Jump to content

Foyle's War


  • Please log in to reply

593 replies to this topic

#451

adelaide97

adelaide97

    Video Archivist

Posted May 8, 2010 @ 1:13 AM

And Thank Bloody Heaven Andrew appears to be permanently out of the picture.

I agree that the Andrew character was a tool. But Julian Ovenden really brought the pretty. And I loved seeing Foyle bask in the awesomeness he perceived his son to possess.

It's so weird to see Foyle driving himself. Totally expected but weird.

I liked the reference to Fifty Ships when Foyle said he may go to America to tidy up some "unfinished business." That scene from Fifty Ships is a favorite; "You have not escaped justice, you have merely postponed it."

I so hope this happens.

And just a couple of nits. I wish they'd come up with some sort of explanation for why Foyle (and Sam?) would go to London and not see Andrew. I also would have liked to see Foyle introducing himself as "I'm a policeman. Name's Foyle."

Edited by adelaide97, May 9, 2010 @ 3:51 PM.

  • 0

#452

Cgr

Cgr

    Fanatic

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 6:42 AM

Last night's episode seemed so reminiscent of the Jamaican in England WWII that we saw a few weeks ago. But I must admit I didn't know the US commander would be in on the whole thing. The one armed man I knew was up to something. And the Sarg was telephoning his involvement. But the commander never.

Then we watched out DVRed episode of Life on Mars and what does it have but a racial problem with Pakistani's!
  • 0

#453

Francie Nolan

Francie Nolan

    Couch Potato

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 8:35 AM

I'm pretty proud of myself as I solved both the mysteries last night long before Foyle and Co. Although, considering how much I usually suuuuuuck at figuring out whodunit maybe that's a point against the writers.

Trying to find a delicate way to put this...am I the only one who sort of wished Foyle had been just a little less than completely open minded and supportive of Mandy and Gabe's relationship? I mean, yes, Foyle is our hero and a paragon of all that is right and good and tea and biscuits, and while I do enjoy when he makes his speeches about the evils of segregation or instabonds with Gabe over fishing lures, it's 19-bloody-45! I think, realistically speaking, he's allowed to be slightly uneasy about the whole situation without it making him evil and it would have been a much more earned and satisfying conclusion if he became more accepting as the case unfolded ala the ex-boyfriend, Tony.

I can sort of understand Sam not having any hang-ups. She's a hopeless romantic and has always had a bit of a problem seeing the big picture when it comes to Love Conquering All, but Foyle? I guess it just bugged me that everyone kept trying to sweep under the rug the hugely difficult uphill battle an interracial relationship would have been at that time. I wanted to smack Sam when she kept glaring at Adam for quite sensibly pointing out that as sympathetic as he was to Mandy's situation he was running a business and he might have to ask her to leave if her presence became more trouble than it was worth. And Sgt.Calhoun, racist corrupt bully that he was, in his own effed up way seemed to be attempting to protect Gabe when he graphically described to Mandy what could happen to them.

Course, YMMV. I'm just relieved the case didn't end with Sam and Adam getting married and adopting the kid as they seemed to be foreshadowing because then I would have had to throw up my hands at the complete lack of realism.

In other news, Sam and Adam are now an unmarried couple living together in a guesthouse with no guests. Can I hope that this shocking development will lead to another visit from the Rev. Stewart?
  • 0

#454

bijoux83

bijoux83

    Stalker

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 11:23 AM

In other news, Sam and Adam are now an unmarried couple living together in a guesthouse with no guests. Can I hope that this shocking development will lead to another visit from the Rev. Stewart?

Ha! That would indeed be quite awesome.
  • 0

#455

Calicocat

Calicocat

    Video Archivist

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 12:05 PM

I'm pretty proud of myself as I solved both the mysteries last night long before Foyle and Co. Although, considering how much I usually suuuuuuck at figuring out whodunit maybe that's a point against the writers.


As soon as the CO said that he would have to see Mandy again to be sure she wasn't being coerced I knew he'd either be the killer or the victim.

am I the only one who sort of wished Foyle had been just a little less than completely open minded and supportive of Mandy and Gabe's relationship?


