I just decided to bring over the full blurb from mediaweek:

Honestly, I think the ratings should be better considering Oracle was the second to last episode. However, I haven't heard or seen any promotion outside of The WB and *during* Smallville (big help that is). Also, the fact that Fade preceded this episode contributes nothing.

Don't you mean something?

I'm just glad Smallville beat Supernatural in the ratings.

ETA: Oh god! Next Thursday we get Vessel at 8 then Aqua at 9.

Nothing. I disliked Fade for it's mediocrity and predictability. It's not as if it was an outstandingly bad episode, but it was rehash ridden. The audience has seen the plot before. Why watch next week with the possibility of getting the same thing?

In other words, it didn't help.

Are they kidding me? They want to make me suffer.



They really should.

I'm not sure the finale ratings will be that much better because . . . the producers have burned and pissed over the promise of change a zillion times over. (Retconning isn't the kind of change people want)

I agree, although I do believe that people know that Smallville has always had awesome season premieres and finales. So maybe casual SV viewers who didn't watch Oracle because they wouldn't be bothered (who can blame them?) will watch the finale (even just out of curiosity). SoFine will be there in full force, Lex will "have the power" etc. I dunno. I just hope the ratings are better.

Maybe they need to show a 10 minute promo for Superman Returns. The Batman Begins promo helped a little last season.

It really shouldn't have to depend on gimmicks like that or at least not gimmicks that it itself has not created. With the Superman movie coming up, maybe they figure they can see a version of Clark Kent that is done better. I really think most of the people who would go see a Superman movie have already tried SV and either are already watching or found it lacking and aren't watching anymore.

I'm not trying to be mean or anything but around my corner of lj, people were way more excited about the SPN finale than the upcoming SV because while the show isn't perfect, SPN doesn't have the baggage of five years of disappointment to make people cynical. Also, I heard a few people here and there say there's been a lot less media pimpage for the finale. That's not going to help.

I know that mobius, but the fact remains that's all it has to draw people in. Not good writing or character development. They have to throw in something with "Oomph!" to get people talking. Let me tell you, after the BB trailer last season's finale, I almost forgot completely about Smallville. I sat there and yelled, "I have to see Batman!". More emotions churned inside from that mere 10 minutes than the so-called 90 minute finale.

Lets face it, all the goodwill the show built during the first half of the season pretty much was destroyed with "Reckoning" and the show has been sliding downhill since then. I'd be pretty damn surprised if we "don't" get the full trailer for SR aired during the season finale. It would be a no brainer to do it. For crying out loud they aired Batman Begins stuff at the end of what will easily go down as the worst season of SV in the shows run.

Which is shame since they brought on James Marsters.

Do you think the ratings would have gone up had they had the guts to kill off Lana?

I think they would at least remain the same, if not go higher. Such a move would create a huge amount of buzz for the show, there would be no more Lana scenes, and it would open up a ton of SL possibilities for the show. But it would take AlMiles real guts to kill the female lead, and they would NEVER go through with it, unfortunately. :(

As someone who's only watched intermittently, it seems to me that some of that attention should have gone to Allison Mack.

Nah, the Smallville chain-of-command goes like this;

Lana
Lois
Dog
Cat
Mouse
Chloe

I think killing Lana would lower ratings because she has fans too.

I think Reckoning lost viewers to the show simply because it wasn't a very good episode. It has nothing to do with who they did or didn't kill. The pacing was rushed, the characters didn't have time to realistically react to what was going on around them. If I wasn't a regular viewer and I tuned in to find out what the big deal was, that episode would have taught me that nothing was a big deal.

And if they had written the show (not just the episode) well they could have killed off Chloe and I'd still be watching.

I think that Reckoning was pimped as somehow really changing thing but the only real thing that changed was that Pa Kent was dead and maybe a little more Mionel when people (both non-Clana fans and Clana fans) wanted the show to move beyond the Clana "secrets and lies" dance instead of going back to Clark angsting over Lana as she dives into another boneheaded relationship or basically the same old crap that had been going on for the past four seasons. I think either way (Lana getting killed or Lana freaking out and trying to kill Clark or Lana quasi-accepting but having problems with it as time went on) would have been better than what's going on now.

And the problem is that the writers over the years have told us this one true thing: nothing matters because we'll change it anyway when we dig ourselves a hole. There's NO reason to put faith in any of the things that are happening. Therefore there's no incentive to follow any plot point because a few episodes down the line, it'll get ignored anyway.

I think that by catering so much to Lana even though it hurt the overall story, they drove off a lot of other fans and now find themselves in a bind because they have to push forward to a story where she's NOT the center of the universe and the fans they drove off are not coming back to save their butts. They're now watching SPN, SGA, BSG or maybe curling up with a good Harry Potter book.

