800 replies to this topic

[jackiecarr]

One of my favorite aspects of the show is the period-accurate clothing and accessories. From Rachel's proto- Jackie Kennedy pillbox hats to Joan's femme fatale satin sheaths (you know she has more than one), discuss Mad fashion here.
The way the guys look in suits makes me curse the invention of "business casual".


Blue Velvet vintage has quite a few Mad Men-type fashions and reproductions.
Jackie: The Clothes of Camelot has 300 color and b&w photos of her outfits throughout her tenure as first lady and slightly before and after. It'll be fun to see her influence on the show's fashions as we move into next season.

Edited by jackiecarr, Jun 23, 2008 @ 8:41 AM.

[GeoBQn]

I really want to get some Mad Men style dresses now. I could go as Rachel for Halloween. But if there's one thing I've learned about clothes shopping, it's never to go into a vintage clothes store with a specific goal because it could only end in heartbreak (especially for petite girls like me).

[Vetasimmons]

Yesterday's New York Times did a feature on the current street fashion of what is now being called Pencil Skirts,
which the writer commented was very sexy and noted were almost "hobble skirts" and worn with very high heels. He mentions how they are sometimes cut on the bias to cup the butt.

I remember just calling this style a "tight skirt" as opposed to a "full skirt." Most skirts in the 50's were either very full and gathered or pleated or very tight, with the cinched waist with a slit in the back so you could walk. Then in the '60's that more ladylike look that skimmed the body, the way Jackie Kennedy and Audrey Hepburn dressed.

[bbob]

Yesterday's New York Times did a feature on the current street fashion of what is now being called Pencil Skirts,
which the writer commented was very sexy and noted were almost "hobble skirts" and worn with very high heels. He mentions how they are sometimes cut on the bias to cup the butt.

I think on the right body type, these skirts are incredibly sexy and flattering.

Re: the "cupping", I remember an interview with Carl Reiner about Mary Tyler Moore's wardrobe on the Dick Van Dyke show. They were only allowed to have her in pants one scene per show, and they had to be really careful about the "cupping". Way too sexy for the CBS censor! (And if you watch those old shows, boy were they right!) Bring back the "cupping"!

[persiaa]

Ah, but don't forget the undergarments. I was a young teen in the early 60s and remember them well. The "best" was the Playtex living girdle-a true instrument of torture. Jon Hamm and John Slattery were on The View this morning, and Slattery remarked that the underwear looked constricting (paraphrasing). That said I love what Clinton Kelly refers to as the "sexy secretary" look-pencil skirt topped by a blouse or sweater.

[LilaFowler]

It struck me while watching the scene where Betty descends the stairs at the hotel at how full and '50s' her dress was- not the most up-to-date silhouette in 1962. I wonder if it was chosen specifically for this reason, or perhaps to contrast against her call girl friend's tight green sheath.

Edited by LilaFowler, Jul 29, 2008 @ 9:42 AM.

[A Little Edgy]

It struck me while watching the scene where Betty descends the stairs at the hotel at how full and '50s' her dress was- not the most up-to-date silhouette in 1962. I wonder if it was chosen specifically for this reason, or perhaps to contrast against her call girl friend's tight green sheath.

I think it might be meant not so much to show her as stylistically stuck in the '50s - as a former model, she would probably be fashion conscious - but rather to emphasize her girlishness and frivolity. I suspect that the day we see Betty in a slender, fitted sheath dress will be the day we know her transformation from innocent, if selfish, housefrau to jaded sex fiend is complete. :-)

Seriously, though, they need to get her out of those full skirts at least occasional. I don't think it was possible for a young, stylish suburban matron to exist, let alone be fashionable, in 1962 without a suit with a boxy jacket and straight skirt. Seriously, look at photographs from those days. Every other woman seems to be wearing a suit like that. I did notice that in one scene at home Betty was at least wearing a dress with a simple A-line (maybe pleated?) skirt. It wasn't a straight skirt, but at least it wasn't poofy with crinoline, and it was very period-accurate.

Edited by A Little Edgy, Jul 29, 2008 @ 12:22 PM.

[MaryWebGirl]

Maybe Betty needs her petticoat like some women can't leave the house without makeup. Wearing one was probably drummed into her by her mother and she'd feel incomplete without it, even though she knows it's going out of style.

[Jumpin]

jackiecarr, thanks for that shop link. I was able to score a wonderful LBD there.

[DDial]

It struck me while watching the scene where Betty descends the stairs at the hotel at how full and '50s' her dress was- not the most up-to-date silhouette in 1962. I wonder if it was chosen specifically for this reason, or perhaps to contrast against her call girl friend's tight green sheath.

