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David Cook: You Had Me at "Hello"


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#26101

LutherMahoney

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Posted Nov 28, 2008 @ 8:22 PM

Kudos to whomever put that commercial together. I could be wrong but I don't recall any winner ever being so prominantly featured in any AI commercials. That says to me that 19 loves them some DC, too. I don't even think it's about promotion or trying to make money off of him because if that were true, they would have done that for the other winners.
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#26102

blinkeye

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Posted Nov 28, 2008 @ 10:25 PM

Okay, sorry but I had to laugh when I read the comment about AI doing that ad because they love David Cook. Idol ratings took a serious dive last year. They have to make sure the winner is a superstar (or at least is seen as one) or the whole purpose of the show is bogus. The real money is in the TV show and not the album sales. TPTB don't love anyone or anything but the $. And the day they can't use Cook is the day they kick his ass to the curb. If they really loved him, they could stop taking 50% of all his income (that's the rumored 19M take of the gigs they negotiate.) Obviously, he won't see much dough from the album. Nobody gets much and supposedly this year the contracts were the worst ever.

Edited by blinkeye, Nov 28, 2008 @ 10:30 PM.

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#26103

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Posted Nov 28, 2008 @ 10:30 PM

That ad......squee! I like him but Cookie's not even my favorite idol of all time, I guess I'd place him third. But it seems they're treating him right.
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#26104

O2Sean

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Posted Nov 28, 2008 @ 10:56 PM

(And I always thought Archuleta was defined as the Anti-Cook ! Ha, ha )


Archuleta got the early notice, then Cook began to get attention. He was pushed as shocking, original, groundbreaking, earthshattering, while Archuleta was supposed to be predictable, boring, safe. David Archuleta took the frontrunner backlash while Cook was supposed to be the underdog. Their favorite type of underdog, one that did and said what they saw as acceptable.

I think that's one of the reasons LO was such a poor choice for a first single. There's nothing edgy or shocking about that song. It sounds like a million other things already out there. When they have this song that sounds like every other Daughtry/Nickelback release, they can't say it's original, or a positive contrast to anything else.

I thought last season was a huge bore and that they wasted many talented contestants. The ratings fell and fell, as most people knew the outcome well in advance, and they only picked up towards the end. If I were David Cook, I wouldn't even want to be in an ad for them after the box they put him in, but I'm sure David realizes they helped make him famous and he'll do what they want. He seems to be a very smart guy.

Edited by O2Sean, Nov 28, 2008 @ 10:58 PM.

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#26105

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Posted Nov 28, 2008 @ 11:16 PM

I'm not saying they don't want to make money off him, obviously that's the whole purpose of the show. Taylor Hicks (who they didn't like) is barely mentioned yet Elliott Yamin who came in 3rd the same season has been on the show at least three times and since he has an independent deal, they aren't making anything from his record sales. If they didn't like Elliott, he wouldn't have been asked back. If they're looking for validation through the winner, they wouldn't have used 4th place Daughtry's song "Home" on the show each week. I believe that if they didn't like DC, they wouldn't have made the commercial all about him.

I don't think the ratings have dropped because of who did or didn't win in the past, they've dropped because the show has been on for 7 seasons yet hasn't changed for the better. The horrible auditions are fun but we don't need several weeks of them. Go back to showing us more of Hollywood week and what happened to people who we saw in auditions who were fabulous but then dropped off the face of the earth. Let us see the idols outside of the show. If the show is fun and interesting (and not stupid filler like the 1 hour results shows) people will watch.
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#26106

wonderwhy

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Posted Nov 28, 2008 @ 11:23 PM

I know what you mean, but since it seems he can't distance himself right now, being the winner and all, I'd rather he had as much promo and support from AI as possible.


