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Coral: putting the capital E in E.Ville


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#1

String Theory

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Posted Dec 31, 2003 @ 8:40 PM

Maybe it's just because I deal with litigation, so, in most arguments are presided over by a judge, but I still can't draw any parallels between Coral's personality and the successful attorneys for whom I've worked. I'm not going to say that all lawyers are wonderful, altrusitic people who've been unfairly stereotyped... becuase, well, some of them are whiny, spoiled bullies as String Theory states. (Also, the OJ Simpson trial is not really a good example because that was the epitome of "exception to the rule". Ito had no control over that courtroom and turned it into a freakin' media circus. I have never seen a courtroom run so poorly.)


Ryanne, I worked entirely in corporate law so I see where you were coming from with your point (the two are different beasts). And who would/could disagree with you about the OJ trial being a media circus (complete with clowns and everything). The reason I used the OJ trial as an example was primarily to show how the million-dollar guys (OJ's lawyers) behaved in a lot of ways like Coral and, while that judge let them get away with a rediculous amount of crap, they also brought that crap to the trial (and they'd presumably pulled the same crap in other trials before OJ although they probably didn't do it to the extent that they did in the OJ trial and probably hadn't gotten away with it as easily).

I definately agree with some of the stuff posted about her breaking down when someone challenges her (like when Mike voted her to the gauntlet) and I definately have problems with the fact that at times she is a bully. But I do think that she is strong (and her being a bully and hating to be challenged doesn't necessarily conflict with her being strong overall). She doesn't let people treat her like crap (Sarah, I'm looking at you) and she doesn't have a problem voicing her opinion (RW team I'm looking at you for not challenging her more when you know she's doing/say some dumb shit). But that whole thing with her and Elka was a reeeeal turnoff so I do think she has poor judgement at times too. She should use her powers for good and not evil.

#2

Jemynye

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Posted Dec 31, 2003 @ 9:18 PM

But when she's up against someone with a little more brainpower, as when that friend of Malik's came to visit early in the season, he shut her down cold--she literally had nothing to say to him, because there was nothing she could say. She just glared at him.


Yes, I remember the episode where Malik's friend discussed Mike with Coral. The guy was very calm, articulate, intelligent and she had enough sense to let the subject go. She couldn't break down Adam or Stephen for that matter. I can't imagine her getting the better of Nicole. Coral knows who to and not to attack. I'm not convinced that Coral would be a good litigator based on those she's chosen to be abrasive and confrontation with amongst the cast.

#3

Bosco

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Posted Dec 31, 2003 @ 10:24 PM

Yeah. But abrasive and confrontational can work as a lawyer in the right court circut... maybe injury law?

#4

Douggley

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Posted Jan 1, 2004 @ 1:39 AM

She couldn't break down Adam or Stephen for that matter.


I think she broke down both. She didn't get Adam when their seasons had that little trip to Morocco, but when she was discussing Sarah with Adam, she basically had him beat. He was mumbling "well. umm...I don't think..you can say what's fair?" and she had a point for everything he said. She also managed to make this point in a decently classy and calm manner. I'd say this is when Coral is at her best - when she uses logic instead of name-calling and intimidation. Yeah, Adam's not a genius, but she was pretty impressive in dealing with him.
Whenever I think of Coral and Stephen I think of that scene where she's looking over the ocean, and he comes up to talk to her. He's talking about how his mother is a strong black woman, and she should respect him. Coral shuts him down, just like she did with Adam. She's calm and collected, "I don't care about your mother. Please stay away from me."
Now someone like Puck, Malik's friend, or even a Heather B. could have Coral reeling very quickly. But Adam? Please.

#5

String Theory

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Posted Jan 1, 2004 @ 1:43 AM

Yeah. But abrasive and confrontational can work as a lawyer in the right court circut... maybe injury law?


