I think this may also be on the season three thread, but....

Angel goes and talks to the little girl in the white room, to find out about Sejan and all that fun season three stuff...

And it hit me....Eve looks just like her...in her looks, in her mannerisms, the way she dresses (the little girl says that she loves read, Eve is always in red), the way she talks, everything...

Maybe I am just seeing things, but it is soemthing to think about...

The little girl in the White Room was supposed to be one of the immortal totems (Gods/Goddesses/& Messengers) of the Sungod Ra. How could Eve be a Goddess? Or messenger to Gods? Now that would be depressing. If they tried to make her even connected to the girl in the white room - what was her name? Mesaktet? - it would make Eve serious, and too glorious..for a second, - and just in ME's mind.

For all she's done; mysterious, now yes I'm curious, but Goddess (even *sniff* Cordy became a demon with a saint complex before she became Cordevil (grrrrrh)), but if they suggest that Eve is related to a Goddess of the Sun (i.e. Eve is Mesaktet/Maat/Ra/Sunbabe or anyone else) I will be seriously pissed off.

I think having Eve turn out to be the little girl would be great. AFAWK, the Ra-tet were not on the side of W&H. Nor were they on the side of Jasmine and/or the PTB. The Ratet also paid the biggest price for the whole Jasmine fiasco. They were wiped out. It makes sense that they might be getting reborn in various ways to try to get revenge or maybe just reassert their power.

Gunn is already the panther in some way, but what about the W&H programming? Is that a plus or minus for the Ra-tet? It was Eve who sent Gunn to get that programming so I'm thinking it might be a double-bluff with the Senior Partners thinking they've pulled a fast one and co-opted the panther, and the Ra-tet knowing it was their plan all along and Gunn isn't coopted by anyone except them. Maybe Gunn also has a tatoo.

And what does that make Lindsey? Is he another totem reincarnating? Gunn is the panther, Eve is the little girl, Lindsey is - what? The shaman guy?

Best of all about the Ra-tet idea, it would allow them to get rid of ST (who is one of the worst actresses I've ever seen - actively awful) and keep the idea of Eve which I think has great potential. If she's already had two forms, she can have another. Just kill her and have her come back in another form, possibly even her old one as the little girl. The kid who played the little girl could at least act.

Wait, isn't the Panther a member of the Ra-tep too?

The little girl was described by Manny as being "evil to the core" maybe she is trying to get Wolfram and Hart's LA branch back for the forces of darkness?

Yes, the panther was a member of the Ratet. I didn't mean to imply otherwise. But the panther seems to me to be merged with Gunn in some way. It might not be. Gunn might be something else entirely.

If Gunn isn't the panther, then the panther has taken the little girl's place in the white room. It might not like that. A large cat in a room doesn't seem right. It may have merged with Gunn to allow itself some greater freedom. It may have a plot to use Gunn to get out of that room and get Eve back into it too.

The little girl was described as evil to the core. I don't see a problem with that and it being Eve though. I would have a problem with Lindsey being evil to the core, but perhaps Eve is also playing Lindsey

It's possible that she's corrupted Lindsey....he is afterall, only human. :)

Maybe she's told him that they are going to destroy the senior partners or something.

I too am inclined to put much of the blame on Joss/the producers/directors/whoever, since they could've told her to play it differently. I think what I don't like about ST's portrayal is that she plays Eve too overly chirpy & helpful. It's almost like they told her to do it that way so that we would all gasp in surprise when she turned out to be working against Angel. I think Eve should be more serious and businesslike...still somewhat friendly, but with less grinning and a more authoritative air.

You know who I think would have been good in this role? Sarah Clarke (from 24). Nina Myers had a lot of qualities that would've been perfect in Eve. They're both office workers with ambiguous motives, and SC always kept people guessing as to whose side she was on. She managed to be mysterious, yet convincing as a good guy without being annoying & overly schmoozy. Also, she oozed sex appeal without even trying, and I could see her having hot chemistry with DB. She's also a little older than ST and could actually seem believable as the Senior Partners' rep. The Eve/Angel sex scene we saw in LoTP looked like Angel's jailbait fetish at work again.

More and more I think the problem is that they chose this actress because of her physical resemblance to the little girl in the white room and never even bothered to see if she could act.

I hope that not what they were thinking "evil little girl" when they chose her, considering the amount of time Eve's been "naked", spewing sexual innuendo (unconvincingly), engaged in gratuitous copulation, stripping out of her clothes and/or skin-to-skin in bed with another character.

I really think they picked ST because she supposedly resembles Jennifer Garner, without bothering to see if she could act.



Heh. Well, milage varies, apparently. IMO, that assumes (i) Angel was able to exercise control over who he screwed, and consciously chose Eve, while under the influence of Lorne's spell and (ii) that he only picks young, (girlish-looking) women as lovers. Darla, even as a human, appeared to be a grown woman, not a girl. So, even though Buffy was young, I don't see Angel having a fetish.

