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#1801

unclewiggly

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 10:55 AM

Oh wow -- I didn't interpret it that way at all. Now I'm confused... and sad. :-(

#1802

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 11:30 AM

Knowing the next best thing to nothing about Chicago, I was surprised to note that the pilot script describes the firm as "mid-level." The firm's digs as they currently appear seem a heck of a lot flossier than "mid-level" to me. Though perhaps the firm's status changed along with the name, before shooting began.

It would have to be mid-level, at best. Top level firms typically have hundreds of attorneys, and more than two floors--in fact they usually have multiple locations around the globe.

Even if we are limiting this to firms which mainly do criminal litigation, a top firm would still likely be significantly larger than this one appears to be.

#1803

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 11:30 AM

I didn't get that last spoiler either, though I suppose it makes sense. Of course, it would add dramatic tension and could open up different things, like Alicia working for the firm as an independent lawyer (do law firms do that?), allowing her to pursue a relationship with Will if they decide to go that route (though I doubt they would, at least not this soon in the series), and maybe allowing her to deal with her own issues of moral ambiguity as she decides what sort of work she would like to pursue on her own. It could also fuel interesting story lines if Peter is released whether he pursues political office or puts in time as a lawyer again

#1804

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 11:34 AM

working for the firm as an independent lawyer (do law firms do that?)

Yes, such attorneys are termed "of counsel" - you're affiliated with the firm, more senior than an associate but not on a partnership track (can be for a whole variety of reasons).

Edited by Ranee, Mar 30, 2010 @ 11:36 AM.


#1805

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 1:12 PM

About the Spoilers Do not put much into Cary getting escorted out. That has become SOP for many employers since work place violence became so common place. I work for the Federal Government and the US Marshalls are the ones that escort us out. Personal belongings are sent on later.

Edited by WolverineGal, Mar 30, 2010 @ 1:13 PM.


#1806

leaping lucas

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 4:20 PM

Ranee
Thanks for the extra local colour and legal perspective. I LOVE getting that sort of context.

WolverineGal
Yes, I thought of that too. We have just had low level clerks escorted from the building, who have done nothing more than put the wet sugar spoon into the coffee.

Christabelle, unclewiggly
Unclewiggly, your summation was pretty much exactly what I took from the various scenes too. I saw others speculating on another board about A&C "both" losing their jobs, and those other perspectives, and wondered where they were getting them all from, as I believe I was reading exactly the same source material. But it seems to me upon rereading that they have taken those perspectives from exactly the same dialogue. For example: ALICIA to CARY: "I'm sorry we both didn't get the job". I took to mean, she was sorry that they couldn't have both been employed at SLG, not that neither of them were.

If anyone would like any more clarification, just PM me and I'll happily send all the clarification I have.

#1807

lizzie b

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 4:44 PM

ALICIA to CARY: "I'm sorry we both didn't get the job". I took to mean, she was sorry that they couldn't have both been employed at SLG, not that neither of them were.

leaping lucas I take it the exact same way as you do. Plus, why would Alicia be celebrating her "promotion" with Kalinda if she had lost her job.

#1808

unclewiggly

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 4:54 PM

leaping lucas & lizzie b, your heads are both where mine went. I mean -- it could make sense that way, right? Please?

Also, for the record, I've changed my mind about having an expanded forum for this show -- we NEED a separate spoiler thread!!

#1809

secretagentman

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 5:26 PM

Anyone know if tonight is a new eps.? The CBS site is useless.

#1810

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 5:31 PM

secretagentman, my listings say its a repeat of "Infamy".

FWIW, fancast has this spoilers post up here which implies Alicia is retained when Cary is fired.

leaping lucas, you're welcome, & thank you for all the spoiler info.

#1811

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 6:38 PM

BLACK BARS OF DOOM. I CANNAE RESIST.

CBS is to blame, of course, with this TOTALLY INHUMANE EXTENDED BREAK. I can't take it! I need new episodes! Or (decent) fanfic! Or I shall be reduced to spoiler-whoring it all over teh internets!

#1812

unclewiggly

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 6:51 PM

And worse than that, there's another 2-week hiatus after next week; no new shows 4/13 or 4/20. :-(((((

#1813

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 8:54 PM

Seriously, another two weeks after that? I thought all the networks were moving away from that type of programming seeing as it causes them to bleed viewers!

