45 replies to this topic

[cutecouple]

Numbered according to DVD/original intended order.

I can see why Fox bumped this one ahead in the broadcast order - lot's of sexy naughtiness. But behind it, there's a bit of character. Small bits that caught my eye was how gracious Jayne was when accepting the rain stick, and how sincere he was when he wanted to trade Vera for Saffron. The big bit was how mature Mal was, and the crew's glee at seeing him married.

[Vercingetorix]

This is my favorite episode to date (I've only seen through Jaynestown). First, the show did a great job fooling me, although some of it was the cheat of having the town leader be in on the scam, which still doesn't make any sense. Second, this ep has some of the best funny dialogue and comic misunderstandings of any ep in the Whedonverse, which is saying something.

- Well, Jayne, I can definitely say that my opinion of you is reaching a middle.

[Shanna Marie]

This is one of the episodes that makes a lot more sense in the DVD order than when it first aired. Inara's reaction to Mal's "marriage" seemed extreme in the Fox order, but it's totally understandable when it comes after "Shindig." If a man has just been willing to fight a duel to defend your honor, you'd certainly be ticked off if he then went and got married to someone else.

I've always wondered if there was something in Zoe's backstory to explain her extreme reaction to Saffron. She really went off on both Wash and Mal about Saffron cooking for Mal. It seemed like there was a story in there somewhere.

[petpluto22]

"Our Mrs. Reynolds" is a paradoxical episode for me. It is far from my favorite- I dislike Saffron and her games too much for that- but it has many of my favorite moments. I love Mal's piece of wisdom about if "someone ever tries to kill you, you try to them right back!" I feel its a good bit of philosophy to carry around in everyone's daily life. I also love all the Zoe and Wash scenes, especially Zoe's "Remember that sex we were planning to have, ever again", and Wash's explanation of how much he loves his wife, and how she can kill him with her pinky. And it has the great Wash-Kaylee moment where they marvel at how much damage Saffron has done to the ship. They are total ship geeks in that moment, and I love them for it, and I love Wash for suggesting that maybe Saffron took the other shuttle because she likes shuttles, using as his reason "Some people juggle geese!" And of course, I love Jayne and Vera.

At the same time, I never got why everyone was so upset with Mal in the beginning. Finding out you've been accidently married is probably never an easy time, and yet no one sympathized. There was Wash's "We always hoped you two crazy kids would get together. Who is she?" But it just seemed as if everyone overreacted in terms of Saffron's innocence and Mal being like a monster.

[whizbang]

First, the show did a great job fooling me, although some of it was the cheat of having the town leader be in on the scam, which still doesn't make any sense.

Was the town leader in on the scam? I took the fact that he never told Mal about the marriage as a sign that he had not been in on it. Or was he encouraging the wedding ceremony? Considering that Saffron sneaked herself onboard and the leader apologised for not having much to pay Mal with, I thought it was all her own trickery.

I really like this episode, and think it's one of the funniest in the series. I love drunk Mal and Jayne, and then the next day when Mal asks, "How drunk was I last night?" and Jayne replies, "I don't know, I passed out." It's one of the moments where I feel like they're real buddies. The reactions to the marriage are great too, especially the look of absolute delight on Kaylee's face - it looks like she's genuinely happy that Mal got married. I think Inara was the only one who really overreacted at first. To me, Kaylee and Wash were jokingly calling Mal a monster. Zoe only got mad about it all later, and maybe she was just annoyed because she isn't a champion of traditional wife roles.

[mollyann]

Not to play a one-note tune, but Simon didn't seem all that pleased about the marriage, either. He was all baffled and stammery and passive-aggressive with his congratulations. But maybe that's just me. (Okay, it's definitely not just me, but you get the idea.)

Was the town leader in on the scam? I took the fact that he never told Mal about the marriage as a sign that he had not been in on it. Or was he encouraging the wedding ceremony? Considering that Saffron sneaked herself onboard and the leader apologised for not having much to pay Mal with, I thought it was all her own trickery.

Somewhere in the shooting script for the episode, it's explained that Elder Gommen was indeed in on the plan. God only knows why they cut out the explanation; about ten minutes of Saffron acting annoying could have been cut instead, to the episode's advantage.

[Vercingetorix]

Was the town leader in on the scam? I took the fact that he never told Mal about the marriage as a sign that he had not been in on it. Or was he encouraging the wedding ceremony?

If he wasn't, then the plan was really risky -- if even one person had said "Hey, Saffron's from the wider verse too," or if the preacher Book called had spilled the beans on the town father not actually giving her away, then the scam would collapse.

[whizbang]

Somewhere in the shooting script for the episode, it's explained that Elder Gommen was indeed in on the plan. God only knows why they cut out the explanation; about ten minutes of Saffron acting annoying could have been cut instead, to the episode's advantage.

