401 replies to this topic

[RiverThames]

Between the six-part opener, "Far Beyond the Stars" amd "In the Pale Moonlight", possibly Trek's boldest and most innovative season. Have at it.

[BanjoSteve]

I'm with you on Season 6, not so much on Season 5. In fact, I would put Season 6 as the second best season of Star Trek, after TNG season 5. I do think Far Beyond the Stars is a little overrated, though. It was cool to see everyone without makeup and in different characters and everything, and I give it credit for trying, but when Star Trek did issues shows in the past, they were always current issues. If TPTB wanted to make a show about racism, why not make it about today's racism? Sure, it's not as flashy now as it was in the '50s, but it's almost as bad, for that feature. Why not have Benny Russell be a guy who's on Death Row because he couldn't afford a decent lawyer, and the court-appointed guy couldn't handle his case because he was working on fifty others and tried to get him to plead out because all of his clients are guilty anyway. As it stands Far Beyond the Stars lets the viewer off easy, because we can turn off the TV and say, "wow it sure was bad back then" and be done with it.

[Cleo256]

Maybe the 1950s environment lets the viewer off a little easy, but I think if you set it in the present day it gets preachier. Suddenly you are talking about racism as it is today literally , and I think you're going to encounter more resistance from the audience, in the form of, "Oh, it's not really that bad." Whereas setting it in the 1950s gets today's audience on your side right away.

Also, the environment of 1950s New York and pulp sci-fi writers is way too much fun to pass up.

[SVNBob]

As I remarked in the old thread, I enjoyed the fact that on this cycle through the seasons, "FBtS" aired on Feb. 1st., the first day of Black History Month.

I think that setting the bulk of the episode in "our" past, but starting and ending it in "our" future was very valuable. The overall lesson I got from it was that while we may have come a long way since Benny's time, we've still got a much longer way (light-years even) to go before we can get to Ben's time.

[RiverThames]

"Far Beyond the Stars" also stood out because the issue at hand was that the lead character in Benny's story was black, and the publishers wanted to change that. That really struck me, since DS9 is the first show I can think of (and possibly the only one) where the lead character is black, and that it was really a non-issue in terms of the series as a whole. Which is exactly the sort of thing Trek should stand for.

[dbrugg]

The only other time I can remember DS9 dealing with human racism (a minor plot in "Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang"), they pulled a similar thing by talking about racism in our past (60s Vegas). But they also didn't dwell on it, so I'll move on.

[ciscokidinsf]

The only problem with Season 6 is that it effectively ran out of 'Creative Juice' after '...Pale Moonlight' The rest of that season, including the season finale, just were not up to snuff... but that is just a minor complaint.

[tothemax]

I didn't like the season finale because TPTB didn't try to hide Jadziah's death, AT ALL, and that was supposed to be the dramatic high point of the ep.

[Elenita]

I'd be happier if Jadzia hadn't been "seriously" injured twice in this season alone and recover perfectly, only to more or less drop dead from a column of Pagh-Wraith energy. Julian pulled a rabbit out of his medkit too many time for me to buy that.

And I still maintain that they should have switched the order of "The Sound of Her Voice" and "Change of Heart" and let her die in the latter.

[BanjoSteve]

And I still maintain that they should have switched the order of "The Sound of Her Voice" and "Change of Heart" and let her die in the latter.

Terry Farrell said as much on the DVD. She thought Worf should have let her die for the mission, since she was leaving the show anyway.

[Cleo256]

It might have been a better send-off for Jadzia, but I love "Change of Heart" for having Worf make the choice I never thought he would make, and making me believe his reasons for it. If he'd chosen the mission over Jadzia, that would have been exactly what I expected him to do, even if she died. I think it's much more surprising and challenging and interesting for him to choose her over the mission.

[Elenita]

See, in my ideal version of "Change of Heart", Worf chooses Jadzia over the mission but gets there too late. That way, Worf makes the emotional choice--always tough for him--and Jadzia dies on a mission she believes in. And her cause of death is the Jem'Hadar, not an insane and possessed caricature of Dukat.

[Cleo256]

I suppose, but "Change of Heart" might have been too tragic then. I like that the episode ends with Worf making his choice and being happy with it. To take away both the mission and Jadzia would have destroyed him, and would have had depressing long-term implications.