I did sometimes feel as though I was watching a very special episode of Foyle's War.

I think Foyle's open-mindedness came in part from a perception of racism and segregation as American traits. The willingness of the rest of the town council (or whatever they are) to cooperate and accept those traits just reinforced his sense that Britons should regard skin color the same as hair color. I do wish that somebody else had voted with Foyle or an American had expressed disgust for segregation and the British for going along with it. It would have lessened the sense that Foyle and Sam are different from everyone else.

I'm just relieved the case didn't end with Sam and Adam getting married and adopting the kid as they seemed to be foreshadowing because then I would have had to throw up my hands at the complete lack of realism.


I thought for a second the marriage and adoption was going to happen.
  • 0

#456

attica finch

attica finch

    Stalker

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 1:36 PM

My favorite moment was when Foyle delivered the fish to Sam, whereupon she marveled "What a catch!" Yes, quite. ::wink wink::

It took me until this morning, and with the aid of the interwebs, to place the actress who played Mandy as the most recent Wuthering Heights's Cathy. I was better with placing the other actors I recognized; all done before the final act. Papa Boleyn! Mean wife from Collision (as well as a Marple turn in a black wig)! Sketchy American special ops dude from Spooks!
  • 0

#457

ThomasAAnderson

ThomasAAnderson

    Couch Potato

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 2:21 PM

and while I do enjoy when he makes his speeches about the evils of segregation or instabonds with Gabe over fishing lures, it's 19-bloody-45! I think, realistically speaking, he's allowed to be slightly uneasy about the whole situation without it making him evil and it would have been a much more earned and satisfying conclusion if he became more accepting as the case unfolded ala the ex-boyfriend, Tony.


I actually appreciated that they went the way they did. I've always hated those very special episodes where racists are suddenly having the black folks over for Sunday dinner. The racists I've encountered are usually frustrated by being unable to pigeonhole and just slap on the exception to the rule label.

Gabe was very handsome hope to see him in more projects.

And to whoever said Sam needs moisturizer--Amen. HD is not kind to her.

Edited by ThomasAAnderson, May 10, 2010 @ 2:23 PM.

  • 0

#458

ovrdedge

ovrdedge

    Fanatic

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 2:47 PM

I was better with placing the other actors I recognized; all done before the final act. Papa Boleyn! Mean wife from Collision (as well as a Marple turn in a black wig)! Sketchy American special ops dude from Spooks!

Adam James who played the killer Major, was memorably, the twice-conned mark from Hustler who kept erupting in hilariously enraged "ARSE!" Although he's also popped up on Doctor Who and Secret Diary of a Call Girl. I thought he pulled off one of the better American accents I've heard, in the sense that although it did slip a little at times, it did not make me full on cringe and wince. They need to get him to play an American on Spooks because that show has major problems casting British actors who can do American accents.
  • 0

#459

Cgr

Cgr

    Fanatic

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 3:58 PM

am I the only one who sort of wished Foyle had been just a little less than completely open minded and supportive of Mandy and Gabe's relationship?


I did sometimes feel as though I was watching a very special episode of Foyle's War.

I think Foyle's open-mindedness came in part from a perception of racism and segregation as American traits.


I honestly wondered why there was a slight outrage at the unwed mother!
  • 0

#460

gules

gules

    Loyal Viewer

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 5:08 PM

IMDB claims that 'Killing Time' was written by David Kane rather than Anthony Horowitz, which could explain the excessive moralizing. Calhoun was believable, the rest of the characters seemed poorly written and blandly acted.
  • 0

#461

bearlock7

bearlock7

    Couch Potato

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 5:33 PM

While what the racist sergeant said was awful, it was also kind of true. Those three (including the baby) were going to face some really major problems and I got the feeling that those issues were being swept to the side somewhat. I'm not up on my social history, but would things really have been all that easy for them in Harlem? It kind of took me out of the story. That and the extreme open-mindedness of our heroes without any (natural) hesitation or questioning. It reminded me a little of a few Little House on the Prairie episodes. At the same time, though, if Foyle had expressed doubts or concerns and gotten over them, that might have pushed it even further into VSE territory for me. Hard to say. But something about this episode didn't hit me right.

