Good plan, Massena1. I doubt it'll happen, not because the storyline's too complex and interesting for TPTB, but because, if it does, they'd be admitting that ditching the Chluthor storyline was a bad idea.

And since you've been speculating, any chance of you working Lucas Luthor into this? Because there you have another party that can be a variable in the Chloe-Lionel-Lex power struggle. But I'd like to see what you'd do with him. Speculate a little more, please?

Snagging NV to play Chloe's mom would just about guarantee me tuning in next year. At least for those episodes.

They seem reluctant to revisit stories of the past and it comes across, to me, like... Well you know how if you break your mom's favorite vase, but don't tell her right away? It becomes harder and harder to tell her you broke it, because not only do you have to admit to the mistake of dropping it in the first place but to the sin of not mentioning it for years. It just gets more embarrassing and harder to revisit the dropped plot--er, vase--as time goes by.

When they do mention things of the past, it seems to be in a sort of off-hand or afterthought way. "Oh yeah? Lex's secret room that you haven't seen in over a year? Here it is! It's important again! For a little while!" I hope they learn from their mistakes and don't do it with the Chloe plots of the past. I love Massena's speculation. I don't want them to wait a year, then bring up Chloe's mom suddenly only as a way to quickly explain a sudden onset of mental illness.

No news is good news, as the old saying goes? :\

I just found out that Nana Visitor is in a new series on ABCFamily called WILDFIRE, which premieres this coming Monday. I had no idea she was in it. However, it's a summer series, so I figure most if not all of it is already in the can. Maybe she'd have time for some guesting work in the fall...?

Get this, Michael Piller (formerly of DS9) is one of the producers of the show. They wanted a TV Mom who could really Act, but hadn't found anyone. Nana wasn't even on the casting agent's list. She came to mind because Piller had seen her at Ira Behr's house recently. He asked that she be brought in and she was easily the best actress they'd read.

Yeah Cyb actually mentioned Nana first, I think, and I heard a bell ring. I thought that was some really inspired casting. And then I started catching DS9 reruns on Spike and now the wish is set in stone.

I saw a Wildfire cast photo just now and did a quick tweak, just to see...

Aww. What coulda been, what might yet be....? :)

It wasn't quite that bad; you found out that they shared a half brother(his mom and her dad), so they weren't actually related. It was still kind of 'EWW' though, because there was a lot of chemistry and 'what if' between the two characters.

Oh man that looks so awesome, Trev! You kick ass. It's kind of freaky how good they look together as mom and daughter. I've been wanting NV as Chloe's mom since season 1, when I saw some old casting pics of a darker haired AM. I thought, "Huh. She looks like a young Major Kira!"

Have they ever even said what Chloe's mom's name is? I don't suppose they'd name her Kira? Heh.

I think it's implied that Lois' mom and Chloe's mom are sisters due to the photo of the Lois family with a very blond mom and I don't think Gabe & Sam are related so . . . any biological nuttiness should endanger Lois as well.

I remember AM once suggested something-something Masterson, that woman in Some Kind of Wonderful as the mom. They've got that cute blond thing going.


The thing is that the producers should know that eventually they need to 'fess the hell up and they might as well do it now. You can't forgive something the perps won't even admit to and keep doing. Step one: stop busting the Ming vases and claiming the trash cans are the vases Step 2: Fess up Step 3: pay for the vases by giving viewers that damn Chluthoropolis arc back, damn it! It's like insisting on a trial when you know the plea bargain is going to be ten years while risking the death penalty with a trial.

edit

*sigh* It's quite all right, Massena1. Just hoping you could do it. Lemme try.

Okay, let's start with this that you've typed.


But let's say that Lionel still wanted another child, so he had that affair with Rachel Dunleavy (sp?) and bought her off. He took the child (Lucas) and put him in foster care, then discretely ruined Rachel. Now there's that spare he wanted. So he has no more use for Lillian, since she's only making Lex "weaker" by coddling him and he's got his failsafe already. Bye, bye crazy Lillian.

Maybe Mrs. Sullivan uncovers this?

I'm not as good as you at this, sorry. But, hey, I managed to add another crazy mom!

My first thought was "yikes, what a bad typo" he quoted. But, after that, I thought it was a good spin! And adding another crazy mom ruined by Lionel gets you bonus points Musex. :)

I think it's cooler that Mrs. Luthor knows Mrs. Sullivan and that this one conversation ruins both their lives rather than Mrs. Sullivan looks into Mrs Luthor's death. Mostly b/c it explains why Mrs. Luthor begins to HATE her husband so much that she'd rather kill her child than let him raise Julian.

