I haven't seen a thread for this episode, which was rerun last night.

I have to say the creepifying effect of Mr. Tucker Booth is undimmed by repetition of the episode. I did wonder, in hindsight, how Saul remembers the allegedly "cool dude."

I think this was the episode that I really started to like Justin.

I think...that I've seen this eppy too many times and its making me lose my appreciation for it. The writing...is inconsistent...as is the pacing. Although, that could be said for a lot of B&S' episodes...

I still can't help but feel annoyance towards Justin. He's very grating for me. His whole storyline with the army and subsequent drug abuse...its not working for me. Not to undermine those who go through that kind of ordeal, but...I'm thinking it has to do more with the actor. There are few and far between instances, to when I like him.

Yay! to Treat Williams...even if he is underused(bah! Berlanti! Give him substance!) I liked Kitty and Warren together...they had good chemistry...I prefer him to The Almighty Senator. Maybe I'd like them more if they followed through more of their "politics". Their faux-republicanism is grating. I'm...a democrat(i guess, I'm only 16), but them just mentioning what they stand for and snide remarks against the dems is not cutting it. I know they have the ability to make them sound appropriate and not dehumanize them(or whatever), but I'm not seeing it.

*ends rant and hopes he doesn't get much flack*

Ps....*also hates scotty*

I agree. For me, it's partly the writing. A son enlisting is, apparently, a fairly common thing that many families experience. But here it doesn't feel organic to me - not natural, here for the issues it can touch on and it's my least favorite storyline (that and almost any scene involving someone named 'Holly' or 'Rebecca'). But another reason why I dislike it is that the actor's angst is not convincing to me, he behaves like someone who's had his favorite surfboard stolen than someone with Real Issues. And his habit of speaking out of one side of his mouth while always raising his eyebrows does annoy me, too...but that's neither here nor there.

Anyway, not to sound negative because I do love the show but that is an area of it that I care for the least.

Agree about the inconsistancy in this episode. I think this has mostly to do with the plot of one brother asking the other for sperm. Not your everyday occurance and franklly if it makes all the characters do a 180 in behaviour to make it work(Sarah reaction, Kitty weird politics) than ... it actually doesn't work!

Liked seeing Scotty but hate that the time is wasted with more petty fighting.

Scotty continues to set my teeth on edge. While Kevin was too harsh in snapping at him, it came at a moment when he was being attacked on all sides by siblings and tempers were flaring. A brief withdrawal followed by actually discussing the matter like adults might have worked better than collecting his toys and going home. I get the feeling that for all his "evolution" and possession of a platitude for every occasion, Scotty has ZERO tolerance, patience, and understanding.

How Kitty could possibly think Warren was anything other than a self-serving weasel is beyond me.

Likewise, how Tommy could hit Kevin with a bombshell request of that nature without any forethought about the repercussions (such as what it would feel like to stand by and watch relatives raise a child you fathered, when you are exceedingly unlikely to conceive your own child to raise) and proceed to whinge on when the idea wasn't greeted with immediate acceptance mystifies me. Sarah treating it like a request for a ride to the airport being turned down for no good reason bugged as well—Kevin should have hit her with a comment along the lines of "You have two children, why not give Tommy and Julia the spare if it's so easy?" to underscore the absurdity.

In Tommy's defense, we never saw him complain when Kevin initially refused. He may have been disappointed, but it was Sarah, not Tommy, who brought it up at the dinner table.

Insane request aside, Tommy was actually the most adult about the whole thing. Sarah just acted incredibly blindsighted about the whole issue and Kitty sounded like she was trying to placate the demographic watching the show, not actually express an opinion she would likely have had.

Ouchie. Heh. Except I'm pretty sure Gabe is the spare.

Maybe if you don't count the way he was acting toward Justin. Last time I checked, bad life decisions weren't transmitted genetically to succeeding generations.

Well, unless one works in a nuclear power plant.

Unless I'm mistaken Tommy didn't say that they were, he said he didn't want anything from Justin. Which made sense to me because you can't say that you are through with someone until they get serious and than ask them for something. I have to admit Tommy's not my favourite character but I respect that he's been the most consistant with Justin which is what he needed. I know Norah loves her kids but she was wildly inconsistant. I mean if you tell someone that their choices have value (her breakdown outside the police station) you can't say that their mistakes don't carry any weight as well. Even Kevin (who is my favourite character) though critical of Justin wasn't very good on the follow through.

But Tommy's being consistently judgmental about Justin doesn't help anybody, unless helping Tommy feel superior counts. It's not as if Justin went to rehab before making his donation to Tommy's cause, after all. There's a difference between offering a consistent, disciplined environment (Nora and Dead Skerritt's job as parents) and constantly reminding Justin that he's a failure (Tommy's self-appointed position).

