keckler
Feb 23, 2004 @ 1:06 am
The episode we've all been hoping for: mutiny and Cpt. Trip.
Or is it?
keckler
Feb 25, 2004 @ 10:12 pm
So...no one in Eastern or Central time liked this episode?
cuiusquemodi
Feb 25, 2004 @ 10:20 pm
I only saw it after the first 10 minutes (it being Ash Wednesday and all), but I liked what I saw. I liked the mutinity, liked Papa Quantum, liked it all. Not one of the best episodes ENT's ever had (sorry, that honor belongs to Twilight now and at least until next week), but still good.
I must say, though, I saw the reverse imprinting half an hour away. It was still good, but wouldn't Reed's and the Major's... friendship precluded him confining Reed to quarters? I must say, after the scene in the shuttle (bickering like an old married couple!), I'm not entierly closed to the idea of them.
Porthos and May-yet-be-useful both got decent screen time, and Hoshi finally does something to advance the plot
And the reason more people aren't on- I tried a bit earlier and it said TWOP Forums might not be up til the morrow.
Edited To Add: Yay. I got the first non-Keckler post for once. An hour and a half after the episode aired. And next week: (in case the preview constitutes a spoiler) Weepy T'pol
Beregond
Feb 25, 2004 @ 10:24 pm
Beats me why nobody's responded... decent episode.
I had no inkling of what to expect beyond the words 'insectoid hatchery'. Expecting some rip on Alien, I was pleasantly surprised by what came along.
It's almost a shame Quantum's little problem wasn't permanent, but I guess we already saw that in "Twilight". The Starfleet-vs-MACO bit was a bit shoehorned, but not uninteresting. Good to know a mutiny can go over well if it has to.
Not much to say beyond that, other than that Bakula does a good Dr. Doobug impression...
Edited 'cuz cuiusquemodi's post reminded me of that ep title
jenmarie
Feb 25, 2004 @ 10:27 pm
I was really bored by the episode. Since UPN promos gave away the mutiny part of the ep., the minute Quantum got the bug juice on him, I pretty much figured out what would happen.
I enjoyed the Reed/Hayes stuff. They make such a cute couple don't they? I really like Hayes in general though.
The little Baby Xindi bugs were kind of cute.
HarleyQ
Feb 25, 2004 @ 10:30 pm
That rocked. I didn't think they'd actually go through with it, but it was full-scale mutiny all the way. I liked the fact that although Trip was the first to disagree with the Captain's plan (which he did quite strongly when it was just him, the Captain and T'Pol talking), he was also the one who defended him the longest. I thought that was a nice touch.
P.S. -- Re. time delay: Can't post until Angel is over, of course!
jen
Feb 25, 2004 @ 10:30 pm
Vulcan nerve pinch!!!
Best. Episode. Ever. Even though I spotted the mind control egg squirt, was still awesome seeing it play out. And they put T'pol in a uniform again. Best executed mutiny I've ever seen. All around impressive. They better not cancel this damn show.
Hugin
Feb 25, 2004 @ 10:32 pm
I was disappointed that it was clearly just Archer being under the influence of alien mommy juice. Because I as a viewer knew with such certainty that Archer was not in his right mind, the conflict lost all tension. I would have been much more psyched by a real ethical disagreement about how to proceed. Alternatively, if Archer must be BabyBugDrunk, make the sounding out of Hayes or some of the other Uh Ohs more interesting. For a short time, I was actually hoping that they were subtly jiggering it such that the stuff in Archer's system made him immune to something local to the planet or the ship that was affecting the judgement of the rest of the landing crew, such that really, his attempt to make a humanitarian bridge to the Xindi was actually the proper choice, and the others were being unnaturally callous. But they didn't take it that way.
Mayweather got some lines. They're still horribly wasting Daniel Dae Kim. The one female Uh Oh on the bridge is cool, although she didn't do much of anything this ep. I suspect she's a stuntwoman, not an actor, but I wish they'd give us a few more little peeks into these people. Or just stick them in red shirts and be done with it. Is Scott Bakula thinning up top more noticeably than before?