Also, the timeline is off in your spec. I'm thinking Chloe's mom left in 1992(?). Julian died when Lex was about 12(?) I think which would also have been about 1992/3. Lucas is 2-3 years older than Chloe/Clark so he was born 1984/1985.

Anyway, they've haven't really explored the mommy issues on the show yet, maybe they realize it's time.

Yay, I got bonus points! Can I exchange them in for pie?

Your scenario, Massena1 (with my contribution added in). If you don't like this one, tell me how you've pictured it.

"I told you, Lionel, I don't want any more kids."
"Fine by me." (sneaks off to secret affair)

Three months later...
"You know, I knocked another lady up. I don't need you or your brat."
"Ha! She'll only make you pay alimony and keep the kid herself."
"Not if she's crazy and deemed an unfit parent."
"You wouldn't."
"I would. Send Lex off to boarding school before something regrettable happens to him."

"Mrs. Sullivan?"
"Mrs. Luthor. Perhaps you'd like to give me more information. I'm not quite sure what I'm doing here."
"Making the headlines, naturally, or doesn't the homicidal marital inclinations of the richest man in Metropolis interest you?"
"Keep talking. I'm all ears."

"Playing friend to the press in your spare time, Lillian?"
"What did you do to Mrs. Sullivan?"
"Save your breath. It's not her health I'd be worrying about at a time like this, especially if I were in your condition."

Years later...
"For the last time, Chloe, stay away from the Luthors! Bad enough that I've lost my job and the both of us nearly got killed. At this rate, we'll be going the way of your mothe--- Shit."
"My what--what, Dad? ...you were going to say Mom, weren't you?"
"Nothing, baby. It's nothing. Just stop whatever it is you're doing."
"I can't. Dad... why is it that you've never filed a suit against Lex for unlawful termination?"
"He was just doing his job. Apparently, I didn't do mine."
"Dad, that's not-"
"Leave it, Chloe. I never want this topic brought up again. Do you hear me?"
"Loud and clear."

Damn. Those little dialogue bits started off all glib and then suddenly got really serious.

You know, if they don't do this on the show, someone's gonna have to end up writing this fanfic, don't you? Otherwise it'll languish in the depths of the TWoP forums forever.

How about Lucas Luthor as the holder of some clue for Chloe? After he left, he started digging up dirt on Lionel, to try and blackmail him. Lionel shut him up, but now that he's in a coma Lucas feels safe talking with Lex/Chloe/whoever. When they finally meet in person, we see that Lionel has cut out one of Lucas' eyes or something like that.

What were the abortion laws in Kansas at this time period?

New Speculation.

I've been thinking about the Lexana and what I want them to do about it. At first my fear would be that Lex would hurt Lana, Clark would get mad, and Lana would then be in the middle of the rift. It didn't take me long to realize that I hated this idea. Stilll, I couldn't figure out how to get around it. But now I know.

1. Clark and Lana date in early Season Five. Canon says that Clana existed, and as much as I despise the pairing, it needs to happen. And I mean really date. Like the first half of the season. Going to the movies, kissing, et cetera, et cetera.

2. Clark dumps Lana. There has been a lot of hints throughout the series that Lana would never be able to accept Clark as Superman. Clark should end up telling her his secret. Er...after he tells Chloe, of course. Lana will be unable to accept his secret, and Clark will realize that he needs to move beyond Lana. Um...does anyone here remember the first season of Charmed? Andy ends up realizing that as much as he cares about Prue, he doesn't see himself in a relationship that Prue being a witch would entail. i.e. He doesn't want to be married to a woman and have to dodge Flaming Ball of Deaths every morning. That's the kind of what I'm thinking. Lana can't accept Clark, so Clark dumps her. It's bittersweet, and they can remain friends afterwards.

3. Lex and Lana begin dating. Clark does not get jealous. Actually, he probably should be dating someone else at the same time. Chloe, perhaps? Or maybe a girl with the initials of L.L.

4. Lana does something to hurt or betray Lex. Remember, she has some major trust and secrets issues. The relationships falls apart.

The things I like about this idea is that it a.) rounds out Lana as a real - but not perfect - character, b.) further makes Lex think that he can trust no one. I know a lot of people think that Lex might like Lana because he sees her as "pure", and c.) it doesn't make Lana the reason for the rift, but does make her character help to further Lex and Clark.

I like the way you think, Bonsai:-) Clark and Lex both have to ditch Lana.



Women always had and always will have abortions, regardless of law.