I like Tommy, but he was being a dink about Justin's drug problem. ETA: I agree, though, that Nora ought to realize that if Justin's choices carry weight, then so must their consequences.

Sorry but I think that in this case Tommy had to be a dink. Justin was basically given a job by Tommy, just like he had been given by his dad many many times before and he went to work high. Justin deserved at least one person to tell him if he didn't want to be a screw up... don't screw up! Yes lots of people have gone to work toasted once in their life, but plenty more have held at least one job in their life in which they didn't.

Although my judgement may be pretty clouded by the fact that I didn't like anything about Justin at this point. A lot of complaining on his part about being treated like a screw up, but not a lot of effort shown on his part in which he tried to change this perception of himself. The puppy-dog eyes were not enough to make me feel sorry for him. Not to mention at this point I'm aware that Justin learned nothing from this and judged other people just as harshly.

Edited not once, but twice because today my grammar sucks!

Was he? What have I forgotten?

I can see the utility of cutting someone completely out your life, if they're a destructive personality who brings harm and unhappiness into your life, but I don't think that applies to Justin, and I don't think Tommy was doing that, really. (I'm not sure the Walkers could do that in the first place; it doesn't seem to have taken hold with Holly, anyhow.)

If Tommy decided not to pull any more favours or otherwise expend effort to get Justin jobs until he gets it together, that I'd agree with. That seems only sensible.

The hotel job where he met Tyler was given to him by Tommy's connections. He got high at work and Tyler had to be notified and we saw her finding him collapsed in one of the hotel rooms. She remembered him from highschool (and had a thing for him) so let him keep his job. Tommy only found out because Justin then showed up at the hospital (it was when they found out Paige had Diabetes) still high.
So even though he could barely walk moments before he drove to the hospital. Tommy than figured Justin screwed up the job he got him and told him he wasn't helping Justin anymore.

Still think Tommy was entitled to be a dick. And yes he was a dick but I think it was necessary to offset all the enablers in Justin's life. It also doesn't help that Justin once clean is pretty much the least forgiving of any of the sibs. In fact I'd say that Justin does a much better impression of Tommy as a dick than Tommy does latter on in the season.

It also helps that BG comes from money and had a substance abuse problem that he conquered. So he probably knew exactly how to play that line. I was impressed that someone stood up to Justin, it seemed to me like his other family members (although I love them) treated him with indulgence mixed with condescension and disgust that episode. Which also rings true to the situation, actually.

I just wish Tommy had been perfectly clear with his feelings instead of just blowing Justin off passive-aggressively- then blowing up at him and embarassing him. Still probably exactly how it would play out though.

Edited because pronouns are my friend, but only with their antecedents clear. : )

It probably didn't help that Tommy was sort of put on the spot and wound up having to announce to his mom infront of all his sibs and their partners that he was sterile.

But if I have since forgiven Sarah for how she behaved at that table (I mean I really don't have anything to excuse THAT behaviour) than I'll give a pass to Tommy.

ETA; I cannot believe that amount of time I have just spent defending one of the characters I'm least interested in. I guess I like to give credit where I see due.

I can't believe Sarah publicly discussed Tommy and Julia's biz in front of everyone, and then proceeded to act like Kevin should give his sperm to Tommy like it was a no-brainer. I mean, I wouldn't expect him to completely refuse, but to have uncertainties in the beginning is completely to be expected.
She is sadly underdeveloped as a character. I've been watching old episodes of Six Feet Under, and damn, it's almost unbelievable that she was Brenda. Kudos to Rachel then, but sadly Sarah's either boring or annoying.
This episode just aired in the UK, btw. Not the best ep of the series, but I liked the three brothers' dynamic well enough.

I was a bit taken aback by Sarah's rudeness in this episode also but I think that it is definitely part of her character to be opinionated and forceful and not always sensitive to how other people are feeling. I remember how she didn't really pick up on Paiges distress over swimming in the pool and also with Tommy - she doesn't really seem to "get" his issues with her running the business. So it made sense to me that she was so strong in her opinion here too and somewhat ignorant of how inappropriate it was to be voicing it.

I really liked the brotherly bonding in this ep, we see lots more of Kevin and Justin together in the rest of the season but not so much of all three of them which is a bit of a shame (especially because Tommy is often his most engaging when he's interacting with his siblings)/

Thoughts on Northern Exposure

A stranger episode. Not quite as strong as the previous two but this show does like to give you food for thought.

