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Rob C.


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#331

Yogurt Baron

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Posted May 18, 2012 @ 1:49 AM

Yeah, it was unfair of me to suggest that Rob C. is as braggadocious and nasty as Russell just because a couple of confessionals. I asked before, I think: did he do any commentaries on the Amazon DVDs? (I'm away from my DVDs this week, but will check those out eventually.)

Rob had options


Is Rob the best ever at "having options"? That's a sincere question - I think he might be. And he deserves a lot of credit for that.

I still think it's ridiculous that he realized he was fourth because Alex told him he was fourth. Probably always will. But I'll grant you that he built his game in a way that that he could flip easily.

Robb from Thailand was kind of an aggressive jerk who didn't need that extra b. Can we agree about that Robb?

Edited by Yogurt Baron, May 18, 2012 @ 1:51 AM.


#332

Bob Sambob

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Posted May 18, 2012 @ 2:01 AM

Is Rob the best ever at "having options"? That's a sincere question - I think he might be. And he deserves a lot of credit for that.

No. That would be Kim. She had the all-women's alliance AND the NuSalani alliance. If Colton had not been med-evac'd and his reign of terror had continued, she had the firepower to take him down. I do think Rob at F7 was kinda similar -- it's just that he had to burn one group for the other. On the other hand, Kim had it set up that the core of both alliance options (herself, Chelsea, Sabrina and Kat) was the same, so the burning wasn't as explicit. It was remarkable.

Edited by Bob Sambob, May 18, 2012 @ 2:03 AM.


#333

Unconditional

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Posted May 18, 2012 @ 2:03 AM

Up to and including the Deena boot, there were no strong, lasting alliances. It was, "Roger's a sexist. He's gotta go. Dave's an immunity threat. He's gotta go. Deena's a strategic threat. Now she's gotta go." And so on. Very moment-to-moment. No real strategic thinking, no real alliances...except for Jenna and Heidi, who were obviously close, and Alex, who was obviously their third.


Those first two boots occurred because of the strong alliance consisting of Rob/Alex/Jenna/Heidi. The two boots that occurred after that, Deena and Alex, occurred because Rob flipped out of that alliance after he was told he was on the bottom. There was obviously strategic thinking and obviously a real alliance, and Rob was responsible for both.


And when you say "it had never been done before", what's "it"? Being at F8 and choosing to go to F4 with the people who'll give you the likeliest shot at the win? I agree: it had never been done before Amazon, except in every season by every winner.


No. One, that's not what actually happened, and two, that's not even true in itself. He flipped out of the dominant alliance in order to create the next dominant alliance, with the people that had no power initially.

and then who came fifteenth in his second try, bragging about how good he was all the while.


And no, that didn't actually happen the way you're describing it. Watch some ASS commentary. Rob's real criticism with ASS was that he was put on a tribe with two people that were already dating, and Rob (Mariano) went out of his way to snake him (Cestrenino) when he could have just voted him out like normal. His complaints with the season had absolutely nothing to do with the caliber of players that outlasted him. However, both he, Jenna, Lex, and practically everyone else involved did accurately state that the ASS season essentially progressed with a very basic theme: take out the people that lasted the longest. That's why you can look at the F7 (sans Big Tom) and see that most of these players had no control of the game in their original season and were really simply learning on the fly. That's valid criticism, because it's true and entirely accurate, but it still doesn't mean that he thought he was better than the people that had just voted him out.

Rob made comments during the season that he has recanted later in an effort to show appreciation for those he may have inadvertently slighted. He has been a great statesmen for this show, and in no way does he have some self-absorbed opinion of himself.

If I had seen Rob, the random, awkward jokester, take over the game, come close, make some great plays and some big mistakes, and ultimately come third, I might like him more.


It's funny because that's exactly what happened. Except for the awkward jokester part, because throughout the show he cited his humor as being a strategy with certain people. He did take over the game, essentially twice. I don't think Rob even made any "big" mistakes either. Jenna did win her way down the stretch and Rob was going to have to pay a price for simply staying in the game, because the choice was going out at F5/F7 or sticking around with a chance to see the FTC.

#334

Yogurt Baron

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Posted May 18, 2012 @ 3:48 AM

You make good points, Unconditional, especially sharing the context of Rob's "I was voted out unfairly" routine after ASS. And for what it's worth - I don't have the DVDs here - I seem to remember him being a real jerk in his final words and/or jury speech in the Amazon, but the TWOP recap doesn't back me up on that. So I might have been all wrong about Rob.

He has been a great statesmen for this show


I've said it before, and will say it again just to be clear: Rob Cesternino, the guy with the podcast, is a Survivor legend/hero/icon. No other player has done more to promote the show after appearing on it, or to engage with the community of fans. Heck, you could argue that no one to ever appear on a TV show has done more to engage with its fans than Rob. He deserves to be (and I think he already is) in the Survivor Hall of Fame...as a contributor to the game, like Probst or the guy who writes the music. As a builder, he's Kenesaw Mountain Landis. As a player, he's Keith Hernandez. For me. But that's what's great about the show: your mastermind is my mediocrity, and we can all find people to love, people to hate, and people to love to hate. Rob's performance in the Amazon puts him in the last category, not the second, for me.

#335

Isuzu

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Posted May 19, 2012 @ 5:00 PM

I think your premice that Rob was the clear fourth in his alliance with Alex-Heidi-Jenna and that it was or should have been obvious to him is simply erroneous. I totally undersand why he, Rob, at the time, thought that wasn't the case, and I also agree with Bob Sambob that what Alex told him was just his view of the situation, which was not especially what Jenna and Heidi were thinking or planning on doing. Think about it: if they're the F4 and Jenna or Heidi wins immunity, who would they take out? The strong, ahletic dude that might win immunity at F3 or the goody, funny dude who was less likely to do so? Additionally, Rob could have planned on any remaining Tambaqui loyalty with Alex first and foremost. When Alex told him he was fourth, I think that meant he was Alex's fourth, which was enough for Rob to boot him, because that meant that, in that hypothetical F4, Alex would side with the girls against him. If there was a mistake made by Rob, it was to go with suche a close knit duo as Jenna/Heidi were, because they wouldn't vote against one another at F4/F3 and that was dangerous...

...but the other assumption you make is also erroneous. No, Rob didn't have the choice to go with an existing three person alliance at F7 or a band of misfits he could control. He was a founding member of the alliance. So if he had gone with the others at that point in time, he would have effectively betrayed Alex-Jenna-Heidi and lost all their votes immediately for flipping. Alex's blunder gave him the ammo to jump the gun on them and justify it later if needed.

Finally, there's the fact that Rob didn't want to align with the misfits in the first place because he thought they were far to likeable to be allowed anywhere near FTC. He knew he'd make enemies in the game and needed people the jury hated more than himself to win. His mistake was vieiwing the game he was in as if he were a fan at home. He correctly guessed that Jenna would be hated by the viewers when she apparently was quite beloved in the game. Hence the scene at F6 where he tries to make her promise a F2 pact because she's so unlikeable. He thought if he went to the FTC with the loveable principal or the challenge monster or the poor deaf girl he was screwed, so he tried to align with who he thought were people that were less likely to win in the FTC than he was.

Edited by Isuzu, May 19, 2012 @ 5:02 PM.