choochi
Sep 23, 2005 @ 10:18 am
Hard to believe that A&E, the all Gotti/all Dog all the time network, actually funded and aired this wonderful miniseries ten years ago. What the hell happened there?
With a new P&P movie coming out this fall, I have been feeling nostalgic for Colin Firth and his damp white shirt. I've heard good things about the movie, which is out in the UK, but I have my doubts that any other version (especially one clocking in at 2.5 hours) could outdo this five-hour production. The actors were all solid, although Mrs. Bennet was a bit over the top. It remained faithful to the book for the most part. And it was muy sex-ay! I love it all through and through. Now I must dig out my DVDs this weekend and watch all of its wonderfulness one more time.
jenniferes
Sep 23, 2005 @ 10:36 am
I just reread the book to psyche up for the new movie version. Since I love the book and want more and more, I'm sure the miniseries will continue to be my favorite. But I've heard good things about the movie on the Jane Austen websites out there, so I'm really excited to see it. It's already out in England, but we in the States have to wait until November.
Pooki
Sep 23, 2005 @ 11:04 am
It's funny that this thread should be started, 'cause there was a marathon screening of all the episodes on the UK Gold channel last weekend here in Britain. I was only going to watch one episode, but of course I ended up sitting there for all of them.
I agree that Alison Steadman as Mrs Bennett was the weak link. I usually like her performances a lot (her performance in Abigail's Party is brilliant for instance), but she could have done with taking it down a notch or two.
I think my favourite part has to be when Lady Catherine De Burgh turns up at Longbourne to confront Lizzie about what she then supposes to be an engagement between Lizzie and Darcy. The whole sequence is brilliant, from when even Mrs Bennett is stunned into near silence by Lady Catherine's appearance in the drawing room, to Lizzie's perfect verbal smackdown of her in the garden (‘These are grave misfortunes indeed.’). I love that whole scene.
helloearth
Sep 23, 2005 @ 1:21 pm
"Are the shades of Pemberly to be thus polluted?" God I love that Lady Catherine. She got just right the mixture of arrogance and righteous indignation.
I'm sure that the new movie will be fine, particularly for people who aren't very familiar with the book or P&P2, but I have to admit that no Mr. Darcy will ever surpass Colin Firth for me.
jenniferes
Sep 23, 2005 @ 1:50 pm
I think for a lot of us, Colin Firth simply IS Mr. Darcy, forevermore.
Mwcdeb8r
Sep 23, 2005 @ 4:17 pm
Wow?! A thread for this mini-series? Absolute best mini-series of all time. I loved the A&E version and also a BBC version. It's funny- the same actress played Mary in both! However, the A&E's version was much better than the BBC version. I ended up buying the complete set on DVD off of E-bay.
I never minded Alison Steadman as Mrs. Bennett. I thought she played her pretty true to character. However, I wasn't quite sold that the actress they had as Lady Catherine de Burgh was as old as she was. In the BBC version, they had a younger actress playing her, say more in her late 40s or early 50s and that always seemed to make more sense to me.
Elizabeth Darcy is my favorite Jane Austen character of all time. There's something about her spark, her wit, her liveliness. The way she refuses to let Mr. Darcy intimidate her. I thought Jennifer Ehle made a perfect Elizabeth, as did Colin Firth for Darcy.
Hehehe- what can I say? I'm a big Austen fan- I plan to name all my (future) cats after Jane Austen characters. They make great cat names.....
JeanPoole
Sep 23, 2005 @ 4:39 pm
Hard to believe that A&E, the all Gotti/all Dog all the time network, actually funded and aired this wonderful miniseries ten years ago. What the hell happened there?
Hee!
I have two reliable friends in London who saw the movie and both were "meh." The source of most of the "meh" was Keira Knightley who didn't seem to capture Elizabeth "at all." Both thought Dench "way over the top" and Macfadyen broodily fine though you really don't like him much until it's almost too late.
I'm thinking I'll wait for the dvd on this one.
Jodster
Sep 23, 2005 @ 4:50 pm
Did anyone see Jennifer Ehle in Possession? Good work again on her part!
