74 replies to this topic

[TudorQueen]

She's turned into such an important character that I thought it would be all right to start a thread for her...

I happen to love the actress, Fionnuala Flanagan, who I have always found both beautiful and talented, and when she showed up in Desmond's 'flashing-about' I thought, wow, is she really in this for just one sequence? Too bad, because she has such force and dignity in everything she does...

And then she showed up this season and so many roads lead to her - Desmond's time tripping, Daniel's mother, the one person Ben seems to answer to [besides Jacob, if Jacob is a person] and who knows what else? I know there are more questions than answers circling around Mrs Hawking [including whatever similarity or parallel exists between her and namesake Stephen Hawking] but this season I'm actually convinced that the answers will come more quickly than we are used to.

I still think she's Ellie, and moreover, think there are other connections yet to be revealed. Can't wait to see her and Daniel come face to face at some point, and more of her relationship with Ben, and oh, yes, what will happen when she meets up with Sayid - or Hurley, for that matter. And did she meet Locke during his time on the mainland as 'Jeremy Bentham'?

[copperdryad]

Oooo. The possibility of her crossing paths with Locke is interesting...

[TheOther]

I simply love this woman. I'm very glad they put a woman to be the guide to everything Ben, Des and the O6 have to do. Not to mention she was really badass in the past, if she is Ellie.

Maybe Dan is also Charles Widmore son, like some people say. She and Widmore seemed intimate.

Anyway, theories about her computer and the EVENT WINDOW DETERMINED.

Window = portal.

The island didn't move in space, only its portals.

. Each star probably represents a potential location of the island.
. Portals (windows) to the island in different time periods?
. They only have 70 hours to get back on the island through the same portal they first went in when Oceanic 815 crashed. Because I believe they need to get on the island in our current time or at least in the time they left.
. The Event Window refers to where the island is going to be in our time. After the 70 hours, it jumps to another place and to another time.
. One event caused the window or portal to open. Which event? I still didn't figure out.

Let's wait and see.

By the way, I loved that she does all her research in a church. She's a physicist mixing science with faith. Very interesting.

[Limbonaut]

I remember when Finola played Data's "mom" on ST:TNG. She was great. She was also creepy as hell in The Others.

[ponyrider]

I still think she's Ellie, and moreover, think there are other connections yet to be revealed.

I'm with you there, that leaves the question how she got off the Island and why wouldn't she want to return herself?

[TudorQueen]

I thought she rocked the episode tonight. I love the character more and more, the way the station links faith and science, the way she talks to 'Benjamin', the self-satisfied purr to her voice... I was fascinated by the little twitches in her facial expressions when Desmond was telling her about the message from 'Daniel - yer son!' and how he and everyone on the island needed her help... made me very curious about her relationship with Daniel.

[kieran555]

I found her to be really irritating, though in all fairness this may be because of an irrational dislike I have toward the actress, who has irritated me in the few other roles I have seen her in. She just seemed intolerably smug, and not in an amusing way like Ben.

That being said the role appears quite interesting and it was good to get some background to things, and like many I am fascinated by when she left the Island (assuming she is the self same Ellie) and why, how she ended up in possession of The Lamppost(what is it about Dharma that compels them to name these stations in such a manner?) and more. I loved that Desmond was having none of it and told her so, though I suspect he will not have much choice soon enough.

[maeish]

Her reaction to hearing news from Dan was interesting, to say the least. I'm not sure whether her ineffectual reaction was deliberate or was a minor boo boo from the actress but it appeared that she was displeased at hearing about Dan. Not to mention that this would possible have been the first time she's heard of him in 3 years. I get the feeling that their relationship might be somewhat strained. I'd love to learn more about the two though.

[TheOther]

I think that picture of the US-Army top secret mission of 1954 pretty much confirms she is Ellie. Though it also seemed meaningful to Jack.

Anyway, I also thought her reaction to Des mentioning Dan was curious. She wasn't surprised at all. She knows he is on the island, I guess. And maybe she is the responsible for sending him to the island or something else. I think she expected Des to come to talk to her.

I also thought it was interesting that she said the island is not done with Des. All the mysticism surrounding her is awesome. Whether she is good or bad, I like her and it seems the portals theory is right. :D

[ponyrider]

The Lamppost(what is it about Dharma that compels them to name these stations in such a manner?)