YES. But they both need to do it without dating her. They should just take one good look at her and her bitchy ways in the season premiere and ignore her for the rest of the season. That'd make me a happy camper.

Bonasi, Lucy.



Yes, but unprofessional abortions could be pretty risky. And isn't it risky to the mother anyway after a certain point? I'm just wondering how much of an option that was Lillian, though I think that the most likely thing is that she didn't even realize about Lionel until later. How old was Julian when he died? I mean, I know he was a baby, but do we have an exact age?

I wish, ainoarwen, but let's face it, that is somewhat...unrealistic, even for Smallville.

Unrealistic for Lanaville (aka Everyone Loves That Lana!). But if we think back to seasons one and two of Smallville, then, it's a different story. But perish the thought of anyone not loving Lana. Indeed.

Okay, maybe I should clarify the above. I will NOT stick around to see a season five where Lex is still feeling his whatever for Lana. TPTB need to either back away from the Lexana for good or just go for it, not giving a damn about what some fans might think. Make a f'ing decision and keep to it. This constant uncertainty is severely contributing to my SV Fatigue.

Actually, I'm hoping that she never finds out. Because that would probably lead to Lana dumping Clark and being a selfless martyr. I'm hoping that the idea dawns on Mr. Density that: a.) as long as they're together she's a target; b.) Lana won't share him with the world and he can't sit by and not help people; and c.) that the maxim: "Having is less fun than wanting" is true and his relationship with her doesn't live up to the four years of pining and fantasizing has built it up to be.



Actually, what I would like to see, is that Lana, in an effort to win Clark back, decides to date Lex and act as a spy for Clark, leaking secrets and information to him about Luthorcorp and sabotaging Lex all the while professing her love for him. That would be a double-twist of the knife in the back to Lex, and would cement his hatred of Clark and his cynicism regarding humanity.

I want them both to realize that Lana will just run into the arms of whoever can help her when she needs them. She's a user. The second you break one of her rules, she'll run into the arms of the next guy. I want Clark especially to realize that he's been the Convenience Guy for four years and that he's been hung up on her all this time because of her Twagic Stowwy.

Remember that Clark's had a crush on her since he was 5, but didn't really start trying to win her over until he found out he'd inadvertently smushed her parents. Dating Lana has been like penance for him. It's punishment. He's been needing her, specifically, to forgive him. Well, I say it's time to get out of hell, and take us with you, Clark! It's just misplaced guilt, and not Ment2b4-eva Luv!

In 1972 or 1973, the U.S. Supreme Court nullified all the individual state laws about first and second trimester abortion in Roe v. Wade. Since then, some state laws about parental notification have passed judicial scrutiny, and some states have passed laws against abortion after twenty-four weeks, instead of a full six months. I don't know whether Kansas is one of those. No laws requiring a husband to be notified or give permission for an abortion have ever stood up in court, just laws about a minor girl's parents (or a judge) having to be notified.

So there wouldn't be any legal reason why Lillian couldn't have aborted Julian. Of course, with Lionel, legal problems are never your first concern.

Thank you, LastScorpion. I wanted to know if that would have been an obstacle. In that case, Lillian probably didn't realize about Lionel until afterwards.

I like your theory, Dread.

Considering that the writers thought the tale of a bored housewife adulteress who backstabbed and trashtalked her husband while being sleazy with a cop and a drifter is romantic . . . I wonder if they get that kind of behavior, running from guy to guy in search of whatever her fickle heart desires is bad. It's not like neither man hasn't seen Lana act perfidiously or leaving people to twist in the wind.

(sighs) Spock was so much smarter. He knew in one episode that wanting is better than having when it came to his fiancee. (laughs) Is it wrong I want an episode of SV to parody that episode? The funny thing is that I actually respect that fiancee more than I do Lana for being so "logical" and "cold-blooded" in figuring out what she wanted and going for it.

It's a bit on the sad side if Lex kills his dad over his mom instead of Clark but I can believe it with the way this series is written.

The one thing that tends to make me see Chloe as going nuts is that little essay in Delete where Clark is doing about a general or some such who goes insane and Clark writes compassionately on his behalf (he was e-mailed during writing his essay). I wonder if this is a foreshadowing of either and/or both Chloe and Lex. Seeing Chloe go nuts and seeing that it's something very hard to treat and not curable by powers would show Clark his limitations in what he can do. I remember in Memoria, Lex's brain has actual physical damage to it? So, finding out about Lex's brain damage and seeing Chloe's problem may make him see both their situations as parallel. That said, I think the going nuts is a total freaking copout as it releases blame from Clark so TPTB will say "Oh,no! It was organic/hereditary/destiny" instead of Clark's assiness contributed to this problem.