I lurve this miniseries. It is the set of DVDs I pull out every time I'm home sick. Wish I could see the BBC version, but I don't get any BBC channels.
anniebird
Sep 23, 2005 @ 10:29 pm
The best scene for me is when she was standing at the piano turning pages for his sister and he was just staring at her all googly-eyed. I watch all six hours just so I can get to that part.
makelikeatree
Sep 23, 2005 @ 11:05 pm
Since money is kind of tight for me, unfortuantely, I do not have the dvds. But, I do have videocassettes. That's right, I taped this bad boy on 3 video cassettes years ago (standard play for good Darcy ogling quality) and I still pull them out and watch them at least once a month. Anyway, I just don't trust Kiera Knightley to bring one of my all-time favorite characters to life. But maybe she'll surprise me. Gotta give her a chance, I guess.
I adore that scene also, anniebird. I just get all warm and fuzzy during the Pemberley scenes when Lizzy and her aunt and uncle go to visit. I love that random people could take a tour of someone's house while they weren't there. Stalking was so much easier back then....
Shallow time...I'm sure it doesn't have to be mentioned because who doesn't think of the wet, white shirt scene when they think of P&P? Yum...I just like seeing a man wearing a wet, white shirt for once. I liked how Lizzy reacted right after running into wet and hot Darcy. Her little, "Oh, we must leave at once!" was the first time she got really flustered (can't say I blame her). Then, of course, Darcy runs out to meet Lizzy and her aunt and uncle with his snazzy green coat, slightly wet hair, and tight pants. Tight pants! I couldn't stop looking at his no-no (or yes-yes) place. It was very, um, prominent. *Giggles*
rosjaq
Sep 23, 2005 @ 11:17 pm
I lurve this miniseries. It is the set of DVDs I pull out every time I'm home sick.
Same here. I had the original box set in VHS when they were first released, but now I own not only Davies' version, but the BBC miniseries from the 80's that I saw when I was about twelve.
My favorite Elizabeth/Darcy moment has got to be the first time they lock eyes. After he's delivered that crushing insult, she devilishly tosses him a look and runs right over to gossip about him to Charlotte. Darcy follows her as she goes and the look on his face was all, "Yes, I was very wrong about that." It always makes me laugh when I watch it.
Scheherezade
Sep 24, 2005 @ 5:06 am
I loved the A&E version and also a BBC version. It's funny- the same actress played Mary in both! However, the A&E's version was much better than the BBC version.
The BBC have made two versions of this with a fifteen year gap in between and completely different Marys. The 80's version was Tessa Peake-Jones and the second (from the Colin Firth version - or as you call it the A&E version) was Lucy Briers.
bookgirl71
Sep 24, 2005 @ 9:08 am
What a wonderful thread! I love Jane Austen and especially P&P. I read the book at least once a year. And yes, Colin Firth and Jennifer Ehle are my favorite Darcy and Lizzy. I confess I am not looking forward to the new movie though. I just don't think it's right to take so many liberties with Jane Austen!!
helloearth
Sep 24, 2005 @ 9:08 am
My favorite is definitely the scene where he quickly changes out of the white shirt (sigh!) and runs down, excited about having a second chance to impress her. They are both so nervous and there is an endearing eagerness about him that just makes him seem so vulnerable and--okay, I'm going to break out the DVD now!
Rozinante
Sep 24, 2005 @ 9:20 am
I have to say I'm not looking forward to the new movie version, for a variety of reasons, including the fact that I don't like Keira Knightley.
But here is a link to an article a friend gave me about the movie, and if Keira hadn't already put me off, this would have:
Sounds like they've completely missed the point...
bookgirl71
Sep 24, 2005 @ 9:36 am
I think it sounds awful.
anniebird
Sep 24, 2005 @ 9:53 am
It sounds awful and it sounds as if this brat of a director isn't following the book at all but is making a movie of his version of that era (or 15 years before, or whatever the hell it is that he did). Go write your own story and leave our beloved Pride and Prejudice alone!
A couple of years ago, I was fortunate enough to be able to go to Bath to the Jane Austen museum. The gift shop was wonderful, as you can imagine, and one of the books I bought was a "making-of" of the A&E version - it was a fun book and I bet it can be bought at Amazon. It's worth checking out.
helloearth
Sep 24, 2005 @ 10:21 am
Apparently the director is confusing the Bronte sisters and Austen. If you're looking for grim realism and a feminist statement it's the Bronte sisters all the way, although they are actually Victorian and not Regency, but I digress.
Austen, however, was not about grim reality and a social statement so much as she was about reflecting the world she lived in (the gentry) and using satire to expose human foibles.