And I agree, we need dedicated threads.

#1814

disapprovingrbt

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 9:36 PM

Seriously, another two weeks after that? I thought all the networks were moving away from that type of programming seeing as it causes them to bleed viewers!


So. Frustrating. TV executives so obviously never watch TV. >:(

#1815

Maka

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 9:49 PM

BLACK BARS OF DOOM. I CANNAE RESIST.

I KNOW. It's so. Difficult. But I will remain spoiler free for this show! This is my vow!

*shakes fist at sky*

and

*evil black bars of inequity*

But, maybe all this (spoiler) talk will keep on boosting our page count, and we'll eventually get a whole forum. That'd be sweet.

I'm liking this rerun of the GW - I forgot how annoying that liberal (and overcompensating for it) judge is in this episode. Also, Will's seriousness when Alicia appears on TV with him is all kinds of sweet.

How many new episodes will run in a row once the show does return? Anyone know?

Oh, and I hated that "ReaganRulz" girl. Her mouth agape while she was on the stand was so distracting.

Edited by Maka, Mar 30, 2010 @ 9:52 PM.


#1816

disapprovingrbt

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 10:02 PM

Oh, and I hated that "ReaganRulz" girl. Her mouth agape while she was on the stand was so distracting.


Agreed. I thought it particularly illustrative of the kind of people who watch Roscoe/Glenn Beck and start those vicious rumours, though.

And Alicia's little side-eye at Kalinda still cracks me up.

#1817

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Posted Mar 30, 2010 @ 11:02 PM

Okay, I have one major complaint about this show.

Where I live, when the promo for the next episode ends, Two And A Half Men immediately starts. No bumper, no commercial.

How dare you make me watch a second of that stupid crap, Good Wife! How dare you!

#1818

mmb8446

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 3:24 AM

Alicia mentions her brother in this episode (he tried to get Alicia to do all the chores by saying that she was better at them than he was.) We've seen Peter's mother; it may be interesting to see how Alicia's family are dealing with her public scandal. Obviously they don't support her if they haven't even called but might be interested in how the kids are doing at some point...

#1819

leaping lucas

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 4:23 AM

Finally, a preview for 1.18 Doubt.

#1820

neevey

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 5:46 AM

leaping lucas:I saw others speculating on another board about A&C "both" losing their jobs, and those other perspectives, and wondered where they were getting them all from, as I believe I was reading exactly the same source material. But it seems to me upon rereading that they have taken those perspectives from exactly the same dialogue. For example: ALICIA to CARY: "I'm sorry we both didn't get the job". I took to mean, she was sorry that they couldn't have both been employed at SLG, not that neither of them were.

Thank you so much for this! I think i read someone's summary that Alicia and Carey both lost their jobs and Kalinda's "she just got promoted!" was sarcastic before i actually read the sides myself, and as a result, even when i read them, i just assumed that was the correct interpretation. Your suggestion makes so much more sense, but i don't know if it would ever have even occured to me!


Finally, a preview for 1.18 Doubt.


Yay! Am quite intrigued as to what's going on when Alicia is on the phone to Will with Grace overhearing...

For me, it's important to realise that Alicia might not stop herself from having something she wanted (i.e with Will) for Peter's sake - but i think she would for her children. If Grace and Zach express any kind of worry or unhappiness about her relationship with Will, that'll probably throw cold water over the whole thing (for a while at least), more so than Peter's jealousy ever could.

When Will asked her in the office whether it was a mistake because she's married, Alicia makes no reply. She doesn't do any of the whole "just because he cheated, doesn't mean i should, i'm a bad wife" drama that many of us expected. The only thing she seems to emphasize is that having children changes everything...in fact, i think that's a massive part of the reason why she's still making any kind of effort with Peter at all.

Edited by neevey, Mar 31, 2010 @ 5:47 AM.


#1821

munkie

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 7:19 AM

I always assumed that Peter and Alicia were the end game, thus the name "The Good Wife". But Noth is not listed as a regular, he is a guest star. Maybe they will not end up together and he will appear in various episodes, either in jail, if he loses, or as an attorney pitted against Alicia/Will in cases. Maybe the drama will come from how they deal with each other as a divorced couple, and how the kids deal with it etc.

