I know..This is the offseason that I wish Deknight was still with the show. It would have been interesting to see what kind of damage control he would have had to engage in. We had the fly for a year and a half, and no matter what you think of him personally or professionally it was pretty cool to have somebody from the inside engaging the fans(even if he really couldn't tell us anything).

He is planning on doing a blog about his experiences on the show, or at least he was up for it when somebody asked. So we shall see. Maybe we can get Holly Harold to have a blog next year? ;)

They could have RDA'd her and knowing how they perceive her as so important, they could have done a lot of things. Up to now I've hated Lana, but haven't really been bothered by what KK might be doing - it's not something I've cared to follow, but pick a side, lady.

No, no I don't.

And while I agree that it's not KK's fault that the writers saw fit to trash the last half of the season because KK announced that she was not coming back, it is her fault that she brought it up and caused this mess for nothing.

Also all that sympathy because she might be sick or people thought she might be sick . . . out the window, y'all.

You know what they'll do. We'll have a bunch of Lana-free episodes, the ratings will go way up.
Then here's Lana.
Hopefully if she really is in 15 episodes, maybe it will only be for a couple minutes and she won't really interact with
to many of the characters too much. Just a shot of her with her newest boyfriend and peeking back into Smallville to
let Clark see she's still around so she can use him as backup if she doesn't like the new boyfriend. Again.

And I agree with mobiusklein. But by her asking to be let go from the show, she sure got to be the center of it.
I know she's not responsible for the writing but they sure changed the direction for her leaving. Which they're paying for now.

I hope those 7 episodes that she's not in next season are the best, most watched ever.

KK doesn't write the show. She doesn't control what they do with her character. If things have been messed up, if characters have acted very OOC then the buck stops with the executive producers. They are the ones who have to fight for their story. KK gets paid to do what is in the script. She did it for 6 seasons and I don't blame her for getting frustrated with her situation and wanting out. If the producers wanted to allow her to leave then it was up to them to figure out her exit and handle it well.

I have nothing but good wishes for KK. I hope she does well. She seems like a very responsible, thoughtful person.

From everything I've read KK is supposedly pretty pro about things. I much more believe that she wanted out, said she wanted out, was willing to buy her way out, and TPTB just wouldn't let it drop then and there and tried everything from a guilt trip to offerring her more money until something worked.

Of course I could be wrong but I doubt it went down with her making a definitive get out move only to change her mind.

The rest of this argument should probably go to the KK thread.

Anyway, I don't see anything much next season for people. I think that the series finale is going to be a Clana loft scene. And who else are they going to dig up? Darkseid?

Let me put it this way, SPN's season finale was BIGGER in scope than proto-Supes. It was about hell, demons, end of the world and even bigger on a personal scale with death and real sacrifice. It's such a pity that a pair of demon-hunting brothers w/o no comic history's season finale was REALLY about saving the world not whether or not a twit dies. I think the contrast (even if you weren't impressed by SPN or floored by the emotional stuff) in just scope & outlook says what's wrong with SV.

Finals

glad to see the rating went up...even if it was just because it was a finale.

I think you all had been too hard on KK I think that I have faith that she reads the awful comments we make about Lana and she tried to improve her. I believe that maybe they did the ultimate Lana rehymening just to bring back dark Lana I'm sure that Noir was a foreshadowing of the things to come and Lana as a player and Clark leaving her and calling her a mistake is to come. Please I wan't to be right!!!!!

"Please be right. That would be awesome. I hope Lana's a B!TCH to Chloe and Clark next season, and tries to steal Chloes role in Clarks life.

Oh look. A sign. In the bushes. Pointing back the way we came. It says, "You were here ===>" and it's pointing to the topic.

So, when are the final numbers going to be up? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this the lowest season finale from all the seasons?

These were posted on page 94 but since you asked.. ;)

Final numbers..

I think they were posted in the previous page.

The problem isn't just the individual writers but the overall vision or lack of and everybody who WAS/IS going to see this show pretty much knows it by now so I don't see an upswing in the cards for the premiere no matter how glitzy it is or how much they promised thing will change. Remember how they pimped out S5 as everything you've been wanting to see . . . and it turned into everything you wanted to see gets ground up into fertilizer by the end of S6?