I think the "promo and support" was intended as an ad for AI8, not as a promotion for David Cook. AI is becoming increasingly transparent, and hence less interesting, in its efforts to control perceptions and outcomes. They are also becoming increasingly competent at marketing. Their credibility to some extent depends on having a "superstar" winner but I don't think it matters to them who that winner is who can fill their product placement role. It's business.
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#26107

TWoP Gadget

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 1:20 AM

Guys, keep this thread on topic - David Cook. Not on AI ratings or 19E or such. Talk about the ad all you want, but this is a thread about David and not about American Idol Ratings In General or How 19E Treats David and/or Other Artists.

#26108

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 1:26 AM

Actually, I think it's more like "AI needs all the help David Cook can give it" since they called upon him to pimp out their show. If DC is a sinking ship AI has no reason to tie itself to him (see: Taylor).

Idol needs to break the perception that it mostly produces Idols with weird, limited fanbases that the public at large views with a skewed eye and a sneer. Daughtry couldn't win his season and in fact lost to Taylor, who ended up a punchline. Carrie is a successful winner but she is largely contained in Country, which doesn't "count" for a lot of people who don't listen to country. Who else is Idol known for: Clay? Chicken Little? William Hung?

So they are taking credit for Cook, who may not be groundbreaking in the larger scheme of things but represented a big change in the context of AI when he won.
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#26109

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 2:09 AM

Idol is primarily known for Kelly Clarkson because she's the first winner. By using DC in a commercial they are finally doing what they should have done each year: honor the previous years winner.
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#26110

StillCookin

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 3:49 AM

This almost rivals Cook's "my album will be the next White Album and Joshua Tree."

Since that's not actually a quote David ever said, it would be hard to rival it. He never said his album will be anything.

By using DC in a commercial they are finally doing what they should have done each year: honor the previous years winner.

Yes, but I would have to think there's a reason why this is the first year where they're actually doing it. Might be as simple as "Simon Fuller is his manager" and might have more to it than that, like maybe wanting his win and image to have some impact on the way Idol is perceived.
Or not, who knows, I just think this commercial is a good promo for Idol, a good promo for Cook, and altogether very well made and exciting.
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#26111

fishie76

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 5:55 AM

I don't think Cook is much different from past Idols. I think AI is just desperate to mint another superstar. The last two winners were a flop and a mediocre success. They don't want the perception that their star-making power is on the wane. IMHO, the promo for Cook has been unusually aggressive, probably for this reason.

It seems a little weird that they're airing these Cook and bikini girl ads so early. Have they done this before? I don't know, maybe this is the norm for TV shows, but the mid-January start date is pretty far away.
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#26112

blinkeye

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 8:21 AM

Bingo two past underpar winners, declining ratings and a male winner in a genre that will get radio play. If 19M stopped promoting Cook with everything it had, it would be interesting to see how much he'd bring to the table. So lets just say they're still doing the heavy work here not vice versa.

Edited by blinkeye, Nov 29, 2008 @ 8:23 AM.

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#26113

StillCookin

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 8:56 AM

If 19M stopped promoting Cook with everything it had, it would be interesting to see how much he'd bring to the table.

I'm always baffled when people talk about promotion as if it's a bad thing. It's 19M's job to promote David. If they didn't, that would be cause for concern, not the other way around.
I'm sure Kristy Lee's fans are saying to themselves right now "well, she isn't selling anything and will likely be dropped, but hey, at least they can't say she was over promoted!". No, not exactly.
The more promotion you get, the better off you are, unless it reaches levels of over-saturation, which IMO is not even close. I think both Davids are getting great promotion, and I think the only ones who find fault in it are those who are waiting for either of them to falter.
So far, they're both doing great, and they both have very bright potential future, so it makes sense to invest in them and hope for return of profit in the years to come.
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#26114

Rehabno

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 11:46 AM

If 19M stopped promoting Cook with everything it had, it would be interesting to see how much he'd bring to the table.


I'm always baffled when people talk about promotion as if it's a bad thing.