It was okay.
ETA: Yes, god, please please please keep T'Pol in a Starfleet uniform through whatever contrivance is necessary.
the47thman
Feb 25, 2004 @ 11:47 pm
I didn't post earlier because I couldn't get to the forums!
Anyway, yes, I'll add my chorus to the "like" section. Well-executed, and Starfleet-unied T'Pol? Nicely satisying.
I think that Archer's initial impulse to save the hatchlings was the right one, but that he also would've been right to stop trying once they knew they had to deplete their anti-matter reserves. After all, it wasn't the Enterprise's fault that the Bug Ship crashed (note that I did miss the teaser, so if it was... oops), so it's not like they were liable there.
RiverThames
Feb 25, 2004 @ 11:56 pm
Liked it. Spotted the bug-juice-makes-the-Captain-wacky aspect, but I think that was just fine. As far as I'm concerned, that means the episode was playing fair.
And while Archer was driven to a point of irrationality, all his reasons why to save the Insect eggs were good ones-- just gone too far in intensity.
Sooeygun
Feb 26, 2004 @ 8:19 am
I didn't hate it.
Wasn't the most exciting episode ever and I didn't think we learned enough about the insect Xindi to make it worthwhile. Except where to hit their ships to make them blow up.
I thought Reed was a little over zealous in his attack on the Xindi ship. I expected that last shot to disable them, and then boom..better than a can of Raid. Kills. Bugs. Dead.
metal666
Feb 26, 2004 @ 8:20 am
Quantum new mission,
castrating Reed every other ep.
Harbringer
Hatery
tarragon918
Feb 26, 2004 @ 8:34 am
Well, as to why no-one had posted...when I logged on to TWoP last night, between 9:30 and 10:00 PM, there was -no- thread for Hatchery. I don't know what was going on--I tried refreshing my screen, but it never appeared and I was afraid to start a thread myself! So I had comments to make, just nowhere to put them.
As to the episode ... well, I really enjoyed last week's foray into Phlox and Porthos and had been looking forward to Hatchery, but I must say that I saw what happened coming at least a mile down the road. As soon as that slime/goo from the insectoid egg was squirted on CQ's cheek, I figured that was going to cause him to act all irrational. And it did! So why didn't any of the rest of the crew catch it well before they finally decided to act upon it?! For that matter, why the heck did they even take off their EVA gear inside that insectoid ship?! They had no idea what sort of contaminants might be on there--and you certainly wouldn't/shouldn't do it just because the air is breathable. Haven't they learned -anything- yet?!
I enjoyed watching the mutiny though, and am continuing to enjoy the on-going conflict between Reed and Hayes (ye gods, do those guys have chemistry or what?!). Insectoid babies gave me the creeps, though--they did look too much like gigantic roaches, I guess. And I got a few minutes (more) of Porthos this week. That is always a good thing.
ETA: changed "post" to "thread" in first paragraph--thread is what I meant, I just couldn't think of it then!
RS6
Feb 26, 2004 @ 8:45 am
Even though I missed the first 10 minutes or so and didn't see the bug spray thing. I had pretty much guessed from the begining that the captain was injected with something to make him wants to protect the eggs. So the whole mutiny was never a realy mutiny to me. I think the whole mutiny was "who think the captain is sick" rather than "who think the captain is wrong".
I also think it's a cop-out that it was mindless-always-follow-order-whatever-the-cost MACO vs. we-think-the-captain-is-sick-Starfleet rather than mutiny-Starfleet vs we-support-the-captain-Starfleet. I think it would've been interesting to see if some of the senior officers support the captain and what kind of rift(if at all) it would create between the the crews in future episode.
skye1974
Feb 26, 2004 @ 8:51 am
We're back!