Hmmm... Clark learning responsibility and compassion from helping Chloe through a breakdown? Definitely has potential. A bit melodramatic I confess, but handled correctly... what can I say, it appeals to my inner woobie (God, I hope I'm using that term correctly).

A-freaking-MEN. Look at what she did in "Perry". The minute she realises that Clark won't be the one to protect her from the mean meany old reporter man, she runs to Lex and whines about the awful, awful threat of having to re-live her parents' death. I was just looking at her actions, thinking, "my God, woman, what a loser you really are! Stand up for yourself, beyatch! It's the 21st century, for crying out loud! Jesus!"

Here's one definition for the word.

This time around, I'm gonna speculate that... nothing will change. We'll see an incessant parade of Lana Lang luvas in season five, Clark and Lex will continue to be her Lap dogs for whatever reason, and, following the trend of the latter fourth season, Chloe will be the only one moving on, or trying to. Sigh. I need a pick-me-up, or a trip to the Bitterness thread.

Ohmygod, I got to definition #3 and cracked up:

Uncle Sam is sending me into the field soon...with a poncho liner (among my other equipment)! Now when I use it it's going to be hard not to laugh, thinking about how my woobie is wrapped around me, keeping me warm.

Too funny...

I always wondered about that. It's even against the (male) writers best interests to encourage adultery, then why did they do it? So that we know that using men runs in Lana's family? Or that the men in Clark's family always had a bad taste in women?

Alot of people seem to think it's okay...just as long as they're the one dating the adulterer and not the one married to him/her. I hear people making excuses all the time -- "Well, he doesn't love his wife, if he did he wouldn't cheat" etc... So it's not surprising that some viewers might have found that episode romantic, rather than disturbing. And it's not surprising that the writers know that and take advantage of it. They're always sending bad messages to the viewers, anyway, and that episode is just one more bad message.

Anyway, Lana/KK can do no wrong, so everyone will excuse anything the character does.

I like the speculations upthread about learning more about Chloe's mom and Lillian Luthor, but since the show is now Lanaville, any mention about moms would be Lana whining about how her mom abandoned her by getting smushed by a meteor. Very little time would be devoted to Lex and Chloe's mothers.

The English Patient was the same thing. I loved the movie, and thought it was beautiful. It wasn't until after I left the movie theater that I realized that they had made me root for a couple of adulterers. Then, I was v. conflicted about the whole thing and kinda annoyed that they had romanticized adultery so much.

Musex - After you mentioned Rachel Dunlevy, I couldn't let it go and tried to remember what her deal was. I ended up skimming some transcripts for Lineage and Prodigal and giving my speculation waaaaaay more thought than I originally intended. I realized I had made some mistakes regarding ages/timeline, but actually it all still works out well. Here's how it would look:

1980 Lex born; Maybe Lillian has heart issues as a result, nurse Dunlevy hired
1985 Lucas born (he just turned 18 in Prodigal 2/03)
Rachel Dunlevy shows up with infant; Lionel forms United Metro.Charities to
take control of child, puts R.D. in mental institution - Lineage
1987 Chloe born
1989 Lionel helps the Kents adopt Clark using United Metro Charities
1992 Lex's 12th birthday party; Julian born; Chloe's mom abruptly and mysteriously leaves her family when
Chloe is 5- Lineage); Rachel Dunlevy released from mental ward (after 7
years - Lineage) and is paid off by Lionel and she begins looking for son;
Lillian kills Julian; Lex sent back to boarding school and his mental issues
begin -Memoria/Shattered
2001 Lex and Clark meet again on a bridge
2003 Lucas is found by Lex
2003 Lionel tries to make Lex think he's going insane

So, my speculation is that Lionel's first victim of institutionalization was Rachel Dunlevy (who claimed that she was never insane) and perhaps he used the same doctor to institutionalize Mrs. Sullivan when she became a threat a few years later. Perhaps, Mrs. Luthor and Mrs. Sullivan talked, but Lionel convinced Lillian that Mrs. Sullivan was lying or crazy. Mrs. Sullivan contacts Perry White about her info. but before she can get it to him, she is drugged and put in a mental ward. Mrs. Luthor gets a tip about the institution, goes there and sees both Rachel Dunlevy and Mrs. Sullivan there. To her horror, she realizes that Lionel is storing away his problems in a mental ward. Lillian threatens to divorce Lionel, but Lionel threatens her back that he will take the children and that she is "talking like a crazy woman". But, just in case, Lionel has Rachel Dunlevy released and pays her off so Mrs.Luthor won't have anyone to back up her story. Lillian stays to be with Lex, but no longer wants her baby and she has a mental breakdown out of despair. Lionel threatens Perry White into submission b/c Perry doesn't have the last piece of evidence he needs to prove his story(whatever it is). Years later, Lionel goes back to the same m.o. of institutionalizing his problems this time with a new doctor when Lex becomes a threat in Shattered.