Actually, I can say that about the other two episodes as well. I've seen the final episode thanks to a preview copy and I'm looking forward to hearing what other people think. My initial reaction wasn't exactly enthusiastic. I'm trying to remember now what bugged me about the episode involving the Russians. Things this season feel a bit heavy-handed or simplistic and I sometimes find myself getting annoyed with Foyle. I don't like that feeling.

Edited by bearlock7, May 10, 2010 @ 5:34 PM.

  • 0

#462

LivenLetLive

LivenLetLive

    Fanatic

Posted May 10, 2010 @ 7:56 PM

And Sgt.Calhoun, racist corrupt bully that he was, in his own effed up way seemed to be attempting to protect Gabe when he graphically described to Mandy what could happen to them.


The best written speech in the episode; it seemed so horrifyingly real, although I couldn't place Calhoun's accent, was he supposed to be southern? I agree about Killer Major's accent, decent with the occasional slip into stock east coastese.

Sigh, as with "Small Island" the horrible racism of the American Soldiers made me cringe, and considering that the UK is home to "The National Front" not to mention home-grown WW2 Fascists such as Oswald Mosley, I would say that there has been some rose-colored glasses wearing on the part of the writers of these scripts vis a vis how accepting white Britain was in the period (no doubt better than the USA, but still..)
  • 0

#463

attica finch

attica finch

    Stalker

Posted May 11, 2010 @ 9:39 AM

I'm not up on my social history, but would things really have been all that easy for them in Harlem?

Yeah, probably. Harlem was, at that time, still in it's 'renaissance' and was a cosmopolitan center of literary and cultural life. Mandy wouldn't have been the only white woman married to a black man there. Especially among musicians, as Gabe was. Probably, the best choice for them.
  • 0

#464

Tim McD

Tim McD

    Fanatic

Posted May 11, 2010 @ 10:12 AM

although I couldn't place Calhoun's accent, was he supposed to be southern?


Sounded to me like upstate New York, though I'm not sure the horrors he described to Mandy happened in that region. Maybe American Northeastern is the default accent Brit actors fall into when portraying Americans. Great choice of actor, just right for the part with his menacing sneer and thick neck.

During the dinner scene I thought the murder was going to be a poisoning, what with all the closeups of the sugar going into the tea cups. Damn producers mislead me again!

I liked Foyle encouraging his not-too-confident young segeant when leaving him in charge of the crime scene. "You can do it!" Like a dad with his kid at a soccer game.
  • 0

#465

willame

willame

    Just Tuned In

Posted May 13, 2010 @ 11:12 AM

although I couldn't place Calhoun's accent, was he supposed to be southern?


Sounded to me like upstate New York, though I'm not sure the horrors he described to Mandy happened in that region.


Unfortunately, lynchings in the US happened everywhere and for many different reasons. http://www.law.umkc....hingsstate.html
  • 0

#466

beadgirl

beadgirl

    Fanatic

Posted May 13, 2010 @ 5:51 PM

There were certainly lots of horrible racial incidents at that time, but also lots of successful interracial marriages (more in the north than the south, of course), so I don't think they were sweeping problems under the rug by having the characters be determined to go through with/approve of the marriage. And besides, how would anything change if no one ever crossed color boundaries?

I'm just glad Gabe got the baby. Enjoy Harlem, Gabe, and buy a brownstone for your daughter to sell for a fortune in the early part of the 21st century.

Edited by beadgirl, May 13, 2010 @ 5:53 PM.

  • 0

#467

Cgr

Cgr

    Fanatic

Posted May 14, 2010 @ 6:16 AM

We kept wondering why they didn't stay in England. Seemed like life would have been mildly easier for them there.
  • 0

#468

dustylil

dustylil

    Stalker

Posted May 15, 2010 @ 8:13 PM

We kept wondering why they didn't stay in England. Seemed like life would have been mildly easier for them there.