I think that scene was more likely due to the ME/WB/FOX's belief that gratuitious nakedness and sex is required to attract/keep a certain demographic; the same belief that gave us naked, wet werewolf girl in chains.

Yeah, I know, I was being kinda facetious there.

I think that was the idea. Lindsey (or whoever) deliberately sent in someone he knew was Angel's type. I don't know about jailbait though. Buffy certainly was, but I wouldn't describe either Darla or Kate (or Spike if you go with the hoyay!) as jailbait. What Angel does like is feisty little blondes with an inner darkness. And I think that's what Lindsey was scripted to have sent in to manipulate and probably seduce Angel. The actress can't do feisty with an inner darkness, unfortunately, but I think that's what we're supposed to be seeing.

Well... maybe I take this all a wee bit too seriously.[/blushing] Ahem.

Seriously, there's no way I would ever believe that Angel could find Eve even remotely attractive.

I've seen this alot, but try as I might I can't see the resemblence at all. I'm kinda grateful, because it would totally put me off Alias if I saw ST in Jennifer Garner.

pootlus,

I agree. That's why I said "supposedly" even though some have said there's a superficial similarity. I wouldn't put it past the casting directors to pick someone like that because JG and Alias are so popular. I mean, why else would they pick someone to play Eve who can't really act the part? I honestly can't imagine what they could have been thinking unless it was purely demographic.

I don't know about Kate (she was a love interest?), but Darla had a little girl voice, just like Eve....I might add that little girl voices are one of my biggest pet peeves in my job.

As far as I can see Angel's taste in women varies. There was the actress who wanted to be vamped, the feminist demon warrior, Cordelia, Buffy, Drusilla, Darla, that barmaid from his human days! He also seemed to find both Faith and Kate attractive - well he's said it about both of them. He also flirted quite heavily with Lilah at times. Even when evil, his preferred female victims, while including teenage women, also included married women, and most of all nuns! I don't see any reason for W&H to send Eve with a particular physical type for Angel in mind.

Quite so. But right now, as far as Angel's concerned, he has more fun with blondes (natural or bleached), especially if they're feisty, evil(ish), and, most importantly, skinny as a rail. Callista Flockhart had better watch her step.

I'll take my question and answers to it over to the Mythellaneous Mythunderstandings thread: Isn't the big cat from the white room (that Gunn possibly turns into), a jaguar, not a panther? And isn't the jaguar a Mayan sun god, in fact, the one from TCTONC?

I just saw Forgiving, and the little girl in the white room reminded me a LOT of Eve. Do you think this was an intentional similarity, or am I just insane?

Sorry, I usually do read back... oops on my part.

PhoenixTears, you might want to read this. This was discussed very recently both here and in the Season 4 thead.

I totally agree with all the mentions upthread of how juvenile Eve is. This may be why during last night's episode while Eve was writhing around over Lindsay's groin I kept getting a really weird "Daddy, Daddy, don't you want to commit statuatory rape" vibe. It didn't help that Lindsay was so obviously uninterested in what she had to offer. Anyway Eve just comes across as such a twelve year old to me, when she was complaining about the SP's putting pressure on her (literally burning her feet or something) it was just so whiny and trying-too-hard that I just could not figure out why Fred was supposed to care about Eve or the SP's over Angel.

I mean, who cares about Eve? She is so dull or maybe it's the actress who is dull but from the first sec I laid my eyes on her I just thought: What!!! She is the one replacing the one and only badass bitch? And I hope it's well clear I'm talking about Lilah.
Eve and her tons of make up and wannabe mysterious acting along the way....give me a break!!! I'm so not falling for it. She is boring and I've already forgotten about her. I always forget about her as soon as an ep is done.....oh whatever.

Just dropping by to say I can see the superficial facial resemblence between Ducklips McEvil and Jennifer Garner. However, I refuse to let it ruin my enjoyment of Alias, no matter how much Eve has been ruining my enjoyment of AtS this season.

I've noticed quite a lot of publicity photos out there for the character "Eve" - almost as many as for the regular characters. IMO, that doesn't bode well for a (much desired) painful death of Eve anytime soon...

Someone must really like ST a bunch, because Eve is such a dud and I can't understand why she's being given so much attention. Honestly. It makes no sense.

A case of bad attention for a character being better than no response at all, I suppose.

At least Jennifer Garner can act and is capable to show more than 3 facial expressions and Sydney also has attitudes in spades. Eve, OTOH, is bland, bland, bland. If she's supposed to be scary, she's not. If she's supposed to be mysterious, then I'll be damned because I always end up wanting to fall asleep everytime she shows up.

I don't really like Jennifer Garner either but I would definitely agree to the rest of that last post.
Eve must go.

So, after her well-deserved verbal and physical smackdowns at the hands of Cordy and Harmony, the Lilahbot is gone. Amazing how quick that smug, femme fatale-wannabe act fell apart when someone finally stood up to her, isn't it?

Oh, and the part where she talked about her sex with Angel. Icky. Why does a character with no sex appeal continually make sex references?