Whichever one wins between Alicia and Cary (and I assume it will be Alicia or the title wouldn't be about the Good Wife) it would be interesting to see them pitted against each other in court if the loser ended up in a different law firm, even Stern's possibly, or as a DA. Then we could still keep all the characters and the drama would be ongoing. If Alicia ends up with Peter or Will too quickly, then the suspense is gone, and much of the drama goes with it.

#1822

neevey

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 7:37 AM

I always assumed that Peter and Alicia were the end game, thus the name "The Good Wife".

Well, i think Robert and Michelle King have said that the title was intended to be ironic. I previously felt the same way as you about it, but now i've come to see the point of the entire show as proving Alicia to be more than that archetypal image of "the good wife." It's a personal journey for Alicia which in many ways has nothing to do with who she ends up with.

Whichever one wins between Alicia and Cary (and I assume it will be Alicia or the title wouldn't be about the Good Wife) it would be interesting to see them pitted against each other in court if the loser ended up in a different law firm, even Stern's possibly, or as a DA. Then we could still keep all the characters and the drama would be ongoing. If Alicia ends up with Peter or Will too quickly, then the suspense is gone, and much of the drama goes with it.

Yeah, i would be sad to see Cary leave SLG, because i think this unexpected, slightly uneasy alliance that he and Alicia have developed has proven to be such good viewing. They seem to have almost an older sister-little brother kind of relationship that i've really enjoyed. However, if he had to leave the firm, even temporarily, i do think it would be great to see him involved in some capacity.

Also fully agree that a "softly softly" approach should be taken with Alicia's personal relationships. While waiting from week to week for something to happen can be agonizing, in the end, it will really elevate the quality and the realism of the series as a whole. At the same time, i appreciate the fact that, so far at least, we haven't been subjected to pointlessly drawn-out drama for drama's sake. Last week's kiss between Alicia and Will was a perfect example - we're all so used to being manipulated and misled by promos and often by the shows themselves, it makes a pleasant change to have things happen in a way that feels organic.

#1823

A Little Lulu

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 7:47 AM

*delurks* This show is absolutely killing me! I tend to go through obsession phases with shows or movies, but The Good Wife is taking me to a whole new level, haha. And y'all aren't helping! Though I love it here. There are so many discussions and well thought-out debates going on here! I, too, wish we had our own thread, mainly so those spoiler-y black bars of DOOM will stop tempting me. It's killing me! :-P

If Alicia ends up with Peter or Will too quickly, then the suspense is gone, and much of the drama goes with it.


I agree, munkie, but I also think there is a very fine line at this. I don't want them to draw things out too long, or it starts making fans (or at least me anyways) angry. I had to stop The Gilmore Girls for this very reason. They kept toying the Lorelai/Luke thing for so long, that I just got disgruntled and gave up the show. So, yeah, it's a very gray area and a miniscule line, but I have faith in the writers!

For me, it's important to realise that Alicia might not stop herself from having something she wanted (i.e with Will) for Peter's sake - but i think she would for her children. If Grace and Zach express any kind of worry or unhappiness about her relationship with Will, that'll probably throw cold water over the whole thing (for a while at least), more so than Peter's jealousy ever could.


Word! This is so true. I just hope that Alicia just doesn't start harboring resentment over her kids if they impede her path to Will. I'm doubt it will, but emotions are a very fickle thing.

But I just wanted to thank y'all for all the great reading and speculating! Is it April 6 yet?

#1824

Florrick

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 7:56 AM

Chris Noth is listed "recurring" because he asked to be in this capacity, they would be more than happy to have him exclusively but he was already in SatC2 so that was the only way to hire him. He was on screen more than Zach and Grace and after Alicia and with Will he is the more "heavy" caracter.
I agree on Alicia and Peter being the end game and I still believe this is the path the writers have chosen but they need to explore other possibilities before Alicia could be absolutely sure of her choice, because i really don't see her having an affair with Will while trying to reconcile with Peter, I understand this is a TV show but it's not sci-fi.

Maybe they will not end up together and he will appear in various episodes, either in jail, if he loses, or as an attorney pitted against Alicia/Will in cases.