Mrs. Bennett was over the top in P&P2, but she was in the book as well. I got the impression that Andrew Davies was viewing the characters through Lizzie's eyes and the fact is that Mrs. Bennett drives Lizzie nuts. I think that's also why, unitl Darcy points out so very directly why Lizzie is beneath him, P&P2 shows us Jane and Mr. Bennett as far more ideal than they really are. It's how Lizzie sees them until their faults are pointed out to her.
“I read the script in the pub one afternoon, and I wept bitterly,” he says
if the new director wept bitterly after reading the script, then the script must bear no relation to the novel because the novel is hilarious.
I think there will be purists who say, ‘She didn’t mean this,’ but we don’t know what she meant. We can only go back to history and take it from there.”
Actually, that's not quite true because we have letters and journals where she did explain what she meant. And if he is viewing history from a post-modernist perpective then god help the fans.
rosjaq
Sep 24, 2005 @ 11:46 am
The gift shop was wonderful, as you can imagine, and one of the books I bought was a "making-of" of the A&E version - it was a fun book and I bet it can be bought at Amazon. It's worth checking out.
I'm outing myself as a complete P&P nerd, I realize, but I own that as well. Also, one of the first places that gave me valid warnings on the possible suckage of the upcoming film version of P&P was the always informative
Austen BlogAusten, however, was not about grim reality and a social statement so much as she was about reflecting the world she lived in (the gentry) and using satire to expose human foibles.
Well put. Her novels were social criticisms of class and don't need to have it's characters reworked in order to reflect modern beliefs on women or the world at large. This is the same problem that afflicted the Focus Film version of
Vanity Fair that came out about two years ago that took Thackeray's novel and took almost all of the sarcastic jibes and malicious digs at classism out and instead gave us a prettified look at a reinvented Becky Sharp. In the case of that movie, A & E (and BBC) had also run a miniseries far superior and better adapted to the mass release.
Mystery
Sep 24, 2005 @ 12:27 pm
I lurve this miniseries. It is the set of DVDs I pull out every time I'm home sick.
Ditto. I just now managed to turn my sister and niece on to it and they've watched it twice already, in just a month.
P&Pnerdalert2: we were in England a few years ago and visited both Sudbury Hall (interior of Pemberley) and Lyme Park (exterior). We went all around Lyme Park and then I sheepishly crept up to the National Trust guide, who spotted me a mile away and cheerfully (and quite loudly!) told me where, a short walk away, I could find the "pond" where Colin Firth swam before meeting up with Lizzie and her aunt and uncle at Pemberley. It's really just a little mudhole. Not that that prevents me from enjoying it every time I watch it.
This version is definitely TV "comfort food" for me and even though I own it, I watch it whenever I see it on TV.
Cadillac276
Sep 24, 2005 @ 7:13 pm
I just want to say that I loved this miniseries when it was on and Colin Firth is Mr. Darcy to me and always will be. That said, the new movie version screened at the Toronto Film Festival a couple weeks ago and I wasn't able to catch it but I did see a bit of the press conference on a local channel featuring Keira Knightley, Mathew MacFayden and the director. They talked about this series and said only good things but as to making the film more 'gritty' I think the director made a good point for it. He said he went for that in the film not only for a realistic portrait of the times but to emphasize how poverty was lurking around every corner for the Bennet girls, if they didn't marry well before their father died. Apparently, in the film Longbourne is always some kind of mess, always a bit less than some of the other estates. He wanted to show that despite their 'class' they were really in a desperate situation.
Listening to him talk eased my mind about the film a bit, I was a fan of the book before the A&E series and I thought he might screw it up but I think I might actually catch it in theatres rather than on video. I like Keira Knightley too, goodwill from Bend It Like Beckham, so I'm hoping the film is good on that front too.
CareBear080787
Sep 24, 2005 @ 9:20 pm
Haha. I'm watching the A&E version of Pride and Prejudice for an English project. Because I'm intensely uncreative. And my friend has been bugging me to watch it since forever. Killing two birds with one stone. W00t.
phoenix_73
Sep 25, 2005 @ 8:46 am
I saw the film last weekend. It's not perfect but KK is an interesting, albeit very skinny, Elizabeth Bennett. The only reason I'm commenting on her thinness is because the wardrobe department seemed to go out of their way to find the best clothes that would cling to her and highlight her lack of chest and bulk so it's very noticeable. There's good chemistry between the Bennetts and Brenda Bleythn isn't as screeching as Alison Steadman but the desperation to get the girls married is still as strong as ever and she brings a light touch to the character without being lightweight, if you understand what I mean.