I totally agree that her death in "Tears of the Prophets" is borderline comical and needed to be way better.

[Elenita]

And I just re-watched "Rocks and Shoals" and still want to beat Keevan's face to a pulp.

Amazing how the quality of the episodes doesn't degrade even after all these years, isn't it?

Edit: The more I watch S6, the weirder Damar seems. "Bajorans could use a lesson in respect?" Man, the difference 32 episodes can make...

Edited by Elenita, Mar 5, 2005 @ 11:28 PM.

[prophetreturns]

I just got my season six DVDs from Amazon this week. What a beautiful color design! Now all I need are seasons one and seven and my DVD collection will finally be complete and I can stop relying on my tapes.

[Curare]

How come the Dominion never sent another fleet after the warmhole was de-mined? It's not like the Founders care about the lives of of the Jem'Hadar.

Edited by Curare, May 6, 2005 @ 12:04 PM.

[MysticalGirl]

It was implied in Sacrifice of Angels (or maybe stated outright, I'm going from memory here) that the Prophets would not allow any more Dominion fleets through the wormhole.

[BanjoSteve]

Also, there was a big joint Federation and Klingon task force right outside the wormhole after DS9 was taken back, with many ships in or near Cardassian space ready to swoop in. They could have thrown a bunch of ships at them but they probably would have lost.

[Curare]

Thank you! This was bothering the hell out of me.

[keckler]

Man, alive! Season five was damn good but season six is kicking our asses with its amazingness! We just finished "Far Beyond the Stars" and I lost it. Lost it! Right there on the Cal Train. Bawling.

God, I LOVE this series!

Edited by keckler, Sep 8, 2005 @ 1:22 AM.

[Elenita]

Not that I want to make you cry again, keckler, but I definitely recommend a second viewing. There are so many subtle touches that are so easy to miss the first time around.

So glad that you and Mathra have made it this far. No Niner is complete without having seen that episode (not to mention one coming up...).

[Unusual Suspect]

Man, alive! Season five was damn good but season six is kicking our asses with its amazingness! We just finished "Far Beyond the Stars" and I lost it. Lost it! Right there on the Cal Train. Bawling.

God, I LOVE this series!

Just be glad you're watching it after recapping Enterprise, it was really hard to tolerate Voyager and Enterprise's mediocrity after DS9.

[Sandbagger1]

Season Six definitely rates right up there. So many good episodes, even some of the silly, mood-lightening ones, such as You Are Cordially Invited. I am looking forward to keckler's first reaction to my favorite episode In the Pale Moonlight.

[tothemax]

Man, alive! Season five was damn good but season six is kicking our asses with its amazingness! We just finished "Far Beyond the Stars" and I lost it. Lost it! Right there on the Cal Train. Bawling.

God, I LOVE this series!

I'm getting goosebumps just sitting at my desk thinking about that episode. Damn!

[BigBeagle]

And you haven't even gotten to my favorite episode of the season, keckler. But I have to admit, "Far Beyond the Stars" was fantastic.

[smgkansas]

Man, alive! Season five was damn good but season six is kicking our asses with its amazingness! We just finished "Far Beyond the Stars" and I lost it. Lost it! Right there on the Cal Train. Bawling.

God, I LOVE this series!

And it just keeps up. Not everything that they tried worked, but I always loved that they were willing to take the risk of trying to stretch. And they had so much story going on that, had they chosen, they could probably have easily gone another couple of years just without really having to introduce much in the way of new storylines. I will always love that rather than staggering to the end, they raced to the finish line and leaped across. This show will always have a special place in my heart.

[Rielynn]

After reading keckler's reaction, I got a craving and had to watch "Far Beyond the Stars" again, and it's still awesome as always. It's the only episode of Trek I have recorded for posterity, and I had to wait six years to see it since my local UPN station switched to WB right after "Who Morns for Morn?". I used to read about DS9 on the bulletin board of a local freenet (back in the Internet's pioneer days) and it was killing me to read all the raves over FBTS and have no way to see it.

Since this episode has been brought up again, I was wondering if anyone knows anything about it having been written by a fan? Because I remember reading that on the board at the time. There was an interview posted with a Trek producer (I think) talking about what makes a fan episode successful and how important it is to really know the characters. Does this ring a bell with anyone?

Edited by Rielynn, Sep 8, 2005 @ 3:02 PM.