My point exactly. Her backing down from those arguments has nothing to do with whether or not she would make a good attorney because every attorney has to pick and choose their battles. You can't win every case and every argument (and you're definately going to lose a few because that's life and the nature of the beast). As an attorney you would assess the firm/attorney on the other side of the table before making a decision about whether or not to take a case (of course there are many other factors in deciding to take a case). If it's a firm/attorney with an amazing record (in terms of winning cases), then you would seriously consider whether you'd want to take the case and, if you took the case, you'd devise a strategy that hopefully won't end in you getting your butt kicked. If the firm/lawyer you're up against comes across as weak (or has a bad record), it increases your chances of winning and you go for it full throttle.

Coral knows who to and not to attack.


So does a good attorney.

Edited by String Theory, Jan 1, 2004 @ 1:47 AM.


#6

Jemynye

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Posted Jan 1, 2004 @ 7:59 AM

I think she broke down both.


I disagree. Adam seemed pretty disinterested in what Coral said IMO. Towards the end of that conversation, Coral's tone of voice and body language changed from that of a gently reprimanding mom to one that seemed to say I like you Adam, let's laugh about this. Also, Adam has continued to vote for Sarah and the team did return her to the gauntlet despite Coral's two cents. I think the RRs team was right to often place Sarah's name on the ballot because overall, she has not been a strong competitor.

Stephen's a person who definitely seems to have issues. However, Coral didn't break him down from what I saw. Actually, I think that they are similar in some ways. They are both rude and make big deals out nothing and intimidate others with anger and like to have the last word. I think during their confrontations, Stephen out-bitched Coral, she was shaken, so she and her minions voted him off.

If Coral was so logical, she wouldn't treat others as she does. She wouldn't have gone after Matt, tried to save Elka, taken advantage of Mike, or picked fights (that she didn't win) with Adam, Stephen, and Ellen.

The only time I have been supportive of Coral during a confrontation was she talked to Jisela about not being fair to Malik.

I guess Coral would be a good attorney if she only has to deal with people who can't handle confrontation like Mike, Lori, and Rachel.

Edited by Jemynye, Jan 1, 2004 @ 8:18 AM.


#7

String Theory

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Posted Jan 1, 2004 @ 10:29 AM

If Coral was so logical, she wouldn't treat others as she does. She wouldn't have gone after Matt, tried to save Elka, taken advantage of Mike, or picked fights (that she didn't win) with Adam, Stephen, and Ellen.


Coral is an extremely aggressive person so her actions are very logical. Matt was a threat to her ideology so she had to get rid of him, Elka thought a lot like Coral and wanted to get rid of Matt too so she befriended Elka as her cohort to get rid of him (and to guarantee that at least one person would not vote her into the gauntlet), Mike is intellectually challenged and is very easy to manipulate so she used that to her advantage, and in terms of "picking" fights with Adam, Stephen and Ellen, I think she tends to "test the water" -- if the other person is just as strong or presents an argument that is more solid than hers, she backs down and re-evaluates how to deal with them (and she probably makes a mental note of them being much stronger than the rest of the spineless twits who let her get away with everything). But these are all things that a very aggressive person would do and it's quite logical (maybe not likeable but logical based on her type of personality).

It's funny because all of the personalities of the players left at this point are very different but, in the end, they all ended up at the same place (one of the last ones left standing). So clearly, people maintain certain characteristics of their behavior (good and bad) because it works for them. Coral's been aggressive, and at times confrontational, and at other times just plain mean, but she's one of the last five still left on her team (Adam has been a gigantic penis but, in this situation, being a penis has worked for him, etc.). Coral behaves the way she does because, most of the time, it gets her what she wants (that's the payoff to being aggressive).

The only time I have been supportive of Coral during a confrontation was she talked to Jisela about not being fair to Malik.


I was supportive of her also when she talked to Adam about Sarah (and even though he whipped her but a long time ago in an argument, she still confronted him about Sarah -- so her "losing" an argument doesn't mean that she's going to back down from the person forever). She seems to have an innate desire to defend people who can't and/or won't defend themselves (like Malik and Sarah). Another reason why I say she make a good attorney and would probably love the job. I agree with whoever said injury attorney.

Edited by String Theory, Jan 2, 2004 @ 11:24 AM.


#8

Jemynye

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Posted Jan 2, 2004 @ 4:40 PM

Coral is an extremely aggressive person so her actions are very logical.