It's an entertaining film though because of time constraints, the chain of events is speeded up. Still I enjoyed it and I was grinning like a loon towards the end. I tend to live vicariously through the romantic adventures of other people seeing as how my own romantic life has ground to a standstill at the moment. No matter.
Back on topic: I love the miniseries too. It's my perfect rainy day movie and sometimes I even find myself saying a la Mr Collins 'have a care Dawkins!' to people or 'I am exceedingly put out!' (like lady Catherine). Heh. So the series is not only fine entertainment, it also helps me find new ways of dealing with people, ways that don't involve raising my finger to them so that's something I know my mother will be thankful for at any rate.
bookgirl71
Sep 25, 2005 @ 9:24 am
The gift shop was wonderful, as you can imagine, and one of the books I bought was a "making-of" of the A&E version - it was a fun book and I bet it can be bought at Amazon. It's worth checking out.
Thanks for the tip.
helloearth
Sep 25, 2005 @ 10:21 am
He said he went for that in the film not only for a realistic portrait of the times but to emphasize how poverty was lurking around every corner for the Bennet girls, if they didn't marry well before their father died.
Well, as pointed out by Austen Blog (thanks rosjaq!), Jane Austen was in a similar position to the Bennet girls and she turned down a proposal. Instead she chose to remain living with her family and to write. Furthermore, I don't think that all five would have missed out on marriage as Jane had already received a proposal at the age of 15 and she and Lizzie were considered local beauties. Also there's Lydia. That girl was going to get herself an officer one way or another, even with Mr. Bennet being so sure that no one would pursue her due to her poverty. If she hadn't fallen prey to Wickham, someone would have fallen prey to her. Mary was the only daughter truly at a disadvantage due to poverty, bad looks and bad personality.
Their situation was serious and I think Mr. Bennet should have been more concerned but it was not immediately as dire as Mrs. Bennet saw it. Jane was still only what, 20? She still had a year or two left. It's just that they couldn't really aspire to the sort of marriages they actually ended up with. They probably would have ended up marrying down.
Limber
Sep 25, 2005 @ 11:22 am
I really, really loved the new film version. And I'm saying that as someone who has the 1996 DVDs, grew up on them, went in chanting "Keira Shitely!" and fully expecting to be able to spill out of the cinema and tumble into a pub to totally eviscerate both Shitely and Mr. Spooks.
I love it. I love the incredible chemistry between the leads, I love beautiful Jane and her giant Irish Setter of a Bingley, I love the fact that the Bennet family love each other. I love that Lizzie is capable of bafflement, and that Darcy is trying to overcome a social awkwardness that comes off as obnoxious.
One line that pissed me off no end in the mini: Jane asks Lizzie when she started to love Darcy, and Lizzie says "When I first saw the grounds of Pemberly". Maybe she's joking, but it always rankled for me, because there's a chance she meant in. In the new version, it's abundantly clear that there is an unbelievably amount of emotion going on between Darcy and Lizzie from their second meeting.
Seriously, I loved it. Give it a chance. It's grittier, wilder, less controlled, and it really was great. Different, but great.
hendersonrocks
Sep 25, 2005 @ 12:44 pm
I'm not sure there are words to describe how much I love the A&E/BBC miniseries with Jennifer Ehle and Colin Firth. There are things that I wish were perhaps a little different (Steadman's screeching, and the exact thing Limber just said- Elizabeth's comment about first seeing Pemberley... it always rubbed me the wrong way and seemed quite different than the book's interpretation), but without fail this movie always, always puts me in a happy place. Colin Firth puts me in a happy place.
I'm glad to hear that the movie may be okay- I'll be checking it out.
Angelgal
Sep 25, 2005 @ 1:30 pm
I actually squeed out loud when I saw this thread. This has to be my favorite miniseries of all time, no contest. Based on what I've heard before, the fact that I dislike Keira Knightley, and that dreadful article that was linked earlier, I don't have really high expectations for the movie, but I'll be at the theater opening weekend nevertheless.
A couple of years ago, I was fortunate enough to be able to go to Bath to the Jane Austen museum. The gift shop was wonderful, as you can imagine, and one of the books I bought was a "making-of" of the A&E version - it was a fun book and I bet it can be bought at Amazon. It's worth checking out.