They still would have had to go to the States until Gabe completed his military service if they wanted to remain together. Or more likely, Mandy with the baby arriving some months later as a war bride. Also, I wonder how difficult it would have been for Gabe to emigrate to Britain had they decided that it would be less problematic for them to live there rather than in Harlem.

considering that the UK is home to "The National Front" not to mention home-grown WW2 Fascists such as Oswald Mosley, I would say that there has been some rose-colored glasses wearing on the part of the writers of these scripts vis a vis how accepting white Britain was in the period (no doubt better than the USA, but still..)

The British military had been racially integrated for decades - if not longer - with no particular problems. That may have accounted for Foyle's distaste for those particular American policies and the treatment of individual soldiers.

I too was a bit surprised at the casual acceptance of the unwed mother. That really didn't ring true for that era. At the very least I would have expected Mandy to have told Sam and others that her husband had been killed in battle soon after their marriage. And then have the truth revealed during the course of the episode.

Edited by dustylil, May 15, 2010 @ 8:20 PM.

  • 0

#469

Francie Nolan

Francie Nolan

    Couch Potato

Posted May 16, 2010 @ 9:33 PM

No money, no job, no home, no prospects, and surrounded by dust and debris of a bombed out failure of a boarding house.


I couldn't have picked a more perfectly romanatic setting for Sam's marriage proposal! When he picked her up and carried her out...swoon!


I liked Adam's character from the very beginning, he was the proper mix of practical and romantic to keep Ms. Stewart interested, and was rooting for him to be the love interest she finally settled down with. So gleeful at the way the story wrapped up--and almost wish for a spin off of the adventures of PM Wainright and his wife (and dozens of children!) Perhaps an occasional cameo from Uncle Christopher? All the children can call him 'Sir.'

Speaking of children, not quite clear on the timeline. Was Foyle James/Jack's babydaddy? Or did Caroline end the affair because she was pregnant with her husband's child? It doesn't help matters of paternity that James seems to have inherited the Foyle Hairline.

Poor Milner. I hope for the safety of Brighton that he eventually figures out how to solve a case on his own. Or at least how to find better assistants.
  • 0

#470

CalAggie

CalAggie

    Fanatic

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 12:42 AM

I was wondering if Foyle were the father when he took such an interest in the case -- at first I thought that was the direction the story was heading: I got a vibe he was the father. Then I thought I had watched too many soaps and was wrong. Then the I was pleased picking out that Foyle had a relationship with Mrs. Devereaux, but was unclear if i was right about the parentage. I guess if he was then he really would not say because that would mean James/Jack would have to give up whatever title he had and his estate. Though in a sense it would probably make James/Jack feel better that the father he thought killed his mother was not his real father.

Why was Foyle going to the States? He said something about the Americans probably not likely a former cop from England snooping around, what did he mean by that?

And I thought the proposal was pretty cute too? I do not have the best of memories regarding FOYLE'S WAR, but didn't we first meet Sam when her building was bombed?

Edited by CalAggie, May 17, 2010 @ 12:44 AM.

  • 0

#471

McBrien76

McBrien76

    Couch Potato

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 2:19 AM

Why was Foyle going to the States? He said something about the Americans probably not likely a former cop from England snooping around, what did he mean by that?


From a Q&A with Anthony Horowitz:

In the new series, Foyle mentions several times that he's going to America, and at the end of the third episode we see him boarding a ship. What's he up to?

If you go back to an episode called "Fifty Ships" [from Series II], you'll find that there's a character named Howard Paige, played by Henry Goodman, who was a murderer who got away. Foyle swore that after the war he would track him down.

http://www.pbs.org/w...r/horowitz.html
  • 0

#472

DesiJ

DesiJ

    Couch Potato

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 2:49 PM

I left the room for a few seconds, and when I come back the hotel is in ruins. What the hell happened?
  • 0

#473

Arnold Robinson

Arnold Robinson

    Fanatic

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 2:56 PM

A plot device exploded.
  • 0

#474

Cgr

Cgr

    Fanatic

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 5:31 PM

I assume it was a UXB.
  • 0

#475

Nagem983

Nagem983

    Channel Surfer

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 5:35 PM

A plot device exploded.