Yeah, I liked this too. As soon as it was over I wanted to shout, "Awesome episode!" as I have been doing lately, but I didn't. However, it was good, pretty good. I figured that Quantum was under the influence of the "bug juice", but had my doubts. The mutiny was great, even if (as predicted by someone in the spoiler board) it was resolved within 42 minutes.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: I love Jolene Blalock and Connor Trinneer! They have a great chemistry in this ep as colleagues and, possibly, good friends. Their expressions while T'Pol was trying to convince Trip to betray Quantum were spot-on.
I even enjoyed the continuing Reed/Hayes conflict turning into grudging respect.
The Mini Bug Houses were adorable. I will reserve my judgment on "the tears" until I actually see next week's episode.
frenchtoast
Feb 26, 2004 @ 9:08 am
While I liked it, I too saw the bug spray a mile away. I would have preferred if he was trying to save them because he felt it was the right thing to do. He had an excellent point--if those were primate babies, the crew would have helped. However, they needed that bug spray plot device to explain why he would jeopardize (well, almost) the mission for another species babies.
And who isn't going to notice T'Pol, or anyone for that matter, wearing a baseball cap into the armory? Wouldn't that seem just a bit weird? But, she looks so much better in the uni than those stupid technicolor catsuits.
I lost a little bit of respect for Hay-for-Brains when he followed the captain's orders without question. But I liked the shout-out to West Point (I live about 20 mins away). And once again, Malcolm showed why he is better at defending the ship by knowing the ship inside and out. Why didn't Hay-for-Brains have someone posted there? But I give Hay-for-brains credit for pulling the pistol on the body bags. I kept expecting one of them to pop out or something. In fact, that was the best scene of the whole ep, IMO.
And I don't think that Quantum is trying to belittle Malcolm. Malcolm may have been a little trigger happy, but for crying out loud, where the hell was CQ?
And, holy crap, Maywho not only spoke, he actually did something?!
And I HATED the promos for next week. Grrrrrrrr.
Skategrrl
Feb 26, 2004 @ 9:27 am
When I attempted to post last night, I received a message the boards were down, so perhaps that is why no one else posted.
I liked the episode. Like others, I too knew Archer's mental state was caused by the Love Bug Juice, but the tone of the episode kept me interested. And because I have a total irrational fear of bugs, I became extremely creeped out (in a good, scary movie way) when the baby insects were crawling up and down his arm. BTW, kudos to Bakula in that scene.
I was also very happy that EVERYONE in the main cast had screen time. Including Porthos. :-)
zooropa
Feb 26, 2004 @ 9:35 am
I liked it. Not great, but decent enough.
I like that there is still some tension between Reed and Hayes. I expected them to drop that plot after the big fistfight a couple of weeks ago and make them all buddy-buddy. But no, Reed is still overly sensitive about Hayes encroaching on his territory with the training of Starfleet personnel and Hayes is more than willing to needle Reed about the fact that Archer is in favor of the extra training. But at least Reed is willing to admit that he was wrong about the simulations Hayes was running. And Hayes admitted that Reed was probably right not to tell him about the mutiny. Loved the look on Reed's face as his worst nightmare comes true when Archer replaces him with Hayes as Tactical Officer.
Even though it was clear that Archer was under the influence of the bug juice sprayed on him, I liked how it played out with the MACOs involved. If this had happened with just Starfleet officers onboard, there would have been no conflict at all. But with the very military, follow orders no questions asked, MACOS on board there was real tension as Trip, T'Pol and Reed tried to get control of the ship. Archer appealed to Hayes' military side with the 'I need officers who understand the chain of command' speech so Hayes was going to do what he was told and the others would have to take the ship back by force.
Loved that Mayweather was the hero by taking Hayes down.
Loved the look on Trip's face when the bugs were crawling all over Archer. It was an 'okay, you're completely wacky now so I'm just gonna shoot you' look.
Movie night is on Monday now? They should have had Reed say that they already moved movie night from Tuesday so Hayes could run training then, so Trip will really not be happy to have more training on Monday.
Yes, T'Pol must be put in a Starfleet uniform permanently and soon please. Don't they get that she looks 1000 times better in the uniform?