Considering the rumored source of the pink script, even the writer must have been disgusted by the finale. This doesn't bode well for writer morale.

Thanks for that, Kahhhn. :)

Wow, so yeah, they were low. Were they lower than "Vessel"?



The fact an actual pink copy of the script was so carelessly tossed into a trash can says a lot about the attitude these writers had towards the season finale, in my opinion.

See, that's what I think too. No amount of pimping of DC characters (especially Jimmy), Clark and any new power (what does he have left besides flying?), craptastic Pod!Chloe powers, or the fall/rise of Lex, or Nois lightswitches will change the fact for that it's still all going to be about Lana (whethere she's dead or alive) Clark will still be bitching about her and the effects of telling her his secret, and Lex will be vowing revenge ... all because of Lana. Nothing's changed. And to top it off? There won't even be any decent Chloe with this shitty power/Chimmy nonsense, for me at least. And with the events of Promise and the latter half of the season hanging over their heads, the writers have to dig themselves out fast - I don't think that bodes well for *anyone* come season 7. They've proved with season 6, this show will revolve around Lana until the bitter end - no matter how much a large part of the fandom loathes the idea. They just don't care no matter how many times in dvd commentaries/articles they've commented they're glad it's over. Except it never freaking is.

Was it ever stated actually what demographic they were writing for?

I think it was just before season 4 when Al said in an interview that they were "returning to the show's roots as a teen drama." Because teen dramas are all about billionaires fighting over witches.

That's better than I thought it would be. My expectations were really, really low, though.

Ah, that explains a lot. Angst is easier to write and cheaper to make then character development with sfx/action.
So why do they keep getting automakers to sponser their promotions? Seems to me that the teen crowd doesn't buy to many new cars.

I thought season four was when they decided to make the show a little more adult, due to Ancier's influence? Hence the somewhat more sexy storylines, moving into the sex in season five. I found an article dated July 14, 2004 that said, "This is not your daughter's WB: Net execs want to change the perception that the Frog attracts only female teens." And another article, three days later: "On the heels of a season that left the WB at the bottom of the ratings heap, chairman Garth Ancier called his network's long-standing strategy of targeting teens a mistake and acknowledged that he is looking to attract older viewers this fall." Now, neither of these articles was about Smallville specifically, but I think they help to explain why Smallville started to feel a little more adult around that time.

However, I'm pretty sure the demographic the CW is targeting with the most fervor is 18-35. And I'm not sure, but I think they're going after the female demographic more than the male demographic.

Teen drama would make more sense if the cast were still in High School. They talked about wanting to do the Clark/Lana/Lex triangle, and having to wait till they were a bit older. They aren't teens anymore. And as the cast ages, the demo/target audience should go up a bit, just IMO. Diehard fans who have been watching who may have started out as teens aren't teens anymore either. I just don't get wanting to make some kind of "return" to teen drama according to the Goughlar.

What Gough says and what Gough does doesn't always match up. I think that's one of the problems. The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing and they end up making a confusing mess. He also said of Season 4 that they wanted to make it more "light and fun" or something like that. The interviews I'm thinking of may have been before they got the orders to "mature" the show. Or he may have just been talking out his ass. But despite the more adult content (nudity, showers, the Manshirt of Failed Seduction) it was still mired down in a lot of teen angst. I don't think Smallville really knows who it's targeting most of the time. They throw bones to a lot of different demos but it's a mess overall.

Well that was said a few years ago. I think they felt that season 3 was too dark or something.

ETA:
Found Al's interview where the teen drama thing was said. It's from Aug 2004.

ETA again:
The sad thing is Al acknowledges that they think the Clana getting stale was partly responsible for lower ratings. They've said multiple times that Clana is death and yet they keep going back to it.

Even if they are not intending to bring in younger viewers I can't imagine who else would be drawn in by the Clana angst. Sure, when I was 15 I thought pain-ridden relationships with no actual basis in reality (because, really, why do Clark and Lana luw each other?) was the bomb. But now, as a 29 year old woman, I just think it is silly. And it has turned me off the show. As long as there is Clana there will be a group of people squealing with delight. But . . . there will also be a much larger group of adults saying ENOUGH. And I'm one of them. I'm pretty much out at this point and will only return when I hear good things on the boards. Teen drama lost its appeal about ten years ago.


