One more post on my brand new account before I leave to imbibe alcohol.

Thank you, Kispexi2, and likewise I'm sure.

Your Peter Pan theory is intriguing, though I had a slight guffaw imagining Zoe as Tinkerbell...If we're going for maximum amusement, I think Jayne should wear the Tinkerbell outfit, and Simon for maximum pretty!

Don't get me wrong, I like ALL of the Firefly cast, including beautiful Morena, and ADORE all the Firefly characters! In fact, it's a testament to how much I like the character of Inara that I see so much potential in her and want more character development and storyline.

One more geek-out before I go.

I think of Inara so far as more of a great concept and device rather than a fully fleshed-out character like Mal. Prostitutes of the future are not only not looked down on, but respected and influential? That's GREAT! And props to Joss for having the guts to put that on mainstream television! As a concept, I think it's liberating, empowering, and intriguing. I have some quibbles though, with the execution. It's interesting to me that though arguably, as a character, Inara may interest me the least, she's the one that makes me think the most about the Firefly futureverse society and how our heroes fit into it.

Aaack, I'm not doing a good job of explaining myself here.

Okay. I watched Firefly on the DVD's so I saw Serenity before I saw Train Job. And what's weird is that after watching the pilot, I got the idea that Inara was a prostitute, but I did not at all get the idea that she was respected, and was of higher 'rank' than the rest of the crew. In fact, from the way Mal treated her, and the way Book seemed to flinch from her, and, I'm not sure, something about Morena's body language and manner, elegant though it was (maybe she didn't have full grasp of the character yet either? this is all JMHO), and maybe just because I viewed it all from my own bound-by-the-conventions-of-my-time perspective, I got the impression that prostitution was just as looked down upon in the future as it is now. Also, the way she joked to Book later about being a 'lowly whore'. I came away from Serenity loving the show, of course, but thinking that Mal was a prudish hypocritical sexually repressed asshole for making fun of Inara's job, and that Inara, far from being the celebrated, respected, glamorous courtesan she's supposed to be, was just another variation on the cliche hooker-with-a-heart-of-gold character.

After seeing Train Job, which had that part at the end where she rescues Mal and Zoe from the police station, demonstrating her 'respectability' and status, I got more of a grasp of the idea, but I still kind of had to work at it. Shindig drove it home more, although I really wanted Inara to tell Mal more forcefully to stay out of her business arrangements, and jumped for joy when she told him in the hotel room that it was "her decision, not his." I thought, finally! the girl shows some spunk!

This is getting too long, so I'll try to wrap it up. Basically, I think the character of Inara and concept of Companion are great ideas that needed a little more time to cook. I think we needed to be shown more, and more forcefully, what a companion IS in that society. The Mal and Inara lovestory, I think, was meant to be a classic sort of 'Rugged Space Captain and Refined Space Princess' class-and-culture-clash sexual chemistry story with the added unconventional Joss twist: the princess in this future scenario is actually a courtesan, and she's just as respected and revered. It's actually a classic story embedded in our culture. I think it was too soon too fast though. In order for us to buy the star-crossed love story, we needed more of a handle on where these two were in relation to each other. The scene in Serenity makes more sense if I know that Inara can handle Mal's derogatory names because she is above him in class, and impervious to his worthless opinion. It's like populist Joe Schmo trying to bring Halle Berry down a peg by telling her she may have won an Oscar, but she's not all that different from or better than starlets starring in soft-core porn, selling her beauty to the masses for money. No offense to Halle Berry fans. Ehh, I've talked myself out and run out of steam.

Have a Happy New Year All Browncoats!!!!

I recently discovered that 3 of the vid files on my little site were, for lack of a better term, humped. I've got a temporary fix in place until I can suss out what's wrong with them. Next time I'll test the ever loving go-se out of them. Damn technology...

Oh, Happy New Year's, everybody!

