...unlike some OTHER fanatics of OTHER fandoms.

This hypocritical shit pisses me off so fucking much. It's so easy to take pot-shots at Trekkies because we/they've been around the longest but as much as they are WELL-AWARE of the popularity (psychotic popularity) of other shows, critics, journalists, stand-up comedians, and whathaveyou never think to allude to their nutjob fans.

I was watching JAG today (don't ask!) when I came across an episode with an undefined name involving Lt. Eh.. Whatever . We'll just call him Lt. Trekkie. He was comparing Star Trek to Shakespeare and while it could have been rather adorable it came across as downright mean-spirited. There are a lot of things wrong with JAG these days but that was the worst load of manure that I have seen in a while. And what makes this worse is that this came from a man who gave us Quantum Leap. Why do we always end up as the archetypical geeks?

What really pisses me off is that I don't see why fans of Star Trek should be condescended to because they happen to like quality programming. When it comes down to it, fans like the show because it's basically good. And somehow it's geeky to use your voice to try to keep a good show. Sheesh.

I've got to add that I'm really tired of somebody finding out I'm a Trekkie, and scoffing. "Oh, you're one of those Trekkies ... with the pointed ears. Like Dr. Spock." (italics mine) Grrrr. Or otherwise cluelessly making fun of the the show(s) or me. I don't even think I would be as offended if, while mocking me, they at least got their damn facts right.

One of the reasons we get made fun of is because since we kinda created fandom (save our show campaigns, conventions), we're the highest profile.

But yes, the perception that we're all like shudder the three geeks from Buffy is highly annoying.

To be fair, there are a bunch of actual freaks out there who get all defensive and in your face about it. But I'd hope that people can realize what's representative.

Sure, there are freaks. But there are freaks about everything. I would say that even though many of us here spend a good deal of our online time talking about Star Trek, most of us
1) Don't speak Klingon (at least not well!)
2) Don't wear Trek costumes anywhere besides conventions and/or costume parties
3) Read and watch things outside of the sci-fi genre from time to time
and
4) Know that the Federation isn't real

In the 'You know you're a Trekkie when...' Cleo posted this link a while back. It also deals with the problem that the extreme fanatics can be to everyone who might like ST but really don't care about exactly how a phase pistol works. I have a hunch that the far majority of us fall in the (sometimes slightly embarrassed) closet Trekkie category.

The article in USA Today that started this topic over in the cancellation thread may actually be based on some truth. Last week I saw a post on another board trying to rally people to bombard the USA Today poll in support of Enterprise. This was in response to several thousand anti-Enterprise votes that had been cast overnight indicating a concerted effort on the part of the Enterprise haters which caused Enterprise to be listed as a show that should be cancelled. The fact that Enterprise ended up well in the positive indicates that the pro-Enterprise faction probably did bombard USA Today. The writer of the article was possibly aware of this and made a comment alluding to it.

I do completely agree that all the cheap 'Trek fan = colossal geek' jokes get really old and are generally the sign of a not very talented writer going for a cheap laugh. But I did think that Comic Book Guy's Klingon wedding ceremony on the Simpsons last week was pretty funny.

I know a few words, and that's it.



I don't even have a Trek uniform. The most I have is a button or two with people from Star Trek on them.



I watch a lot of non-sci-fi shows and I also watch a lot of sci-fi. Trek and Wars mainly though. Book wise, it's usually either The Bible or something about wrestling or Star Trek.



No, the closest analogy we have to the Federation in real life is the UN, and truth be told, the UN is more a reflection of the Galactic Senate in the Old Republic. Ineffective and filled with corruption.

I am a Trek fan, I don't have a problem saying so and if people don't like it, then too bad. I'll tell it up front sometimes, sometimes I just let it come out. Whichever way doesn't matter to me because it's not gonna change my opinion about Trek and I'm not changing for anyone. They can either accept me as a big Trek fan or they won't and if they don't then it's their loss.......Period.

I don't have one either and, believe me, I tried my DAMNDEST to get one the last time I was in Vegas. They just didn't have one small enough.

If you or someone you know is handy with a sewing machine, they have the patterns to make them. Oooo I wonder if they have any on E-Bay? Will have to check.
ETA yep, they do.