Question - how did Reed and T'Pol get on the bridge? I think I missed something here because when they saw the entrance was guarded by MACOs, Reed said they couldn't get in that way and they turned back. Then they suddenly appeared on the bridge from different directions. T'Pol seemed to appear from behind Hoshi. How many entrances are there to the bridge anyway?
nelamm
Feb 26, 2004 @ 9:41 am
Not bad. Yeah, I saw the whole thing from the first second, but I like how it played out- who the MACOs supported, how Trip changed, etc. I wonder if this will come up again at all, if/when the infants are discovered.
frenchtoast- baseball caps are standard wear on NX-01, much as they are in the US Navy today. I grinned when I realized it was her. And a nerve pinch!
zooropa- they showed them getting into a Jeffries tube, and then come onto the bridge from the starboard side (the usual entrance is on the port side).
I'm not quite clear on why Phlox couldn't use his powers as CMO to order the MACO to ignore Archer in that scene where he's trying to scan him. But I can see that he'd be reluctant to risk it- and he was only delaying to get a scan anyway.
West Point! Yay! I love little real-life touches (like baseball caps).
I had to rewind the Eugenics Wars bit to get the story because the first time around, I was too busy figuring when Archer's great-grandfather lived. I guess he theoretically could have lived in the 1990's, but it fits better if he had fought in the wars of the 2250's. (And, as it happens, we know the Eugenics Wars never happened, without massive fanwankery.)
And Hoshi and Mayweather both got to kick some ass. I liked the way it was shown- the senior officers are plotting the whole episode, and all we see on the ensigns' faces are reactions and following orders. So it was nice when Hoshi refused the order, and Mayweather flipped Hayes. (Was Mayweather's voice all weird at the beginning, or was it just me/ my set?)
Lots of little points and big points a good episode make.
RiverThames
Feb 26, 2004 @ 9:40 am
I lost a little bit of respect for Hay-for-Brains when he followed the captain's orders without question. But I liked the shout-out to West Point (I live about 20 mins away).
I was torn-- I mean, I didn't like his "orders above all else" attitude, but at the same time, I liked that he acknowledged both that Reed should have talked to him rather than coming in guns blazing, and also that whole idea behind what happened to Archer was pretty much outside of his experience set.
GoldfishGirl42
Feb 26, 2004 @ 9:45 am
Man, I didn't know how addicted I was to TWoP until it wasn't there. ( And I've got it bad.)
It wasn't Twilight(well , nothing is), but if Hatchery is a harbinger(sorry) of things to come, the last quarter-season of eps is gonna rock.
I don't think I've ever said this before, but....Bakula was good. The scene where he confined Malcolm to his quarters( and before him T'Pol), and the Bugman of Alcatraz scene...creepee.
For once, I actually saw the end plot twist coming a mile away, but I thought it was nice that they put in a scene where they messed with our heads a little- "You mean there's nothing wrong with him?" Almost believed it for a second.
Y'all know my deep love for Connor Trinneer. :) The Boy was great as usual, and though we haven't seen it much this season, I loved the shout-out to Archer and Trip's friendship- as someone said, that he was the first to go "WTF?", but the one who held out the longest(well of the mutineers) believing in the Cap'n.
-Is it wrong that I laughed out loud when Hayes was holding the gun on the dead bug?On a more serious note, hurrah for not ending the Reed-Hayes tension...no more fist fights, but more tension please...
-Was that a nerve pinch I saw? Joy and rapture!
-A sort of continuity: the long recalcitrance of any Star Trek captain to go get a physical gets a little more sinister.
-Cute little buggers, weren't they?
Good acting good writing, good plot: can't wait for next week....
skye1974
Feb 26, 2004 @ 9:57 am
Lots of little points and big points a good episode make.
One of the little points that stood out to me is how personal T'Pol has made this mission. Her loyalty and affection for her human shipmates (which even seems to extend to Earth itself) is just awesome, in the truest sense of the word. Her determination to complete the mission and save Earth is as strong as the rest of the crew of Enterprise.