I agree with you completely. I think Joss came up with the idea for a Respected Futuristic Hooker with a Heart of Gold, was extremely impressed with said idea, and delved right into it without really taking the time to completely sketch out the character. It is not always necessary to do such a sketch, but in this case, in order for the character to feel like something more than a gimmick (which is how she often came off to me), it really was. Don't get me wrong--I grew to like Inara and have a total girlcrush on Morena. However, I'm not convinced Joss thought about the character beforehand as much as he should have.

I don't think Inara is an incomplete character. Inara is supposed to be mysterious. She's not a Kaylee who lays her intentions and affections on the table.

Inara wasn't my favorite, but she did grow on me. MB has a surprising talent for comedy, and the few times Inara was able to cut loose, she floored me. Best example: the "you stupid son of a ..." moment from OMR.

While a lot of the Mal/Inara stuff was generic UST, the last few moments of HoG were outstanding. NF and MB really showed that behind all their prickly protectiveness there was a depth of feeling for each other that went way beyond sexual tention.

IMO, Meenbean, Mal and Book are much closer in their morality than either would like to think. (Although I suspect Book gives himself less of a hard time about it). Jayne too has a bit of an 'old-fashioned' attitude to Companioning (can I use Companion as a verb?). Because, I guess, these three are Old School men: Brave Protective Hero, Born Again Religious Guy and Man's Man.

I wonder what Zoe really thinks about Inara. I mean, they're cordial and all that, but there's never any bonding like between Inara and Kaylee and River. I think Zoe might share Mal's opinion, unsoftened by any UST.

There was a very interesting bit of dialogue between Inara and Zoe in the script for "Trash" that did not make it to the screen, in which they discussed Companioning, men, and gave us a nifty Firefly-speak sex-slang word.

It always seemed to me that Book was flinching at Mal's behaviour toward Inara not what she was. I think the scene where he brings her dinner shows he is quite comfortable with her.

As for Mal I think he does feel like she "outranks" him and uses the insults to make himself feel more equal than he really believes he is.

As for Zoe doubt she even thinks about what Inara does for a living - "not my concern Captain."

I'm on my way out the door to purchase the Firefly DVDs. Your insightful posts, stellar fanfic and extremely informative replies to my Buffy vs. Firefly questions have all inspired me to buy the DVD set of a show I've never even seen one episode of. (this is fairly daring for me, given that I usually only purchase DVDs of movies or TV shows I've already developed a deep love for!) I'll drop back by this thread to give my impressions of the episodes. Thanks for all of your help in deciding to spend my money on what I'm sure will be yet another Joss-helmed masterpiece!

Yay marlaas! You so won't be sorry.

Okay, I think I found a continuity error in War Stories...need to have someone with a better TV to check it out for me.

When Wash and Mal are walking up the hill, and Wash is carrying the big box o' medicine, I think Mal is missing suspenders.

Yes, the suspenders seem to be missing! Help me out here, folks. It is entirely possible that I'm losing my mind.

Huh, Skripka. I hadn't noticed the suspenders but will check it out next time around!

I thought perhaps you were going to mention the major boo-boo I recently sighted in War Stories. Has this been mentioned yet? We absolutely know that it is Mal's left ear that was cut off. However, right before the henchman plugs the evil device into Mal's lovely chest for the first time, Mal's right ear is definitely gone and a gash is in its place. His right ear is there in one cut, gone in another, and back in the next cut.

Still, I LOVE, love, love my Firefly. We are up to Heart of Gold now and I can't seem to bring myself to watch it. We are too near the end. Sigh.

I just finished watching my set I got for Christmas. I cried twice. Once watch the special features and seeing the cast and crew talk about how they loved working on the show and how they tried to make every episide special, because they knew it wasn't going to survive. The second time was watching Objects in Space (I watched them all in the DVD order), because it was done, there was no more left and it hurt to see the last of these characters.

I really hope Joss gets to make a movie of this. I can't believe I'm this attached to a canceled TV show.