Nora/Dave - I have to admit I really like this pairing a lot and it's quite funny how Nora might've had the least inpure intention and yet Kitty delighted in teasing her to no end regarding the cosiness of the two. I really want Nora to get it on with Dave, he's a sweet guy.

Kevin/Scotty - During the scene with the dinner Kevin was doing alright defending his reasons for not wanting to give his sperm away and then he kinda blew it with how dismissive he was with Scotty towards the end. I did enjoy his later conversation with Kitty on what it was like growing up being gay.

Justin/Tyler - Offering to help out Tommy endeared him a lot this week and I liked how he opened up about his experiences in Afghanistan and the way that Tyler is able to be a good influence on him as well.

Kitty/Warren - I kinda knew they were not gonna happen and I'm kinda glad. Kitty and Warren work better as sparring partners as opposed to being lovers and Warren's realisation that the boat with them has officially sailed was a bit of a relief too.

Sarah/Joe - First off it wasn't Sarah's place to speak about Kevin giving Tommy his sperm furing that meal and she should've backed the hell off but I liked her for grilling Saul about Rebecca and her flirtatious side with Joe in the attic was nothing short of fun. Fun is something Sarah needs to have more of IMO.

Tommy/Julia - I know they aren't the most exciting couple in the show but they are sympathetic and I like how Julia does try to give her husband confidence without trying to humour him. Tommy's scene at the clinic with Justin and Kevin was a riot.

Saul - he needs to stop being so evasive. Just tell Sarah the truth because you just know she won't give up unless you do. Who's more important to Saul - his family or Holly?

I've seen better but this was still good, an 8/10 from me.

No recap! The only reason I watch this show is to be able to enjoy the recaps!

Just broadcast tonight in France. My two centimes...

The "no-one wants to go but they all end up at the house" was predictable and farcical, but still fun. For a house no-one goes to, they seem to have a lot more than just canned goods to eat... and a singular lack of dust.

Kevin/Tommy: Let us not forget that Tommy lied to Kevin about whose idea the sperm donation was. That for me would have been a big warning light not to go through with this hare-brained plan. In any case, I can't be bothered about the genetic obsession.

Tommy/Julia: Can't believe she didn't hit him when she learned he had asked Kevin for his sperm.

Kevin/Scotty: Kevin was totally justified in screaming at Scotty. Kevin was being attacked, and unfairly at that. At the very least, Scotty owes him discretion: stand by your man! And the "you're gay you need to think like this" bit is beyond annoying.

Sarah: Perhaps she wants Tommy to have a kid so he'll get off her back... But where are her own children? Last news was that the family was still adjusting to Paige's diabetes. Who are they staying with? Joe's non-local parents (no presence at hospital)?

Justin: He's cute and all, but who believes him as an addict? As a suffering human being?

Amber: Would have loved to see the interview.

Nora: I would have liked a comment on the presence of her grandchildren on the board. Do we see anything about Sarah's kids? It would have been a good opportunity for her to comment on Tommy's situation.

Kitty/Warren: Why in the world he lets her get away with her "GOP = family values" BS is beyond me.Oh yeah, he's just written that way.

Excellent recap, Joe R! Of the early episodes, NE is probably my favorite (even in spite of Kitty's "Folgers commercial" nonsense. Hee.). So much great Walker interaction.

Enlisting may be common - deployment is not and it is a very scary thing for the person and the family to go through. I thought the show, and the actor, did a great job of detailing how Justin was affected by PTSD after coming back from Afghanistan.

On another note, the one thing that bugged me the most about this episode was how all of the concern with Kevin donating his sperm to Tommy and Julia centered on his being gay and on left wing/right wing agendas. There was abosotely no mention of whether a person just might not want a child out there that he would not be the father of himself. IMO, that would be the primary objection.

A lovely recap. Just a niggle: it was of course in Afghanistan, not Iraq.

PS: What you find when you Google Tucker Booth:
http://www.thefrozenfoodsection.com/artists.asp?t=8

Now who is itching for a flashback with the "real" Tucker Booth? Mmmmmm

Bah! You're right -- I'll fix that as soon as I can. Thanks.

As it happens, I do: I think Annable's doing a nice job with this role. (Rhetorical? Pff. I don't do rhetorical.)

Nice job on the recap, too, Joe R. In particular, I like your notice of this:

I've said it before, but I think the little glimpses we get of Who-lia's relationships with the rest of the family are interesting and I wish we could see more of them. Somehow it doesn't seem all that likely.

To the show's credit (and to our recapper's as well), this whole plot could have been a big mess of squick; instead it was funny and moving and entertaining. Well done by you!