344 replies to this topic

[PolkaDotty]

She's cute. A few years younger (and a few pounds heavier) than me, in 1962. Right now Sally and her brother are more or less "cameos" in the shows; although they vaguely have storylines, they don't have episodes of their own. Bobby is either the unluckest child or a future serial killer. Sally is facing an eating disorder or substance abuse issue in ten years.

Sally is taking it all in. The father she adores is fighting his own demons, let loose upon him by Archibald Whitman. Her mother goes through life in a fog. (But it looks like next week we will meet Gramps, and hopefully some questions will be answered.)

I'm keeping my eye on (and putting my money on) "Salamander."

[Guitargal]

Love the thread titie and count me in on the Sally train. Kids know

[ags]

When I see Sally on the screen, Girl Interrupted 1974 pops in my head.




PolkaDotty, this should be in the Mad Men and Women Category, you can post a message in the Mod Q&A and request that it be moved. Also, will you consider adding Bobby, something like "Sally Draper, Woman of Destiny and Buckethead Bobby." I know that doesn't flow, but you get my drift.

P.S. Although the more I read it it does kinda fit the dynamics of the Draper household.

Edited by ags, Sep 29, 2008 @ 5:31 PM.

[NeonJungle]

Wee-hoo! Sally's got her own thread! I heart Sally.

Buckethead Bobby

Too funny! I'm picturing Bobby wearing a bucket -- hole cut out of the bottom, head stuck through, so he can't lick his hot spots, a la "what you do with your dog with the Elizabethan collars don't work to curb hot spots."

[scoop94]

I can't remember who posted it or in what thread, but I always smile when I think about Sally growing up, changing her name to Samantha Jones to get out of her dad's shadow and opening her own PR firm in Manhattan, where she goes through numerous romantic adventures along with her pals Miranda, Charlotte and Carrie.

[Scaramanga]

I'm picturing Sally in college and getting all activist in the aftermath of the Kent State massacre.

Bobby - well, Bobby's special.

[PRgal]

How old is Bobby? He's going to narrowly miss the draft, right?

[DR76]

I think that by the time Bobby is old enough for the draft, the Vietnam War will be over.

[Billthebear]

I don't know just how old Bobby is...but the draft ended in 1973, so if he was born in 1955 or later, then he would miss it. Even if he were born in 1954 or 1953, his chances of being drafted would have been relatively slim, as they were inducting many fewer men in those last years of the Vietnam War than they were earlier.

[Scaramanga]

The actor who plays Bobby is seven, so if the character and actor match, he'd have been born around '55. He must be at least 6-7, since he was in school in 1960.

I think, with his love of robots and spacemen, Bobby will be one of the first Star Trek fans when it comes out in a few years. When he hits his late teens in the early 1970's, he'll be the right age for some of the first Star Trek conventions! Then he might move out to the West Coast and be in on the first wave of the silicon revolution.

[EleanorAquitain]

My significant other was born in '52 and so was a part of the draft (he was in college at the time and his number never came up). If Bobby were born in '55, which is a reasonable guess, he would probably be a part of the last year of the draft which was, IIRC, 1973. Of course, as a guy who comes from a family with wealth and connections, he could likely find ways to avoid serving.

[PRgal]

If Bobby is 7 and Sally is around 9 or 10, wouldn't this mean that Betty, who is 30, had Sally at 21? Did Betty graduate college? Normally, people graduate when they're 21, going on 22.

[Scaramanga]

Of course, as a guy who comes from a family with wealth and connections, he could likely find ways to avoid serving.

Yeah, my guess is that Don will make sure Bobby's firmly in college before he has a chance of getting drafted. He wants his kids to have everything he didn't have, and he won;t want to be reminded of his experiences in Korea.

[EleanorAquitain]

If Bobby is 7 and Sally is around 9 or 10, wouldn't this mean that Betty, who is 30, had Sally at 21? Did Betty graduate college? Normally, people graduate when they're 21, going on 22.

I would guess that Betty got married at 23, and maybe had Sally at 24, so maybe we would need to reassess their ages by a few years.

[PolkaDotty]

Yeah, my guess is that Don will make sure Bobby's firmly in college before he has a chance of getting drafted. He wants his kids to have everything he didn't have, and he won;t want to be reminded of his experiences in Korea.

Which is exactly why Bobby will tune in, turn on and drop out. He will be a flower child in San Francisco in 1967 and riot in Chicago at the Democrat Convention in 1968. Get a foot infection in Woodstock in 1969 (my sister-in-law did!) and stand by while his sister Sally burned her bra.

And then he'll enlist.

Like every good boomer child, he will do just what his parents want him NOT to do.

ETA: Ok, before anyone else says it, the ages don't match up. That's because when Bobby ran away, he switched his bus pass with an older kid, and assumed that kid's identity. I know it's a stretch, but such things do happen.

Edited by PolkaDotty, Oct 1, 2008 @ 5:37 PM.