The people I know who watch SV in primetime (which isn't many) really liked "Reckoning." I think the casual viewer liked Reckoning, while online fandom was harder on the episode since we're more invested in the show.

The reason I point out primetime is that I know quite a lot of people that watch SV on ABC Family. They rarely, if ever, watch it during primetime. ABC Family really hurt the show by stopping airings of the reruns. Does anyone else know people like this?

Mobius nails it. Reckoning essentially made the promise that the shows dynamic was truely going to alter and that it wouldn't be the same afterword. It failed to deliever on that promise. All we got was more relationship angst instead of truely going forth with Clark's journey to becomming Superman. The only journey Clark's been on that I can tell is the journey of the ex-boyfriend finding out that his former BF(best friend..sorry clexers)is playing tonsil hockey with the woman he still loves but can't be with because.......(imagine the sound made in the Peanuts cartoons when the kids are being talked to by a nameless/faceless adult)he just can't...That's supposedly the story of Superman.

Actually I hope the ratings are good for the Finale-- I'd hate that a creatively strong season ends on a dismal note, compared to last season's all flash and no substance. Most of the season Lana has been backgrounded and we've gotten some quality relationship dynamics, mythology stuff, etc. The only real disappointment for me was Lois' continued stagnation. I felt there was a shift after Reckoning. The Lexana is being handled well, Lex is keeping his balls and possibly playing her, and Clark's been very reserved about the Lexana. While Clark's not clear on his destiny yet he's been the focus and there's been steady character development. There has been water-tight continuity- both series long and season-long. I want them to be rewarded for giving us a great season lest they think "Oh, not enough S4-esque glitter and ass."

Reckoning was an excellent episode; even Lana subsequently changing her mind about the breakup can't ruin that for me. Is there anything substantive indicating people were driven away by Reckoning? There was the typical mid season lull after the build up but the ratings have been consistent.

Word. If the finale doesn't do well, they'll probably think "this season was too dark" or some such crap.

Also, it's only natural that a new shiny penny will get people excited (SPN). It's their first season, the potential could take the show anywhere. I watch a couple episodes to try to get into it (when suddenly hit with the realization that post-Smallville my only real appointment tv will be gone and ohnoes!) and I don't see what's so special about it. It's even more anvilicious and corny than smallville with the religious stuff too, I find the sibling dynamic forced, etc. Last year it was the same thing-- "omg Lost!/omg VM!/omg ___" during their first season even though now it's tapered down (even heard some people that squeed last year saying they're downright sucking).

Maybe the series' history works against it so it's more a commentary on the series in general than the season. The thing is that it's hard NOT to improve from S4 but it doesn't mean that people still don't have legitimate problems with this season. Even people who like this season openly say they scratch their heads about several rather big plot threads like Why do people now like Lionel and who is Lionel really? What happened to the whole Teague murder coverup? Perhaps it's simply burnout because the amount of improvement isn't enough for some viewers.

I guess it's like having a boyfriend (a metaphor I've seen used) where he really sucked for a year, promised he'd get his crap together and did improve quite a bit but still someone you had to continually make excuses for and are disheartened that this is the very best he can be. Even if the new prospective boyfriend isn't great, at least you get a possibility that things might not suck as much.

It’s not about *not* having any legitimate problems. It’s about whether the overall and comparative quality should be reflected in viewership, which if we go by the numbers so far, it usually is. But then if the strongest season thus far isn’t enough then nothing will be enough- that niche that gave up post-S4 wasn’t largely part of this season to begin with; they’ve lost those viewers already so that’s already behind them and not a factor. I don’t think they concern themselves with wooing that niche back considering now things are moving quickly and they don’t bother worrying about the casual viewer being confused anymore-- and one can’t miss 5 episodes and come back and understand things, especially where Lionel and Brainiac are concerned. The Teague cover-up answer is is the name; Lex took care of it, and for whatever reason hasn’t held it over her head. Perhaps it's a last resort for when she *inevitably* will scrunch up her nose and back away. If the man can spirit away a huge ass space ship and only get caught because one of dozens of cops miraculously survived, he can cover up a murder (which he did do with Brigitte Crosby, so he’s had practice). Aside from Martha and one boneheaded comment by Chloe, I don’t see anyone holding hands with Lionel and skipping. His story (redemption or playing everyone? Evidence to both sides) is still to be explained. . ( and honestly some of those complaints come off as impatience about not knowing readily what Lionel’s all about. He was possessed as early as last finale and it’s playing into this finale…they had the hints subtly [and not so subtly- Hidden] build all season long- so Lion-El concept is not at all coming out of left field here). There’s a difference between problems and unanswered questions; Lionel’s lying to Martha suggests there’s more to it than a saintly act.