I was in Bath last month and visited the Centre. Unfortunately, I was with friends who didn't share my Jane Austen obsession and kept bugging me to leave...but I did check out the fabulous gift shop. I should've ditched my friends.
The best scene for me is when she was standing at the piano turning pages for his sister and he was just staring at her all googly-eyed. I watch all six hours just so I can get to that part.
Oh, word. Darcy and Elizabeth sure knew the art of eye sex (as I like to refer to it). Another one of my favorite scenes, is, of course, the first proposal. Colin Firth just blows me away in that scene, especially with his reaction to Elizabeth's "...had you behaved in a more gentleman-like manner" line. His expression is priceless - he looks as if he's literally been slapped in the face.
still fluxing
Sep 25, 2005 @ 3:21 pm
I can hardly watch the scene with Darcy's first proposal... I just feel so bad for the poor man. I know, I know, he deserved every single word of it, but seeing him suffer is awful. And it's not just because Colin Firth is one fine piece of ass, I am the same way with the book. I have to force myself to not skip that part.
I have some mixed feelings about the Kiera-version. On the one hand, I don't want to judge it in advance, but on the other hand what I've read about it so far does not bode well.
helloearth
Sep 25, 2005 @ 4:06 pm
Because of this discussion I was watching my dvd last night and when it got to that scene Mr. helloearth couldn't resist sitting down to watch with me. He can be quite Darcyesque (is that a word? If not it should be) and always feels the need to act as a Darcy apologist when Darcy is in a scene where he isn't coming off too well.
Mystery
Sep 26, 2005 @ 12:59 am
Mr. helloearth couldn't resist sitting down to watch with me
That's so funny. When we just had the videos, MrMystery would sigh "Are you watching this again?" and then be jumping up to change videos when each one ended. The DVDs make things much easier.
However, he still looked askance at our friend's husband when we were in a pub after our day at Lyme Park and the friend raised his glass to us and intoned "My good opinion, once lost, is lost forever."
sofa addicted
Sep 26, 2005 @ 2:35 am
I've been seeing a poster for the newest film version of P&P at my local cineplex, and when I stumbled across my tape of the BBC version I wound up watching it again.
I don't like the thought of presenting Longbourne as shabby and the aura of poverty hanging over it, as if it were Tara after the yankees came through, since nothing in the book supports such an idea. I'd say Miss Austen makes it clear that the opposite is true, by Mr Bennet's speech that he had never economized because they always thought there would be a male heir and by the time that dream died, it was too much of a habit to spend freely. The stated income of 2,000 a year put the Bennet family far ahead of most families in England at that time, though nowhere near the rarified ranks of Mr Darcy or even Mr Bingley. The worry of poverty was more one of those bugaboos that probably didn't seem real to the young daughters, who most likely thought their father would live forever and they'd marry well enough so it really didn't mean much. Oddly enough, it was silly Mrs Bennet who actually had the best grasp on the total implications of it all. The A&E/BBC production presented what I think was a fair portrayal of Longbourne as a very substantial manor house, not as elegant as Pemberley, though certainly in no way run down.
Mrs Bennet was toned down a little for this production, her hilarious reaction to the news of Lizzie's engagement wasn't shown at all. I was a little disappointed not to hear her shrieking "10 thousand a year! I shall go distracted!"
One line that pissed me off no end in the mini: Jane asks Lizzie when she started to love Darcy, and Lizzie says "When I first saw the grounds of Pemberly". Maybe she's joking, but it always rankled for me, because there's a chance she meant in.
That is a direct quote from the book, and Elizabeth was not being serious:
``It has been coming on so gradually, that I hardly know when it began. But I believe I must date it from my first seeing his beautiful grounds at Pemberley.''
Another intreaty that she would be serious, however, produced the desired effect; and she soon satisfied Jane by her solemn assurances of attachment. When convinced on that article, Miss Bennet had nothing farther to wish.
ainoarwen
Sep 26, 2005 @ 6:19 am
My whole family loves the mini series. It took some convincing for our dad to watch it, but in the end, he became a devout fan.
My favorite scene has to be the dance at Netherfield Park. It is just... exquisite. I love the dance choreography, so much so that I even learned it by heart and tried dancing it out with a friend who is just as obsessed as I am with it.