He is not going to jail, in episode 22 he'll win his retrial, I suppose this spare us the conventional cliff-hanger and open the door for season two where he'll probably try to be a SA again with Childs and the Fed do their job to avoid it
I can see Peter in court with Will in case he is SA again. I suppose Peter would not miss the chance.

If Alicia ends up with Peter or Will too quickly, then the suspense is gone, and much of the drama goes with it.

Exactly, that's the reason why they have waited for Peter to be home again before throwning in the relationship with Will and why now they need to address it but I don't foreseen it be hanging there for too long at least in the terms of I want/I don't want, after a while any triangle gets cheesy.

Yeah, i would be sad to see Cary leave SLG, because i think this unexpected, slightly uneasy alliance that he and Alicia have developed has proven to be such good viewing. They seem to have almost an older sister-little brother kind of relationship that i've really enjoyed. However, if he had to leave the firm, even temporarily, i do think it would be great to see him involved in some capacity.


I believe we are going to see some nasty stuff between Alicia and Cary and even if I'm not a big fan of his I can really understand why he could be totally pissed by seeing Will so openly on Alicia's side and decided to be less fair.
I'll be sad too to see him leave but I don' think they'll keep both and Cary could end up in another lawfirm and being a guest star sometimes or maybe shift side and work for the state.

Edited by Florrick, Mar 31, 2010 @ 8:06 AM.


#1825

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 8:54 AM

About this episode- isn't Trial by jury as much of a fundamental right as Freedom of speech? So how could the judge just override the jury in such a way? It seems to me this would be grounds for an appeal.

Sigh...the main problem I have with this show is this: I really want to like Alicia, and to root for her to overcome all obstacles to happiness.

But- I can't while she remains married to Peter; he's such a lowlife that I think less of her for remaining with him.
Nor so I want her to end up alone and independent- where's the fun in that?
I'd like her to be with Will, but failing that, I'd be open to having her in a relationship with someone else.

#1826

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 9:12 AM

I agree on Alicia and Peter being the end game and I still believe this is the path the writers have chosen but they need to explore other possibilities before Alicia could be absolutely sure of her choice, because i really don't see her having an affair with Will while trying to reconcile with Peter


The end game? I know that's what a lot of people have speculated that that's the case, but I don't see it. Is that what anyone hopes for in a protagonist? That after having been betrayed and lied to, they find happiness with the one who hurt them? I can see that if you make Peter the protagonist you can hope for his redemption, that he is able to make amends and lead a good life, but I think the natural tendency is to hope that the victim can move on and become a stronger and happier person.

Also, is she trying to reconcile with Peter? She's rarely home, they never talk, she shows no interest in his legal proceedings. I think she's trying not to rock the boat, but that's where it ends.

#1827

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 10:04 AM

Where I live, when the promo for the next episode ends, Two And A Half Men immediately starts. No bumper, no commercial.


It's as if they're actively trying to drive you away from the show, Split Ends. I hate when the nets do stuff like that.

The only thing she seems to emphasize is that having children changes everything...in fact, i think that's a massive part of the reason why she's still making any kind of effort with Peter at all.


I don't think she's wrong to do that. The kids have had a huge shock (as has Alicia, of course), and I think Alicia feels that it's worth the effort to try to make things work for Peter for the kids' sake. However, I don't think Alicia would stick around solely for that reason. That's what makes the show interesting to me: There are so many layers.

I always assumed that Peter and Alicia were the end game, thus the name "The Good Wife". But Noth is not listed as a regular, he is a guest star.


I think Peter has been written well enough that we don't have to see him in every ep for him to be a major player in the show. And Noth's billing might be contractual more than anything else (i.e., he's a big enough star that a special billing was created for him). Heather Locklear started out as "special guest star" on MP and when she became a series regular, they kept that billing. And Edward Hermann always got a "special appearance" credit on GG even though there were seasons where he was in nearly every ep. In some ways, the credit means nothing.

#1828

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 10:04 AM

I was not aware of the Alicia/Peter endgame theory either. I do not pick that up at all from how each of the characters are being written. I do see them continuing to work on the marriage, but I think this is much more about Alicia's journey than it is about Alicia/Peter as a couple's journey.

I think she's trying not to rock the boat, but that's where it ends.