Tonight, she was willing to disobey Quantum, a man she obviously admires and respects. She was also able to convince Trip, also a man she admires and respects (maybe just a little bit more than Quantum ;-)) to betray his long-time friend and Captain.
One thing that kind of confused me, though. When T'Pol made her log entry as acting captain at the end, she said that they had left the Bug House ship and were on their way to Azati Prime. However, when Trip went to see Quantum, the captain ordered him to tell Travis to proceed to Azati Prime and Trip nodded his compliance. Was Quantum just ignorant of the fact that T'Pol had already done this and was Trip just sort of patronizing Quantum (in a good way) to make him feel as if he had regained control?
Whew, too many pronouns...
Oh and the tiny little shipper in me smiled at the scene in Sickbay at the end when T'Pol left and she looked back at Trip as if to indicate that he should follow and he did. I'm sure it didn't mean anything, but it was cool in my little head.
lowkey
Feb 26, 2004 @ 10:10 am
One thing that made me chuckle ...
When T'Pol and Trip are first discussing the possibility of removing Archer, and she mentions that they need Phlox to do a full workup. Trip says that what she's asking will get them both thrown in the brig. Then she gives him "the look".
Maybe I'm crazy, probably I'm crazy, but I interpreted that look to say "Together? Would that be so bad?"
Like I said, I thought it was worthy of a chuckle. And it seems obvious that T'Pol is wearing the spandex stretch pants in that relationship.
frenchtoast
Feb 26, 2004 @ 10:15 am
Nelamm, I’ve seen the caps before, but I never noticed the crew wearing them on the ship, only on away missions, if that's the correct term. I was surprised none of the crew/MACO's noticed. But loved the nerve pinch. And please, keep her in the uniform.
And Goldfish Girl, that whole shuttlepod scene with Hayes and Malcolm made me laugh. And I do like that they are still a bit at odds. Why would one fight solve their differences?
Michmak
Feb 26, 2004 @ 10:36 am
I really enjoyed this episode - loved Archer and his reasoning, taken to the nth degree - for saving the eggs. Reed and Hayes are great together! The shipper in me loved the look Reed shot at Hoshi when she refused to do what Hayes told her.
And is it just me, or did this episode make anyone else want to go and read Ender's Game by Orson Scott Card? I'm sure the Xindi Insectoids are just the Buggers with a different name.
ETA: forgot to mention that I really enjoyed Archer's firm tushie in the Starfleet Undies. Yum.
thingamajig
Feb 26, 2004 @ 10:38 am
So...no one in Eastern or Central time liked this episode?
Some of us in the Central time zone didn't get to
see the episode, because as usual, SEC basketball is king. How many more weeks until basketball is over?
DrTomorrow
Feb 26, 2004 @ 11:33 am
Yah, when I tried to access TWoP after this ep, I got a "boards down until Feb 25" message.
I liked this one quite a bit, for a lot of little reasons. It did remind me of some of the better episodes from other ST series, a ship-based story with lots of interesting littler character interactions and insights.
As to Phlox the CMO vs. MACOs - from past eps I gather that the whole Starfleet / MACO / Starfleet Medical chain.of.command hasn't been entirely hashed out.
And call me a big silly, but every time I hear Phlox say "Imaging Chamber", I get a nostalgic feeling.....
dml
Feb 26, 2004 @ 12:23 pm
I've said it before and I'll say it again: I love Jolene Blalock and Connor Trinneer! They have a great chemistry in this ep as colleagues and, possibly, good friends.Their expressions while T'Pol was trying to convince Trip to betray Quantum were spot-on.
I agree, I think those two actors have wonderful chemistry. It doesn't matter what the situation is, dramatic, humorous, or sexy, they make a fantastic duo.
I also really liked how T'Pol invaded Trip's personal space and got very close to him during the same scene. It's the combination of the professional and personal dynaminc in their relationship that I find so interesting.
nelamm
Feb 26, 2004 @ 12:24 pm
Nostalgia for what? And remind me- Phlox said Quantum didn't even realize the control himself, right? That's why it had to fit within his own logic, I guess.