Speaking of, there's a continuity error in the clips of the dance that always irritates me. When Sir Lucas approaches Lizzie and Darcy during the dance, the clip they show of Jane and Mr Bennett dancing is a totally wrong sequence. In the shown clip, they're walking in a circle around each other (holding hands) as the dancers do at the beginning of each "cycle". But as the music plays out, the correct sequence of the dance would show them at the end of the cycle. This error always bugs me a little.
If I hear very good things about the Keira movie, I may see it in the movies. If not, I guess I'll watch it when it's released on rental.
Pooki
Sep 26, 2005 @ 6:32 am
Mary was the only daughter truly at a disadvantage due to poverty, bad looks and bad personality.
I've always thought that Mary probably wouldn't have gone on to be married, and would probably be the one daughter who would stay with her parents as they got older. I think perhaps she should have married Mr Collins, she would probably have been quite well-suited to him. I suspect Kitty would have gone on to get married soon after the events of the mini-series, as she was pretty and apparently keen to marry young, and since she now had two very rich brothers-in-law who would know lots of suitable men and who could help out with the dowry, I suspect she could go on to make a very good marriage.
I'm surprised the Bingley sisters weren't more desperate to get married, Caroline's attempts to attract Darcy aside. They looked a lot older than the Bennett girls, and despite coming from a rich family, didn't exactly have men flocking to them. I love the scene where Darcy says to Caroline, after she's been disparaging Lizzie's looks, something like ‘For some time now I have thought of Miss Bennett as one of the most handsome women of my acquaintance, and Caroline's face drops, as she realises that being so bitchy probably wasn't a very good tactic to try and attract him.
choochi
Sep 26, 2005 @ 8:11 am
I've always thought that Mary probably wouldn't have gone on to be married, and would probably be the one daughter who would stay with her parents as they got older. I think perhaps she should have married Mr Collins, she would probably have been quite well-suited to him. I suspect Kitty would have gone on to get married soon after the events of the mini-series, as she was pretty and apparently keen to marry young, and since she now had two very rich brothers-in-law who would know lots of suitable men and who could help out with the dowry, I suspect she could go on to make a very good marriage.
Austen provided an epilogue of sorts to her family in which Kitty marries a clergyman near Pemberley and Mary has to settle for a clerk who works for her Uncle Phillips.
Mrs Bennet was toned down a little for this production, her hilarious reaction to the news of Lizzie's engagement wasn't shown at all. I was a little disappointed not to hear her shrieking "10 thousand a year! I shall go distracted!"
She's also grasping for compliments and ends up with: "So handsome! So tall!" Hee!
I also wish they had shown some of the post-proposal banter in the mini-series. It's one of my favorite parts of the book.
lighthouser41
Sep 26, 2005 @ 8:53 am
Because of you all, I found myself watching the miniseries again yesterday. I have both the tapes and the dvds. Mr lighthouser came in while I was watching and said."What are you watching, a western?" tee hee! The mini series is what turned me on to all things Austen and am currently reading all the books again. I try to read P and P at least once a year. I find it very modern for having been written 200 years ago.
jenniferes
Sep 26, 2005 @ 10:02 am
Sounds like you are all major fans like me, so I thought I'd turn you on to some excellent Austen sites. There are some great writers writing fantastic Austen-based fan-fiction, plus history and insights...
This is the new movie website for the UKThis is a website based around the BBC miniseries (I believe -- Firthness, as in Colin Firth)All kinds of neat info on Jane AustenGreat fan fiction and more...
bookgirl71
Sep 26, 2005 @ 12:15 pm
jenniferes, thanks for the awesome links.
All this talk about P&P means I'll have to break out my VHS tapes too. Actually, it really means that I'll just have to suck it up and get the DVDs that I haven't bought yet because I thought it was wasteful when I already have the tapes.
I don't like the thought of presenting Longbourne as shabby and the aura of poverty hanging over it, as if it were Tara after the yankees came through, since nothing in the book supports such an idea. I'd say Miss Austen makes it clear that the opposite is true, by Mr Bennet's speech that he had never economized because they always thought there would be a male heir and by the time that dream died, it was too much of a habit to spend freely. The stated income of 2,000 a year put the Bennet family far ahead of most families in England at that time, though nowhere near the rarified ranks of Mr Darcy or even Mr Bingley. The worry of poverty was more one of those bugaboos that probably didn't seem real to the young daughters, who most likely thought their father would live forever and they'd marry well enough so it really didn't mean much. Oddly enough, it was silly Mrs Bennet who actually had the best grasp on the total implications of it all. The A&E/BBC production presented what I think was a fair portrayal of Longbourne as a very substantial manor house, not as elegant as Pemberley, though certainly in no way run down.