This is a strange phenomenon. This idea that you can have to much promotion. I actually had a conversation with a non AI watching, non internet savvy friend and she asked when they were going to start promoting David.
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#26115

Mariposa2

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Posted Nov 29, 2008 @ 2:00 PM

If 19M stopped promoting Cook with everything it had, it would be interesting to see how much he'd bring to the table. So lets just say they're still doing the heavy work here not vice versa.


Hi everyone. New to the boards here. I think that if 19M did not have the financial means to promote Cook they would have released one of the more top 40-friendly songs on his album as his first single (e.g. Lie, Life on the Moon, Come Back to Me, Declaration, etc. etc). There are at least seven songs on Cook's album that would have had faster results than "Light On", with much less promotion. Cook has already proven with TOML that he can do the the heavy work. This is a song that did well without a music video and without much support by Cook's fans beyond the first few weeks of sales. Yet it went platinum and continues to be the #1 song on AC for more than 10 weeks in a row. The path of least resistance would have been to release "Lie" as the next single (furthermore that song kills live), but then it would have been even harder to release a song like "Barbasol" after that. So instead, they chose the song that would help define Cook as a rocker instead of as another pop artist. It's definitely a more expensive strategy but hopefully it pays off in the long run. When artists are well promoted like this, I generally see it as a sign that the label has a lot of confidence in that artist and expect good returns. Labels are not in the business of wasting money.

I actually had a conversation with a non AI watching, non internet savvy friend and she asked when they were going to start promoting David.

I've heard similar comments from other people, so I'm not even sure he is getting as heavily promoted as we perceive. One week ago, one of my co-workers, who watches a lot of TV mentioned seeing Archie perform and was wondering whether we would ever hear anything from Cook. I guess she didn't watch SNL!
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#26116

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 10:48 AM

So instead, they chose the song that would help define Cook as a rocker instead of as another pop artist. It's definitely a more expensive strategy but hopefully it pays off in the long run.


LO is a pop song, at its most a poprock song. The whole Cook album falls under the "Pop" category in itunes while the Daughtry album falls under the "Rock" category. LO flopped in all rock radio formats. I don't see how this pop song can define Cook as a rocker instead of another pop artist. Remember INO did very well in modern/mainstream rock?

When releasing LO, RCA is expecting success like INO as a poprock single. Business rules won't change because of RCA or 19M's "love" for Cook.
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#26117

trewdat

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 11:13 AM

Jordin Sparks is a mediocre success? You could have fooled me. Do you know how many artists that we love don't sell enough albums or singles to get gold or platinum status like Jordin, especially in the current economic climate.

However these days the really big money in music is in touring and I think this is where Mr. Cook can truly clean up. Not sure if Cook is going to go out as a headliner to start or as an opener, apparently Nickelback has already lined up their openers for 2009, Seether and Saving Abel. As you know Daughtry opened for Nickelback, as I had the pleasure to witness live and personal. To be honest, Nickelback impressed me more live than I thought I would ever admit as I went for Daughtry and while Daughtry was good, I didn't find him as exciting as a lot of other artists. Having seen David and his band on SNL, I was impressed and think they have that chemistry that is going to make for one hell of a live experience. I also sense Cook and his band are going to be the kind that like to mix it up the set list and not do the exact same show night after night. Add to the fact they are a good looking band, and David is charming and witty, it sounds like an evening with the David Cook band is going to be a fun one.

Not sure how the current climate is going to affect touring in 2009. Concert revenue overall has been increasing every year for quite some time so it will be interesting to see the 2008 stats but with Madonna touring and charging the equilavent of a car payment or two or three, it might still be a good year.