Maybe the MACOs don't have a similar rule about the CMO, and so would ignore it.
frenchtoast, they wear the cap often in the engine room. But I guess it was more important to cover the ears and just get the guard down for the second or so needed.
I noticed the "on the way" thing at the end too. They were clearly moving at warp, and then Quantum and Trip spoke like they were still in orbit. And I doubt Trip could cover up- CQ could look out the window.
Lots of beauty shots of the ship this week, by the way.
And are there different styles of underoos?
BassetHound
Feb 26, 2004 @ 12:28 pm
Keckler said:
So...no one in Eastern or Central time liked this episode?
Well, any viewers in Philadelphia or the surrounding area had
Enterprise preempted for a college basketball game. Damn UPN. I'll have to catch the re-broadcast.
tothemax
Feb 26, 2004 @ 12:31 pm
I'm conflicted about this episode. The bug juice thing was so incredibly predictable I was a little miffed that Phlox et al didn't think of it right away. And I wanted the the Xindi arc to move forward which didn't happen. On the other hand, the ep was well done and a little creepy. I was entertained which is what matter in the end. Still, on with the arc already!
frenchtoast
Feb 26, 2004 @ 1:07 pm
Nelamm, I am ashamed to admit I never noticed them wearing caps in Engineering. ::bowing shamefacedly:: Which is why it stuck out for me in the episode.
I noticed the "on the way" thing at the end too. They were clearly moving at warp, and then Quantum and Trip spoke like they were still in orbit. And I doubt Trip could cover up- CQ could look out the window.
Mr. Toast commented that why in the world did CQ choose his quarters if he wasn't going to look outside!? I just shrugged my shoulders and thought perhaps the CQ scene was supposed to be first, but got moved in the editing.
IMO, the episode would have had more teeth if CQ wasn't sprayed and was doing it for humane reasons. Even though I knew it was the spray, I was hoping it wasn't.
But, seriously, why couldn't they have written a story about questioning Quantum helping the Xindi without that bug spray plot device. When he started the repairs for the hatchery, I thought of
keckler's continually gripe that the Insectoids and Reptilians are evil because they're different, and was hoping against hope that they would explore it. But, no.
belsum
Feb 26, 2004 @ 1:12 pm
The bug juice thing was so incredibly predictable I was a little miffed that Phlox et al didn't think of it right away.
I actually yelled at the TV, "Don't you people know how sci-fi works?!" I'm wondering if it was even
supposed to be a "twist". Maybe we're just all in that mindset still from last week. Was there anybody who
didn't know it was the bug goo?
I must say, after the scene in the shuttle (bickering like an old married couple!), I'm not entierly closed to the idea of them.
I'm totally onboard the Reed/Hayes ship now. I loved their interactions this episode. Thought it was very a believable progession.
They're still horribly wasting Daniel Dae Kim.
Yep. It's wrong.
alexxia
Feb 26, 2004 @ 1:35 pm
I liked this episode. The bug juice seemed too obvious to me. After Phlox said the bugs only lived to 12 years, I really thought this was going to be a 'try to make your enemies your friends' storyline....kind of like Geordi/Hugh, Odo/Jem Hadar baby or Seven/Borg from the future. Anyway...I was still hoping up until CQ's obvious meltdown. I also really enjoyed all the crew interactions with the mutiny. And a scene with Porthos...love that dog.
roffle
Feb 26, 2004 @ 1:51 pm
They have to get Blalock in a crew worksuit, T'Pol wearing pajamas is like yelling "she's an officer and the people next to her are likely to be important enough to blow up too".... She knows she's vaccum packed into her costume, and that that was part of her contract to be the space babe.... two or three shows back on Degra's ship she had to hold a readpad in front of her Stairway to Heaven to cover up....
Bug Juice was okay, but then Quantum is absolved and it's "Good mutiny Trip, no hard feelings?"