I took a really good look at the "ear switching" scene from War Stories. It looks like they flipped the print, reversing the scene. Dunno why. Mal also has a pretty distinctive blood smear on the right side of his face that ends up on the left.
Who knows, maybe the ME gang decided to have some fun with the continuity that day...

Anyone find any easter eggs in the set?

There's just the one of Adam Baldwin singing "The Man They Call Jayne".

If you can't find it, kimmako, put your DVD, um, cursor up to the Joss Sings blurb and press Left + Enter. Adam is a sexy, sexy beast, even if his singing skills rival mine for Worst Ever in the History of the World (and even if he does make one teensy mistake with the lyrics).

I loved seeing that. We had to watch it twice, because the first time we were laughing too hard.

First post, so hopefully I won't mess this up too badly.

I had a vague affection for "Firefly" when it was on, though it wasn't my favorite, but I decided it was worth getting the DVDs, which I'm still working my way through. On the bright side, I'd missed at least two eps, so I get more than just three unseen hours. I kind of like that. It's also definitely coming across better than I remembered, though I still think "Our Mrs. Reynolds" has some serious flaws. I'm hoping they're fixed with the other Saffron ep(s?) that I saw mentioned as coming up.

Since someone mentioned a continuity error, I think I also noticed one in "Ariel," the last ep I've watched. Jayne is cuffed with his hands behind him, then thrown to the ground and kicked with his hands unbound, then has his hands bound again. Not that I really care about such things, but since I actually noticed for a change, I thought I'd mention it.

Be sure to report back through your tears, if necessary, Marlaas. Newbies to the FF 'verse give me hope. In one of his recents posts over at the OB Nathan requested Browncoats continue to post our "conversion" stories. Perhaps ammo for Universal or "crack" for the cast?

Meenbean, the synthesis Asian/Western culture Joss created is a perfect home to a Priestess/Companion concept. Some of the viewers had problems with the WildWest throwback ("where are the tractor beams?") but to me newly terraformed planets would be a veritable stew of pioneering or developing cultures. Nascent cultures used women as religious or cultural intermediaries. Inara fits the Vestal role to a "T" as they were highly born and highly trained women to lead community rituals which usually included sexual favors to insure the success of crops, etc.

Oh, and is a nicely put turn of phrase.

For you Mal/Inara shippers (and I know you're out there!), some Happy New Year fic:

"Sweet"

Rated "Hot" by maystone

I just watched "Serenity", and, while I'm too tired to write anything too in-depth (or, for that matter, coherent!) I just had to tell you all that I'm already hooked on this show. First of all, it may be the most beautiful looking show I've seen in years---the effects, camera work, etc. are just outstanding.
As always, there's the stellar Joss-esque dialogue. ("Can we maybe vote on the whole 'murdering people' issue?" Hee!)
I'm already fascinated by Mal, like 'the Shephard', and, for some reason, developed an instant adoration for the pilot-(I believe his name is Wash?) There's actually no character I dislike, although obviously after one ep. I still feel there are many characters I know very little about.
Whenever I first watch a new series, I tend to get so caught up with remembering names and retaining basic plot information that I sometimes can't fully appreciate the episode, so I may like Serenity even better on second viewing. (This tends to be especially true with these types of shows, since there are so many subtle nuances that are easy to miss the first time around).
I can't tell you how excited I am to keep watching. After just one ep. you can consider me a very happy convert!

ETA: Am I the only one DID believe Kaylee was dead...?!

If she is a spy, there's no reason she has to work for the Alliance. My personal theory is that the Companion order (temple, guild, society) is some sort of highly secretive and powerful organization with mysterious plans. All Companions are double agents: courtesans with access to power and influence, bedding their way into influence. I mean we've seen Inara at least twice pulling in favors from political figures.