[Mamalita]

I think Sally turned 6 last season, making her 8 now, and born in 1954. Bobby is probably supposed to be 1-2 years younger. Betty said that she was 28 in Season 1, but it was one of the earlier episodes, which could place her birthday later in the year. If Betty was born in 1931, graduated the year she turned 21, modeled approximately 12 months, married Don and gave birth within a year, the timeline could work. The math on Adam Whitman's age is far fuzzier.

[mjforty]

Yeah, my guess is that Don will make sure Bobby's firmly in college before he has a chance of getting drafted.

Student deferments were ended by Nixon in 1971 so attending college would not have made him ineligible.

[unclewiggly]

Yeah, my guess is that Don will make sure Bobby's firmly in college before he has a chance of getting drafted.

Given that it's Don Draper we're talking about, I wouldn't put it past him to put Bobby on a bus to Canada.

[Scaramanga]

Oh, interesting - didn't know that about the deferments.

[ags]

It will be interesting if Bobby insists on enlisting in the army, even though he doesn't have to, but he is being his father's son and wants to show that he is a brave, honorable and patriotic man like his father.

[Constantinople]

Just wondering why Bobby is the Child of Doom.

After the family picnic, I would have thought he was a a Wicked Pissah.

[Scaramanga]

LOL! My guess is that the "Doom" is because he always seems to be in trouble. Or it could be that he kind of looked like Dr. Doom with that metal bucket on his head. ;-)

[MaryWebGirl]

Regarding the Sally age discussion, I could have sworn I heard Betty say last season that she got pregnant during her engagement to Don. I've never heard that repeated anywhere, though, so maybe I'm making it up.

[lz1982]

Bobby would miss the draft. My father was born in '54 and missed it. Although the war was still going on, the draft had ended by '73.

[PolkaDotty]

Just wondering why Bobby is the Child of Doom.

That was me that named him that. Every time I see Bobby, I see doom in his future.

Yeah, he dodged a bear in the picnic episode, but that kid should not sign up for any magazine subscriptions, if you know what I mean.

Poor Bobby.

That was me that named him that.

That probably should have read, "That was I who named him that" but I actually like the palindromic effect.

Edited by PolkaDotty, Oct 2, 2008 @ 8:41 PM.

[Scaramanga]

Whenever I see the heading, it makes me think of, "Miniver Cheevy, child of scorn, grew lean while he assailed the seasons."

ETA - I also noticed this week that Carla's first thought was that it was Bobby rooting around in Don's desk.

Edited by Scaramanga, Oct 3, 2008 @ 1:59 PM.

[PolkaDotty]

ETA - I also noticed this week that Carla's first thought was that it was Bobby rooting around in Don's desk.

Good point. Of course, this is because Carla is always thinking of Bobby (and Sally): making sure they are fed, get to school on time, etc. Betty doesn't seem to care that much about her children. I think Don is more attuned to his children than Betty is. That's not necessarily a bad thing, because some men are more nurturing than women, but since Betty's the SAHM, she really ought to pay a little more attention to Sally's destiny and Bobby's [sorry to say this] impending Doom.

[anthreed]

Go ahead, Betty say it again! "THIS is why we can't have nice things!"

Just started watching this season, and my first thought on viewing this poor kid: that boy ain't right. Poor kid being blamed by his mother for everything. If he's not "Rescue Me"s Connor (R.I.P.) (unspoilered, sweartagawd!), then he'll have years and years of self-esteem therapy work ahead of him. Or remedial socialization sessions.

And Sally, take your pick: booze, pot, cocaine, ciggies, all before your first failed marriage. Thanks Mom and Dad! Really, her mother is just a box of chardonnay in the afternoon away from living in a Jacqueline Susan novel, so let's hope little Sally finds the feminist movement when she runs off to college, and not the Children of God.

"YOU!" Sally will eventually yell at her aging, bitter, brittle mother when her "stash" is discovered, "I learned it from YOU!"

[quaintirene]

I think Sally is going to be just fine. Don pats Bobby on the head, but he hugs Sally. I think she's the only person in his world that he feels pure uncomplicated love for, and she loves him right back. That father/daughter relationship will keep her level and sane. I've seen it over and over again, women who had great, loving relationships with their fathers do much better than women who don't. I think she'll grow up, get a job and get on with it.

Bobby, however, isn't likely to be quite so lucky. Neither of his parents seem to love him very much. Bobby will hit the 70s on a dead run. And then the 70s will hit him. Cocaine. Crystal Meth. Qiana shirts...

[Scaramanga]

I think Don adores Bobby, but maybe just hasn't figured out how to show it. It's easier for him with Sally because the whole man thing doesn't get in the way and he can just be casual with her.

The "Ask me anything" speech was palpably loving for me. And the man is so determined to not hurt Bobby like his father hurt him, that he's afraid to even administer reasonable punishment.

For a man in Don's context, one of the most important jobs of a father was to teach his son to be manly. So he can't cuddle and tickle Bobby the same was he does with Sally.