Is she definitely gone? The revenge comment might still come to bite us in the ass in the future.

halllm,

Do you really want to know?

I think I would prefer to stay in denial of the potential bringing Eve back. Call me crazy.

I wouldn't.

Well, now that she's out of Wolfram and Hart, I have to say that with Eve, if they played to how she came across, she could have been relatively interesting. A girl who's, underneath her exterior scared of everything and tries to put herself forward, and has bitten off much more than she could chew with evil forces could be an interesting character, and one that I think Sarah Thompson could play much better.

Just wanted to drop by to say how much I hate Sarah Thompson. She is so miscast as Eve. Eve has a good arc, good lines, has slept with Angel and Lindsey and still it makes no difference because she sux. I keep wondering, is this on purpose like Dawn irritating us on Buffy was on purpose, at least at first. Or do they actually mean Eve to be an interesting character, like Lilah. Does ST have some connection to some powerful person that ME must cater to? That's the only explanation that makes sense, cause this is the worst case of casting in ME history.

The woman sux.

I'm still trying to decide if my problem is with the character or the actress. Maybe it's some combination of the two; the part is written as fairly low-key on the usual ME evilness scale, and ST is bland, so it's a deadly dull combination. Stephanie Romanov as Lilah is such a hard act to follow - a good part played by an actress with some screen presence (who's also drop-dead gorgeous). Maybe if they'd gone back to the catwalk to cast Eve....but Kathy Ireland's voice would send us all into fits of giggles, Miss Tyra is busy with ANTM (Congratulations, Angel, you're still in the running to be America's Next Vampire Champion) and Molly Sims is still on Las Vegas.

All I want is to not ever have to deal with Eve anymore. I guess the actress did have a hard time competing with Stephanie Romanov's Lilah, and was therefore under a bit of pressure but still, I agree she sucked ass.
Sucked as in past perfect or better simple past. Or simply the past.

I had better stop this.

Let the by gones be by gones and so on and so on. So long, Eve, "lets not keep in touch (Cordy)."

This is all Eve's fault. She killed the show. (Just kidding. Probably.)

Well, her character didn't help the show. Anyway, I hope they don't waste any of the precious time left on her (even to kill her off).

I didnt mind him much before. Possibly because he just said one or two lines. But today? Hated him. Obnoxious jerk. Fred kept saying no, and he kept insisting. I hope he dies. Soon.

Well, the characters he's played have died on both Buffy and Firefly, so the odds are good.

I suspect that as a jilted lover, he's gonna do something nasty to Fred. Eww, not that. I meant something else nasty.

I'm so sure Knox is evil...was sure from the first second I saw him.


I concur. And that's why I'm really looking forward to Knox's slow torture/death at the hands of DarkWes. I can't wait to see what the man who bought us "I'll take away your bucket" AND "Sorry Dad but I've got to put you down" will do to someone who REALLY pisses him off.

Well we know Knox is evil since he laughed about the fun they had torturing animals at the previous Halloween. He's obviously a psycho.

I guess after "Hole in the World," it is safe to say that Knox has gone from friend to fiend.

Knox is still my friend. =) Though he might be dead. Hmmm.

Yeah, the odds were with him being evil from the beginning....he was working for Wolfram & Hart...right there. Proof "the boy's not right". I'm pretty sure he's dead now anyway. Too bad, because he was awful nice to look at. Hee.

I thought Eve was pretty okay last night. I agreed with a few people in the episode saying that she does a better job with 'vulnerable' than she does with 'evil/tough/sexy.' And that she manages to look better disheveled than she does in all her W&H dress-up time. She still wasn't great, but I don't think she was actively draining energy from the scene.

Anyway, I still hope we find out what Eve's deal is. Why is she doing all of this? Did she hook up with Lindsey and then infiltrate W&H? Or was she already working there, and then met Lindsey? And again, why did she do it?

Last night really made me think that she was just in it because of Lindsey. She seemed like an actual person, and god help me, I felt a little sorry for her when she asked "Have you heard from him? About him?" From that scene, it seems like all she really cared about was Lindsey, and she was happy to go along with whatever he wanted to do. She was pissed when he got taken out, and now that he's gone, she's scared and doesn't know what to do.

Oh, and when Lorne talked about how horrible her future was and how she should "make like Carmen Miranda and die" (hee hee), I'm pretty sure I could hear the squeals of delight coming from all over the world.

Oh (again), and I hadn't noticed until someone pointed it out in the episode thread that she was singing "L.A. Song," which Lindsey sung in "Dead End." I think that was a nice touch.

Dead doesn't mean he's gone! Nooooo!

Besides, IMDB says he'll be here next week. =)

Plus Fred's comment about him working at W&H too long. Plus the power scene of all 6 guys walking down the stairs, all wearing black except Knox in white. Plus more stuff I wish I could remember know except that it's been a while since we've seen him.

I totally agree. The showed Eve in pretty much the only way that I would ever have sympathy for her, pining for Lindsey. I'm with her all the way.