Ever read The Chronicles of Narnia? The Lamppost marks the Entrance to Narnia, how it ended up being there (it originates from London if I recall correctly) is explained in the first of the seven books written by C.S. Lewis. The one that wasn't turned into a movie, therefore that part of the history is missing in the movie version. The movies start at book two.
I though the name was very appropriate for the place that marks the entrance to the magical Island :-)

Edited by ponyrider, Feb 23, 2009 @ 9:17 AM.

[kieran555]

Good point ponyrider, though I wonder if all the others are as aptly named as this latest one.

I also thought it was interesting that she said the island is not done with Des. All the mysticism surrounding her is awesome.

Mysticism surrounds all characters connected with the Island it would seem, and quite right too. I look forward to her being right about the Island not being done with Desmond but also for her own assurance about things to be proven totally wrong. All these people, Ben, Hawking, Widmore, they all seem to believe they have deeper connections with the Island, or at least a greater understanding of what it is all about and I think it would be very amusing if they are being played just as much as they are playing with the current generation of Losties and their 'you must do this and that' confident sounding statements are misguided and they all have a collective breakdown in discovering they never knew the Island as well as they thought they did.

[Glass Ocean]

The fact that Daniel named his lab rat after his mother is hysterical and probably a harbinger of the dysfunctional secrets in their relationship, yet to be revealed. Hehe.

I've been trying to find a link to the Ellie mentioned above, but Lostpedia isn't coughing it up. Is this the blonde with the similarly rolled-up hairido? Some help, please.

If Eloise once lived on the Island, and then became an expert in time travel and, presumably, physics, Danny boy must have had quite a childhood with her. Even more so if she was bouncing around the time-space continuum on a regular basis, leaving him alone or with just a nanny to care for him. If she is the same as the 1950's era Islander, how did she get to leave and why? Doesn't the Island want her back too? Wasn't she hanging around withe a young Widmore when last we saw her?

[SunlessNick]

I still think she's Ellie, and moreover, think there are other connections yet to be revealed. - TudorQueen

Ellie seems plausible, and all the aircraft people's lives were wrapped round each other; I'm betting that others' are too. (Hell, we have Desmond meeting Libby and Sayid's torture mentor).

I've been trying to find a link to the Ellie mentioned above, but Lostpedia isn't coughing it up. - Glass Ocean

Ellie is indeed the 1950's other. And is thus the right age to be Eloise Hawking.

How she left is an interested question, and possibly related to Charles Widmore's leaving.

Oh, and I loved her telling Jack to pay attention.

Edited by SunlessNick, Feb 24, 2009 @ 1:37 AM.

[just watching]

I wonder is Eloise got involved with Charles Widmore before he left and Daniel is the long lost child Widmore never knew he had.

That way Daniel's connection to island is more profound that we gave him credit for, not to mention his connection to Desmond as he would literally be his brother in law (and Penny's biological brother).

Edited by just watching, Feb 28, 2009 @ 11:03 AM.

[seric26]

If nothing else, she's the Wise Witch in the Woods; so many stories have this character, the motherly elder who encourages and nurtures the odd sides of life. Here she's run an antique shop and minded a church hiding a bizarre lab. In Minority Report a similar character had the keys to genetic secrets. The archetype is usually fairly stationary, and must be visited; but we've already seen her on two continents, so hopefully more travel scenarios are possible.

[SloanRanger]

Wow, what a total cast-iron bitch she is... or is she? She indicated to Widmore that sending Daniel back to the Island was a greater 'sacrifice' than Widmore could understand... I never figured out how she felt about her son. I imagine he could be a challenge, but still, she sent him back knowing that it was at least possible that she, herself, would end up shooting him.

I want to think there's more to the character, more to her relationship with Daniel. And, btw, if her last name is Hawking and Daniel is Widmore's son, where does the 'Faraday' come from? An intermittent stepfather? A lie on Ellie's part?

[chailey]

I think that she sent Daniel back because one of his actions is necessary for the protection of the Island and thus, mankind. Hence, her sacrifice of him and her anger at Widmore. A poor relationship with a daughter is no comparison to being forced to send your son to what you know is certain death. Eloise, like many of the others, isn't a particularly warm person (perhaps that's a part of their humanity that they lose when they become Others?), but I think that she really loved Daniel. I think that she is a bit of a bitch, but she wasn't being cruel to him because of that--she forced herself to push him towards his ultimate fate. If so, she probably suffered greatly.

At least I hope so, because not only did she send him off to certain death, she caused him great emotional pain through his life.