But these are all things that a very aggressive person would do and it's quite logical (maybe not likeable but logical based on her type of personality).


I disagree. Extreme aggression and logic don't necessarily go hand in hand. Actually, I see it as being moreso a symptom of illogic.

Elka thought a lot like Coral and wanted to get rid of Matt too so she befriended Elka as her cohort to get rid of him (and to guarantee that at least one person would not vote her into the gauntlet)  Mike is intellectually challenged and is very easy to manipulate so she used that to her advantage


I've always viewed Elka as a follower. Coral is good at manipulating and intimidating certain kinds of people.

in terms of "picking" fights with Adam, Stephen and Ellen, I think she tends to "test the water" -- if the other person is just as strong or presents an argument that is more solid than hers, she backs down and re-evaluates how to deal with them (and she probably makes a mental note of them being much stronger than the rest of the spineless twits who let her get away with everything).


I agree.

It's funny because all of the personalities of the players left at this point are very different but, in the end, they all ended up at the same place (one of the last ones left standing). So clearly, people maintain certain characteristics of their behavior (good and bad) because it works for them.


The above is not funny rather a fact of life. However, while manipulative tactics worked for Coral in getting rid of Matt and not being sent into the gauntlet sooner than she was, I contend the reason she remains in the competition is due to more legitimate and logical reasons. She's earned her spot with much improved performances after being voted into the gauntlet.

Edited by Jemynye, Jan 2, 2004 @ 4:44 PM.


#9

String Theory

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Posted Jan 2, 2004 @ 9:12 PM

I disagree. Extreme aggression and logic don't necessarily go hand in hand. Actually, I see it as being moreso a symptom of illogic.


Of course extreme aggression and logic don't necessarily go hand in hand but they aren't necessarily contrary to one another either (which was the point of my statement). The reason I made that connection was because someone posted earlier that her actions were illogical. My response to that is that, based on the aggressive nature of Coral's personality and how she is playing the game, her actions are very logical (especially since they are garnishing results that are in her favor). Some of her tactics (like getting rid of Matt) are logical and blatantly so because it's clear that she was trying to get rid of anyone who threatened her or her goals (and this is typical behavior of an aggressive personality -- it certainly wouldn't be expected of someone like Sarah who is very passive).

The above is not funny rather a fact of life. However, while manipulative tactics worked for Coral in getting rid of Matt and not being sent into the gauntlet sooner than she was, I contend the reason she remains in the competition is due to more legitimate and logical reasons. She's earned her spot with much improved performances after being voted into the gauntlet.


Um, I know it's a fact of life but I still think it's funny (as in ironic) that people with very different tactics can arrive at the same destination at the same time. That's what makes watching competitive shows like this interesting. Just an observation (I wasn't looking to be Yoda or anything).

But back to the question of her actions being logical, how is her improving her performance any more legitimate or logical than voting Matt off of the show or taking advantage of the weaker people on the team? I think you're confusing logical with admirable. It seems as if you are saying that because her actions against Matt (and weaker teammates) were not admirable they are illogical but her decision to work harder is admirable so therefore it is logical. Logic is not contingent upon nobility. Logic is, quite simply, a mode of reasoning or analyzing. When it came to some of her disdainful actions (with Matt or Elka, etc.), it is very clear to see that her actions were premeditated with clear, beneficial and very attainable goals being the driving force behind her reasoning. That is logical. (she may not have always achieved her goals but that doesn't negate the logic of her thought process to begin with -- not every logical decision yields desired results -- that is, as you say, a fact of life). But even in terms of yielding results, she got the results she wanted from going after Matt and befriending Elka (Matt was voted off and Elka helped her do that). (And I'm not by any means saying that everything she does is logical or defending her every action -- I'm speaking specifically about how she's playing the game).

In competitions, getting rid of anyone who threatens to come between you and your goal or threatens your ideology is VERY logical. While these are not tactics that everyone would use, they are highly logical and they are practiced in human nature from a two year old child who knocks over a playmate to get a toy, to nations going to war.

Every last tactic she has used (good and bad) has contributed in some way to her still being in the competition. But more than that, I agree with you that her ability to adapt has contributed to her being there as well. As you said, after she was voted to the gauntlet, she simply improved her game and clearly tried harder. This is also logical behavior (but it's not more logical than her other behavior just because it's more admirable and palatable).