This didn't strike me until I saw the episodes on DVD. The show is gorgeous, isn't it? Widescreen, the various browns, blacks and grays are beautifully defined and textured, and the experimental techniques really make a visual impact: light flares in the camera, slightly off-key framing, CG effects used wittily to fake realism. I especially love the CG tricks--how they would animate a zoom into a computer generated scene, which is so not the normal, staid way of presenting CG effects in a perfect frame.

marlaas, keep posting as you go through the DVDs, I like reading new viewers' reactions to the show (the Sci-fi UK boards were fun, if a little underpopulated). Word of advice though, in case you're not already doing this--don't read anymore of our posts until you finish the DVDs. I'd hate for something major to be spoiled for you and we're not using spoiler warnings or anything.



That's so awesome that you were able to enjoy that surprise. Nope, most of us here didn't (couldn't) believe Kaylee was dead in "Serenity". 'Cause Fox aired the pilot as the series finale, so we'd already seen the following episode in which she was alive.

No, I'm embarrased to say. Serenity was the first episode I saw, I'm glad to say, but I still knew Kaylee would stick. But somehow, I bought it. I was like "wuh, huh, how?". I totally bought it. I didn't think she'd be off the show, just that she was a little dead now. Worse off, I even believed it the second time I watched it. How sad is that? I just didn't remember!

I'm so lame.

Not lame! Honest.

I'm part of the group that saw Serenity last, so I KNEW Kaylee survived and that scene was STILL full of tension for me.

Wooo marlaas. I'm so thrilled that you're loving it! Btw, watch out for Zoe if you're going to drool all over her hubby. Most of us are too afraid of her to admit to the Wash love.

I saw Serenity last, but I still thought that Kaylee had died. Since I knew that she didn't stay dead, I was really shocked by this scene. As Simon raced down to the infirmary, I'm thinking "he's got to do something extraordinary to bring her back or else Mal would have killed him." Heh. Never did I think that Joss would write something so wickedly funny :)

motteditor - I've seen Ariel quite a few times now (What?), and it looks to me as if the guard only gets one cuff on Jayne. His hands are behind his back, but he keeps moving around, trying to get more info on what's happening and consequently the guard can't get the other cuff on him.

It's a kick to see all the new people falling in love with Firefly.

Lady Agnew - you're seeing the Guild as something along the lines of the Bene Gesserit?

Hey, folks, I am only an occasional visitor to this thread, but I did avail myself of the search function to try to make sure this news was fresh.

Though you all would like to see where Firefly ranks on Barnes & Noble's Top Ten Video List.

Thanks, kierya. Number 5! Yay!



I saw "Serenity" first and was totally convinced she was dead. Mostly because it's a Joss Whedon show and he does things like that. And partly because of Mal's manner with Simon. When I realized she was OK, I was gobsmacked at Mal's cruelty. Didn't like the man at all.

Huh! Those were the days.

BTW ran into someone on the Buffy: Big Bads thread who says they can't abide either Nathan or Alan and will never watch anything with either of them in ever again. It's a strange old world....

Yup. Only secret-er. It makes a cock-eyed sense, and I'm reminded of the way in which Inara rounds on Atherton and informs him that he's stricken off the Guild-list.

Also, look at the two ex-Companions we've seen. One, Saffron, is a murderous thief who uses all sorts of wiles (violent and seductive) to get what she wants. She seduces and she kills. How is that sort of training (as Inara noted) "Guild training?" I can see it part of the basic training to possess some sort of hand-to-hand combat, but Saffron came off more as a secret agent/spy turned bad than a former courtesan gone bad.

Nandi tells Mal in "Heart of Gold" that she had to leave the order because she couldn't stand the strict and constrained lifestyle. Does it make sense, giving up the privilege and wealth of being a Companion to whore herself out in a bordertown out in the middle of nowhere because she was sick of dulcimer lessons and tea pouring etiquette? The life of the common whore (which Nandi chose) is hard and despised and no fun at all. Because, you know, of the poverty and lack of respect. I can't imagine it was the strictly legit life of Companioning she found so distasteful. I postulate that it was the illicit spying and double-agenting that she couldn't stomach.

