A controversial character for sure, but my favorite on the show aside from House himself. And I started liking her even more after realizing we're going to be faced with more Sela Ward next year.
Allison Cameron
Started by
kieyra
, Jun 09 2005 08:27 PM
2346 replies to this topic
#1
Posted Jun 9, 2005 @ 8:27 PM
#2
Posted Jun 9, 2005 @ 8:35 PM
A controversial character for sure, but my favorite on the show aside from House himself.
I honestly liked her to begin with. Then she followed the Sara Sidle method of Seeking Valdidation in Inappropriate Places. I have to give Jennifer Morrison credit for delivering some of the most cringe-inducing lines(you just couldn't love ME. What?!) in a fairly convincing manner. Apart from that, the writers are going to have to do a stellar job to get me back on her side.
#3
Posted Jun 9, 2005 @ 8:42 PM
Aw, man. Was going to start a thread titled, "Do You Like Me?: Dr. Cameron". But I had to run an errand, and when I got back, you'd beat me to it.
I'm one of the few who genuinely likes her. I particularly like that she confronts things head-on, however inappropriately. I do wish, though, that the writers wouldn't make her issues so stereotypically feminine, such as how her main arc this season revolved around "Do you like me?"
I'm one of the few who genuinely likes her. I particularly like that she confronts things head-on, however inappropriately. I do wish, though, that the writers wouldn't make her issues so stereotypically feminine, such as how her main arc this season revolved around "Do you like me?"
#4
Posted Jun 9, 2005 @ 8:51 PM
Heh. I avoided the main show thread because I couldn't keep up, but also because of the Cameron bashing. I think perhaps I indentify a little too strongly with her (i.e., my inability to deal with the bashing is solely a personal problem), but I also really liked the House/Cameron dynamic until they threw Sela Ward into the mix.
Anyway, I like her. I like that she's messed up and insecure and girlie, but not stupid.
Anyway, I like her. I like that she's messed up and insecure and girlie, but not stupid.
#5
Posted Jun 9, 2005 @ 9:12 PM
Word.I'm one of the few who genuinely likes her. I particularly like that she confronts things head-on, however inappropriately.
People say that she acts like a teenage girl, but I honestly don't see that. She wears her heart on her sleeve and wants to know and say things without tip-toeing around the issue. She could stand to choose her words more carefully, sure. But isn't that the way with most people like that?
#6
Posted Jun 9, 2005 @ 11:18 PM
I like her as well, but I can easily see how many find her annoying. I just like my characters with flaws, even if they're female.
#7
Posted Jun 10, 2005 @ 1:26 AM
wisteria said
Everyone seems to forget that she's got a lot of baggage to lug around; she was widowed at like, 22, and she may or may not have been ( but probably was ) abused in some way as a child. I mean, this show has proved that all these characters have an intricately woven "character tapestries" if you will, and serious psychological damage would explain her wanting to be liked by everyone and her need to please. That doesn't make her a stupid teeny-bopper character though, not at all.
kieyra said
I identify with her a little too much, too. Haha that doesn't make me look too awesome, haha. I can't stand the Cameron bashing either for those same reasons, it depresses me. I have a lot of issues, obviously, haha. She and Foreman are like, the only ones who show any signs of outwardly caring for patients and they both get the worst reputations as characters.
DumbBrunette saidI'm one of the few who genuinely likes her. I particularly like that she confronts things head-on, however inappropriately. I do wish, though, that the writers wouldn't make her issues so stereotypically feminine, such as how her main arc this season revolved around "Do you like me?"
People say that she acts like a teenage girl, but I honestly don't see that. She wears her heart on her sleeve and wants to know and say things without tip-toeing around the issue. She could stand to choose her words more carefully, sure. But isn't that the way with most people like that?
Everyone seems to forget that she's got a lot of baggage to lug around; she was widowed at like, 22, and she may or may not have been ( but probably was ) abused in some way as a child. I mean, this show has proved that all these characters have an intricately woven "character tapestries" if you will, and serious psychological damage would explain her wanting to be liked by everyone and her need to please. That doesn't make her a stupid teeny-bopper character though, not at all.
kieyra said
Heh. I avoided the main show thread because I couldn't keep up, but also because of the Cameron bashing. I think perhaps I indentify a little too strongly with her (i.e., my inability to deal with the bashing is solely a personal problem), but I also really liked the House/Cameron dynamic until they threw Sela Ward into the mix.