The crew and Maj. Hayes had that "O shit this is real, this can't be real but it is..." but the rest of the MACOs didn't have it. Hard to root for cardboard MACOs.
NOBODY kills movie night, you mofo....
SA22C
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:00 pm
I was horribly dissapointed by this episode. It was billed as 'consequences' for Archer's new 'win at any cost' ethic. Instead we get the good ol' Alien-mind-control schtick.
BAH!
Am I the only one who thinks that Archer should have to answer for his decisions sometime soon? I mean, let's take stock here, shall we?
1) Threatened to kill Sim in order to save Trip
2) Did the decompression boogie on a prisoner
3) Refused to let Phlox give the Alien-in-desperate-need-of-moisturizer pain killers so that he could conduct an ineffectual interrogation.
The way Archer is going, there will come a time when the crew should not swallow his latest 'bending' of morality. That should be the subject of a mutiny, not this worn out drek that we were subjected to last night. The lack of conviction displayed by the writers really ruined this episode for me, despite some great moments between Malcolm and Hayes and between Trip and Archer, especially in the final scene.
I'd also like to register myself as hopelessly old-fashioned. I don't see the so-called gay subtext between Malcolm and Hayes. All I see are two guys in a pissing match over their respective territories. Why is everyone so insistent that the two are seconds away from getting a room and a big tube of Vaseline ?
dougkeenan
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:02 pm
Was there anybody who didn't know it was the bug goo?
Yes. Chief Medical Officer. Science Officer. Even Chef.
They did a great job not figuring out the obvious. I don't know whether earth should be rooting them on or preparing burial rituals.
Jeebus Shuttlesworth
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:10 pm
I thought it was ok. The bug juice thing was obvious from the start. Good moments were T'Pol in a Starfleet uniform, Trip both raising his objections to the captain but also defending his orders to the others, and those creepy bug babies.
How can anyone take the MACOs seriously in those uniforms? I was staring at them, trying to figure out what that white junk was supposed to be. Snow? Stars? Is it supposed to be some sort of camoflage?
skye1974
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:14 pm
I was staring at them, trying to figure out what that white junk was supposed to be. Snow? Stars?
My thought was bird crap.
tothemax
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:16 pm
It was billed as 'consequences' for Archer's new 'win at any cost' ethic.
Never ever ever ever believe anything you see in a UPN promo. Ever.
I don't see the so-called gay subtext between Malcolm and Hayes. All I see are two guys in a pissing match over their respective territories. Why is everyone so insistent that the two are seconds away from getting a room and a big tube of Vaseline ™ ?
It's mostly wishful thinking. And Vaseline comes in jars... or so I've heard.
keckler
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:20 pm
Well, as to why no-one had posted...when I logged on to TWoP last night, between 9:30 and 10:00 PM, there was -no- thread for Hatchery. I don't know what was going on--I tried refreshing my screen, but it never appeared and I was afraid to start a thread myself! So I had comments to make, just nowhere to put them.
tarragon, there was a thread, it was on the second page of General Gabbery.
RiverThames
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:22 pm
They did a great job not figuring out the obvious. I don't know whether earth should be rooting them on or preparing burial rituals.
Well, there's "figuring it out" and "proving it". I think they had pretty much figured it out, that's why they had their mutiny. But they also knew that just saying, "He got hit by bug juice and is now being wacky so we're ignoring him," wasn't going to wash with a guy like Hayes. They needed evidence, and for evidence they had to do a full scan of Archer.
Saeward
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:30 pm
IMO, the episode would have had more teeth if CQ wasn't sprayed and was doing it for humane reasons. Even though I knew it was the spray, I was hoping it wasn't.
