How unfortunate though, that passing the buck is rewarded more than the taking responsibility of a manager?
[/quote]
I thought about adding that...I really remember thinking last week that its sad that Chris, in the end, did the respectful, stand-up thing, but got fired anyway.
I think if there is something large, and glaring, that a PM or M (for that matter) is responsible to notice and if not correct it, at least attempt to correct the behavoir of the individual causing whatever problem is occuring. Again, a reason it was sad to see Chris go. He gave his best effort to damper marcus's antics, but without avail. From what we saw, Rebecca made no attempt to remedy anything that went wrong in terms of setup, decorations, refreshments, etc. I think she should have been held responsible for that.[/quote]
I dont believe that these situations are comparable. Chris has his choice of who to take to the boardroom. It had already been established in their boardroom by Trump and the Viceroys that Mark was the major reason for the loss due to his incompetent ads, yet Chris insisted on trying to blame Markus, even though he was RIGHT about the problems with the ads. Trump basically told Chris NOT to bring Markus back into the boardroom since he had nothing to do with the loss. When Chris went against the directive of Trump and brought only Markus with him, he basically showed up Trump and sealed his fate. If he had though it through the could have also brought in Mark and both of them may have been able to deflect the blame back to Markus, and hopefully in the exchange get Markus to talk too much and seal his doom. That he didnt showed everyone that he felt he could force Trump to fire the problem child of the group. If anything Chris was being disrespectful of Trump. Bad idea.
With Rebecca, she had the choice of bringing two people into the boardroom. One had overall responsibility for the event planning and the other bombed on one specific task during the event. I think Jen W failure contributed more to the overall failure than Toral's. Had Jen W. come up with a better event, then Toral's miscues would not have meant as much in the overall assessment of the success of the event. I also think that Jen W's attitude spoke more about how she was willing to do a halfass job on the event since she probably felt that the blame would go to the PM anyway. From her conversation with Caroline its obvious that she didnt put her all into the event. She probably felt she could blame Rebecca for not exercising more control over her and the event, much as the blondes tried to do on the previous task with Marshawn. By the time of the event it was too late to make any changes, and so Rebecca was stuck with what she had. Also Rebecca was able use the blonde clique's disruptive tactics to deflect attention away from Toral and focus it on Jen W. She had the advantage of being able to stand up for a friend, who she may have felt rightly or wrong was an asset, and also offer someone just as deserving or more deserving for firing. She stood up to Trump, but in a respectful way, and at the same time gave him an out to keep her.
ConanGrammarian
Oct 12, 2005 @ 12:59 pm
benrod1 Nice point.
I think the main difference between the ways in which Chris and Rebecca handled wanting to get Trump & Co. to dump the unpopular kids was Chris brought only Markus and no one whose incompetence had affected the outcome (Mark).
Rebecca brought Dawn, but covered her but by also bringing JenW, who "Tethnology Expo" cake and blah event certainly had a major impact on the loss.
Chris left Trump no choice and got burned for doing so. Rebecca gave him an out. The moral of this story is: Never back your boss into a corner.
ETA - Trump was right, m-f is the only real way to tell them apart. Dawn is the one hated on TA:MS. JenM was brought into the TA:DT boardroom. Thanks, tiggeril.
Psyche78
Oct 12, 2005 @ 1:09 pm
The moral of this story is: Never back your boss into a corner. [/quote]
Nobody puts Trumpy in a corner
tiggeril
Oct 12, 2005 @ 1:57 pm
Rebecca brought Dawn, but covered her but by also bringing JenW, who "Tethnology Expo" cake and blah event certainly had a major impact on the loss.
[/quote]
Just bein' nitpicky here. Rebecca brought Jen W. (who was fired) and Jen M. (who had horrible hair) to the Boardroom. Dawn's over on Martha's show. :)
Magsi2
Oct 12, 2005 @ 2:50 pm
tiggeril beat me to it! I still get confused about which team did what task and who belongs on which team....especially when I'm trying to figure out the fantasy game questions. OT: They really need to put martha's FG questions up earlier than Trumpy's. Her show is on a day earlier....
musichic2000
Oct 12, 2005 @ 3:30 pm
...