During one of my 'Mass Media and Society' lectures last semester, our professor actually had us watch Trekkies as an example of how a form of media can influence culture. People know that I am a fan of the show, but I just felt like I wanted to sink into the floor. Especially with the 'SpinerFems' and the Trek Dentist.

The entire class, I was like, "Kill me now."



But if we watched Star Wars, there would have been no problem.

Right now, Toronto is in the threos of Maple Leaf fever, what with the Leafs advancing and all. There was a guy on the news the other day who had the Leaf's insignia tattooed onto his scalp and then shaved his hair every time the Leafs made the playoffs. Is that any less fanatic? Why is it okay to paint your face blue and roar up and down Yonge Street honking horns and damn near rioting when the team wins a game, and yet to enjoy a TV show makes one a "loser"?

I agree that most of us aren't the stereotype; I just think the people who do fit it are so bold and loud, they skew things a bit on their own, even without any help from the ER writing staff. But I still hate the latter.

Someone once posted about having some appreciation for the extremists, for keeping the show going, and so on. OK, mayyyybe.

It doesn't help that the official Paramount-made documentary about Trek chose specifically to highlight the oddest of the group- the Clinton juror really springs to mind. Does Denise Crosby have a chip on her shoulder, or was it unintentional?

On patterns: Are they on some material besides paper? Otherwise, you could photocopy them. The original Tech Manual has them (for TOS, of course).

I'm used to getting no respect, since I write romance novels -- "you write *those*?" (polite shudder). While speaking to a civic group *coughjuniorleaguecough* about my profession, I made a passing reference to an episode of TNG (I forget in what context). One of the audience gasped and said, "You mean, you're a Trekkie, too?" She made it sound as though I had just admitted I was both a pedophile and a cannibal. I don't think of myself as a Trekkie (must be that closet thing) but I've watched all the series since the original (I was young, okay?), except DS9, and I've enjoyed them. I've never understood why I should be embarrassed by that.

I am SO glad this thread was created. I was just thinking about this over the weekend. I went to the ST convention Saturday and was amazed at the variety of people there. Of course, there were the few "extremists" with the full costumes and pointed ears, but for the most part, the attendees were, for lack of a better word, normal.

It's also easy to write the lame trekkie jokes because everyone knows about it. Buffy and Smallville are not as well known, comparatively. For example, just about everyone knows about "Live long and prosper." I don't think the catchphrases from other more recent shows have had the chance to make the same impact.

As for a writing campaign, well, we write to our Congressman when we are interested in something. The only way that TV executives know about the audience is through unreliable Nielsen data and advertising. It also says a lot about the audience and their likelihood to watch the show if they take the time to write and send a letter. More than Nielsen data, that's for sure.

To answer the question about patterns, they should be on paper that is easy to handle. Not just the shape because certain instructions are also on the pattern such as notches and dots etc. And instructions should also accompany the pattern, though there are probably some serious sewers out there who don't need it.

I have had people react all the way from "you don't LOOK like a Trekkie," (what do Trekkies look like?) to "I wouldn't admit that in public, if I were you." In fact, that last one came from a family member when I was telling him that Mr. Barphe and I chose our satellite dish company based on which one offered UPN channels (at the time, one of them didn't), because we wanted to watch ST. It's even odder because said family member has questionable ethics, and is my only blood relative to have spent time as a criminal defendant in a courtroom. I don't own any Trek clothing, and the only book we have is the TOS compendium, we just watch a lot of Trek.

I've always enjoyed Trek in its different incarnations. I'm not that vocal about it, I don't go to conventions, I refuse to wear a uniform, and I have no desire to start campaigning for the show to remain on the air.

I think it's all about moderation. I love the West Wing (pre-John Wells, that is), but I'm not about to join a politcal campaign, start wearing Republicanesque clothing, listen to NPR, learn all about the federated states of Micronesia, and memorize the names and faces of Congress.

It's entertainment, nothing less, nothing more.

Of course, I tell myself that while I grit my teeth trying not to throw things at the television when I see what a travesty my favorite show has become.

Just be glad Wells isn't in charge of Enterprise. Archer would be bipolar and Malcolm would dye his hair blond and take up smoking.