LexClark4ever - I was imaging this being like 2 eps. devoted mostly to Lex and even last year, he got that. It would be a great way to lead up to Lex justifying the murder of his own father since Lionel had ruined so many lives in addtion to having unknown numbers murdered. And as I said, one way for Lana to be brought into this is to have her get the power to see people's dreams or hear their thoughts and discover Lex's dark secret. Which would parallel Chloe finding out Clark's secret. And maybe one more episode in which Perry realizes his connection to Chloe's mom and gets Chloe back on the trail of investigating it.

Was it ever mentioned what Chloe's mom did for a living?

Going back to the idea that Lana could never handle Clark's secret:

I think it would be good for her to find out, have her and Clark be in a relationship and have Chloe realize through Lana's lack of bitching or her cover-ups for Clark that Lana knew what was going on. That cuts Chloe deep, especially since Clark has got to be a damn fool to think that in Blank he spends all this time w/ Chloe and she doesn't catch on (especially when he comes home to a door ripped off on his house). Chloe, hurt adn embittered, starts turning more towards Lex and he starts using her.

Chloe realizes near the end of the season what she has done, and that Lex wasn't the warm fuzzy guy she thought he was. In an attempt to make things right and protect Clark somehow, she ends up getting hurt. Meanwhile, Lana has been getting all spazztastic about Clark and his powers, and they have this huge blow out fight about him always leaving her to save someone else when there's a huge explosion or something and she throws down the ultimadum that it's either her or the fire, and he takes off, ending it (finally) w/ Lana and going to the disaster, where Chloe is dying.

As he realizes it's too late, he goes to tell Chloe the truth, when she stops him by telling him that she already knows. As she dies in his arms, the ramifications of that hit Clark. Lana was willing to let other people die so that he could spend more time with her, while Chloe loses her life trying to protect Clark so that he can save others, and this creates a push for him to grow into Superman.

OR....

Chloe is seduced into working for Lex (not per se sexually) and when she realizes all the "good" things he was having her do were really harming others, she begins to go mad w/ guilt. Again, Lana smoothers Clark, they break up, blah blah.

Clark goes to see Chloe in the mental insitution and she leans forward, barely speaking so that the cameras can't pick it up, and says in some crazy way that she knows what Clark is, and she'll never tell. Her guilt drives her to madness but her devotion to protecting Clark keeps her somewhat luicid throughout that time. Again, Clark sees the contrast between Chloe and Lana.

Masseena you really need to put an application in with the SMallville writing staff. However I would change it to just Chloe and Lois digging the truth up. Possibly from Perry when he hires her and realizes she is the cousin of Chloe Sullivan. I don't want Lana involved in this at all. She has no reason to be, and it would seem forced, and we would all hate them for it. Or christ Lionel is Bastardly again and apparently he feels he is untouchable so have him just tell Chloe to threaten her that if she ever reveals anything about the Luthors the same fate awaits her, regardless if he is dead or not. Because I'm sure Lex wouldn't want that kind of info about his family getting out. It would destroy his company, and ruin him. Just a couple of other possible scenarios for ya.

wrighty - Glad you enjoyed my musings. 1) I HATE Lois so I try to ignore her when I think about the show so it's hard to me to speculate about her. 2) Did I mention I can't stand Lois? 3) As a result of the introduction of Lois, suddenly I'm much more tolerant of Lana. She's still boring, but I can see some redemption in her, interest-wise. And remember Extinction? I could see her justifying Lex's actions against Lionel. Imagine her telling Clark that she only wished she had someone to blame for her parents' deaths so she could get justice for them. 4) I'm a complete and total Chlois convert as of Commencement, so until spoilers tell me otherwise, I refuse to believe that Perry is going to hire ED's character before Chloe gets a job there.