Wow, I wish they had left that in. They had seemed like such a nice little community, with the rain stick, party, and all the food they gave to the crew. I'm really disappointed in that Elder. I'd rather he'd have been duped into thinking Saffron was an innocent little girl than part of the evil scheme.

[sailorwind]

Why would he have helped Saffron to dupe the crew of Serenity who just helped him out? It's not making a whole lot of sense to me.

[Vercingetorix]

Some more stuff that bothers me about Our Mrs. Reynolds (despite the fact that it's one of my favorites).

1) The crew doesn't loot the deconstruction ring or whatever. IMHO, if you are attacked by space pirates and win, you have salvage rights.

2) Mal lets Saffron go (or live). Saffron tried to kill his entire crew. She will certainly kill other people - dozens if not hundreds - because Mal let her go. Mal was ready to airlock Jayne for just turning over the Tams to the feds.

[gcmtech]

Why would he have helped Saffron to dupe the crew of Serenity who just helped him out? It's not making a whole lot of sense to me.

I read somewhere that it could be like the old "wrecker" communities who would lure ships towards the rocks in the old days and then loot them. It could be that they were in with the net people, and the bandits were more of a mild annoyance than anything else.

1) The crew doesn't loot the deconstruction ring or whatever. IMHO, if you are attacked by space pirates and win, you have salvage rights.

Well, I thought the reason they didn't stop right away was cause they couldn't. We have no idea if they ever went back and looted the net, but I'd bet they did.

Mal lets Saffron go (or live). Saffron tried to kill his entire crew. She will certainly kill other people - dozens if not hundreds - because Mal let her go. Mal was ready to airlock Jayne for just turning over the Tams to the feds.

I think Mal is more upset about Jayne cause it was personal - I trusted this person on my ship, and he turned on me and my crew - whereas with Saffron, it was more like with Patience - I fell for that, so I'll hurt you back, but I won't kill you.

</fanwanks>

[mollyann]

I agree that Mal should have killed Saffron, but it makes sense to me, character-wise, that he wouldn't. Despite what he may like to think, the guy has a rather old-fashioned sense of nobility when it comes to women, and I'm not sure he'd be able to bring himself to kill one. Still, he's a dink for not taking his own advice from the same episode: "Someone tries to kill you, you try to kill them right back."

[petpluto22]

he's a dink for not taking his own advice from the same episode: "Someone tries to kill you, you try to kill them right back."

Wow, I never realized that until right now. Huh. Well, he really is a dink isn't he? And I would have been a happier person if he'd killed Saffron, especially because I now have a professor named Yolanda, and even though she is a short, round Cuban woman, I can't help but look at her funny.

[chunkyrice13]

Now, this is important Pet: under no circumstances should you marry her.

[petpluto22]

Ya know, chunkyrice, I'm gonna do my best to take that advice to heart. But it is Sociology of the Family and we're studying marriage, so she might pull some funky marriage ritual from some other culture I'm unaware of in class! I fear I may be a lost cause.

[Isabelle31]

Mal lets Saffron go (or live). Saffron tried to kill his entire crew. She will certainly kill other people - dozens if not hundreds - because Mal let her go. Mal was ready to airlock Jayne for just turning over the Tams to the feds.

I think Mal is more upset about Jayne cause it was personal - I trusted this person on my ship, and he turned on me and my crew - whereas with Saffron, it was more like with Patience - I fell for that, so I'll hurt you back, but I won't kill you.

Definately. With Jayne, it was a lot more personal. Mal trusts him with his and the crews' lives and he turned on all of them. He also has an actual friendship with Jayne.

I also think that putting Jayne in the airlock was a way of keeping him in line. We don't even know if he actually would have killed Jayne, but my guess that that he wouldn't have. I think he was pissed at Jayne (rightfully so) and knew that he needed to scare him shitless so he wouldn't turn on the crew again.

I agree that Mal should have killed Saffron, but it makes sense to me, character-wise, that he wouldn't. Despite what he may like to think, the guy has a rather old-fashioned sense of nobility when it comes to women, and I'm not sure he'd be able to bring himself to kill one.

I agree, Mollyann, especially since he makes the mistake of not killing Saffron again in Trash, even after he threatens to.

[Raychill Canuck]

So I just watched this episode again this past weekend. A couple of observations - based on what is seen on the show (as opposed to the shooting script) there is no interaction between Saffron and the Elder. For someone just watching the show the assumption would be that Saffron wasn't acting with the blessing of the Elder and the community.

The other thing I noticed was how much Book enjoyed playing with Mal's mind. Because he had observed what had happened the night before (the advantage of being sober) he used that and the encylopedia he had Simon grab to mess with Mal. The special hell was furthering his fun. Who know Shepherds had such a playful side?

