to look forward to. Wonder if Simon engineered the kidnapping of Lloyd. And can't wait to see how Shoreh Aghdashloo knows D. Gibbons.

Edited by lilith1930, Dec 3, 2009 @ 9:08 PM.

[Empress1]

Wait, I totally didn’t know there weren’t going to be new episodes until March. Keep up, me.

There was a lot going on in this episode, not least the appearance of cute-as-shit Michael Ealy. Which makes me more upset that there are no new episodes until March, because again: dude is fine.

Oh my God, it WAS a funeral on the beach! (I am embarrassed to admit that I know that white is a color of mourning in Korean culture because of 30 Rock.) I’m glad that we know that Zoe told Demitri she didn’t actually see him there. I love both actors (and they make a crazy good-looking couple), so I really want them to make it, but it’s not looking so good. I also like the way race is at play here; it doesn’t matter to Zoe and Demitri, obviously, but it’s not unrealistic for Korean immigrants (right?) to want their son, especially if he’s their only child or only son, to marry a Korean woman.

And dude, Mark kills Demitri? On purpose? That is some serious shit. And it looks like he really does get angry at him in episodes to come.

I love Angry Courtney B. Vance. “That’s what happened to the TV.”

I kind of don't know what to make of this. I rarely rewatch, but I think I'll have to. I'm not quite clear on the Lloyd and son parts. (Lloyd and Olivia are totally going to do it.)

[pacejunkie]

We have to wait until March 2012 for new episodes?!?!

Not quite that long, only March 2010. ;)

Is it me or do the villains and mystery characters on this show all sound ridiculously melodramatic when they speak? It's beginning to irk.

Mark's an idiot, he needs to die. What was the point of that hostage situation? And the throwing of the table? And the running off to Hong Kong in general?

The memorial service reveal was fail because the audience figured it out weeks ago. Too obvious.

And talk about out of character. Suddenly Janis wants a baby more than anything and Olivia thinks Lloyd is kind of cool after all. Wha??

[mascan42]

Just by bringing up the Many-Worlds theory, they've opened up the possibility that what they saw in the flashforwards was not actually the future, but a glimpse into a parallel universe.

Unfortunately, after a THREE MONTH HIATUS, nobody will care.

[pacejunkie]

Unfortunately, after a THREE MONTH HIATUS, nobody will care.

I'm beginning to not care already.

[AimingforYoko]

Anybody notice James Frain at the news conference? I guess Dom was the only one allowed to keep his native accent.

but a glimpse into a parallel universe.

They better not. A better show already has that conceit.

[BooBear]

Did they just give us the answer as to what is going on here? Everyone flashed to an alternate universe on that date in April. Doesn't that explain why no one seems to know about the flash forward's events - in the flash forward?

[Zoriah]

Is Mark Benford a remedial FBI agent or something? Seriously that Hong Kong hostage fracas had to be the most moronic thing yet he's done on the show. I am finding it hard to find any redeeming qualities about this guy. He's whiny, reactionary and self-absorbed. And now we find out he's going to kill Demetri? Great, just great. I hope the writers aren't expecting us to root for and sympathize with this guy because I just can't do it the way he is written and acted right now. I actually want Olivia to cut him loose and see what happens with Lloyd who seems the more stable, more endearing guy and he's one of the 'bad' guys. Go figure. I liked the scene with Zoe and Demetri's mom. Knew it was a memorial, but I like how they made it a real character scene there.

[WordCynic]

Ugh, agreed that I don't even want to know what's up with Mark lately. He seems to get stupider as time goes on.

At the very least he got fired and no longer has the gun that will supposedly kill Demetri. But that doesn't appear to have been his motive during the utterly stupid hostage scene. Then again, there doesn't appear to have been a motive at all. I mean really. WHAT was that even ABOUT? Was it even supposed to make sense?

I'm loving the many worlds theory. But I also like physics. =)

Edited by WordCynic, Dec 3, 2009 @ 9:30 PM.

[shapeshifter]

So there's not much difference between the men Olivia winds up with in either universe.

So maybe the kids overheard Lloyd saying D. Gibbons caused the FF.