But, feel free to spin the scenario I laid out any way you see it. :)

But, FYI, my only speculation regarding ED's Lois is that towards the end of the season, she and Chloe will rent an apt. to live in the next year together on Sullivan Lane. (They'll decide it must be fate telling them to get that apt.) When Chloe gets in trouble with the Luthors, someone will go to the apt and either mistake Lois for Chloe or Lois, being the overconfident person she is, will attempt to stop them and get killed. Chloe will go into hiding, still send in the article to Perry, but as an homage to her cousin, give the by line of her first front page story in the Daily Planet (the one she has talked about for 4 years) to her now-dead cousin. So, there you go.

Since there is so much speculation going on about the Luthors and Chloe, I wouldn't mind seeing a storyline where Lionel, still resenting Chloe for sending him to jail and all that, finds out about Chloe's impending mental illness and decides to speed up the process. In essence, he'd start drugging her, and finally lands her in a mental institution. As for how it'd end, I haven't really decided. I'd love to see this storyline tied to Lex's own experiences at Lionel's hands, though. So I guess Lex would be instrumental in getting Chloe out of there. I don't know what Clark would be doing during all this. Probably something Lana-related. Don't know, don't care.

Hee, Lana in the T'Pring role --

Lana: You have become much known among our people, Clark, almost a legend. And I came to know that I did not want to be consort to a legend.

Clark: I understand. It would take too much attention away from you as a legend in your own mind.

Yeah, she was refreshing in that way. "Kalifee!" When confronted, she expressed clear, concise, honest motivations. Having won the challenge, Spock could've had her, but she made it clear that she'd only take his money and lands, and Still have Stonn on the side.

I'd love to have seen Lana tell Lex something like that, after his offer of a Queendom. "Just so you know what you're getting, Lex...Yes, I'll wear the crown, I'll have your name and money... And Clark will still be there, whenever I call."

Oh, the cheers would be deafening... While you're at it, Clark, please stop seeing destiny as something scripted out for you by ancient grafitti artists. Pisses me off. Clark began believing Lex is destined for Eeevil because of those pictures, and, ever since he crossed that line, he's never once stopped to consider that maybe believing in Kawatchee Krayons instead of his Friend is directly Causing this asinine interpretation of "prophecy" to be fulfilled!

Clark himself is writing Lex into the role of villain. What right does he have to call Lex friend, if he's only gonna treat him like an enemy (Or alternatively, as an ATM) and see everything he does as shady, anymore?

Massena, I think Lucas is good for another arc all his own, and you can always pull Chloe into that one later on. I wonder if Lex still knows where he is. Last we heard, Lex told Lionel, "Lucas is under my protection now." I don't know what that entails, but what happened when Lex went missing for 3 months? Is Lucas on his own again? Heheh, maybe he's seen how helpless Lex's protection forces really are and decided he'd be better off on the road.

Also, I've often wondered if Rachel Dunleavy, as Lillian's nurse and Lionel's mistress, had anything to do with hastening Lillian's demise a bit.

Rachel: Oh, this isn't over Lionel. I'm going to expose you.
Lionel: Expose me--to whom? My wife is dead. You know that.

That struck me as ominous, somehow.

------------------------------------------------------

ETA: And now, for a moment of bitter cynicism...

The Talk. S5, episode 2. Clark returns from the arctic. Chloe drops one anvil too many, and all it does is send Clark into another fit of psycho-rage. And it goes something like this...

Clark: Nothing happened in the Caves, so Forget about it!!
Chloe: But --
Clark: No glowy lights! No teleporting farmboys!
Chloe: But --
Clark: It wasn't Me! Got it?!?
Chloe: Clark --
Clark: It was a term paper! Shut up! Get outta here! [Stuffs Chloe back into her VW and stomps away]

Terrible, I know, but, maybe by invoking the worst ahead of time, there'll only be room left for something better later on. (For example, I'm sure Chloe's hair will be much nicer-looking than in these illustrations...)

Heh... How about this -- Chloe sits there seething for a few moments, then she starts the car, slams it in gear, and Floors The Accelerator...

Clark is too steamed to notice at first that the sound of flying gravel isn't receeding into the Distance but coming Right Up Behind Him! He turns, astonished, too late to avoid the collision. Chloe, being savvy, doesn't hit Clark's steel-hard body head on, but turns her car and brakes into a sideways slide that catches Clark by surprise and smashes him right thru the wall of the barn. Chloe's jolted hard, as the passenger side of her car is caved in, but she's alright. She jumps out to inspect her handiwork and lay down some serious Wrath on the BDA. And we know how much more bruising human snark can be than alien muscle. ;)

Or, Lionel could have drugged Lillian into that mental breakdown. We saw him all heartbroken about her in Memoria, but that was just Lex's memories of what happened. Surely the MB would act sincere and stuff if Lillian's increasing madness was his own doing.