Also, we've seen Inara fight hand-to-hand, handle a sword, pilot a shuttle, influence the son of the magistrate in "Jaynestown" to let Serenity fly away against his father's orders.... she's awfully handy at lots of things that no real courtesan would have use for. She's a super-Companion! Able to handle all emergencies and contingencies.

I love the thought of Inara being some sort of Bene Gesserit because I loved that order in Dune. The Bene Gesserit are sooo cool.

And my admittedly far-ranging spec on what precisely was in the needle-not-a-suicide-kit is some super secret poison/biological weapon that's effective against the Reavers.



How strange. I can imagine someone watching the show and not liking it at all, but I can't serious contemplate someone seeing the show and loathing either Nathan or Alan. Even if the show's not to their taste, the both of them are really quite good in it. How strange.

Because of FOX's general assiness, it didn't even cross my mind that Kaylee could be dead. When the episode first aired and Mal let her hand go limp, I was all, "Wow, I guess we're supposed to think she's dead. Too bad FOX is stupid."

OK, one more conversion story to share...maybe it'll go no further than this but come on, I have to believe that, online, someone can hear us scream.

So: I love Joss and all his works and so was eager to watch the show when it came on. The 'pilot' threw me but I stuck with although I wasn't completely infatuated, I'm ashamed to say. I was disappointed for Joss and his players when it ended but that was that.

So, Pére Noel brought me some lovely DVDs and we've spent some great snowed-in days (ok, two inches of snow but we're feeling lazy) watching them in English, French (humour? doesn't translate but the story works) and with all commentaries. I convinced M. Bloody P. to watch with and he turned to me about episode 3-4 and said: 'is this the first season?' so I had to give him the whole, 'only season, cancelled, bad ratings, f*&cked with by F$x' story. And he was sad. And said some bad words.

Here my tale ends, we're set to watch 'Objects in Space' and we're both sad. Sad. Sad. Sad. : (

P.S.: We're such a wicked demographic - DINKs who love TV and movies and buying any and all products that we see on our favourite shows. Oh ye mighty ratings whores, we look upon this work and despair.... Bring it back. In any form. You'll get some credits from us.

Hopping on board the DINK-Firefly train. Best Buy junkies, badly.

Trying to think of something constructive to add other than "Fox, you are teh suck", but it's not happening.

So, I've saved the last two eps for after work tonight, but I am left wondering:
Does anyone know where Joss planned to go for season one? Comparing it with "Buffy," there's no real BBEG. It reminds me a bit of season one of "Angel" in that sense, but IIRC we were starting to get some season-long plot by this point in its inaugural year. I assumed it would have something to do with River (the final documentary mentioned something about the Blue Sun corp.), but I couldn't see a big showdown really looming, since they seemed like our new Wolfram & Hart.

On other notes, have we learned anything since the show ended about Book's back story? That's one of the thing I'm most curious about.

And I totally buy the theory from a few pages earlier that Inara's dying. I don't think I'd have picked it up on my own, but after watching the shows with that idea in my head, it completely makes sense. Her answer to Kaylee after her "Ariel" checkup ("Same as last year") really seemed like the nail in the proverbial coffin, though I haven't yet seen the commentaries so I'm unsure about the whole needle/suicide kit people are mentioning here.

Well, I'll cop to the Wash love. But then I'd consider it an honor to be smacked down by Zoe.

About Ariel and Jayne: he was handcuffed behind, and then did the old trick of getting the legs through the arms so that the hands are now in front. It works if you don't have hips. sigh.

Yeah, our Jayne is one hot, flexible merc.

(what?)

In TTJ, he does a flip into the train car.

And in the cell in Ariel is when he slips his legs through his handcuffs.

But I think we're talking about right after he and the Tams are captured. I've wondered about that scene, too. It doesn't look like Jayne's got any handcuffs on at all when he falls down.

I suppose I could fanwank that the guard didn't have a chance to handcuff him, or had troubles because he was struggling, or...