[Lila82]

Possible stupid question: are we supposed to be under the impression that Wedeck and Simon knew each other before their meeting? Something was just so off about their conversation and body language.

I don't know which scene was more fullfilling: Wedeck clipping Mark's wings or Janis! pulling one over Simon. Thing is, I don't hate either character, although I do find them deeply in need of hubris. Yet, it was so wonderful to see them reduced to the idiotic egomaniacs they really are.

Anybody notice James Frain at the news conference? I guess Dom was the only one allowed to keep his native accent.

OMG, YES! Can we keep him? Between him, Michael Ealy, and the Famous Jett Jackson, this show is chock full of hot guest stars.

Go figure. I liked the scene with Zoe and Demetri's mom. Knew it was a memorial, but I like how they made it a real character scene there.

Hands down, best scene in the entire episode. There was something so beautiful yet tragic about Demetri's mother's accepting this woman's love for her son and realizing it can never happen. Not a parent myself, but I know mine only want my happiness. It has to be agonizing to see that, close enough to touch, and know it's only a pipe dream. I cried, which seems to be a constant occurance. For all its sci-fi plotlines, this show does human moments really well. (Al's death, I'm looking at you).

I'm loving the many worlds theory. But I also like physics. =)

And I like "Lost" and the Dharma Initiative! Sorry, had to throw that out there. But I digress...I really liked the many world's theory too, but was too distracted in that scene by Olivia's sudden chumminess with Lloyd. I thought she was avoiding him like the plague, and now she's asking him loaded questions and prying into his life?

[avenger314]

I think this was the best episode since the pilot. More, more mystery, more mysterious things, less "How could you do that to me?" "But I haven't yet!"

Demetri needs to dismantle that gun. Remove the bullets, put it in a vise, disintegrate it in acid, hit it repeatedly with a sledgehammer, scatter the pieces across the country, etc. Make the gun Not Exist Anymore.

I wonder if either Mark or Demetri turns traitor somehow? Again, with the self-fulfilling prophecy type deal?

I thought it was a rather abrupt turn-around for Olivia to suddenly be gushy with Dr. Simcoe.

More male employees should address their male boss as 'cupcake,' especially when about to get reamed out.

I liked Demitri's "What's the play? What's the play?" Because Mark obviously had no clue whatsoever other than "Hulk Smash."

I don't know if it's the way Joseph Fiennes' lips naturally form, but it looks like he's always smirking. In almost every scene, it appears he's got a smart-alecy smirk going on. It was particularly prominent tonight and also last episode when he was questioning Wedeck about the text message.

I would so love for this to be a conversation between Demitri and Mark on the flight home.

M: I would never shoot you, Demetri.
D: I know, Mark. I wish there was a way we could make sure it never happens.
M: I never would.
D: You know... Al jumped off a building to make sure he didn't harm an innocent bystander inadvertently.
M:....
D: That was very brave of him.
M: It won't come to that.
D: I'm just saying, that's the bravest thing I've ever seen.
M: It... won't come to that.
D: You'd do that for me too, right?
M: It... won't come to that.
*awkward 14 hour flight*

[BooBear]

that scene by Olivia's sudden chumminess with Lloyd. I thought she was avoiding him like the plague, and now she's asking him loaded questions and prying into his life

I took it that she thought Lloyd was finally gone from her life from good (in transferring his son to a far away hospital) so she could let down her guard a bit and try to make up for the rudeness she had shown him earlier. But what is up with Lloyd's son? What exactly is still wrong with him? It has been 4 months.

I agree Mark is an unsympathetic, stupid, goober. I don't know why we are supposed to care about him.

[izabella]

So we don't really know that it was Mark who used Mark's gun to kill Demitri, just that it was his gun that was used, right?

I don't know wtf Mark thought he was doing in that restaurant, but it's exactly that sort of idiocy that ends in something like your partner getting killed. *glares at Mark*

What was with Deacon Gibbons and that rosary he kept playing with?

[Mars in Gemini]

Wow, that's three eps in a row that I actually liked.(Thanks, ABC?) But now with this little "break" coming up and given the commitment-phobic/sadistic nature of said network, I'm feeling more worried than pleased about the show's future.