LOL

It could be that I wasn't paying enough attention but I didn't understand what happened here either.
  • 0

#476

Arnold Robinson

Arnold Robinson

    Fanatic

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 6:28 PM

I assume it was a UXB.

Well, yeah, but it was just so dumb. "Oh, yay, we saved the neighborhood, the green, and the ramshackle old dump!" <kablammo> "Oh well, let's get hitched!"
  • 0

#477

sonbulat

sonbulat

    Just Tuned In

Posted May 17, 2010 @ 8:32 PM

I'm not sure if it was a crazy PBS edit or a glitch in my DVR,but the recording jumped from Foyle telling Jack that Agnes is dead to the next scene. Who killed Agnes? Why? And why did Jack keep quiet?
  • 0

#478

elle

elle

    Fanatic

Posted May 18, 2010 @ 9:42 PM

sonbulat, here is a shorthand version of the resolution.

Did you see the part where they introduced the other Jack Somebody who was also in the British Free Corps (I think that was the name)? Both he and James-Jack were in Dresden. Jack Somebody figured out that James-Jack was passing on information to the British by writing someone named Agnes. He seemed amused by it and promised not to turn James-Jack in. During the bombing of Dresden, they were separated. Jack S. thought that James-Jack had been killed. When he came back from the war, Jack S. claimed that he was the Jack of the letters and was welcomed back with open arms, so to speak. When James-Jack was arrested, Jack S. realized that all this might come out into the open and that the only people beside him and James-Jack that knew who was the real Jack was the recipient of the letters - Agnes. He found her, under the premise of having information about James-Jack set up a meeting with her where he strangled her.

Foyle gets James-Jack to finally admit that he was the Jack of the letters. I suppose after finding out that Agnes was dead, he realized that he had to speak in order to have her murderer caught. It was implied that James-Jack could prove it by explaining the code in the letters. It would then just be a matter of arresting Jack S. (small scene) and going through whatever procedures needed to be done to have James-Jack exonerated and released from prison.

The why of it all - Jack felt that his father had to be punished and that by keeping quiet, being found a traitor and sentenced to hang would accomplish that. The reason was because as a child, he had seen his father bludgeon his mother to death.*

*What I don't understand was what kind of "tragic accident" was the mother supposed to have had to explain her death because that is how it had been described before the reveal. She fell? Met up with a tramp on their private estate? What?

Armed with this information, Foyle goes back to Sir Charles' estate and confronts him with this information. Sir Charles' excuse for all this was that she had wanted to leave and that "no one in his family ever divorced, not for 100s of years". Milner arrests Sir Charles' for the wife's murder.

(okay - maybe not so much a 'shorthand version', eh?)

The question was brought up as to the possibility that James was possibly Foyle's son. I don't think so. She was already married to Sir Charles when she met Foyle as a volunteer nurse. It could be debated about what exactly Foyle meant when he told James that "he knew her" (his mother). I got the impression that their time together had been very short and she had felt obligated to return to her husband as it would be best for the child.

Going back to an earlier scene, I did have a snicker at the sergeant's unease around horses. The actor did a good job making it look like he really didn't know what to make of them. A couple of quibbles - I'm not sure if the humor was appropriate at the time Milner is telling Agnes' friend that she had been murdered. Also, wouldn't most folk, even city folk, know the difference between a stallion and a mare?
  • 0

#479

graculas

graculas

    Just Tuned In

Posted May 19, 2010 @ 7:41 AM

Wasn't the mother supposed to have been trampled to death by a herd of deer? I expected Sir Charles to murder her with some of the antlers they'd got hanging around, but he just bludgeoned her to death in a very un-deerlike way.
  • 1

#480

attica finch

attica finch

    Stalker

Posted May 19, 2010 @ 9:02 AM

Wasn't the mother supposed to have been trampled to death by a herd of deer?

Better. (If by better I mean more outlandish, and I do) Gored by deer antlers.
  • 0