Yeah. I still think it's a continuity error.

D'oh! Total Freudian slip! Good eye, Lud!

Okay, I had more to say than that, but I'm still getting the hang of posting and had some wrong fun with quotes and had to delete most of it.

marlaas and Phantomchic, I'm a closet Wash-lover too! I think he's an older Xander-in-Space with piloting skills, and he and Zoe I see as a sort of Xander and Not-Evil Faith. Wash's "Can we vote on the whole 'murdering people' issue?" got me too.

On Mal, Book, and Jayne, respectively, Kispexi2 writes


I get the feeling Jayne is more a Horny Thug (heh) than Man's Man, and I think he views Inara's profession very basically. Sex! Woohoo! For Money! Being amoral, I don't think he has any judgements on it.



You know, now that I look back, Hegel, you're probably right. Once again, I wonder about Book, and what version of Religion he practices. After Inara, I wonder about him the most. Whatever the case, Mal obviously thought Book would be uneasy with Inara, and wanted to make them both uncomfortable, though what he ended up doing was make himself look like a jerk. Brave Protective Hero and Cocky Ass! (Of course, I forgive him, 'cause he always manages to redeem himself, and also he's so cute).

Since we're labeling the Men, let's do Wash and Simon. Wash, I suppose is the Sensitive New Age Guy, willing, and loving, to let his strong woman lead. What's Simon? I remember reading someone earlier in this thread refer to him as a cross between a Stud and an Ingenue. Stingenude was it? Too funny!

Actually, it's really easy to slip the cuffs from behind you to the front. I did it myself once.

It wasn't slipping the cuffs, which he clearly does after they kill/knock out the two guards. It's a bit earlier when he mouthes off and one of the guards slugs him. He falls to the ground and it seemed very clear that they had his hands undone.

Oh, I don't know, there are quite a lot of people who would argue that Jayne is very much the Man's Man.

Whoops, wrong kind.

Psst. Over here. Fellow Wash lover proudly stepping out of the closet, with my pimping stick in hand - Sky Without Stars. It's Wash, it's gen, and it's sorta angsty.

*skulks back into closet and stows away pimping stick*

Thanks to everyone again for the warm welcome!
I had decided that this time I'd jot down notes as I watched this episode, but, of course, I immediately became way too engrossed in the show and my notepad remained blank :) So I'll just remark on a few things about The Train Job that stick in my mind:

Can I just comment yet again on how gorgeous this show is? I tend not to notice or greatly appreciate a show's look, but the visuals here are just breathtaking (and I'm not referring only to the actors, though they're certainly among the yummier eye candy I've seen in quite some time!)

As much as I've tried to follow posters' advice about not 'spoiling' myself by reading too many of your comments, I did remember reading (maybe even incorrectly?) that people weren't thrilled with The Train Job. As a result, I wasn't expecting to like it as much as Serenity, but my expectations were blown out of the water---I absolutely loved it!

Is it too premature in the series to call myself a Kaylee/Simon shipper?! Kaylee's just such a warm and delightful person, and Simon seems like someone who's struggled to relate to people and could really benefit from someone like her in his life.

I really like the Inara character (though I think I've read posts where people feel she wasn't fleshed out enough, and I suppose I can see that---after all, the 'hooker with a heart of gold' has become a frequently seen 'type' and it's a struggle to make the character a more unique individual). I'm interested in the whole idea of how companions are viewed in that society. Mal seems to have contempt for her profession, while others (Kaylee, The Sherriff in Paradiso, etc. ) speak of it with a certain amount of reverence. (By the way, I really like how Kaylee and Inara are friends---it totally defies the unfair expectation I had that other females would automatically dislike and/or resent the ship's female 'companion.') Inara also mentions that companions always get to choose their customers etc., and she's also clearly accustomed to speaking her mind and demanding a certain standard of treatment, all of which certainly conforms with Joss' feminist ideaology. By the way, is there such a thing as a male companion?