I am curious and should look it up as to whether David's album has been released in countries other than the US and Canada and how it is faring. If you can establish a global fanbase, you are on your way to the A team of music and some artists do phenomenonally well, album wise and tour wise outside of North America, sometimes it boggles our minds but hey I'd take Euros and Yen as happily as US dollars and I am sure so would Mr. Cook. When they are singing Light On in Manila that should really blow his mind. Isn't he going to the Philippines soon or has he already been. Given the love Michael Johns received, I think Mr. Cook will be warmly welcomed.
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#26118

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 11:35 AM

I don't know if this is strictly David related, but as more and more people simply steal the music they want to listen to, they are going to have more cash available to them to actually go see concerts -- which they will do, because every concert is different and you can't buy or steal that experience canned. It's almost (but not quite) a slow reversion back to the old old days before there was recording media where the only way to experience music was live. Funny really.

ETA: This may sound nuts, but I wouldn't be surprised to see them open for Motley Crue come Feb... Although I'm not sure I like that idea -- wrong kind of rock. But...evs.

Edited by bzork, Nov 30, 2008 @ 2:51 PM.

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#26119

Rehabno

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 1:01 PM

bzork. I second your theory regarding live music. I know I prize live recordings by Jason Mraz more than his recorded music. I actually became a fan of Jason from listening to live concert recordings. Come to think of it. I became a fan of David from listening to his pre idol live recordings on the YTube. Creep anyone? The spontaneity of a live recording cannot be matched. The mistakes, the jokes, the banter. I don't think David can get out there soon enough. I actually am annoyed by the wait. The only question left is will he be the headliner or an opener. I don't know who he would open for. As someone stated earlier Nickleback already have their opening acts lined up. Is anyone else out there, big planning to tour?
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#26120

TWoP Gadget

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 1:34 PM

Folks. Topic. David Cook. Not YouTube, downloading songs off the Internet, the history of recorded music, Jordin, 19M's policies, how 19M promotes other artists.

David Cook.

#26121

Mariposa2

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 2:45 PM

The only question left is will he be the headliner or an opener. I don't know who he would open for. As someone stated earlier Nickleback already have their opening acts lined up. Is anyone else out there, big planning to tour?


I remember Cook mentioning that he wanted to do college tours, so in that sense, he could easily be a headliner and attract a decent crowd. College students are pretty open-minded about checking out new groups. However, if he wants to really expand his audience and win over some doubters then opening for a high profile performer would be good. His album is very eclectic so he wouldn't even need to open for a band like Nickelback or Foofighters. Perfomers like The Fray, Pink or Dave Matthews Band (although I doubt they are touring) might also be cool. I think the Killers will be touring soon too. I have no clue what would be the better option. I think he'll win over a lot of people either way.
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#26122

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 5:37 PM

Wnners selling more is a given


No, it isn't. And it certainly wasn't expected of Cook. But he outsold Archuleta. By a lot.
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#26123

anne uk

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 5:55 PM

trewdat, in reference to your post about where else the album has been released: not in the UK at this time. I have it on order through a UK website who have it listed as an import. It hasn't arrived yet which is frustrating as I read all the comments about the songs. As yet I have resisted the urge to download as I want the excitement of the original CD arriving in the post and the first play of it. Not sure how much longer I'll be able to hold out though...
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#26124

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 7:09 PM

trewdat, in reference to your post about where else the album has been released: not in the UK at this time. I have it on order through a UK website who have it listed as an import. It hasn't arrived yet which is frustrating as I read all the comments about the songs. As yet I have resisted the urge to download as I want the excitement of the original CD arriving in the post and the first play of it. Not sure how much longer I'll be able to hold out though...

anne, you are stronger than me. I ordered the album through Amazon.com but it took so long to get to my little corner of the world that I caved and got it on iTunes two days in.
It was still very exciting to get the CD in the mail three days later, though.

I'm very curious to see what will become the next single and when can we expect it to come out... I think that will tell us a lot about RCA's marketing strategy for the long run. Personally, I think there are at least 5 songs on this album that would make better singles than LO, so there's plenty to work with for the album to have continued success over time.
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#26125

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 7:57 PM

I am curious and should look it up as to whether David's album has been released in countries other than the US and Canada and how it is faring.