[johngd1126]

Has it ever been explained why Ben called her "Penny Locke" in the episode where he visits the church and her back is to him and she is lighting candles?

[Mandy P]

JohnGD1126, I think Ben said "any luck?", and not "Penny Locke," but I could be wrong.

[polarbeorn]

I doubt Daniel would keep his stepfather's name, while his Mom went back to her own.

The simplest explanation is that her name was Eloise Faraday. Since she calls herself Mrs. Hawking. Mr. Hawking must have been some guy she married in the interim.

[Glass Ocean]

I want to know whose side she's on now. Does she work long-distance with Widmore or not? Are they enemies in present day?

There must be quite a network out there if both of them show up at Desmond's ER hospital almost simultaneously.

If the WHH theory is actually true, did she already know that she shot her grown son in 1977? Did Charles know that as well? How could she have raised him sooo single-mindedly if she knew what his fate would be? Where's destiny and where's free will in this scenario?

Mommy, WHY can't I play the piano? *aarrgghh*

[johngd1126]

Mandy, I could have heard wrong, but what would he be referring to? Why would he be asking HER if she had any luck? I'm going to listen again tonight...

[walrus17]

Mandy, I could have heard wrong, but what would he be referring to? Why would he be asking HER if she had any luck? I'm going to listen again tonight

I think Ben was asking Eloise if she had had any luck in finding where the island was going to be so she could help the O6 get back to where they once belonged.

[TheOther]

I think that she sent Daniel back because one of his actions is necessary for the protection of the Island and thus, mankind. Hence, her sacrifice of him and her anger at Widmore.

I think the same. It must have been very hard for her to make Dan become the man she would shoot and kill 30 years ago. She had to sacrifice him and it wasn't just for the whatever happened, happened idea. She is a mother, she could try to change it, but she is an Other. What they believe (Eloise seems to believe the future can't be changed) and why they behave this way is a very interesting mystery yet.

[maeish]

I've been just re-watching S5. How creepy or slightly disturbing must it have been for Eloise to watch her son slowly grow up into the man she first sees when she is 17 and then later shoots dead when she's 40?

That being said, I think Eloise must have held herself back emotionally from Dan because she knew what was going to happen and, somewhat selfishly, she was protecting herself emotionally by not getting attached to Dan. On the otherhand, she could have really showered him with more love seeing that she was going to shoot him. Who said you can't have a well-adjusted and loved genius?

[rockerelf]

Did they ever say what age Dan was when Hawking first read the journal? Right after he was born or years later, like maybe when she stopped him from playing the panio?

[maeish]

Did they ever say what age Dan was when Hawking first read the journal? Right after he was born or years later, like maybe when she stopped him from playing the panio?

I'm assuming Eloise first read the journal after she shot Dan and she was around 40 and still pregnant with him. Dan would have been around early 30s when he died?

Did they ever say what age Dan was when Hawking first read the journal? Right after he was born or years later, like maybe when she stopped him from playing the panio?

I'm assuming Eloise first read the journal after she shot Dan and she was around 40 and still pregnant with him. Dan would have been around early 30s when he died?

[pretorian]

That being said, I think Eloise must have held herself back emotionally from Dan because she knew what was going to happen and, somewhat selfishly, she was protecting herself emotionally by not getting attached to Dan. On the otherhand, she could have really showered him with more love seeing that she was going to shoot him. Who said you can't have a well-adjusted and loved genius?

Then again, it must have been weird to watch him grow into the old man she met back when she was 17 years old no matter how much she loved her baby by the time she was pregnant.

[Lgreer28]

If Eloise knew that she would end up killing Daniel in 1977, why didn't she try to change the situation? I'm not saying that it would have worked. I believe that sometimes you can change the past and sometimes you can't. But she could have tried to avoid her son's fate. And she didn't.

[pretorian]

If Eloise knew that she would end up killing Daniel in 1977, why didn't she try to change the situation? I'm not saying that it would have worked. I believe that sometimes you can change the past and sometimes you can't. But she could have tried to avoid her son's fate. And she didn't.

Problem is that Eloise not only was a mother but also an others's leader so her obligation was to protect both the island and Jacob, as tempting as it was to see her son grow old enough to marry and give her grandchildren the only thing she could do for him was to send Desmond and hope that Daniel would met Charlotte before he would die.

Funny thing is that Eloise also knew all along Charlotte was the woman Daniel was going to fall in love with.

Edited by pretorian, Jan 7, 2010 @ 1:51 PM.