Anyway, I like her. I like that she's messed up and insecure and girlie, but not stupid.
I identify with her a little too much, too. Haha that doesn't make me look too awesome, haha. I can't stand the Cameron bashing either for those same reasons, it depresses me. I have a lot of issues, obviously, haha. She and Foreman are like, the only ones who show any signs of outwardly caring for patients and they both get the worst reputations as characters.
#8
Posted Jun 10, 2005 @ 1:52 AM
I do too but then again, I like all the characters on the show so far.I'm one of the few who genuinely likes her.
I explained why this is in the large main thread but I'll repeat it here. Cameron is the kind of character I'd hate on almost any other show because they'd probably try and make her the strong heroine of the show. There are still issues with the way she is written at times, especially in terms of dialogue, but in general she is presented as she is. Characters see her as she is. She gets teased for her behavior. Her strengths are also her weaknesses. Her ability to empathize has aided her and hindered her. She's hard to watch at times and yet I do see her as brave to put herself out there.
#9
Posted Jun 10, 2005 @ 7:53 AM
Plus she has a nice set of, uh, Guatemalan necklaces.
Yeah, I'm shallow. So what? With all the members of the Greg House Estrogen Brigade (are y'all still calling it that? If not, my apologies) here it's nice to have someplace to focus my attention during this show (aside from EWD over on the couch, of course...).
Yeah, I'm shallow. So what? With all the members of the Greg House Estrogen Brigade (are y'all still calling it that? If not, my apologies) here it's nice to have someplace to focus my attention during this show (aside from EWD over on the couch, of course...).
#10
Posted Jun 10, 2005 @ 12:31 PM
I like her and I hate her. She reminds me of the many, many girls who value "niceness" way too much. She does make me feel fantastic that I have left girlhood and all its appurtenances behind, so, all things being about me, I like her. Cameron's sweetness often seems to get in the way of her being effective. The only time I really liked her was when she was trying out ways to be taken seriously--then she had my sympathy and support, despite House's grousings.
Of course, jealousy figures into my assessment of her. For a fifteen year-old, Dr. Cameron's got it all, seemingly without breaking a sweat.
Of course, jealousy figures into my assessment of her. For a fifteen year-old, Dr. Cameron's got it all, seemingly without breaking a sweat.
#11
Posted Jun 10, 2005 @ 2:03 PM
Where did that come from? I don't remember ever hearing a reference to her childhood, let alone childhood abuse.and she may or may not have been ( but probably was ) abused in some way as a child
#12
Posted Jun 10, 2005 @ 2:14 PM
and she may or may not have been ( but probably was ) abused in some way as a child
I think she denied that in the first episode when House brought up her "damage." Though it could be more than this, I think we're supposed to believe right now that the majority of her damage stems from being a widow at a very young age. I hope the writers go a little more in-depth with this next season. I'd like to find out if her husband was another student, or (my suspicions only) that maybe she fell for another boss/teacher/mentor type person.
#13
Posted Jun 10, 2005 @ 6:05 PM
I'm gonna duck right after I say this.
I like her because she's really hot. And that whole doctor's outfit just brings out all sorts of wonderful fantasies. Now I just have to hope my wife doesn't read this board.
*ducks*
I like her because she's really hot. And that whole doctor's outfit just brings out all sorts of wonderful fantasies. Now I just have to hope my wife doesn't read this board.
*ducks*
#14
Posted Jun 11, 2005 @ 1:19 AM
I like her because she's really hot. And that whole doctor's outfit just brings out all sorts of wonderful fantasies.
Both of these facts also help me to easily overlook the fact that I can't really stand her personality.
#15
Posted Jun 11, 2005 @ 7:34 AM
I like her because she's really hot. And that whole doctor's outfit just brings out all sorts of wonderful fantasies. Now I just have to hope my wife doesn't read this board.
I see it exactly opposite; she's hot in her civvies but kind of blah in the doctor's outfit. It wasn't until House went to her place that I even saw what anyone saw in her because until then she just seemed plain.
#16
Posted Jun 11, 2005 @ 11:05 AM
Maybe so, but that one blouse with the cap sleeves made her seem like she never left being 12, regardless of how she's developed physically.
Remember being a girl, sure. Being a girl when you're close to 30, a little suspect.
Remember being a girl, sure. Being a girl when you're close to 30, a little suspect.