I honestly don't think I've ever had a problem with it. I like Sci-fi and that includes the StarWars and X-files stuff. Maybe people do think I'm weird and I'm just not noticing it. If someone wants to wear the Klingon uniforms and speak the language, more power to 'em.

The only people that know about my obsession with Star Trek (and sci-fi in general) are my immediate relatives. A few of my close friends know that I watch Star Trek and other science fiction, but I don't let on the extent of my interest. I get tired of the shocked looks and the "You watch what?" so I just keep it to myself. I think the only outward display of my Trekkie-ness is the daily calendar on my desk at work.

Conventions are fun, and wearing the uniform (to the convention, not to jury duty!) helps you get in the spirit of things. I did it. I got compliments from both Nog and Neelix, so I think that's justification enough. Ha.

Cool!

Which reminds me: I met Icheb!! And saw Leonard Nimoy from about 50 feet away!

What bothers me most about that those types of comments are how derisive they are. What's wrong with watching a good TV show, and enjoying all the goes with it? And what harm has a really obsessive fan ever done?

Not to mention, what a judgemental thing to say. Have you ever watched it? Can you criticize that which you have not seen? Why do you think it's stupid and geeky? Because of all the pot-shots, as keckler said, that are out there? There's a really informed opinion.

And I've gotten that too, and it's just too tiresome to explain that I happen to enjoy the premise, the characters and the usually above standard television writing.

As for buying a costume and learning Klingon, it's fun. Harmless fun. I don't criticize your choice in interests. I'd appreciate the same understanding.

And scarymom, I love romance novels. There's only so much Flaubert I can take. But that's a whole other subject.

I remember, many years ago, during one of first couple seasons of NYPD Blue, they were asking some guy for his alibi, and he said, "I was home with my girl, watching Star Trek." Later they found the girl, asked her what they were doing, and she said, "Watching Star Trek. He likes the one with Spock, but I like the one with Levar." I remember being so pleased to see an instance in which people watching Trek were portrayed as something other than a bunch of stereotypical geeks.

Ha, for a second I thought you were going to say that they figured his alibi was false because guys who watch Star Trek don't have girlfriends.

Hee! That's funny, thinga!

My brother loved Free Enterprise because the Trekkies are not what he expected: the stereotypical geeks who have no social skills and can't get girlfriends. They're reasonably cool guys to whom Kirk is a hero.


I think the problem is that the media and Trekkies are full of the most extreme cases. That creates the perception that most Trekkies are like that, and not that these are the most extreme cases.

I come from a skewed world view. At an engineering school and an engineering company, it's more or less assumed you have at least a passing familiarity with Trek. That you know Kirk from Picard, at any rate, and know what "Resistance is futile" means.

I thought so, too, thinga!

I've always been very vocal about my love of Star Trek, sci-fi, comics, all things fanboy in nature. But I think it's because I know there's a stereotypical fan that I'm very far from it. Starting with my gender. So I guess it's been a little life mission for me to let everyone I come in contact know that hipsters with sex lives dig Trek, too.

So what did you all think of the Trek reference in The Office, season 1? Yes David was right (Spock is half Vulcan, not Vulcan. Technically.) but was it a harmful portrayal or loving? I could argue it either way.

I'm not too open about being a fan of Trek. I know I shouldn't really care what people think, but I can't help it. I had a hell of a hard time in high school once people found out I liked Trek. Somehow I got the nickname 'Space Man' , and it all went downhill from there. Now that I'm in college it's nowhere near as bad, but I still feel uneasy talking about Trek in public.

Allow me to be bitter? Way back in elementary (and on to high) school, there were people who Trek at the same time as I did, but they went way over the top. I know it's wrong to throw others to wolves and hope they leave you alone, but the grief that they got over it (rightfully?) was transferred to me.

And while it wasn't an issue for years- I went to a college full of geeks, and even those who weren't were pretty tolerant and even partly on our side- lately I've found myself dating a string of women with whom Trekkie-hood is a conversation stopper. I can't explain it.

It's strange that in this day and age people would be "closet Trekkies". Fans of other shows are not ridiculed to the point of "hiding". What is the difference between being a fan of another show compared to Star Trek? Because, there are those really wacky (and sometimes dangerous) sports fans, yet no ridicule, as Pippin pointed out up-thread.