[SunlessNick]

They don't let anyone become an FBI agent, right? I mean, there has to be some basic level of education to join the bureau, right? Because I've seen more intelligence shown from Barney Fife than Mark tonight. - AimingforYoko

That was one of the things I was aching to discuss when I asked if I could post a spoilered summary a couple of days ago. I mean, we've called Mark out on some dumb stuff before, but that was such a spectacular, unmitigated exercise in obvious and blatant stupidity that it makes me wonder how he could even say FBI.

On the plus side - beyond seeing Shohreh Aghdashloo again, I mean - was that they did make an effort to establish a plausible way of finding her in all of Hong Kong.

What was with Deacon Gibbons and that rosary he kept playing with? - izabella

The most interesting thing about the episode for me was that it now looks like Simon isn't a bad guy in the sense of creating the worldwide flashforwards.

In the Speculation thread, I hypothesised that the experiment Lloyd (and now I'd add Simon) were working on was hijacked by another cabal trying to create the worldwide visions as some sort of proof of God. Given the events here, I'd suggest that the Somalian towers - which Simon called "accelerators" - were part of that hijack.

Alias D Gibbons looks like he's coming from a religious place, given the rosary. Does that make him one of the hijackers? In that case, Nadra would be one too; does that square with her warning Demetri about his death? Or are they opposing the hijackers, but knowing something about them before the blackouts happened? Or is it that they were members of the hijackers, but are now turning against them? That would explain why Alias D Gibbons needs to hide.

So, I liked this episode. Lots of plot happening, the big mystery of the premise explored. Nice interaction between Janis and Bryce over what they want flashforwards to mean (though I still hope Janis changes her mind). Janis stumping Simon. Great atmosphere during Lloyd's press conference; together with an overdue reacknowledgment of the magnitude of the disaster. Not enough Nicole though (I'd like to see Janis and Nicole interact somehow). And Mark's stunt being portrayed to be exactly as harebrained, ludicrous and futile as we thought; and it getting his ass canned (if only that would mean we focus less on him and more on Demetri, Janis, and Vreede).

Edited by SunlessNick, Dec 3, 2009 @ 10:42 PM.

[Driad]

With the upcoming hiatus this seems like a good time to ask ...

Is this intended to be a one-season show? If it goes much past the end of April, what's left besides a lot of explanation? If it does get a second season, it will be interesting (we hope) to see what they do with the time.

[sweetpd7]

It was so sad when it was finally revealed that Zoe's FF was of Dmitry's funeral. I'm not sure why she wouldn't have called his mother or other relatives sooner. Shouldn't her friends have been in the FF, and if not, wouldn't she talk to her friends/ would be bridesmaids to see if they were at her presumed wedding, but not visible in the FF? One of the frustrating things about this show is the simple, easy to solve questions get neglected for months.

This is the first episode we've made any clear headway in for weeks. Zoe's FF. Janis making some investigation into a sperm bank. Mark's woman with voice of doom was found. D. Gibbons was found right there with her. Simcoe made his confession finally.

ITA with upthread stating that Mark's gun should be dismantled, broken and crushed into little pieces. But the one thing that keeps me sucked in, is I want to watch the ways characters try to alter fate and whether they succeed or get trapped into the same outcome. But 4 months break, I'm not sure any of this is going to bring me back to weekly watching. It will probably be like the pilot. First new episode: All sorts of action, followed by weeks of varying interest and tedium. sigh.

[Gweilo]

Episode 10 in Hong Kong -- where I live, so I was bursting out in laughter more than once:

How corny and fake "Hong Kong" was. A few real skyscraper shots, but the rest looked like a Charlie Chan movie filmed on a backlot.

The streets were fake, the clothing was fake, the police were fake, the whole damn thing was fake.

People walking around the streets wearing big flat coolie caps, and other traditional clothes, bicycles everywhere (you do see bikes in HK, but very few) and most absurdly, a F***ING RICKSHAW!! (There are a half dozen very old men who still have licences for rickshaws, they just pose for photographs near the Star Ferry, they never actually take anyone anywhere.) And a junk in the harbour -- there is one and only one junk like that in Hong Kong, and it is used only for tourist calendars and setting the scene in dumb movies (like this). They didn't even do this kind of cliched anachronistic crap in The Man with the Golden Gun (made in 1974, though they may have used the same junk). Basically it looked like the 1950s.