#17
Posted Jun 11, 2005 @ 4:40 PM
dbrugg, right you are. A few of her work blouses looked as if her grandmother bought them. Her casual clothes were brighter and more up to date. Omega697 was merely pointing out that he had fetishes which fit with Dr. Cameron's wardrobe--really thin girl in flared pants, strange shirt, and a lab coat, and an unusual barrette habit.
#18
Posted Jun 11, 2005 @ 6:31 PM
Heh. That would have been a good name for this thread. Or a kick-ass girl band. Topic? I'm wondering why the focus tends to be on her physical assets/appearance. I'm thinking that maybe there's not a whole lot else to say at this juncture. Despite her out-there-ness, we don't have a lot of information about her. She's got potential, though, so what would you like to know about her, based on what we've already been shown? Besides why her wardrobe is a little strange, I mean.unusual barrette habit
#19
Posted Jun 11, 2005 @ 8:53 PM
It's not only her wardrobe that's a little strange (although not nearly as strange as Chase's). She's been written so inconsistly this season that her personality is hard to pin down. In the early episodes, like the pilot and last weeks Paternity, she was pretty together and competent, eyes rolling at House's sexual harassment comments, although somewhat insecure. By the time of the Vogler episodes, she changed from episode to episode depending on which writer was in charge of the script, from funny and smart under Shore, to neurotic with Moran, over to manipulative with Kaplow writing.
Maybe now that the romantic heat is on House/Stacy, the writers will be able to develop her more as a doctor than an teenager with a crush.
But the barettes must go. Surely the assertiveness book she read would have mentioned that.
Maybe now that the romantic heat is on House/Stacy, the writers will be able to develop her more as a doctor than an teenager with a crush.
But the barettes must go. Surely the assertiveness book she read would have mentioned that.
#20
Posted Jun 12, 2005 @ 11:44 AM
She's been written so inconsistly this season that her personality is hard to pin down.
So true. That is partly the reason that I can really,really not like her. Sometimes she is just such a transparent tool to tell about the male characters concerns and male characters problems. Not that she wouldn't have to put up with those problems, but that no girl, woman would react the way she does. If she's going to be a ditzy, crushy thing, then let her lose it and wail out loud to someone--and own it. She's got an annoying mishmash of characteristics and responses and as we watch them we're asked not to lose sight of the fact that she is the embodiment of female virtue. She annoys me. Greatly.
#21
Posted Jun 12, 2005 @ 2:32 PM
I hate her, and I hate when she wears the matching pants/vest sets.
#22
Posted Jun 12, 2005 @ 2:51 PM
Ugh, now you're reminded me of those books on women in the workplace that were coming out just as feminism was starting to take off. (Early seventies, I think.) Women were told to dress just like men as possible, which meant pant suits with matching vests. Another form of passing. Unless you were an A cup and had no hips, it just looked really silly.
Maybe Cameron's problem is that she's a male fantasy of how a good girl would act, doing House's mail and getting him lunch, being warm and empathic with the patients, crying over centrifuges when things get too much for her. (As opposed Cuddy, who is another kind of male fantasy, with a dominatrix's low cut, revealing oufits.)
Four producers, only one of whom is female. Another eight writers, seven of them men. No wonder Cameron is such a mishmash of reality and fantasy. Katie Jacobs and Sara Cooper need to put more into Cameron's description in the show bible. And vet the dialogue when Moran and Kaplow write it.
Maybe Cameron's problem is that she's a male fantasy of how a good girl would act, doing House's mail and getting him lunch, being warm and empathic with the patients, crying over centrifuges when things get too much for her. (As opposed Cuddy, who is another kind of male fantasy, with a dominatrix's low cut, revealing oufits.)
Four producers, only one of whom is female. Another eight writers, seven of them men. No wonder Cameron is such a mishmash of reality and fantasy. Katie Jacobs and Sara Cooper need to put more into Cameron's description in the show bible. And vet the dialogue when Moran and Kaplow write it.
Edited by KatalynJ, Jun 12, 2005 @ 3:02 PM.
#23
Posted Jun 12, 2005 @ 6:12 PM
Both women's wardrobes are bad; Cameron's is, I think worse than Cuddy's, which at least have some style even if it is from dominatrix r us.
When the two women writers aren't vetting dialogue, they need to talk to the wardrobe people.
When the two women writers aren't vetting dialogue, they need to talk to the wardrobe people.
Edited by anndra, Jun 12, 2005 @ 6:13 PM.
#24
Posted Jun 12, 2005 @ 9:39 PM
When the two women writers aren't vetting dialogue, they need to talk to the wardrobe people.