I agree. I think she has slowly been getting her equilibrium back and does not need any more conflict until she is steady on her feet again. I think that's what is so wonderful about how JM is playing Alicia. It is a beautifully layered performance.

#1829

Florrick

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 10:16 AM

The end game? I know that's what a lot of people have speculated that that's the case, but I don't see it. Is that what anyone hopes for in a protagonist? That after having been betrayed and lied to, they find happiness with the one who hurt them?



I'm not the writer so I cannot speculate on what lies in their head but that was the selling plot for The Good Wife and in most of the interviews this thing has not changed, how and how long and why are the real questions. I'm with Alicia and if she finds that Peter is still the one for her, where is the problem? Happiness is such a personal feeling that I don't want to judge her for doing something that maybe I would not do. We have more than one example for each choices, stay or leave.

I can see that if you make Peter the protagonist you can hope for his redemption, that he is able to make amends and lead a good life, but I think the natural tendency is to hope that the victim can move on and become a stronger and happier person.


Peter has always been a protagonist even if his screen time is less than Will or Kalinda, and as you say, I want to see him make everything he could to rebuild the trust - I don't know if this is going to be enough but at least I want to see him trying.

Also, is she trying to reconcile with Peter? She's rarely home, they never talk, she shows no interest in his legal proceedings. I think she's trying not to rock the boat, but that's where it ends.

I agree, she is doing something else but it's so openly on purpose, she had a very different approach when Peter was in jail. I hope that this fooling around with Will could lead her to make a decision and start to talk seriously with Peter.
She is already stronger and in her shoes I would surely go for a new better man, other that Will (and his snaky way of getting into her life again after wasting his chance back then) and Peter (and his being adultery probably without reasons) but this is a TV show and we need a couple of male caracters.

BTW, and I'm talking in the I-Love-Chris-Noth capacity, as long as they don't give me the divorce and custody battle and let him go with another woman and being a SA again and maybe set a parallel story to keep him on the show with a consistent role, I can sign right now not to be sad if Alicia will choose Will. Just spare me another dose of cheating.

I do see them continuing to work on the marriage, but I think this is much more about Alicia's journey than it is about Alicia/Peter as a couple's journey.


I agree, and in her journey you insert family (Peter, kids), work (Diane, Will), friendship (Will, Kalinda), enemies (Childs and now I think Cary). This scenarios pop-up in foreground episode after episodes, blending with Alicia story. This is more or less what we had until the recent 2/3 eps.

Edited by Florrick, Mar 31, 2010 @ 10:27 AM.


#1830

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Posted Mar 31, 2010 @ 10:31 AM

Reading back over the sides two things: first, Alicia saying Will doesn't feel the same way about her is one of the stupidest things I've read for this show. The hell girl? Did she hit her head while drunk? Second, Cary seems suspiciously sure that Alicia is sleeping with Will. Previously it's always been a rumor they've joked about. Now he's stating it as fact? Hmmm. I don't think it is fact (yet) but I wonder why he thinks it is now.

I don't really see an endgame or 'chosen' couple yet. It could go either way at this point. It could go both- they could have her separate from Peter, get together with Will for a while, then reconcile with Peter. While I would like to see her separate from Peter for at least a while, relationship with Will or no, beyond that at this point I really don't care. I love Alicia enough that I'd go with whatever she chose. I agree that it's more her journey than her journey with either man.

Also, is she trying to reconcile with Peter? She's rarely home, they never talk, she shows no interest in his legal proceedings. I think she's trying not to rock the boat, but that's where it ends.

I've wondered this myself. Where is this reconciling? Sticking by him for the kids, sure. Sticking by him to get her children's father through the retrial, sure. Sticking by him because she's not sure enough on her feet yet to want to rock the boat again, sure. Sticking by him because she still loves him and just doesn't know yet if she's still in love with him or can get there again, sure. Reconciling? I haven't seen much effort there. I think she wouldn't mind if it happened, if they could just magically go back to being happily married and in love but I don't think she's in the mindset to work at it yet. She's still so closed off to him and everything he's involved with. If anything she's keeping herself distanced by refusing to get involved in his retrial or campaign.

Edited by L star, Mar 31, 2010 @ 10:33 AM.