I really love the Mal/Inara dynamic----usually I hate the whole "wow, they start out hating each other and then, lo and behold, there's an attraction!", only because it is SO overdone. But the dynamic between them fluctuates between hostile to humorous to subtly fond of each other, which is what keeps it so interesting for me. I honestly don't have any idea what happens between them, when usually TV shows make it painfully predictable from the outset EXACTLY where each relationship is going-(and, for all I know, whatever was supposed to happen between them never did since *sniff* the show was killed off so prematurely).
I love Mal---just love him. What a perfectly conceived 'anti-hero.' Morality is show gray on this show, and I really love that---especially because it's so rare on TV.

I really have a lot of questions about the whole space/Western mixture, but I'm struggling with how to articulate them. Am I right in saying that, although this is set in the future, the people are somehow part of what we consider the 'old west' culture? Is it a commentary on how things (cultures, language etc.) come full circle, that people are still the way we were back then no matter how far into the future we may go? In one way I find the mixture between space and western fascinating and exciting---in another, I find it a slightly uneasy blend. I'd really appreciate hearing other people's views on how these genres do and don't blend, and where exactly Firefly is (in terms of time and place), according to the show's mythology.

Finally, I heard/read somewhere that Joss and his staff had complex, well thought out backstories on each character---that, unlike Buffy, where the characters mostly worked towards the same goals, each of these characters had very different perspectives on each issue and what their personal needs were. After just two episodes, I'm already feeling cheated that I won't get to see all of those developments :(

When: 2517 AD
Where: Good question. Earth has been used up completely, and probably abandoned, thus the references to "Earth-that-was" that'll crop up occasionally. By this time Humankind has managed to terraform and settle at least 70 worlds in the galaxy. One of the starmaps used in two different episodes features the NGC-3525 planetary nebula, also known as the "Eye of Jupiter", which lies 2000 light years from Earth. There was a bit of an argument during the original airing of the show as to whether the 'verse was set in a single starsystem or multiple ones due to two different VO narrations that were used. My bias is towards the multiple starsystems. The Union of Allied Planets, the Alliance, runs the show. The US and China were apparently the last remaining superpower/nationstates left, and they formed the basis of the Alliance. If you look carefully in a couple of eps you can see the Alliance flag emblem on various items. It's a fusion of the US and Chinese flags. There's various lists of the worlds mentioned and other stuff out on the 'net. I can point you toward a few of them if you like. Joss seems more into character developement than world-building, but it's fun to put some of the pieces together to try to fill in the picture.

It is never too early or too late and we are too few to be picky.

Welcome.

adds to her list

Really? There are only a few? Then I would have come out sooner. I love Kaylee and Simon. Kaylee's absolutely the sweetest thing in the verse, but also not as innocent as one would imagine (Joss was so right in comparing her to Alyson Hannigan), and Simon is just the prettiest, closed-off and gayest straight guy ever. I love how he keeps messing up. The scene in The Message is adorable. If I didn't dislike Book before, I sure do once he interrupted their kiss. He's mean. And he has stupid hair, and I never really liked him anyway.


p.s. Okay, not true about the hair.

Re: the mixture of space and western. OK. The old western thing is overemphasized. What is there is frontier and space. That's a really common notion in science fiction where you have space exploration and colonies. See Heinlein 'Tunnel in the Sky', Anne McCaffery's Pern series, Janet Kagan's 'Mirable', some of Elizabeth Moon's stuff, just to name a few.

The concept is that you have a colony that has just started up. The terraforming and transportation costs are enormous, and the colonists will have to pay that off. Also, unless you are on an established route (and those planets were colonized first), you don't get a lot of traffic, bringing you goods and services.

So, do you take with you a lot of high dollar, hi tech stuff? If it breaks down, how will you afford the replacement? and how soon will you be able to obtain a replacement? No. You take low tech stuff. That means horses for transportation (and as Jayne mentioned, steak) instead of Hummers.