[sailorwind]

Some more stuff that bothers me about Our Mrs. Reynolds (despite the fact that it's one of my favorites).

1) The crew doesn't loot the deconstruction ring or whatever. IMHO, if you are attacked by space pirates and win, you have salvage rights.

Who knows if they went back or not, but I'm sure their first priority was to catch Saffron and get their shuttle back. Plus, they blew the place to hell, how much would have been left to salvage?

2) Mal lets Saffron go (or live). Saffron tried to kill his entire crew. She will certainly kill other people - dozens if not hundreds - because Mal let her go. Mal was ready to airlock Jayne for just turning over the Tams to the feds.

I agree with everyone that it was more personal with Jayne. Jayne is "part of the family" and he turned on them and put them all in danger when they were trusting him. Saffron just plain out duped them all. It was stupid of him to let her live, but I don't think he could have killed her.

The other thing I noticed was how much Book enjoyed playing with Mal's mind. Because he had observed what had happened the night before (the advantage of being sober) he used that and the encylopedia he had Simon grab to mess with Mal. The special hell was furthering his fun. Who know Shepherds had such a playful side?

Book was totally playing with him. I also think he could have easily divorced them saying it was a non-binding marriage, as that was not Mal's religion, held under false pretenses. But it was more fun to see Mal squirm.

[prodigalchicken]

Plus, if Book had told him that he could easily be divorced from Saffron, we never would have gotten that brilliant reaction in Trash from Mal when Monty says, "but I'm her husband" and Mal says, "Well, who in the damn galaxy isn't?" Or. . .it was something like that. Hi-larious.

[sailorwind]

I believe that's what he said when Duron said he was her husband. To Monty it was something like 'You're not the only one."

[prodigalchicken]

Yes, I think you are right, sailorwind Both were funny lines, though.

[danheaton]

I'm currently doing my 2nd viewing (yes, only the 2nd!) of Firefly, and I've come to this one, which I'd put in the middle overall. There's still plenty to like, including some great Mal/Jayne banter, more of the Inara/Mal relationship, and of course fun scenes with Wash. Although I enjoyed it, I feel like this episode drags a bit in the middle with all of Saffron's schemings. Once she enacts her plan, it does get moving and ends well. Solid episode.

It is ridiculous that Fox would flip this episode in front of Shindig and Safe. One thing I've really seen on the 2nd viewing is the way the episodes flow into each other. Taken out of order, they would confuse audiences and lose viewership, which is just not fair to a show of this quality.

Did any fans of The Shield notice a cameo by Benito Martinez (aka David Aceveda) as one of the criminals? Very cool.

[wlfdncer]

hehe yeah I noticed that cameo before... for some reason I really had trouble separating him from his character on The Shield so it was weird for me.

[Mack the Spoon]

So, this was the latest in my watch-through in order to turn my housemates in Browncoats (it's working, BTW!), and my friend A said something interesting at the end. At the end when Mal was encouraging Inara to quit playing and say how she really ended up unconscious, and then of course there's the fakeout where he says "I knew you let her kiss you!", A was sure Mal was just playing with her, that he knew she had kissed him. That hadn't occurred to me - any thoughts? I think it's perhaps plausible, but I don't know.

[DocOrlando]

Plausible, but very unlikely. Despite what the viewers see as sexual tension between Mal and Inara, I really think that Mal has very little interest. There isn't nearly the "I know you want me" back and forth during their (usually good natured) sniping.

And personally, I think it added to Mal's charm. The guy is savvy about most things, but he's a real lunkhead when it comes to things in skirts.

[Mack the Spoon]

The guy is savvy about most things, but he's a real lunkhead when it comes to things in skirts.

Though I *do* see more of a connection between the two, this is how I think I feel about the scene.

[Mathonwy]

Agreed. I see Mal-Inara as boiling over with UST, but in this scene ... it's pure childish glee on Mal's part, IMO. Ha - look, Miss Fancy Pants fell for the same trick I got suckered with. Tee-hee!

[Arevhat]

I've been trying to get into Firefly because so many people whose tastes I admire and respect have sung its praises, and while I haven't been loving the early episodes, there's nothing to actively dislike, until this gem:

"The Hell reserved for people in particular need of horrible torment...like child molesters, people who talk at the theater."

Oh, har-de-har-har. Joss Whedon, you've such an edgy, sparkling wit. Is there much more of this vomit-inducing "humor" in future episodes? I'd really like to like this show, I'm not easily offended, but gah.

[Shukriyya]

I don't like this line either. I don't remember there being anything like this in later episodes. I have to say though that "Heart of Gold" is an episode that is rather hard to watch because of the villain's misogyny.

[Eegah]

There's always "We live on a spaceship, dear."