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4-12: "Till We Meet Again" 2008.09.08 (recap)


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#1

Last Time Lord

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 9:33 PM

First time creating an episode thread, so I hope I did it right.

The only thing I can think of to describe this episode is, "Oh, holy shit!"

That torture scene... I was not expecting something like that on this show.

Edited by Last Time Lord, Sep 8, 2008 @ 9:35 PM.


#2

publicdefender

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 9:44 PM

OH. MY. FUCKING. GOD.

THat episode was crazy intense! The juxtaposition of the conversation between Nancy and Esteban and the shootout was brilliant. That scene where she asks him if he loves her made me SO incredibly sad for Nancy. She finally steps up and does the right thing and in the end it turns to shit regardless...But should she have waited to see if Esteban came through? Could anyone with a conscience have waited? I still think what she did was right. ANd now what will he have done to her? I think this episode made me love her more than ever. She's just so lost. She's in quicksand now.

We now Guillermo is gone now, so he won't be getting killed...

YAY for Silas acting responsible for once. YAY for Quinn FINALLY possibly coming back.

I KNEW Doug was going to call INS on Maria...

The torture scene was so fucking intense. Poor Schlatter! That was really disturbing.

The finale is going to be CRAZY. More crazy than Season 2 I think.

Edited by publicdefender, Sep 8, 2008 @ 9:49 PM.


#3

MrsObvious

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 9:48 PM

Holy SHIT!!!!!
I feel all uneasy. Almost uneasy enough to not watch next week, although of course I will. Wow.

#4

mcsteamygirl

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 9:55 PM

Unbelievable episode. The shootout intermixed with the Nancy/Esteban scenes was fantastic. This is probably their best season.
It has been incredible. The torture was more than I could watch but I really can't wait to see what happens next week.

#5

FrozenBarbie

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 9:58 PM

And now what will he have done to her?


Something tells me we haven't seen the last of the lion. It's Chekov's rule, isn't it?

#6

publicdefender

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:04 PM

Agreed, 4 is the BEST season.

#7

Ahully

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:04 PM

Ugh. Bad, horrible scene. It's frightening to realize how close Esteban is to people who do that kind of thing, she's just a step away from that. And Esteban's face, as he went from smiling politician to snarling gangster in one fell swoop was frightening, too. Does he love her enough to save her? Cesar has no love for her, that's obvious. And now that he knows it's her...oh, dear god. I hope E really meant it when he said he does things he'd never do bc of her, it's the only way she or the kids can survive, if he's willing to turn his head.

An uplifting scene, tho, to see Silas be a grown up who loves his brother. Hope it's not foreshadowing, that he's going to have to step up and be a grown up permanently here shortly...

Thank goodness we only have a week to wait!

#8

mcsteamygirl

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:07 PM

Couldn't the lion also be a protector. I think he must be killed trying to save Nancy. It just fits with Nancy is always recovering from something in the next season.

Edited by mcsteamygirl, Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:08 PM.


#9

publicdefender

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:10 PM

He won't be able to off her. He'll try to stop it. And I think she's pregnant - just too much foreshadowing (no caffeine, mentrioning his kids, asking if he loved her, her wearing a loose dress...Throwing up on her prom date..._

#10

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:10 PM

The juxtaposition of the conversation between Nancy and Esteban and the shootout was brilliant.


That was so fucking awesome that I had to rewind it several times.

Now I have to go watch something light-hearted to get the image of that last scene out of my head.

Celia's scenes didn't really do much for me. The only thing good about it was the possibility that we could see Quinn again. Other than that, I found her part to be pretty useless.

Edited by VaVaVoom, Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:16 PM.


#11

Ahully

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:26 PM

Are we overlooking the importance of boats? They were mentioned again tonight. The lion could be a red herring; or just meant to represent Esteban. Or Nancy herself may be the red herring for Esteban...if he chooses to ignore the obvious guilty party and go after someone else. Still kind of wondering if Till is the 'inept lawman' that comes through in the end, a character that Westerns often have.

And yes, (almost) everything I ever knew about film I learned on Wikipedia:

FYI: Chekhov's gun; red herring; Western genre

#12

FrozenBarbie

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 10:52 PM

It's frightening to realize how close Esteban is to people who do that kind of thing


Isn't he the one calling the shots? Esteban seemed dangerous from the beginning, and I never thought for one minute that his affections for Nancy were genuine. Still waiting to be proved wrong on that one, though. I guess we'll find out. He'll either try to have her killed, or try to save her, even if it costs him. If it's the latter, then I'll believe he really does love her. But for now, I'm sticking with my gut feeling that he's been playing her like a cheap baja sexto.