Even the internet/lj has a mixed bag of opinions that run extremes let alone the rest of the viewers. The casual viewer doesn’t concern himself with the details we draw from each episode; that’s not to say they take things at facevalue but they don’t hold grudges from a season ago if the last half dozen or dozen episodes were cool. If X show is cool and on tonight, that’s what they’re watching; there’s not this sense of loyalty or spurned-lover type investment going on. One show I view casually…I just went through all the episodes of Gilmore Girls for instance, and if the f-list seems to think the spoilers are great I’ll watch; if not I’ll skip it; the shows failures from a season or two ago don’t sway a choice to indulge in something that (appears to currently, consistently be) good tv. Basically, if they’ve had assloads of strong episodes, the ratings should reflect that lest they go back to the old formula. Season one was sweet and Season 3 was pretty strong but my opinion this is the one season where they are taking creative strides without looking back, burned bridges, and done it compellingly with respect to continuity. There were a lot of point of no-returns (death; ruined relationships) and at the same time whole new relationship dynamics they’d never tapped before (confidant!chlark; lexana; mionel), packaging it all with a renewed focus on the mythos. This show will get another season, so it's not about saving it from cancelation- it's just good to keep the incentive there for trying even when the season is guaranteed.

I think the ratings for the finale will be high because most people just watch the premiers/finales when it comes to Smallville since those are always the most entertaining, well written episodes.

I sincerely don't get why people think Smallville lost so many viewers after Reckoning. First, as it was highly pimped, that was the 100th episode, and it usually brings former and occasional viewers to sit and go through the hour just because it was the 100th episode. Nothing more, nothing less. They don't expect these people to stick around for other episodes. Otherwise, Smallville numbers would've improved greatly after Aqua, which we know it didn’t.

Second, the following episodes were just terrible. Vengeance and Tomb were poorly written and the focuses were elsewhere but on Superman (especially Tomb which was the weakest episode this season so far). Third, not only Smallville, but also all The WB shows have lost audience in the past months. Maybe that's because they've been promoting the shows and the network less than the usual given the fusion that will happen next fall with UPN.

Forth, it's not Lana's fault, or Clark's or because they don’t use Chloe more that the numbers are going down. I find it really amusing that assumptions like that are made. As a TwoPer myself, I understand why some would come to this conclusion, since the opinions here are pretty much the same, which gives the impression this is what the major audience think, but still, I don't take this niche as the definitive and determinant one when it comes to opinions about this show.

And fifth, I suggest a look at the Nielsen Ratings. Most of the shows have been lowering their numbers (especially Thursday’s shows). It’s not a Smallville occurrence only.

Couldn't the whole numbers loss really relate to the six week hiatus they took mid-season? That certainly would be enough for people to not so much forget it's still on. but find it hard to remember if the season had ended or not. I'm wondering if the slow increase in numbers came from people going "D'oh!" when they realized the last epi before the break was not the season finale.

edited because I realized that I had stupidly typed in Reckoning.

I disagree about Vengeance. I think Vengeance was an excellent follow-up to Reckoning. IMO, it was one of the best episodes this season.

As for Tomb, well, it wasn't the best episode. However, it did have some excellent acting by AM and good Chlark moments. But I've found that after rewatch, it wasn't nearly as disappointing as when it first aired. It grew on me.

And look at this for comparison...



Vengeance and Tomb were consistant, and then it jumped right back up for Cyborg. We left for the hiatus on a high note.

IMO, all evidence seems to point to the hiatus being the momentum killer for SV this season. Reckoning was no doubt a disappointment for many, but the numbers show that people were still tuning in on the episodes that immediately followed. After hiatus, the show came back with absolutely no press, no fanfare, and a very weak episode, Hypnotic. An episode that really seemed to piss people more then anything else. And there was no "big" episode after that, like a Cyborg, that might catch peoples attention. And I really and truly think the Clexana is a viewer turn-off. People recognize it just for what it is, soap opera bullshit.

But bottom line, somewhere during the hiatus, SV losts its buzz. And hasn't gotten it back.

And I agree with PepSinger, I loved Vengeance and think its one of the strongest episodes this season. I think the stinkers this season have been Fanatic, Lockdown, Tomb, Void, Fade.

Word. Not to mention, the truly craptastic TV promos and posters haven't helped. The only decent trailers we got were for Mercy, Oracle, and now Vessel.

Tomb was just out of left field and contrived. This shows that even if it's Chloe centric and not pimping/heavily featuring Lexana doesn't mean it's a winner. I agree about being careful about thinking the internet congintent's complaints represents most viewers. That's something 've learned about perceptions of Lois in particular.

I don't think Tomb was one of the weakest episode this season. I reserve that title for Hypnotic, Lockdown, Fanatic, and of course, Aqua.