sofa addicted, I agree with everything you wrote. Well put.
helloearth
Sep 26, 2005 @ 12:25 pm
sofa addicted I agree with your post as well and I feel that the quote
``In marrying your nephew, I should not consider myself as quitting that sphere. He is a gentleman; I am a gentleman's daughter; so far we are equal.''
from Lizzie to Lady Catherine also supports your quote and the fact that their family is by no means poor (though that is a possible future after their father dies due to the entailment) but they are living right up to the penny.
This is shown by the glimpse at the beginning of the miniseries as Mr. Bennet goes over his accounts and looks a little stressed out. The whole objection from Lady Catherine is that Lizzie has extended family in trade (in Cheapside no less!) while Darcy has connections to the aristocracy. It is not that she is some half-educated country bumpkin farmer's daughter.
choochi
Sep 26, 2005 @ 12:33 pm
I forgot about that scene with Mr. Bennet and his account books. Loved the look of disgust after he tallied things up only to be easily distracted by the wine/port bottle. Summed up Mr. B's approach to financial management pretty well. The whole series is full of little moments like that and it is easy to overlook or forget them.
I, too, agree with sofa addicted's assessment.
sofa addicted
Sep 26, 2005 @ 2:24 pm
``In marrying your nephew, I should not consider myself as quitting that sphere. He is a gentleman; I am a gentleman's daughter; so far we are equal.''
helloearth, I've often used that quote to point out that Miss Austen definitely considered the Bennets to be firmly in the genteel class due to Mr Bennet's lineage, though many revisionists try to claim the Bennets were middle class, a social position that really didn't even exist as such in 1800 England.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who found the Poor Longbourne idea distasteful and inaccurate. I tend to get riled up when I see 20th/21st century notions applied to past eras and I definitely don't like revisionism.
If I could sit down and talk to Miss A, I'd love to ask her if she had it in mind to expose more of the Bingley backstory but never did, since I find it amusing in the light of Caroline Bingley's snobbery that they
" were of a respectable family in the north of England; a circumstance more deeply impressed on their memories than that their brother's fortune and their own had been acquired by trade."
That means that the Bingleys were really no better socially than the Gardiners and the Philips (trade and an attorney) or Mrs Bennet herself (daughter of an attorney); they just had more money. They had acquired some town bronze and attitude but the Bingley sisters were first generation genteel at best. I would have considered it excessively diverting (thanks, Eliza Bennet) if Mr Darcy had been quoted as saying he found Caroline Bingley to be below his consideration as a possible wife because she wasn't a gentleman's daughter.
Aimee Myers
Sep 27, 2005 @ 11:02 pm
I would give a million dollars for Colin Firth to look at me the way he looks at Jennifer Ehle in the scene when she is playing the piano at Pemberly. He's dreamy.
This thread made me go and watch my DVDs today. It never gets old.
highlandfan
Oct 2, 2005 @ 9:58 am
My mum and I have both seen the BBC(1995) version on the DVDs and the new movi, they are both very different and both Mr Darcy's gorgeous. I would reccomend the film as well because the reviews are really postive and everyone who has seen it is loving it.
Best scene Colin Firth lake my friends and I watched that scene a few times play rewind
neciamorris
Oct 2, 2005 @ 11:04 am
I'm so happy I stumbled across this thread. It has made me long for my DVDs. I lent them to a friend, and haven't been able to get them back. I had mixed feelings about the movie. My affection for the work springs largely from the mini and I felt no real need for a theatrical version. It couldn't possibly be better, because the mini is almost perfect. Just long enough, with a chance to expeirence all these wondefully quirkly characters. A theatrical version would be too short. Would we see Mr. Collins and in his full glory? Would we be given a chance to be seduced by Mr. Wickham? Would we come to know all the quriks and quips of the Bennetts? Can you do all that in two hours and watch Elizabeth and Mr. Darcy fall in love? I don't think so. Now I know it won't. I'm not saying that it will be a terrible movie, but it won't be Jane Austen's romance. It will be this director vision, change for change's sake. I'll still go to see it with the expectations that I'm would have when seeing any historical melodrama.