Now, the whole old west vibe with the long skirts and the plain speakin'? that's something Joss and Co brought to the table. Of course, some planets are colonized with groups of people who have certain ideas but by and large, you reach for the common denominator that people will respond to - so frontier/colonies = old west.

It's the 'plain speak' that I find a little jarring and even a little forced at times, but I'm already getting used to it.

Thanks to all those who have already responded to my long post---I just already love this show and have so much to say!

By the way, I'm forcing myself to avoid reading fanfic or Shack's recaps until I've finished watching the series (or, at least watching the series for the *first* time, since I can already tell that there are many, many viewings of it in my future!) I can already see the potential for outstanding fanfic, though---I guess the ONE advantage to canceling the show so prematurely would be that there's so much room to speculate on and create stories, characterizations etc. We're forced to use our imaginations since Fox deprived us of the reality!

marlaas: The Companion issue is one of those things that's still a bit undefined. Further "up thread" (pg 158) Lady Agnew posited an interesting theory about them being similar to the Bene Gesserits in Dune. All we know for sure is that they are considered very respectable by society - I like to consider them Geishas (of the Future!).

Mal is really the only person that seems to have a problem with Inara's job. I"m sure part of this is the fact that he is attracted to her and he strikes me as the possessive sort *g*. There's a great conversation between them in Shindig where he gives her his opinion of her job pretty clearly.

As for male Companions...we haven't seen any, but knowing Joss, they're bound to be out there. There are boywhores in a later episode.

Hey, I'd be a Simon/Kaylee 'shipper, you know, if the boy wasn't GAY and madly in love with Mal (or is that lust with Jayne?). *g*

Sorry. The crazy slasher part of my brain grabbed the controls....

Re: Plot arcs
I don't think we ever would have seen the kinds of plot arcs on Firefly that they have/had on Buffy or Angel, given what we've seen Joss say in interviews and commentaries. He's said that while those are shows about superheroes who have to save the world, he saw Firefly as more about ordinary people who aren't so worried about saving the world. Instead, they're struggling to survive, to get a job and earn some money so they can put food on the table and fuel in the ship to keep flying until they find another job.

There is some material built in to provide a big-picture ongoing threat, with the corrupt government that experiments on kids to turn them into weapons, and River being one of those weapons who has escaped, so that the Feds want her back, want to catch Simon for taking her, and very likely would kill the rest of the crew if she's caught on the ship. But I see this story playing out more in character arcs than in plot arcs, at least for the first couple of seasons -- River learning to cope with what's been done to her and eventually learning to use it to her advantage. Simon coming to terms with the fact that he can't cure his sister and figuring out who he really is now that he's lost just about everything he used to define himself. Mal having to weigh his "don't get involved" edict against his long-buried idealism. Etc. And these character arcs driven by that ongoing threat could even be played out in stories that have nothing to do with the Alliance, such as using River's abilities on the job or Simon struggling with whether or not he should develop that potentially fine criminal mind of his.

Further down the line, we might have more of a plot arc as the Alliance becomes more of a threat or as the characters, either as a group or individually, make the decision to do something about the Alliance. But I don't think the show would ever have become about the crew of Serenity flying around saving the galaxy from the evil Alliance.

Atherton didn't have a problem with it, but his "you can dress her up but she's still a whore" line indicated a pretty clear lack of respect.

The one thing that I felt was not really well-thought out in the Firefly 'verse is how Companions came to be and what their role was. IMHO, the geisha comparison doesn't really work. Geishas, heteratae, and courtesans all had their place in society because of the overall constriction of gender roles, which was something of a madonna/whore dichotomy writ large. The general culture of the Fireflyverse doesn't seem to fit into that, making the place and power of the Companions make less sense. I feel like Joss had the end point of wanting to be subversive and flip the expected power dynamic of a hooker, but hadn't given much thought to how that would happen. So it's just there.

*sigh* Of course, if he really wanted to flip the expected, Sean Maher would have been cast as the Companion character. He's certainly pretty enough.