That silhouette was still around in the early 60's...but Jackie was a huge influence....and she had just come onto the scene. As shown by the White House Tour. Her chic style took the country by storm. So I expect to see Betty being transformed from Dior to Cassini or even Chanel when the occasion fits. Jackie was wearing a Chanel suit when Kennedy was assinated.

[jackiecarr]

You're welcome Jumpin.
I loved Betty's Valentine dress, but I wonder would the party girl really be wearing that much jewelry? She was dripping with stones and looked rather gaudy unless they were going someplace really fancy. Does anyone remember if the companion was in white tie? I think he was. The woman in "Secret Diary of A Call Girl" says that it's important to be well-dressed but discreet.

Peggy's dressing better but still staying with her girlish style, that mustard satin blouse isn't something she would have worn last season.

Betty definitely looked very Grace Kelly/Hitchcock in the scene with the mechanic.

I noticed Joan's matching colorful shoes with that red? hot pink? dress in the office.

[DDial]

I noticed Joan's matching colorful shoes with that red? hot pink? dress in the office.

No I didn't notice the shoes...I was too fixated on her "torpedoes"...boy they're really featuring those specimens this season.

[xii]

The NYT mag has a short piece on Janie Bryant, MM's costume designer. I didn't realize she had worked on Deadwood, another show that did a really good job with period costumes.

Edited by xii, Jul 30, 2008 @ 11:22 AM.

[Tanker]

They're not as glamorous as the women's clothing, but I love the men's suits. Ah, the 60s! When Real Men wore Real Suits (and, for the most part, hats. They didn't fully disappear until the 70s, when Tom Landry and my father were the only men in America still wearing fedoras). I wish the skinny ties would come back into fashion, so my father's authentic 60s' tie bar would fit again.

And just why did we men stop wearing tuxes for a night on the town?

[AuntiePam]

Seriously, though, they need to get her out of those full skirts at least occasional. I don't think it was possible for a young, stylish suburban matron to exist, let alone be fashionable, in 1962 without a suit with a boxy jacket and straight skirt.

Yep. In my 8th grade graduation photo, I'm wearing a suit -- slim skirt, short jacket. If a 14-year-old Iowa girl can be stylin' in 1959, DDial is probably right that Betty's inner changes will be reflected in her clothes.

We were still wearing full-skirted dresses to prom though -- maybe party wear is slower to change. I wonder if Betty's dress was new, or an old favorite.

[Mamalita]

I've been watching my DVDs of The Dick Van Dyke Show recently to make fashion comparisons with Mad Men, since both shows feature a thirtysomething man with a "glamorous" Manhattan job (television writing vs. advertising) married to attractive women who left "showbiz" jobs (dancer vs. model) to marry and settle down in the suburbs. Just the episodes for 1961 and 1962 so I'm not too fashion forward. The women's suits were mostly straight skirted with a short jacket, and Laura always wore one when visiting Rob's office in the city. During the day, Laura was most often in a top and capri slacks, or a blouse and skirt, but not a dress with a petticoat like Betty wore last week. Maybe Millie the next door neighbor would be seen in that, but she was never as stylish as Laura.

The silhouette of the party clothes is a bit more varied, but Laura had quite a few cocktail dresses with straight skirts. Sally Rogers was in her 30s and was more likely to wear a full-skirted party dress than Laura, but even she had a number of straight-skirted dressy outfits. I'm sure there was an episode or two where Rob thought Laura's dress was too tight (usually when some guest star had a crush on her and Rob was jealous), but it was nothing approaching Joan's usual office wear. The steno pool must be accustomed to her work wardrobe, because I think that for the time, her look would have been considered highly inappropriate for an office. I don't think a lower-ranking woman could get away with it.

I read/heard somewhere (DVD commentary? Weiner interview?) that Peggy made her own clothing last season. Money isn't necessarily an excuse for her not to have a more professional wardrobe, since I'm sure McCalls and Butterick were making suit patterns back then. If her first season wardrobe is anything to go by she was probably only an average sewer so perhaps she didn't want to try something more elaborate. The mustard top is not something she would have worn last year, so I do think she cares about fashion on some level.

Edited by Mamalita, Aug 3, 2008 @ 7:33 PM.

[classicalangel]

Another bluevelvet vintage fan here! I just bought a beautiful dress from there, mostly inspired by Betty's look.