You know, it's just as sexist to assume that a couple of writers might have some special insight into costuming decisions just because they're women.
#25
Posted Jun 13, 2005 @ 12:34 AM
Also I have to say why are we assuming that the women writers are the only ones who can fix things?
I never found a problem with her character, I always felt the different aspects to her personality are complexities. She reacts to House differently because she is attracted to him. She didn;t completely understand him until recently though.
And she is damaged. Not because she's awoman but because it's her past. Chase and Foreman also have their issues and baggage. We'vew seen more of Chase's but because Cameron's issues involve House it plays differently.
I like her, and not just cause JM's hot.
I never found a problem with her character, I always felt the different aspects to her personality are complexities. She reacts to House differently because she is attracted to him. She didn;t completely understand him until recently though.
And she is damaged. Not because she's awoman but because it's her past. Chase and Foreman also have their issues and baggage. We'vew seen more of Chase's but because Cameron's issues involve House it plays differently.
I like her, and not just cause JM's hot.
#26
Posted Jun 13, 2005 @ 8:44 AM
Also I have to say why are we assuming that the women writers are the only ones who can fix things?
I don't think that's what's being said. Generally, female writers tend to write better for women and male for men. It's not to say that there aren't male writers who write well for female characters and vice versa. However, being that writers experience firsthand the trials and tribulations associated with their respective genders, they tend to write better for their own. We don't know who is dressing Cameron, but if men are dressing her, they may have a very different idea on what is appropriate than a female dresser.
I think that's what KatalynJ and anndra are getting at (please correct me if I'm wrong). In my opinion, that's not sexist, it's just a matter of experience.
I myself think that we just saw far too much of Cameron's needy side this past season. Watching the earlier episodes, however, she's a bit more forceful and tends to put up with her co-workers' crap (House and the other ducklings included) than she did later on. I say enough with her extreme vulnerability for awhile, but I don't think it was completely out of character to act that way. It was just a little too much for a little too long.
#27
Posted Jun 13, 2005 @ 9:29 AM
eejm, no correction needed; that was exactly my point.
Agreed. There's a fine, but definite, line between vulnerability and neediness and all too often, I think Cameron's characterization crossed it. Lines like "do you have feelings for me?" are pretty much always cringeworthy: certainly they are to me. If they are determined to pursue the House/Cameron thing, she needs to be both more consistently drawn and IMO a much stronger character than she is right now or House would eat her alive.
Disclaimer: I'm not wild with the idea of turning House into the House/Cameron show; I used to watch ER which IMO died when it descended into relationship hell. And, that was, at least in theory, an ensemble piece (stop laughing!); House is for better or worse (for me definitely better) the Hugh Laurie show. And, bringing his relationship with any one of the ducklings too much into the foreground will, I think, inevitably push the others too much into the background (not to mention Wilson and Cuddy). I'm interested in all of the characters not just two of them.
I myself think that we just saw far too much of Cameron's needy side this past season. Watching the earlier episodes, however, she's a bit more forceful and tends to put up with her co-workers' crap (House and the other ducklings included) than she did later on. I say enough with her extreme vulnerability for awhile, but I don't think it was completely out of character to act that way. It was just a little too much for a little too long.
Agreed. There's a fine, but definite, line between vulnerability and neediness and all too often, I think Cameron's characterization crossed it. Lines like "do you have feelings for me?" are pretty much always cringeworthy: certainly they are to me. If they are determined to pursue the House/Cameron thing, she needs to be both more consistently drawn and IMO a much stronger character than she is right now or House would eat her alive.
Disclaimer: I'm not wild with the idea of turning House into the House/Cameron show; I used to watch ER which IMO died when it descended into relationship hell. And, that was, at least in theory, an ensemble piece (stop laughing!); House is for better or worse (for me definitely better) the Hugh Laurie show. And, bringing his relationship with any one of the ducklings too much into the foreground will, I think, inevitably push the others too much into the background (not to mention Wilson and Cuddy). I'm interested in all of the characters not just two of them.
#28
Posted Jun 13, 2005 @ 9:32 AM
(I compose off line to save dial-up costs, and while I'm off, eejm has very nicely handled the question!)
I like Cameron too, and I like her complexities. She's got admirable qualities: she's the only one of the ducklings who looked at what her weaknesses were (House told her to be more assertive and fight for her opions) and she did something about it; when Vogler was going to fire someone, she was the only one to update her resume and look around for another job.