#10

Jemynye

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Posted Jan 3, 2004 @ 7:53 AM

Good points, String Theory, and I think we agree on several. I'm not confusing logic with admiration and I hope you aren't either. As this matter is subjective, I'm going to leave it as we agree to disagree.

#11

String Theory

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Posted Jan 3, 2004 @ 9:48 AM

As this matter is subjective, I'm going to leave it as we agree to disagree.


Jemynye, I agree.

Edited by String Theory, Jan 3, 2004 @ 1:46 PM.


#12

ineedsomesleep

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Posted Jan 4, 2004 @ 8:37 PM

When Coral checked out the threesome, did anybody else think "ho train"?


Hee! That actually brings up an interesting point. I've been noticing lately how Coral seems to shy away from all on-camera "hooking up" of any kind. When Veronica invited her in the tub she kinda covered her face and looked like a shy pre-schooler (not that I'd wanna come within five feet of Klep, Butterface, and Abe in that situation!). Her reaction just seemed so un-Coral since she's usually so aggressive. She did the same kind of thing in the YNS DVD when Mike asked her to join in his fake porn flick he was making of Lori and Jisela and she refused. And the girl did a damn good job of hiding her hook ups with Adam and Theo. She's definitely a famewhore (she has no problem getting up in other people's romantic business -- I'm looking at you Nicole!), but I've always liked how she never felt the need to show that kind of stuff on camera. Hey, maybe she just wasn't getting any, but still...mad props to her for showing some class!

Edited by ineedsomesleep, Jan 4, 2004 @ 8:46 PM.


#13

Rocketgirl 141

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Posted Jan 4, 2004 @ 8:42 PM

I'm gald she doesn't put all her sh*t out there the last thing I need is another Trashelle.

#14

desibee

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Posted Jan 6, 2004 @ 4:05 PM

Wait a minute. Coral hooked up with Adam? As in ADDam? And Theo? Which one? And why hide the Theo one, either way?

#15

JilliBean

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Posted Jan 6, 2004 @ 4:52 PM

I know nothing about Coral and ADDam, but she hooked up with Theo on BOTSeasons. It was hinted at in the preview episode, but never shown during the actual series.

#16

wwigbeee

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Posted Jan 6, 2004 @ 5:13 PM

Addam?! ewwww. I thought she hooked up with Vegas STDeven too?

#17

lavar78hotmail

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Posted Jan 6, 2004 @ 5:27 PM

And the girl did a damn good job of hiding her hook ups with Adam and Theo.

No, the editors did. We were shown a shot of her stroking Theo's hair in previews, but it never made the cut during the season (BOTS).

IIRC, Coral wanted ADDam, but I don't think he wanted her. Ouch.

#18

String Theory

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Posted Jan 6, 2004 @ 5:52 PM

No, the editors did. We were shown a shot of her stroking Theo's hair in previews, but it never made the cut during the season (BOTS).


I remember seeing that and thinking to myself, "Damn, why didn't they show Coral's hook-up with Theo?"

The editors/producers must LUV her (or she's giving them the "stare of death") because none of her sexual exploits have ever been made into even a footnote on RW or the Challenges. What's up with that?

#19

ally170

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Posted Jan 6, 2004 @ 8:08 PM

Wasn't one or two of her hook-ups mentioned on the 40 Degrees of Seperation or whatever it was called that was on about a year ago? Am I remembering correctly, wasn't she one of the people they talked about.

#20

Lantern7

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Posted Jan 7, 2004 @ 12:29 AM

"19 Degrees of Reality Hook-Ups." She got cozy with Theo, and he went out with Steven...although they didn't say how far it went. They just needed a bridge from Theo to Trishelle and beyond.

#21

lavar78hotmail

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Posted Jan 7, 2004 @ 1:15 AM

"19 Degrees of Reality Hook-Ups." She got cozy with Theo, and he went out with Steven...although they didn't say how far it went. They just needed a bridge from Theo to Trishelle and beyond.