And I've just realised another thing that made it look very weird, there was no traffic. (Except the ludicrous bicycles and rickshaws and American left-hand-drive armoured cars for "police".) Any areas with the nightlife seen here would have a constant stream of Mercedes limos, red taxis and green minibuses. If it was a main street, double-decker buses. But none of those were seen.

I'm trying to like this show, but this is pretty pathetic.
It looks like they sent a crew to take scene-setting shots (or got a local company to do them) and didn't have any cast on location, saved a few bucks by using the costumes and sets left standing from Hope and Crosby's On the Road to Hong Kong.

Plotwise: The CIA calling the shots in Hong Kong?? As they said, this is part of China now. No way would the agent have had the pull to get Mark off the hook for his gunplay.

Was Mark just trying to get himself thown out of the FBI so he couldn't kill Demetri? Dumb, but what other motive?

As for gun A561984: well, FFS, now Demetri has it. Get to a machine shop and grind it to dust. Now.

I liked Simon a bit more, now it seems he isn't the Doctor Evil of the piece.
"A techie, chess playing, social misfit physicist. Well, that should narrow it down"

Edited by Gweilo, Dec 3, 2009 @ 11:24 PM.

[susanstarflower]

If I had realized the hiatus was going to be this long, I probably would not have stuck around for so long. I found Mark uttery absurd and repellent this episode, serious point-of-no-return repellent. He endangered Noh repeatedly.

I found Olivia's sudden apparent infatuation with Lloyd rather off-putting -- married woman, small child at home. As a single, suddenly widowed man, his response to her "friendliness" was less jarring (oh, and she "saved" his child) but she really had that come hither and make my dream come true vibe. But, if I were married to Mark, I'd be thrilled to find someone so mature, calm, intelligent, sane.

I was expecting this series to take off both because the preview anticipated but also because there's a lot to cover if we are following the series in some approximated "real time" running up to the FF predicted date.

I'm still annoyed at LAST week's pointless "searching for Keiko" -- pretty but pretty much pointless. Enough.

[Bussy]

Ethough Shoreh is electrifying, I had zero interest in the plotty stuff apart from her presence in it. However, all the character stuff had me squeeing. I came away from the episode not caring in the least about Simon or D. Gibbons or the FBI. I was too busy falling in love with Lloyd in the same way that I fell in love with Bryce last time. I want to hug him tightly. And now that Olivia has stopped freaking out about her FF, she and Lloyd are adorable and I can't wait for them to happen. And I have to admit that I squeed out loud when the scene changed to Bryce and Nicole. I love them both and ship them so hard (and was so so so excited about the promo with them!). I also loved Zoe's plotline; heartbreaking scene with Demetri's mother. Well done, show!

So now we know why Dylan's staying in Olivia's house! I love it.

And thank goodness for no Tracy this week.

That said, onto the stupid, which plagues this show. It was completely ridiculous for Lloyd to just be walking around the hospital without bodyguards like that. Everyone was incredibly stupid this week. The Hong Kong mission was stupid, but I was genuinely surprised at the reveal that Mark is the one who will kill him. Mark is an ass and I'm just over trying to like him. I theorized months ago that in his FF, he had been fired by the FBI, and he was drinking in his office because his life had fallen apart and he wasn't even supposed to be there. Given this week's plot developments (and the brewing Lloyd/Olivia), I see that happening.

[MizStaken]

What is it with the networks taking shows off for extended periods of time? First Glee now Flashforward, jeeze. I'm starting to take this personally.

I liked the episode, maybe mark thinks that by doing all this, he's gotten himself fired and can't possibly end up where he was in his flash forward.
I guess we'll see.

Don't understand Janis' burning need to have a kid now. At least we know she's not going to get knocked up the old fashioned way. Supergay indeed.

Poor Demitri, first you realize you're going to be killed now you find out that it's your partner that's going to do it to you.