It seems almost as if those passing judgement feel left out. Like being a Trek fan is some passport into (goodness, I almost said strange, new world!) some secret club. No one likes feeling excluded and so they act like bullies, sort of. Of course this doesn't justify or excuse, perhaps just explain. Then again, maybe I'm being a little too forgiving.

And nelamm, being a fan of Star Trek is one of the things that attracted me to my hubby. That and musicals, but I digress.

Oh they get ridiculed by me. "Baseball cap" is a dirty insult in my group of friends. Maybe the difference is that sports nerds are supposedly big and strong and can beat you up if you make fun of them where as sci-fi fans are all supposedly spindly and weak and have to sit there and take it?

Hee, belsum! While they may be able to beat me up, I can certainly make their life hell. Or I could ask the friendly neighborhood Klingon to avenge my honor.

Seriously, I try to look at it as, "To each his own". Everyone has likes and dislikes. Hubby went on some subway rail-fan trip last weekend, which completely bores me. Sportsfan, fine whatever. More power to you and go team. But, this need to separate people into categories really bothers me. Not to mention that people derive pleasure from insulting and mean-spirited remarks, just really ..... makes me want to go watch Star Trek.

I must admit, I tend to hide my Trekkiness quite a lot, and only my family and close friends (read: those who come out to my flat and see my huge ST video collection) really know about it. I don't know why I hide it, and if someone else admits to a liking for Trek I'll jump right in and agree.

Although, I'm just about the only person I know who lives alone, and I don't want to encourage the image among my friends of me sitting on my own in a Starfleet themed room, wearing Vulcan ears and watching DS9. :)

And nelamm, if someone mentioned Trek to this girl on a date, the evening would suddenly perk up!

And I actually want to do this. Monster House Trek style. Or at least TOS inspired colors.

When I was in grammar and high schools, I kept it to myself for my own survival. I was already picked on ALOT for being different, it would have been even worse if they knew about my love of sci-fi. Now I guess I hide it as a reflex action.

frenchtoast, I think you're being just a bit generous. Some people are just mean. And while there may not be literal beating up by anyone older than, say, Nelson Muntz, belsum, I think that dynamic lingers in our minds for quite some time. Me, I once got beaten rather severely by someone who disapproved of my Trek-love.

As to jumping in, EnglishMuffin, I try, but more often than not (and I know I'll come across as a real jerk here), the Trekkie I find myself talking to will turn out to be one of...them. At the very least, they'll make me feel all kinds of inadequate (especially because they tend to be into "serious" sci-fi too, which I'm not), and sometimes they'll just turn me off. In my sister's synagogue, for example (I pray there a lot too), there's a whole crew of these people. They're very nice, and it's nice to share interests, but...I avoid them. Maybe I want to have my cake and eat it, too- to enjoy my Trek and yet not be labeled. I don't know.

Whoa. Turning into a confessional here. On a cheerier note, Muffin, remind me to look you up the next time I'm on your side of the pond :-) . (Although I wonder: What are English Muffins called over there? Do they even exist?)

I've found that TWoP is the perfect place for that.

Oh, I know what you mean.

Somewhat off-topic, but

Errr... I don't actually know. To the best of my knowledge, we just call them muffins; they're kind of like a bread roll/teacake type thing? (Don't even ask why I chose the name of something I can't even describe.) And you're welcome over here anytime, nelamm!

Yeah, probably. Then again, I'm a girl (ewwww) and, like belsum said, when a female admits that she likes Star Trek, for some reason it doesn't seem to generate the same reaction. Plus, I'm trying to work up some good...is it karma?

I agree, some people are downright mean and it really bothers me. Especially over something as relatively unimportant as a television show. Really, why does it bother them so much that they have to nasty and at times violent.

Gosh, this topic gets my blood boiling. It's just the unfairness of it.

Oh boy, I know exactly what you mean. When I went to college, I was thrilled to actually find one other person who was into Trek. And then... he started talking. And get this - his name was Kirk. Because his mom? Loved Kirk. Gahh... I love Jadzia, but I'm not gonna name my kid that. ;) (And with my luck, I've probably just offended someone who named their daughter Jadzia. Sorry.)