The site below lists Cook's album as #3 in total global sales after Beyonce and Nickelback. His total is 285,000 meaning that he sold approximately 6,000 copies outside of the US in the first week. This number seems a bit low, but based on what anne just said, I'm guessing it's because it hasn't been released to many places outside the U.S.

http://www.mediatraffic.de/albums.htm
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#26126

losecontrol

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Posted Nov 30, 2008 @ 8:44 PM

No, it isn't. And it certainly wasn't expected of Cook. But he outsold Archuleta. By a lot.



Oh, I definitely expected Cook to sell more albums. Rock artists almost always sell more albums than pop artists do. I think some people were just thrown off by Crush slaughtering Light On in sales (as well as surpassing ToML at this point or close to it)... they expected the pattern to hold for their albums, but it didn't. It's nice that both of them are selling well; it's been a long time since the winner and runner-up from the same season were successful. It couldn't have happened to a nicer pair of guys. :)

Edited by losecontrol, Nov 30, 2008 @ 8:47 PM.

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#26127

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Posted Dec 1, 2008 @ 1:50 AM

No, it isn't. And it certainly wasn't expected of Cook. But he outsold Archuleta. By a lot.


A winner has outsold the runner up in every season but one. This season, where David Cook was pushed as breaking the Idol mold, winning in a landslide, getting promotion on SNL, seen as cool and hip by the media, being the star of ads for the show, while David Archuleta was supposed to be a bizarre relic of a bygone era, I think the general idea was that he would outsell Archuleta (at least that's what I thought the mood was). I'm actually surprised Cook didn't outsell him by even more, given all the hype, but that bad first single choice and the general decline of the music industry probably didn't help.

I just hope David Cook gets as much money and as many opportunities as he can after the bumbling from the label and from AI. He does deserve success.

Edited by O2Sean, Dec 1, 2008 @ 6:18 AM.

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#26128

shell74

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Posted Dec 1, 2008 @ 4:03 AM

No, it isn't. And it certainly wasn't expected of Cook. But he outsold Archuleta. By a lot.


He's outselling Archie in album sales right now. That doesn't necessarily mean that he'll sell more albums in the long run.

Edited by shell74, Dec 1, 2008 @ 4:06 AM.

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#26129

HombreSolutions

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Posted Dec 1, 2008 @ 11:54 AM

He's outselling Archie in album sales right now. That doesn't necessarily mean that he'll sell more albums in the long run.


It all depends on how long RCA is willing to push singles from both artists.

'David Cook', aka The Record, has at least four potential radio hits (on AC and HOT AC) in the forms of 'Lie', 'Life on the Moon', 'Mr. Sensitive', 'Declaration', and possibly 'Bar-ba-sol' on rock radio, though it runs a little too long IMHO (it needs at least one verse excised for radio release).

I'm not familiar with Archie's album (just not my thing), but he could conceivably go the route of Jordan Sparks/the tortoise and sell slow but steady albums while racking up hit singles.

It really all comes down to Label commitment at this point. After Christmas the fans will have depleted all of their money on these albums, so longevity depends on marketing/payola doling.

Edited by HombreSolutions, Dec 1, 2008 @ 1:15 PM.

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#26130

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Posted Dec 1, 2008 @ 12:09 PM

Not sure about actual CD sales overseas, but I just checked iTunes and David Cook (the album) is ranked as follows:

Canada: #28 (all genres), #5 (pop)
UK: #20 (rock)
Australia: #41 (all genres), #6 (rock)
New Zealand: #10 (all genres), #3 (rock)
Finland: #15 (all genres), #5 (rock)
Sweden: #58 (rock)

They don't seem to be offering the album yet in Germany, although Time of My Life is offered as a single, and the album is for sale in France, but I don't see him charting on the Top 100.

I doubt iTunes makes up much of the overseas sales, but it interesting to see where David is popular. The Finns appear to love him, but maybe that has something to do with Espen Lind, who co-wrote on the album with David.

Edited by BootStar, Dec 1, 2008 @ 12:22 PM.

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