It would take a show with much more courage (ntm freedom from Network interference) than
Enterprise to do a plot like that. Mutiny plots on TV series involving main characters pretty much have four choices:
- 1. the Captain is not in his right mind;
- 2. The mutineers are not in their right minds;
- 3. the mutiny is a ruse to fool a third party; or
- 4. either the Captain or the mutineer/s are being clearly identified as villains
Otherwise, either the Captain or the mutineers are ruined as protagonists for the foreseeable future. Mutiny, even fictional mutiny, is serious business.
dougkeenan
Feb 26, 2004 @ 2:34 pm
There was a TNG episode with this sort of structure - Picard taking the ship into a star or something. The crew gets pushed to how much they'll take before self-preservation kicks in. ("You can't protect someone who's trying to destroy you." Thought we had that figured out by the first series!)
I just don't understand why Hayes couldn't see the obvious - Archer gets facial, Archer acts irresponsible. How long would Phlox's scan have to take? I'd rather believe Hayes really *is* after Malcolm's job and struck at the opportunity.
frenchtoast
Feb 26, 2004 @ 3:21 pm
Saeward, I agree, mutiny is serious business. Although I liked the mutiny part of this episode, I wish it could have been avoided by actually developing a sort of sympathy for the buggy babies. But when Archer agreed to the quantity of the anti-matter, I realized they weren't going down that path.
Thankfully, they did give us a little to think about. Archer's comment about baby primates and the little moral from the Eugenics War was at least something. But,they have less than an hour to complete the story so we get bug spray and therefore mutiny.
I'd rather believe Hayes really *is* after Malcolm's job and struck at the opportunity.
I don't quite get that feeling as much as Trip/Reed/T'Pol/Crew know Quantum better than the MACO's and so knew something was wrong with him. And rather than sit around and try to explain it to Hayes, they took matters into their own hands. As in--it's our ship, it's our captain, and you're just along for the ride. YMMV.
nelamm
Feb 26, 2004 @ 3:33 pm
I was thinking about the camoflage during the show. It seems an all-purpose type- they use something similar today for urban camoflage, and it seems quite effective in the dim grey corridors of Enterprise.
frenchtoast
Feb 26, 2004 @ 3:39 pm
My mom commented that the camoflage looked like bird crap too, skye Personally, it looks like baby spit-up to me. Though, it didn't bother me that much during the episode like it usually does. Guess I've gotten used to it.
Cleo256
Feb 26, 2004 @ 3:47 pm
I'm deeply conflicted about the episode. On the one hand, they avoided many of the pitfalls of Trek-mutinies past. The mutiners were in their right minds, which is always more interesting because they have to overcome their conflicting feelings. The captain was not an alien replicant with a dubious agenda but was himself, though mentally altered. So, good for them so far.
On the other hand, I think they tipped their hand about Quantum acting funny too soon. I picked up on it as soon as he told Trip, "this is not open for discussion". Quantum loves discussion. And I just kept hoping the crew would discover the schmutz in his eye as the cause much sooner (or maybe have them discover it wasn't the cause), and provide an interesting plot twist.
But the character interactions all felt right. Trip was very reluctant to turn on the captain, which I liked. So I guess that's in the episode's favor.
Kris_AB
Feb 26, 2004 @ 4:40 pm
Well, the mutiny was fun, T'Pol wearing a cap and in a Starfleet uniform was good, the Reed/Hayes HoYay is amusing...Did you all catch Reed looking him up and down during that one scene? I don't usually look my co-workers up and down like that. Maybe Dominic Keating is subtley throwing a part of the Trek fanbase a bone. Um, HoYay and bone in the same paragraph makes it incredibly tempting to write badly conceived yet chuckle-worthy gay sex jokes, but I'm resisting.
This episode doesn't exactly inspire intelligent commentary. They really went the wrong way with it. I'm expecting to enjoy it more as seen through the recapper's eyes.
BassetHound
Feb 26, 2004 @ 4:48 pm
Blalock made the role her own, she deserves better than [having to wear skin tight clothes]
I agree JB is doing a great job, but I honestly think she embraces the "sex kitten" role she has on the show. She's interviewed that she like her coustumes, hair/make up on the show. Posing for provocative adds in the Lad Magazines bolsters the image she wants to create for herself.