And, yes, I did just say 'the bomb' - my taste in tv relationships has changed but not my language skills. Yikes.

Exactly. And the peculiar thing is that the demographic they're really after is 18-35, I think. There may well be some Clana fans at the lower end of that demographic (and I'm sure there are 35-year-old Clana fans, although I tend to suspect they're less prevalent), but it seems like an awful lot of that demographic isn't going to be thrilled by teenage-style love at the expense of plot and solid character development. I really think that this, more than any other thing, is what's responsible for the sagging ratings this year-- they've simply turned off a large amount of viewers, even in the demographic they're shooting for.

What I don't understand is this - I have now seen/heard several statements (thanks Cyb) from AlMiles re. the Clana relationship and how it is old/stale/done. They seem to understand that a lot of people are tired of it. And the ratings, in my opinion, definitely reflect this . . . so why, oh why, would they continually bring it back every year? It can't simply be because they love KK. Was it the plan all along to have Clark pine for Lana through the entire series? If so, bad planning people - and you are getting what you deserve with these low ratings.

It's because they're idiots, plain and simple.

This is such a good point...I think they new it was going to be shit, and didn't throw it in the trash but actually handed it to someone and made up a cover story. No writer can be proud of what they accomplished this year in totally assassinating a super hero's character, relegating his mother to a guest star and having no consistency in anything from week to week. Maybe whoever it was (maybe Deknight since he was leaving, he never did comment about that script) decided they wanted us to read the crap so Al and Miles would finally understand that they are morons.

According to his interviews, we know Al at the very least is extremely proud of this shitty season. That doesn't surprise me.

It also makes me feel very sorry for Brendan Fraser and Maria Bello with the Goughlar handling Mummy 3.

One of the things that convinces me that there's really no hope for next year is that, unless I'm misunderstanding the situation, Gough and Millar and whoever else was involved were doing everything they could to persuade Kreuk throughout the latter half of this season to stay on next year. This means that, even as they saw the ratings tanking after "Promise," when they should have realized that Lana was killing the show, and therefore should have been thrilled that Kreuk was leaving, they were desperate to get her to stay. This tells me that they've learned nothing. And why should they learn anything now, when they've learned nothing in the previous five years? They've seen the ratings tank every spring since season three when they return to Lana/Clana, and they've continued to return to Lana/Clana every spring all the same (like swallows to Capistrano). So it's unlikely there are going to be any changes, at least any for the better.

I agree with RichardAK, they have a hard-on for Lana no matter how hard they deny it or claim she's boring or what the hell ever. They may not like boring under the oak Clana but they sure like to have her attacked, nearly killed, being a bitch, dressed in skanky clothes, being the center of the SV world etc.

Well if they believe that the slide was because of Lexana then breaking them up and getting her back with Clark would be reason to have her stay...I don't think they would see it as one character's problem. And honestly, if they wrote Lana more to how she was at the beginning of this year then I think more people could start to like her again.

I think they tptb are destroying the ratings because of their desire to dragout this show for for sooooooooooo freaking long, when really Clark should be matured and grown out of his teenage crush by now. However in my opinion, the reason why they've dragged out Clana for so long across the series spiced it up then watered it down despite saying theyre sick of it, is because- as far as ship plans go on this show- when tptb wrote the Fever Letter in season 2, it was basically setting a framework to cover the entire expanse of the series. Chlark are " boy/girl" of each others dreams masquerading as each others best friends the entire time. Lana is the one Clark loves today. Chloe loves him too, but lets him go for now (Chimmy Chimmy this season- or take season 5's version) and at the end of the series the facades are spose to be ripped off, when Clark grows out of Lana and into Chloe. Problem is, Chlark being each others bff's- once it happens,theyd never break up so the angst is gone- Clark can't open his eyes "fly back" to her til the very last season (cue Zod when they thought 6 was the last). Too bad for Al/Miles they want this show to go on forever!