Hmmm... I'm not really sure I see that. I'm a chick and in my high school, the only Trekkies (for lack of a better term, lol) were me & one guy a few years ahead of me. (This guy rawked - I was able to have awesome, indepth, intelligent discussions about Trek-related issues with someone who wasn't one of "them," as nelamm so aptly put it, hee!) I was ridiculed just as much as the guy. Of course, we were pretty comparable 'geeks' - we both wore glasses, were pale as hell, spent most of our down-time reading (gasp!), and loved not only Star Trek, but The X-Files and all sorts of fantasy & sci-fi.

Now that I'm in college, though, overall it isn't as bad. Maybe because college is a little more... grown-up... than HS. Just a tad, though. ;)

I've never hid that I was a Trekkie or a Phile - but I don't go around wearing pointy ears and insulting people in Klingon. ;) But I will wear an X-Files T-shirt and the gods know that if I ever actually make it to a con, I WILL make myself a shirt that says "I heart Porthos." ;)

Wow, this is a really interesting thread.
I kind of agree with frenchtoast's exclusion theory, mainly because I see it everywhere (though not always to the violent extent nelamm pointed out). It seems that to feel included ourselves, we exclude others -- pointy-eared or perpetually holding a beer can or (insert your favorite stereotype).
Down with "Boxes"! Long Live Individual Expression!
Yeah, I'm a great subversive, but I need to work on my slogan writing...

I recall being at a Trek convention when a TV crew turned up for a news story. They got all the people who'd entered the costume parade and asked them really nice sensible questions about why they liked Trek and about making the costumes. All very pleasant. Then they edited it to make my friends look like freaks.

I don't care what people think of me. I'm very much an outed Trekkie and proud of it (except when I get accused of liking Voyager).

This is the larger "problem". This kind of treatment reinforces all those bullies who think that it's OK to beat up or at least intimidate those who are different. When media outlets ridicule Trekkies it perpetuates the idea that Trekkies are in season all the time.

I must live a very circumspect life, because I don't regularly come into contact with .... those Trek fans. That being said, I might be a little intimidated by their extensive knowledge, but I would hope that they wouldn't think worse of me because I am not as an avid fan. I guess I'm naive, but I like to think that they would be as accepting and welcoming as I would be to them. It doesn't mean that I expect them to become my best friends, but being pleasant and, at the bare minimum, courteous never hurt anyone. And no, I will not take off my rose-colored glasses.

That's what bothers me the most about the above quote. Here people were being friendly and helpful and the media had to twist it. For nor reason than to try to embarrass and humiliate. No, not every Trekkie is a rabid fan, but it doesn't mean s/he turned in their humanity card when s/he became a Trekkie. And to target them, after they've been nice enough to talk with you, just pisses me off.

nelamm, I just caught this while re-reading the thread. What? What happened to this person? If you don't mind my asking, where did you grow up?

I just look at all of us who are regularly in these fora. We are a very diverse group, and though I have only met one of us in person, we seem a well educated relatively well-adjusted group.



Heck, they needed something to replace the hookers there! :-P

skye, don't ask. A traumatic youth. This particular incident was in summer camp (upstate New York, I guess), in a bunk of people who didn't like me for a bunch of reasons, but picked on this one in particular. Bullies vs. nerds, old story, multiplied in intensity.

nelamm, that's horrible.

I always felt betwixt and between with my Trek love. On one hand, I had my mother--who felt that, somehow, Star Trek made me gay. Seriously. That's what she said. On the other hand, I had friends in eighth grade who were...well, frightening in their Trek/Dr. Who love.

It's perfectly fine to plaster a big-ass Titans magnet on your SUV, paint your face blue and red, scream at people at football games who, for some inexplicable reason, don't fall down prostrate at the mere mention of "patriotism," and, generally, act an ass concerning football, basketball, hockey, what-have-you--but if you mention loving Star Trek and thinking that Deep Space Nine was the best post-TOS show, you get looks as if you just said you're waiting for the mothership to come and take you away.

Or, worse, you get some snotty fucktard telling you that you spend too much time watching television and not enough time "studying."