OMG, TW looks crazed in those shots. It's funny as hell the way Trevacious Guy used them though. Hee!

Yep, this Clark-Morgan Edge scene is one of my favorite TW moments.

Now that would be a much more interesting storyline than Lionel having killed Lillian. I mean, we've done that story already, when we learned about Lionel killing his own parents. Plus, it would undo all Lex's sacrifice over Julian, and by making him hate Lionel, it would take away all his angst over wanting his father to love him. It would be boring and annoying.

But if Rachel had done it? Especially if we learned that after Lucas came back? (Lucas, Lucas, bring him back, bring him back!)

Lucas could come back, and he and Lex could fight for a bit over what had happened between them in the past, and we could learn where Lucas disappeared to, and he could get caught up on Lionel's jailtime and all. And then Lex and Lucas could reconcile and become friends. Then Chloe's snooping or something could turn up Rachel's culpability in Lillian's death, and Lex could get really angry and draw away from Lucas. Then Lucas could yell at him about how Lex always hated being blamed for Lionel's crimes, and Lex could make up with Lucas again, and the two of them could work together. Someone would be on Lex's side! It would be great. They could even be shady and kinda evil together, whatever, I just want Lex to have someone who will stand by him.

Edit to add: This could also be tied into the previous discussions of Chloe's mom being drugged to insanity by Lionel. Maybe Chloe's mom was the one who told Lillian about the existance of Lucas, and that led to Rachel killing Lillian. Or something. That could bring Lex and Chloe back together again, working to figure out the connected fates of their mothers.

Sorry to be dense.... what episode were those scenes from? And wow, what a way to use them!

I believe they are from Pheonix, hunnybunnyipm. I miss Morgan Edge. :/ Maybe Lionel has some more old buddies (that are more exciting than Genny) that can pop up.

Trev Guy - Yeah, I didn't orig. add Lucas and Rachel Dunlevy to the mix b/c I thought it might get too complicated. I did it b/c MorexMorai asked me to try to get them involved. But, given the timeline, it works. Rachel specifically said she was in the mental ward 7 yrs- her release would have been about the same time as Chloe's mom leaving her family and Julian's death. It is very interesting that so much would happen that same year.

ciann- I had speculated about Lex getting a new guy friend in Metropolis to party with who would encourage Lex's bad behavior. I don't know why it didn't occur to me that Lucas would be PERFECT for this role. It could be fun to see jealous Clark pop up again over Lex's relationship with Lucas. (btw, if you haven't seen Trev. Guy's caps of jealous Clark from Prodigal in the TW thread, you should realy take a look.)

Also, if they introduce Jimmy Olsen as a love interest for Chloe and as someone w/whom she starts investigating cases in Metropolis, I'd enjoy seeing Clark watch as he is replaced in both Chloe and Lex's lives while he stays home and goes to community college.

As for Rachel being involved in Lillian's death, in Lineage, Rachel said upon release from the mental ward, Lionel paid her off and she started looking for Lucas. Lex has implied that his mother lived quite a while after Julian's death and I'm not sure what Lionel's motive would have been to allow Rachel Dunlevy back into his home after putting her in a mental ward. It couldn't have been revenge for Julian's death b/c Lionel seemed genuinely shocked that Lillian had anything to do with it in Memoria. Further, he seemed to act as if he genuinely cared (in his own sick way) for Lillian.

But, here's the timeline again, if you want to figure out how to make Rachel be responsible for Lillian's death.
1980 Lex born; Maybe Lillian has heart issues as a result, nurse Dunlevy hired
1985 Lucas born (he just turned 18 in Prodigal 2/03)
Rachel Dunlevy shows up with infant; Lionel forms United Metro.Charities to
take control of child, puts R.D. in mental institution - Lineage
1987 Chloe born
1989 Lionel helps the Kents adopt Clark using United Metro Charities
1992 Lex's 12th birthday party; Julian born; Chloe's mom abruptly and mysteriously leaves her family when
Chloe is 5- Lineage); Rachel Dunlevy released from mental ward (after 7
years - Lineage) and is paid off by Lionel and she begins looking for son;
Lillian kills Julian; Lex sent back to boarding school and his mental issues
begin -Memoria/Shattered

Ok, so what exactly is the purpose storywise of Lana NOT going to college. Because I don't get it.

Maybe it will teach Clark that staying behind where it's safe and comfortable isn't a good or a noble thing. That to live your life, sometimes you have to take chances and give up your comfort zone, face the possibility of failure, and enter the larger world around you.