CheekyCricket
Oct 12, 2005 @ 3:56 pm
Also, loyalty wasn't an issue in Chris's decision to bring Markus and not Mark into the boardroom: he wanted to get rid of Markus for the sake of the team's future success, and wasn't necessarily looking to save Mark. So, Chris didn't have much of a defense for ignoring Trump's warnings, except that he felt Markus should go, and go quickly. "Integrity," well, maybe he could spin that somehow, but since he was expressing the wishes of most of his team (except Markus) rather than going against the wishes of his team, as did Rebecca, it would be a much tougher argument for him to make.
Rebecca, on the other hand, was in the underdog role and since people tend to sympathize with underdogs, she could use loyalty and "integrity" (as she interprets it) to defend her support for Toral, and her decision to ignore Trump's warnings. Oddly enough, if she had brought in Jennifer W. and Toral, she wouldn't have needed much of a defense, since JW clearly had performed poorly.
joejoe
Oct 13, 2005 @ 7:21 am
I don't get the constant trashing of Markus by Jacob. Right in the 2nd paragraph Jacob makes him out to be a loser because he played nice with the guys after getting back from the boardroom.
What alternative did he have? everyone on his team said they hate him. He could
(a) be a jerk to them and ensure his removal asap
(b) be nice and admit his failures and try to get a 2nd chance
he went with B. Why is that the loser thing to do? I'm pretty sure a "Hey Josh? Go fuck yourself in the boardroom, okay?" as Jacob recommends would just have made everyone on the team hate him even more, rightfully so.
The writing is funny but constantly bagging on Markus is getting old. He is a bit dorky but otherwise a good person (and compares favorably with most everyone from the previous 2 seasons) so I hope this doesn't go on for the rest of the season, til Markus (inevitably) gets fired.
edited to add caps - I didn't know lowercase letters would result in a warning
Jacob
Oct 13, 2005 @ 9:15 am
Read the site
FAQ before posting again, please.
Also, thanks for the input, but please try to stay on topic. This thread is for the episode. Feel free to email me.
AlmondEyes
Oct 13, 2005 @ 2:36 pm
Question: who in God's name is this Felicia of whom you guys speak? Is she one of the Uniblondes? (tm someone upthread wittier than I am.) I'm getting the famewhores from this show and Martha's version completely confused. Any help I can get in sorting out the various Apprenti would be greatly appreciated!
So last week, Trump decided loyalty is a good thing - hence his firing Jennifer Wilbanks instead of Rebecca. Which way will the Trumpometer swing this week?
Note to Trump: please resume taking your meds, or perhaps increase the dosage. Your constant mood/rationale swings are becoming quite confusing.
Nobody puts Trumpy in a corner[/quote]
Hee! Or, if they do, it had better be the yoogest, most luxurious, prestigious, bestest corner in the world.
Madhoo
Oct 13, 2005 @ 2:43 pm
AlmondEyes, not to mention there had better be some gold foil decorations in the corner ;)
tiggeril
Oct 13, 2005 @ 4:19 pm
Question: who in God's name is this Felicia of whom you guys speak? Is she one of the Uniblondes? [/quote]
Yep. I haven't seen her do anything other than hang around with Kristy making a bitchface.
Quiddler
Oct 13, 2005 @ 5:37 pm
Nobody puts Trumpy in a corner[/quote]Hee! I think we have our next NoN candidate.
karenk
Oct 14, 2005 @ 5:09 pm
Nobody puts Trumpy in a corner
Hee! Or, if they do, it had better be the yoogest, most luxurious, prestigious, bestest corner in the world. [/quote]
ROFLMAO! Thanks, Psyche78 and AlmondEyes, for making me laugh at Trump. Again.
spillsome
Oct 25, 2005 @ 2:56 am
Hello everybody,
I am a 15 years old french guy.
I watched the episode 3 of the apprentice on a french private television yesterday.
I watch this show to learn english and sometimes I can hardly understand some words.
Does somebody remember what Donald Trump said to Thoral in the board room.
He talked about the fact that she went to the best school and at some point he said that her education does not give her "common sense" or something like that.
Can you somebody write what exactly was the sentence that Mr. Trump said ?
thank you very much for your help.
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