Neko
Oct 2, 2005 @ 11:32 am
All of this talk about Mr. Darcy and his wet white shirt reminds of something I saw last weekend. I rented the DVD of Bridget Jones: The Edge of Reason (oh, shut up! It's got either Colin Firth or Hugh Grant in almost every scene -- what's not to love?). In the book, there's apparently a bit where the Bridget Jones character interviews Colin Firth. When they filmed the second movie, there was a lot of speculation as to whom they would find to play Colin Firth in that scene (since Colin was playing Mark Darcy, they didn't think it would work if they also had him play himself; confusing?). They ended up not finding an actor, so they cut it. But according to the director (I think) who introduced the clip on the DVD, one day after shooting, Renee Zellweger stayed in her Bridget Jones clothes (skimpy, tight) and Colin Firth changed into his own clothes and they filmed Bridget interviewing Colin. Bringing this whole mess to the topic: while he's trying to discuss the serious movie that he's supposed to be in the middle of filming, all she can do is squee about the scenes in both P&P and Love, Actually where he jumps into the water. It's really very funny, because I know that's exactly what I would have been focused on if I had a chance to talk with him. But they also dropped another tidbit that I had never heard: she asked him if it was true that in one scene, there were stage notes that said he should imagine that Mr. Darcy had an erection. I'm thinking it's the piano-at-Pemberly scene.
Oh...found a link to the scene. There are photos and a transcript, and a link to watch the clip:
Bridget squees over Colin.
mo pie
Oct 2, 2005 @ 11:53 am
I love the miniseries, and in total agreement about Mrs. Bennet being the weak link. Also someone mentioned Mary and Mr. Collins; I don't think it's in the book, but I love how Lucy Briers plays her unrequited love for Mr. Collins throughout the miniseries. She's always giving him these wonderful looks.
My one disappointment of the miniseries is that it doesn't have my favorite part of the book, where Lizzie tells her father that it was Darcy who paid off Wickham, and he says something like "Wonderful! I'll offer to pay, he'll moan and rave about his love for you, and that will be the end of it." I always wondered why that was changed/omitted.
Oh, and thanks for the link, Neko! That was the only scene in the book that I liked, and I love that they filmed it for the DVD. So funny. I wonder if the thing about the stage direction is true. I always think of that when I watch the film.
choochi
Oct 2, 2005 @ 2:22 pm
I've heard about that stage direction too. I think it was when Lizzie and Darcy meet after her three mile trek to Netherfield in part 1. Was it because of her hair, Louisa, her hair? Or was it because of her fine eyes brightened by the exercise?
phoenix_73
Oct 2, 2005 @ 4:27 pm
Yep, that stage direction is for when Darcy meets Lizzie after she treks it to Netherfield to see how sick Jane is getting on. The BBC are currently doing a series called 'Drama Connections' on Tuesday nights talking about the big TV dramas of the past and they focused on P&P about two weeks ago. The writer Andrew Davies and the producer Sue Birtwistle were talking about it and how the director decided to that a headshot of Darcy was the safest way to go and would keep everyone happy!
That link was very funny. Colin Firth's reactions were hilarious (wonder if he's had a lot of interviews like that since 1995) and Renee as Bridget was great. Thanks for posting it, Neko.
icedtea
Oct 2, 2005 @ 5:32 pm
I lurve this miniseries. It is the set of DVDs I pull out every time I'm home sick.
I have found my people. I do this too!
I probably will end up seeing the Keira version coming this fall, but it'll be going in with low expectations.
Angelgal
Oct 2, 2005 @ 5:44 pm
Superficial moment: Maybe he's just not photogenic, but this new guy playing Darcy? Nowhere near as hot as Colin Firth. Not even close.
In the book, there's apparently a bit where the Bridget Jones character interviews Colin Firth. When they filmed the second movie, there was a lot of speculation as to whom they would find to play Colin Firth in that scene (since Colin was playing Mark Darcy, they didn't think it would work if they also had him play himself; confusing?). They ended up not finding an actor, so they cut it.
Love the clip, but I'm so pissed that they weren't able to fit that scene (with another actor) into the movie. That was the funniest part of the book by a long shot.
I've always been disappointed that the miniseries cut out all the good stuff that happened in the book after the second proposal scene, but at the same time, I love the stuff that was added to show more of Darcy's POV (the scenes where he watches her out the window at Netherfield playing with a dog, and the fencing scene later on: "I shall conquer this.")
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