ETA:abcmedianet.com

1. 7th Heaven...5.66 M
2. Gilmore Girls...5.12 M
3. Smallville...4.81 M
4. Supernatural...3.99 M
5. Everwood...3. 72 M
6. Charmed...3.39 M

Fast National for Vessel.

According to: Zap2it



And: MediaWeek

zap2it.com figures for comparison:



mediaweek figures for comparison:



Oh and btw, Tomb did pretty well in the ratings so I don't know how anyone is suggesting it showed a lack of interest in Chloe episodes. It's not true.



Tomb maintained the week to week numbers on both ends meaning that it kept the same audience from the week before it and it sent the same audience into the next episode. So, there is no reason to think that it wasn't a rating success. The episodes that have problems are "Exposed" which was the first episode to take a dip in ratings and "Lockdown" which had a considerable dip in ratings in relation to the episodes airing before and after it. Another one was "Hypnotic" which lost viewers from the average per episode for the season, which wouldn't be bad bc of the break, but instead of building into the next week, it began a ratings slide until they stabilized with Mercy.

What were the numbers for last season's finale?

I realize the CW shake-up may alter past patterns, but do I have reason to hope that they'll re-run S5 during the summer? I've seen about 1/3 of the episodes, and after reading the recaps and seeing "Aqua" for the first time (my eyes! my poor poor eyes!) would greatly prefer to TiVO what remains rather than considering buying the DVDs when they are released.

Manddoo, if I'm remembering correctly, Commencement's final number was 5.5 million.

Oh dear, those are not impressive numbers for a season finale. The ratings barely climbed from the week before. I don't know how/why Mediaweek felt they were good enough to consider Smallville a lock for the new network. Relatively speaking, the numbers are pretty decent next to trainwrecks like One Tree Hill, but even within this whole season of Smallville, Vessel's ratings are nothing to rave about. I wish the TPTB would take a hint as to what the viewers are just not interested in (i.e., Lana angst) and give us more of what Smallville should be about: Clark's passage to superhero status.

The WB starts reairing S5 May 25 starting with Arrival.

The final numbers are in for last week. Smallville was the WBs 3rd most watched show and actually tied with UPN's ANTM which was UPNs top rated show of the week.

7th Heaven (so called series finale) - 7.56 million viewers
Gilmore Girls (season finale) - 5.33 million viewers
Smallville (season finale) - 4.85 million viewers
Everwood - 4.27 million viewers

How in the hell did 7th Heaven get 7.56 million viewers??!!??!

That's why they did a turnaround and decided to renew the show for the CW.

That and Brenda Hampton's pact with Satan.

Well, at least Veronica Mars got picked up. If they had cancelled VM after doing the turnaround on 7th Heaven, I was going to boycott the network. I heard they cancelled Everwood and are keeping One Tree Hill Though, so I'm still plenty bitter.

Series finales usually get big ratings increases as people tune in just to see how they end the story. I'm not sure how many of those people will actually watch next year when they were led to believe the show was finally going to be over.

Analyzing Thursdays at 8

Big Day/Notes From the Underbelly (ABC):Doesn't seem like much audience crossover with Smallville. Big Day is about a wedding, with each episode representing one day leading up to the wedding. Underbelly is about a couple and pregnancy. Big Day sounds iffy but promising but Wendie Malick being in it kills it for me. Notes From the Underbelly is a horrible title, sounds like Britney Spears and Kevin Federline's new reality show. Will get large boost from Grey's Anatomy.

Survivor (CBS): Shows no signs of slowing down. Proabably the show to beat on Thursdays at 8.

My Name is Earl/The Office (NBC):The shows NBC tries to convince you are hits! Earl is doing pretty good and seems like it would take a lot of SV viewers away. It's very good with the 18-49 crowd. The Office seems to do very well with the well-to-do upperclass men. The Office is one of those shows where the fanbase will go apeshit if it's ever cancelled and buy Variety ads to save the show, make petitions, that whole enchilada.

Til' Death/Happy Hour (FOX): Sitcom starring Brad Garret and sitcom where I don't know what the hells happening. Combined with decomposing OC it looks like FOX will be suck on Thursday nights in terms of ratings. Of course the dumb sitcoms might make a decent showing with the 18-49 men.

If I were Hypothetically to stop watching Smallville (for whatever reason) this season I think I would switch to the Big Day/Underbelly combo. It's something new at least. None of the other shows appeal to me.

Right now I think I'd rather watch Ugly Betty than Smallville. That or Survivor: Segregation Island.

Hmmm...which is worse: segregating the minorities or shipping the one person of color off to Wichita?

I didn't know Ugly Betty was going to be on opposite Smallville. I actually do want to watch at least the pilot for that one becuase it filmed in the building I work in. This could be a legitimate dilemma.