I think you made a mistake. Theo's straight (except when it comes to James, naturally). You meant Coral went out with Stevenereal, right?

#22

MaryWebGirl

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Posted Jan 16, 2004 @ 7:17 PM

What really baffles me about Coral is why she would do another challenge. Call me crazy, but if I almost died on the job and I felt my employers' indifference to my safety played a part in it, I'd quit. Coral doesn't even have to do that -- she just didn't have to go back. Did someone tell her they don't have spiders in Mexico? Because last time I checked they do.

I hope she gets asked why she's there in the preview/review show.

#23

OMGItsKane

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Posted Jan 16, 2004 @ 8:14 PM

The thing about it is that the comments of her teammates, recording clearly after the bite, they still sound pretty bitter and angry, so I don't think it turns out as bad as some thing/hope.

#24

GalJ

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Posted Jan 16, 2004 @ 9:42 PM

I don't know. If there was a challenge in flippin paradise Mexico, I'd probably go even if I just finished one a few weeks/months before that. It doesn't seem as if Coral cares about what people think and more power to her for that. I think I'd be one challenge participating ass. Why the hell not?

#25

PetuniaP

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Posted Jan 17, 2004 @ 9:38 PM

Why the hell not, indeed? Beats working for a living.

Topic? Coral rocks....and she did hook up with ADDam. She even took him along as her guest when the BTNY cast took that trip to the beach house during their season. Malik took Jisela and Nicole took Bobby. The editors kept ADDam off camera, lord knows why.

#26

OMGItsKane

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Posted Jan 18, 2004 @ 10:25 AM

I don't even care about the spider "bite" or whatever. Coral shouldn't have been there to begin with. Watching a little bit of this mini marathon on today, just shows how self-absorbed and selfish she truly is. Like when they voted her in the Gauntlet, she got so upset as if they had to nerve to send HER. Queen B. How dare they? She just ran out of the room like when you smack a bully in the face and tell him off. Of course the team courage was short-lived, as soon as she came back, they folded like a card table.

Coral. Oh shut the hell up. And do something with your hair. And that big ass head. And get off my TV. Go find you a nice White dude(or lady, you and Elka were pretty close and she looks really butch) and jump in an ocean. Of bees. And sharks. With bees in their mouths. And lasers on their heads.

Matt summed her up best "She's strong, aggressive, forceful, and very competitive...JUST NOT ON THE FIELD."

Edited by OMGItsKane, Jan 18, 2004 @ 10:50 AM.


#27

Colobethers

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Posted Jan 18, 2004 @ 11:01 AM

In Mike's recap of the first part of the final mission, he comments on the whole Coral drama:

I can't wait to see how they edited it because I have a feeling I know but I'm going to wait and see before I say anything. I love the promos for the finale. My favorite part was she's not breathing because that's total sh*t but I wasn't there but I could see them making way more dramatic than it really is.


So wait, BMP makes something seem more dramatic that it really was? How could that be?

I don't know if Mike is trying to save face on his Miz reactions towards her or if he's being honest in saying that the whole thing wasn't as bad as everyone is saying it is. But I'm tuning in tomorrow to see!

#28

Rocketgirl 141

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Posted Jan 18, 2004 @ 5:28 PM

I think he's trying to save his a**. I don't think BMP would go as far as to hire two people to play EMTs, have Coral lay on the ground, and the fake EMTs say "She stopped breathing on me." I've also felt that alot of times Mike's done or said things to cover his a**. He just always has to be the "good guy." Not only that but, how could he say when he stated that he wasn't even there?

Edited by Rocketgirl 141, Jan 18, 2004 @ 5:29 PM.


#29

Poly

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Posted Jan 18, 2004 @ 11:01 PM

Edited because Rocketgirl 141 is elloquent and reading is Fund-E-mental

Edited by Poly, Jan 18, 2004 @ 11:05 PM.


#30

biakbiak

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Posted Jan 18, 2004 @ 11:04 PM

Well at least he acknowledges that he wasn't freaking there. What a tool.

It will be interesting to see how Coral and Mike interact on the new challenge.

Edited by biakbiak, Jan 18, 2004 @ 11:05 PM.