My problem is the lines some of the male writers put in her mouth (Moran and especially Kaplow). The "Do you like me?" in Control was early teenager, "House and I talked about our feelings" to Chase wasn't much better. Kaplow did it with Stacy too, in the "you'll always be the one but I can't be with you" speech. My daughter turned to me and said "I can't believe she said that", demonstrating that even the 15 year old female can identify bad writing. Real women don't behave like that, at least not ones as smart as they want us to believe Cameron and Stacy are.
Cameron should be 28 - 32 years old* and she's a widow. Jennifer Morrison dyed her blonde hair dark because she thought she should look more serious for the role. It doesn't do the character any favours when wardrobe and makeup make her look 16. After all, she's at least got to look professional when Kaplow makes her act like a 14 year old.
*3 - 4 years undergrad, 4 years of med school; 3 - 4 years of residency; 1 1/2 years with House.
And now anndra. This board moves fast! Good point about House eating LittleGirl Cameron alive.
I like Cameron too, and I like her complexities. She's got admirable qualities: she's the only one of the ducklings who looked at what her weaknesses were (House told her to be more assertive and fight for her opions) and she did something about it; when Vogler was going to fire someone, she was the only one to update her resume and look around for another job.
My problem is the lines some of the male writers put in her mouth (Moran and especially Kaplow). The "Do you like me?" in Control was early teenager, "House and I talked about our feelings" to Chase wasn't much better. Kaplow did it with Stacy too, in the "you'll always be the one but I can't be with you" speech. My daughter turned to me and said "I can't believe she said that", demonstrating that even the 15 year old female can identify bad writing. Real women don't behave like that, at least not ones as smart as they want us to believe Cameron and Stacy are.
Is it sexist for a professional woman to have some insight into how professional women actually dress? I think Cuddy is fun and attractive and I've gotten to accept her clothes, but it requires a huge suspension of disbelief to accept that the dean of medicine dresses like she slept her way into the job. (I've worked in hospitals and academics; the women at the top tend to be too busy to spend time on fashion; their skirts are lower and tops buttoned higher so they'll be taken seriously. Lower down the ladder, they're more likely to show up at work comfortable in loose sweaters and baggy pants.)it's just as sexist to assume that a couple of writers might have some special insight into costuming decisions just because they're women.
Cameron should be 28 - 32 years old* and she's a widow. Jennifer Morrison dyed her blonde hair dark because she thought she should look more serious for the role. It doesn't do the character any favours when wardrobe and makeup make her look 16. After all, she's at least got to look professional when Kaplow makes her act like a 14 year old.
*3 - 4 years undergrad, 4 years of med school; 3 - 4 years of residency; 1 1/2 years with House.
And now anndra. This board moves fast! Good point about House eating LittleGirl Cameron alive.
Edited by KatalynJ, Jun 13, 2005 @ 2:38 PM.
#29
Posted Jun 13, 2005 @ 9:56 AM
I think the writers are trying to show three different types of characters with their female leads, and how House reacts to each type: you've got Creampuff Cameron, Compassionate Conservative Cuddy, and now Solid Steel Stacy. House clearly doesn't respond to the creampuff type AT ALL. He feels like he's sinking into a vat of cotton candy, and he claws his way out at the first opportunity. The solid steel type--the challenging woman--attracts him, but the competition can get a little brutal at times, doing neither party any good. Cuddy may be the perfect compromise for House--strong enough to stand up to the snark, but with enough creampuff in her to prevent major damage.
As the golden middle ground, Cuddy gets the best deal in terms of characterization. If the writers want the fans to respond to both Stacy and (especially) Cameron next season, they're going to have give the former some compassion and give Cameron some spine without affecting her caretaker personality--which HAS been consistent.
As the golden middle ground, Cuddy gets the best deal in terms of characterization. If the writers want the fans to respond to both Stacy and (especially) Cameron next season, they're going to have give the former some compassion and give Cameron some spine without affecting her caretaker personality--which HAS been consistent.
#30
Posted Jun 13, 2005 @ 11:14 AM
I like the Cameron character -- she's one of the few female characters I've seen on TV who is smart and skilled at what she does, but still has social/emotional insecurities and vulnerability, yet she is not totally neurotic and self-absorbed. She has a lot of room for growth, which is interesting (to me) in a character. I just hope the writers will allow her character to grow and change in some not-so-cliched ways. (Less romance angst would be nice).
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