And what's up with Olivia's 360 in regard to Lloyd? She avoided him like the plague for a while now, but suddenly, she's Olivia on the spot.

Anyway, hope I'm still interested in this show in 4 FREAKING MONTHS!!!

[Lynn44]

I've seen some really dumb moves, but Mark's actions in the restaurant take the cake. There was no reason for that, especially after the Lady (can't remember her name) said that what she was telling them might cause Dem's murder to happen.

I thought for sure Mark and Dem would be captured and Mark would be forced to shoot him.

Mark really, really needs to take a hike...

I love Angry Courtney B. Vance. “That’s what happened to the TV.”

I couldn't agree more, that was an awesome moment !!!

Well, now we know how Dylan ends up with Olivia and Charlie... won't Mark be surprised when he gets home !!!

I loved the scenes with Lloyd and Olivia... I would follow him anywhere, sigh....

I so thought Janis was going to ask Bryce to be the "Baby Daddy"... and then later, I totally thought Bryce was going to offer !

Wouldn't the big screen TV playing outside in Hong Kong be televised in Chinese ???

Oh, and "Cup Cake"... cracked me up !!

I am completely shocked we have to wait until March for the next episode, I had no idea that was coming.

Edited by Lynn44, Dec 3, 2009 @ 11:54 PM.

[Babiicakes]

I can't recall, were we ever shown any of Nhadra's FF? Something about the way she told D. Gibbons that Mark and Dem had been chasing him since he blew up the doll factory and how she couldn't protect him made me think that maybe she was making it up to throw them off their game.

[cadiai]

I'm convinced now that we aren't actually supposed to like Mark or sympathize with him at all. There's no way. After all of the shit that he's pulled? Uh uh, no way, especially not after this episode. Seriously, what was he expecting to happen in that restaurant? Grab Nadra with a gun, have one other gun on your side handled by a bewildered guy who has no idea what you're doing (to be fair, this feels kind of call back-ish to the pilot to me, in which Mark was going nuts and Demetri wasn't used to things like that) who no longer isn't too sure if he should be helping you (I guess, at the very least, Mark ensured that only he would get shit for this), and... then what? Stupid, stupid, stupid impulsive man. Oh lord. I was actually expecting him to be let off with a slap on the wrist after the tone the show has taken thus far, so thank god he actually got fired, if on that level alone. Rebelliousness is all well and fun and good and can make for a sympathetic character, but not when you actually have an awesome boss.

For whatever reason, though, I do like the idea that it's actually him who's supposed to murder Demetri. (And for the record, avenger314 - that conversation made me crack up way too much. Kudos.)

I still can't believe that Simon actually went along with Lloyd for press conferencing (like I can't believe that Lloyd was able to walk around the hospital as freely as he was, if only for people being incredibly pissed at him). Didn't seem in-character for his ego, but I'll let that slide because he was a lot more mellowed out this episode and I'm starting to like him more as a result. Him working with the FBI branch is a development I like/am looking forward to.

As for Olivia, I took her sudden turn of intense niceness as a "thank god I can get this man out of my life now" attitude, so first off, like someone upthread said, she's making up for being an ass previously, and secondly, she's probably elated at this and it's showing in her helpfulness. The continued niceness would be for Dylan's sake, I assume (and this sort of scenario, if she takes him in, would explain his trust in her from the beginning pretty well, given proper development of course).

Long break, but at least this was a good point to leave it off at. Lots going on. Taking the last episode into account, though, it has incredibly strange pacing - felt like everything in this week's previouslies was everything that happened in the non-Bryce parts of the last episode. I'm honestly not sure what to make of that.

[Model Citizen]

BooBear, I'm with you. I thought some time ago, why doesn't somebody look up in their flashforward and wave and say "Hi Me-From-Six-Months-Ago" and proceed to give some sage advice about things to avoid, stocks to buy, etc.

With an alternate universe theory in play, there can't help but be a significant snow balling of changes. With nearly everybody knowing a snippet from the future it is bound to cause some to avoid the future. And even those who had no flashforward and think they are doomed will likely change their future by either becoming very careful and avoiding their death or becoming very foolhardy and bringing it on sooner than originally destined.