Adios, Guillermo!!!

#13

publicdefender

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 11:16 PM

Nah, he's not playing her. He does love her, and that will be his downfall...And she loves him too, which is of course what makes it tragic. It would be WAY too simple if he were just playing her. THen the character of Esteban would be totally lacking in depth. He loves her very deeply, and that is in part what makes him less reprehensible...He seems himself in her as well; they are very similar in many ways. Also, in articles Demian Bichir said straight out that Nancy is the first woman Esteban has ever really been in love with.


Anyone notice that a new tunnel was being built already? Despite Nancy's best efforts to stop it, she may have closed on floodgate but more just keep coming...

#14

FrozenBarbie

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 11:37 PM

The shootout intermixed with the Nancy/Esteban scenes was fantastic.


I enjoyed it, too, although I couldn't help comparing it to the Godfather ending.

#15

Ahully

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Posted Sep 8, 2008 @ 11:44 PM

Anyone notice that a new tunnel was being built already? Despite Nancy's best efforts to stop it, she may have closed on floodgate but more just keep coming...

Yep, but at least she'd done what she could, her conscience is clear...sort of! It all just keeps coming back--it's no place for her to be, the point she's at now.

I'm a firm believer that Esteban loves her. His face, everything, he really does love her and they love each other. It's possible to love someone who's awful, and for someone awful to love. Sure, he may have been giving her a line about no more girls in the tunnel--or a technicality. After all, he was having another tunnel built anyway. And he's a guy who has the gall to stand up at a press conference w/the DEA and yap about prosecution. But I think he's been as honest as he can be with her, hiding the things he thinks would make her think less of him. I think if he doesn't have her killed, it's going to be a really sad parting scene.

I am scared sh*tless by the previews on Sho.com for next week. And the bones I spotted in the bowl on his coffee table next to the pics of his daughters in this week's ep. They were bones, am I right?!

#16

FrozenBarbie

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 12:06 AM

It's possible to love someone who's awful, and for someone awful to love


Of course it is. I don't know why I would doubt the motives of a lying, dangerous, corrupt politician. They need love, too. Maybe I'm just too cynical in my old age. But I'm clearly in the minority on this one, so I'll keep an open mind, and will jump on the love train, too...but with reservations (heh).

#17

RandaPrince

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 2:17 AM

Holy fucking shit! That was intense.

My comment to my husband after the ep: "Nancy's safe or there'd be no show ... Silas and Shane are probably safe too, because that would be darker than this show's ever gone. But then again, tonight was darker than it's ever been before now ... "

Yikes.

#18

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 4:51 AM

Holy fuck that was intense.

And funny.

Nancy is safe. Duh. Silas and Shane didn't get involved in much shit in this episode, so I don't think anything will happen with them. Same for Doug and Andy. Celia collapsed at her table, but she's off to find Other Daughter.

I won't even comment on the Nancy storyline, cause it was that good. Did the snuff film watching guard who gave Celia the coke get away with it? I couldn't tell.

Things that cracked me up.

Celia in the downtown rehab, and the reaction of the addicts when she left. Her reaction to finding out the name of Quinn's (that her name?) boyfriend. Celia apologizing to her ex (I've forgotten his name, which is sad cause he used to be a regular fixture). Andy and Mermex. The scene between Silas and Shane was pretty good too. Though I didn't like that Silas caved for the three hundred but whatever, he is the same guy growing pot in a cheese shop back room and who poked a hole in a condom to stop his girlfriend from breaking up with him to go to Princeton. I really don't like Sanjay, he's always bugged me, but the scene between him and Nancy was pretty funny if only for Nancy's reactions through it.

#19

publicdefender

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 5:48 AM

They were bones? OMG!

I don't think he will have the heart to kill her - he'll know WHY she did it (the girls) and as he said to her he's not dark-hearted (or at least not ENTIRELY so). I don't think he himself is the danger at this point. Think it's Cesar and his henchmen.

#20

future is green

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 6:36 AM

Amazing episode. Disgusting torture scene. I felt like I was watching "Hostel" for a minute. Although, from the beginning of the episode when they showed the sander in the opening scene, I KNEW someone was going to get effed up by one of those things. What an absolutely DISGUSTING way to torture someone.

And to whoever said they didn't like that Silas caved for the $300, I don't think he did. I think Shane swiped a sandwich from the shop after Silas went out front to help that customer. As he was walking out he even said, "Go back to school, Shane." And was anyone else wondering what kind of customer just pushes their way into the back room of a shop? Good thing Silas closed the door of the grow area right beforehand.