I love how the costume designers managed to reflect who these people are in their clothes. Even if you weren't a fan last season, that parallel scene that opened last week's episode with Joan and Peggy said so much, mostly with their outfit choices. Peggy's outfits to me look a bit more grown up this season. There weren't any of those sweaters she used to wear sometimes last season in last week's episode, and the mustard top was more fashion forward. The most noticeable part of her 'look' for me is the ponytail, which I'm sure is purposeful. If she did her hair a different way her outfits might not seem so dowdy.

[Botswana]

During the day, Laura was most often in a top and capri slacks, or a blouse and skirt, but not a dress with a petticoat like Betty wore last week. Maybe Millie the next door neighbor would be seen in that, but she was never as stylish as Laura.

I once heard Rob Reiner tell a story about visiting the set. His dad Carl created the show & played Alan Brady, star of the show they wrote for. Rob was about 13 & had a crush on MTM and her capri pants & could not resist the urge to smack her on the ass.

My mother said she used to wear pants (in the late 50's or early 60's) that were made of some sort of very tightly knit material that was kind of like what wet suits are made of. One of my dad's brothers smacked her on the ass as she was bending over to check something in the oven. My mum said she didn't feel a thing, but my uncle hurt his hand pretty bad & never tried that again.

[A Little Edgy]

I've been watching my DVDs of The Dick Van Dyke Show recently <snip> Just the episodes for 1961 and 1962 so I'm not too fashion forward. The women's suits were mostly straight skirted with a short jacket, and Laura always wore one when visiting Rob's office in the city.

Yes, and in the early scene tonight, when the office staff are clustered around the radio listening to news of the crash, you can see that many of the secretaries are wearing suits just like that. I'm pretty sure it was the standard daytime uniform for middle-class women in the city at the time.

Edited by A Little Edgy, Aug 3, 2008 @ 10:19 PM.

[DDial]

Auntie Pam said: Seriously, though, they need to get her out of those full skirts at least occasional. I don't think it was possible for a young, stylish suburban matron to exist, let alone be fashionable, in 1962 without a suit with a boxy jacket and straight skirt.


Yep. In my 8th grade graduation photo, I'm wearing a suit -- slim skirt, short jacket. If a 14-year-old Iowa girl can be stylin' in 1959, DDial is probably right that Betty's inner changes will be reflected in her clothes.

We were still wearing full-skirted dresses to prom though -- maybe party wear is slower to change. I wonder if Betty's dress was new, or an old favorite.

In '61 my prom dress had a very fitted bodice and an huge full skirt...it must have had some layers of tulle as a petticoat to get it to stick out. It came from the most fashionable shop in town. Fashion back then was not a monolith, Betty is playing the affluent surburban housewife role with her full skirt shirt waist dresses and pumps to the hilt. Looking back on the late 50's early 60's ads targeting women she's dressed typical of upscale affluence. The office underlings would have dressed accordingly.

[xii]

Some 1962 fashions.

[Lurkey]

Last season, I all but screamed aloud when Betty whipped out that little green leather cigarette case in her shrink's office; that exact case sat on my grandmother's dressing table for probably 30 years. This week the thing that made me jump was the pin Francine was wearing at the Drapers'--sort of a half fleur-de-lis? I had to pause the DVR and run into my own bedroom just to make sure I still had an exact duplicate, my grandmother's again. The details on this show are note-perfect...and make me miss Grammy like crazy. Man.

[jackiecarr]

Me too. I was rewatching "Long Weekend" the other night and noticed one set of twins' earrings to be similar to an earring and brooch set of my grandmother's. Those big round costume pearl and crystal-look clip ons must have been pretty common. It's kind of weird seeing the type of stuff that my grandmother kept and wore into her 70s and 80s on the young actresses. Like I doubt I'll wear my Guns n' Roses t-shirt from high school 40 years from now, but you never know... I wore some of my mom's old 70s stuff in college once in a while, but in an ironic manner.

I noticed Joan's dress at the party was very early 60's, but the fabric looked more like a daytime summer dress- very Lilly Pulitzer. Oops, on rewatching, that's a top and skirt Joan is wearing, nevermind.

Edited by jackiecarr, Aug 5, 2008 @ 9:05 PM.

[ags]

I think Betty still wearing her full skirts in the early 1960s would not call into question her fashion cred. She is still a 30 something suburban housewife for whom it's important to be stylish but not necessarily trendy or cutting edge. Her look is carefully cultivated and is steeped in the Grace Kelly / Hitchcock blond mode. Granted Jackie Kennedy was also a 30 something housewife, but I don't see Betty immediately connecting to the dark haired Jackie or Audrey Hepburn. Eventually the full skirts will become passe, but at this point the looks are co-existing.