I think that people don't want to give Lana a chance anymore. Do you actually believe that Goughlar isn't like that Christopher Walken character who says "Needs more cowbell!" (though they're more like "Needs more Lana!" no matter how nonsensical it is) And honestly I think a lot of former Chlarkers now think Clark doesn't deserve Chloe anymore and if they don't think of it in terms of "deserving" they think His dick is just plain dead except for Lana.

Maybe he just has a pocket full of kryptonite.

(I'm sorry, I just couldn't resist that one, that was too easy. Hee! You may groan and disown me now.)

Ratings roundup.


And to make things look even more embarrassing, I've made a pretty chart that visualizes the show's failure (in final numbers)! :D

For the week of May 13, 2007 to May 19, 2007:


The cycle 8 finale of America's Next Top Model is the highest rated program to ever air on The CW (the cycle 7 finale of ANTM previously held that spot).

Great, so Tyra Banks will continue to plague our television sets for the foreseeable future.

It's because she be fierce, Dread.

ETA: Tyra just came by and smacked me up the head for saying it wrong. Tyra is actually FEEYERCE!

Thank you for the pretty chart Scry. It really demonstrates the huge plunge after Promise. And even though the ratings for the finale went up significantly they don't reach the level of Promise. It makes it even clearer how much Promise turned people off.

I also find it interesting that the rate of deline increased after Nemisis. When I was watching that episode I knew it was good, but I also realized that I just didn't care anymore. Maybe I wasn't the only one who felt that way.

Oh, I hope TPTB get the message. I'd really like to care about this show again.

As a reasonably casual viewer of this show (up until this season anyway! Damn you Raya! And the Phantom Zone! And the promise of cool Phantom Zoners let loose that... Well, yes, that kind of went awry. Let's not speak of that) I have to say that usually they do a good job of hooking me with the premieres and finales.

I know I'd actually stopped watching after Reckoning last year, but eventually went back and watched all the episodes because the finale looked like it would be cool (Zod! Brainiac! A Clark/Chloe kiss!).

But Phantom? Left me cold. It didn't leave me wanting to tune in for the next season premiere the way other season enders have.

So while the ratings may have gone up a little, I'll be really interested to see what the ratings for next seasons premiere are. I guess it probably all depends on how they promote it, etc. etc. But, for me at least, it's not an automatic 'watch it', and I wonder how many other casual-ish viewers feel the same.

Season 6 pretty much destroyed any "watch it" desire I had for this show. It shows twice a week where I live so I don't have to watch it on it's first run on Thursdays until I catch up on what people are saying on the forums.

Does anyone have a graph of the preliminary ratings? I think they would be more indicative of the ratings since they don't include preempted markets.

Early to mid-S5 was a pretty good mix of the sci-fi and the soap but since then, it's been largely soap. So, it's not a must see for me, but a probably see. I think it'll drop a million viewers next season, as well.

I think it will premiere with the same amount as the finale....ZOD didn't really go down that much....And depending on the storyline at the beginning of the season the numbers could go up a bit. And then when they bring you know who back from you know what the ratings will once again get nuked.

If you know who, actually stayed away, then I guarantee you that the numbers would increase.

Hee hee, Kahhhn. I like your post. It reminds me of Harry Potter. "He who must not be named", Lanamort

What I'd like to see is the entire CW line-up and the declines of ALL of their shows.

People are quick to point the blame on "Promise" here but I wouldn't be surprised if the CW went down across the board around that time.

Why do you think that all CW shows would go down at around the same time, Craig? Advertising (or lack thereof)?

Didn't Supernatural hold pretty steady? And I don't think ANTM took any major hit, and actually finished up the season with pretty decent numbers.

SPN did hold pretty steady overall, even when SV was doing it's ratings slide. However, SPN's ratings did tend to suffer whenever it went up against a "very special" episode of GA or CSI. And heaven help SPN if GA and CSI had "very special" episodes on the same night. (Which they often did.)

Now, NBC is putting The Office in the same timeslot. Sheesh.

Although, I do wonder how SV would've done Thursdays at 9 this season.