#21

SublimeChica

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 7:17 AM

Silas, what the hell? You seriously are running a grow house in which customers can just saunter right in the back room? Good lord, son...you've clearly learned everything from your mother.

This was a hard episode to watch! Nancy is so conflicted and so confused in her moral choices...she just doesn't see that she can't just be halfway into that world...it's like Guillermo said, there's no sign that says "weed only" over the tunnel. She voiced her displeasure about the girl smuggling to Esteban, although I don't think she gave him enough time to respond. It was very, very naive of her to think she'd be protected even if the feds never mentioned her name or involvement. Poor Nancy....she's just so lost this season.

#22

Danie84

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 8:07 AM

The only thing I can think of to describe this episode is, "Oh, holy shit!"

Before I could catch my bearings on everything that happened, the episode was over. I can't imagine how the season finale will play out, because all hell broke loose in this episode.

#23

Ahully

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 8:17 AM

I logged on this am for the sole purpose of saying I think Nancy is going to die or we're left to believe she has been killed. In some ways, I think Cesar is naive to think Esteban will back him and was 'naive' to have killed the DEA guy; I think E is going to want more proof that it's Nancy than from his second-in-command who's already voiced his displeasure and shoots Nancy hate looks with him standing right there.

Silas, what the hell? You seriously are running a grow house in which customers can just saunter right in the back room?

And 'hidden' with some kind of sheet with a weed leaf on it!

#24

publicdefender

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 8:22 AM

I logged on this am for the sole purpose of saying I think Nancy is going to die or we're left to believe she has been killed.


There are 2 more seasons. It's MLP's show. How could they kill of the star of the show and still have two more seasons? Besides, MLP has talked about the next two seaons, she's clearly in the m unless Nancy becomes a ghost...Nah, I think the question will be if someone else was killed, like one of her kids (which I don't think will ultimately happen).

#25

Ahully

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 8:28 AM

Publicdefender, I know you're right. But I'm paranoid! What about Celia, too, with her tying up all those loose ends; making amends w/Quinn...??

#26

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 8:37 AM

Maybe Estefan and Ceasar take Nancy for a boat ride but its Ceasar (the only one who knows that Nancy is the snitch) who is killed ala the Sopranos.

Estefan shows his love for Nancy and Nancy has to move away again because even Estefan can't protect her if someone else finds out.

#27

frostedglass

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 8:38 AM

Well we did see Till's partner and one of Guillermo's men die. Does the person who dies have to be a main character I wonder?

That said, OMG, that episode was intense. I was not on the Nancy's pregnant train until I saw her sipping on a Ginger Ale this episode.

Love Isabelle. Love love love her not caving to peer pressure and calling Shane on his puppet behavior. Poor Isabelle. Shane was her compadre through a lot of her turmoil, and now he's into a different kind of friend and experience.

I wonder if Andy showed signs of loving Maria if Doug would have called INS? Andy didn't seem to into her though.

Esteban and Nancy...Wow. Tragic but intense and beautiful and ugly...Wonderful TV!

#28

jennams

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 9:56 AM

My heart was paining watching the scene where they're going between Nancy and Esteban and what was happening at the store. Is it pathetic that actually cried? Twice?!

This season is brilliant.

#29

publicdefender

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 10:10 AM

My heart was paining watching the scene where they're going between Nancy and Esteban and what was happening at the store. Is it pathetic that actually cried? Twice?!


Not at all. my heart was BREAKING for her in that scene. She is so in love with him - and vice versa - and that must have been so hard after Judah, opening up to someone again. She usually avoids that. The look on her face made me tear up! So vulnerable and tentative and just asking to be loved. MLP has this amazing capacity to make Nancy so naive and, in some ways, innocent in spite of her flaws. She almost seemed like a teenage girl in that scene. And so crestfallen when he told her no more girls in the tunnel and she realized that now she may have put the nails in the coffin of their relationship.

I keep hoping their story will end less horribly than I am imagining, though I doubt it. I really believe she is pregnant.

#30

braggtastic

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Posted Sep 9, 2008 @ 11:03 AM

I am actually worried about Nancy, but then I think about how she seemed to be in a situation impossible to get out of in other finales.

I think Shane's voice has officially changed now. I didn't detect any cracking last night.

Isabelle needs to keep her hair just like it is - no black or purple. I swear she'll be skinny by next season if she keeps growing at this rate. I can't wait to see Celia with Quinn, or Celia's quest to find Quinn.