[zumpee]

The silhouette of the party clothes is a bit more varied, but Laura had quite a few cocktail dresses with straight skirts. Sally Rogers was in her 30s and was more likely to wear a full-skirted party dress than Laura, but even she had a number of straight-skirted dressy outfits. I'm sure there was an episode or two where Rob thought Laura's dress was too tight (usually when some guest star had a crush on her and Rob was jealous), but it was nothing approaching Joan's usual office wear. The steno pool must be accustomed to her work wardrobe, because I think that for the time, her look would have been considered highly inappropriate for an office. I don't think a lower-ranking woman could get away with it.

I think Sally Rogers' clothes were also intended to be a bit off and dowdy---since she was the "older" single woman on the show. Much the way Alice on The Brad Bunch wore clothes a good 8 -10 years out of fashion (and Miss Jane on The Beverly Hillbillies). As for Joan's clothes, I asked my mother (who was 21 in 1962) about her very va va voom outfits and my mom said only a LOW level (like switchboard operator or file clerk) employee would've been permitted to dress like that. Definitely NOT and office manager. But I suspect Roger probably likes how Joan dresses just FINE, so he's willing to let the inappropriate slip.

In the case of Betty and Peggy, it's more laziness to make their types fit the story---and historical accuracy cann take a leap! Peggy's the "ingenue" so she has to dress like a complete hayseed--despite the fact that such outfits wouldn't have been tolerated when she was Don's secretary and certainly not over a year into her promotion. Betty's the faux Grace Kelly, so she has to at all times, look like Rear Window (though I seem to recall one seen with Grace in capris)

[DDial]

Back then the "ice princess" Grace Kelly was about as major a celebrity/star as a person could get. She was up there right along side Jackie. Betty's cool blond Philly /debutante/high class persona coupled with below the surface simmering passions is Grace all over. Watch some old Hichcock movies. The unattainable blond trophy was what Don wanted, but when she revealed that she lived for the sex with him, he suddenly lost interest. The unattainable was the attraction. I think she's figured this out, and is damned pissed.

Edited by DDial, Aug 6, 2008 @ 8:08 AM.

[xii]

Are Joan's dresses really all that risqué, or is it just that she has such a knockout body in them?

I doubt that Peggy's dresses wouldn't have been tolerated in a real-life ad agency in 1960-62. I think she just would've been seen as less fashionable than other women, and somewhat dowdy. But her outfits aren't so flagrantly out of style that they demand public attention.

[zumpee]

I doubt that Peggy's dresses wouldn't have been tolerated in a real-life ad agency in 1960-62. I think she just would've been seen as less fashionable than other women, and somewhat dowdy. But her outfits aren't so flagrantly out of style that they demand public attention.

According to my mom, who was the same age, Peggy's outfits would've been barely tolerated in the steno pool in publishing. Advertising was apparently MUCH fussier about how your appearance. If Peggy were a switchboard operator, amybe---but as the secretary to the head of creative and now a junior executive, she would've LONG ago heard about it. there's a lot of contrivance

And Joan's skirts ARE pretty tight. Most offices would've said something about THAT, too.

Back then the "ice princess" Grace Kelly was about as major a celebrity/star as a person could get. She was up there right along side Jackie.

As for Betty's Grace Kelly look, that might well be true---but it still puts her clothes out of fashion. Grace Kelly married and left the movies in 1956. While she was certainly still a beautiful woman, she herself no longer dressed the way her characters did in Hitchcock movies (she was also a woman of fashion). Again, the wardrobe people are so devoted to dressing for type that they are sloppy with historical accuracy.

[peachfuzz]

Popular fashion isn't monolithic - never has been. I have no problem believing that at any given moment, women are dressed along a spectrum of what's up-to-date and fashionable, and that it goes without comment. Are you wearing low-rise bootcut jeans in the late 2000s? Still wearing tailored silhouettes? Wearing heels with short skirts? 40 years from now, someone might well point out that these choices were INCREDIBLY OUT-OF-TOUCH for the time period, but of course no one thinks of it that way right now. Now, if we saw a woman in a suit with huge shoulder pads and mall hair, we might think she looks dated - but that would be because she's missing the mark by fifteen years, not five or six.

[AuntiePam]

What are your thoughts on why Peggy hasn't updated her look -- including the ponytail?

Possibilities:

• The producers aren't paying attention
• She can't afford new clothes.
• She's insecure about her looks and doesn't want to draw attention to her physical self.
• She's keeping one foot in the secretarial pool.
• She just doesn't care.