Lana's the exact opposite of that. She had the opportunity to live a life outside of her comfort zone, in a place where she wasn't worshipped and adored, and the first opportunity she had, she came home. And, don't mention the mystic tattoo.

Frankly, I think most normal people, if they blacked out for a few hours and woke up with a tattoo, would assume that they had a very good time the previous night.

Nice theory there you've got there, Dread. But it's based on real world logic - so it ain't gonna happen. TPTB will spin the storyline in whatever way to make sure Lana's point of view is validated, that her bullshit tragedy is highlighted.

Yeah, count me in with those viewers who are wondering about Lana's place in the series. What on earth are TPTB going to do with her? I mean, whuh? Will she work at the Talon? I gotta tell you I wouldn't be opposed to seeing her as a cleaning lady in order to earn her living. Maybe they'll have her become an arts teacher at the local kindergarten or something.

Sometimes I wonder how KK feels about having to portray such an aimless character.

I just have to wonder why they have both Lois and Lana out of college while Chloe is pretty much going full-bore.

I know Lana's pretty (god, how they stress that) but honest to God, a VP candidate or someone ambitious enough to want to become Senator wouldn't be hankering after a pretty coffee jockey who didn't go to college and was happy to stay in SV, especially one that demanded 24-7 attention. Politicians don't give 24-7 attention to their spouse while campaigning. Of course, that's probably why comic!Lana ditched Pete in the comics.

It makes sense to me that the writers had Lana stay in Smallville, b/c she represents Smallville to Clark. She should represent the future Lois laid out in front of him in Commencement (goes to community college, takes over the family farm, marries Lana and raises his kids on the farm). That is what his future would probably have been if he didn't have his powers and if he wasn't destined to be Superman.

Next yr. I think will be about Clark reaching a crossroads. He'll be torn b/w his life in Smallville (lana, the farm, his folks) and that future life above versus his future in Metropolis as Superman. He'll have to make a choice and that wouldn't work as well if Lana wasn't back in Smallville as something he'll have to choose to leave behind. Lana will represent the road not taken. As for why she doesn't go to college, too? Well, she may change her mind about going to community college. But, if she doesn't, I think they'll show her regretting staying in Smallville when she sees Chloe and Lex living it up in Metropolis *crosses fingers*

Man, it'd be great to see Chlex on the cover of the Inquisitor next season with the gossip rag being all about this hot, young, blonde on the arms of the very eligible, handsome young billionaire. Can you imagine Lana's jealousy that Chloe would be the cover girl in Metropolis? Hee.

Seriously, both Clark and Lana should regret staying home. I hope the writers plan on showing that. It would be seriously messed up for them to show Clark and Lana happy that they stayed back. Although, I'll admit, the way they presented teenage parenthood in Ageless doesn't build my confidence. :(

ETA: If we're putting out worst case scenarios in the hopes that it'll prevent them from actually happening - my worst case scenario would be Chloe gets amnesia from the blast in the cave and the writers drop the Chloe and Clark need to have "the talk" storyline which was half of last season. In addition, my worst case scenario would have to include any future in which Chloe doesn't become a hot shot reporter at the D.P. b/c she's insane or dead. The writers said that was her destiny and if everyone else is going to live their destiny, then Chloe damn better live hers, too.

It makes sense to me, too. Plus, it's Lanaville, and you can't have Lanaville without Lana. But from Lana's perspective, I don't know what the hell is going on. Her reasoning about how she doesn't want to go just because it's what everyone expects--it just sounds like more of her weird narcissism. Who's this "everyone" she thinks is waiting around on pins and needles for her to decide to go to school? Her friends? Nell? Society in general?

There's been some good discussion in the Scare topic about Clark and his responsibility (or lack thereof) to tell people about himself. I come down on the side that says he should wear a big neon sign of warning, but realistically that's not going to happen.

So I'd like to see him considering a few things, like how until very recently, he thought he'd been sent to earth as some kind of overlord. Dr. Walden had been given powers by the Caves of Contrivance to destroy him. Segeeth may actually be the hero of the story. The secret chamber in China was guarded by Kryptonite, causing him to think maybe the Gay Stones weren't meant for him. I'd like to see him wondering about these things, being troubled by them.

Maybe they could bring back Kyle Tippett as a way to get Clark thinking about those things. They used the Kyle/Bob friendship and later enmity as an anvilicious comparison to the Clark/Lex friendship. They could use something like that again. Bob had Kyle to stop him (rather gruesomely, too) but who's to stop Kyle if he starts down the same path? Maybe Kyle could come back to Clark and say he's been tempted to abuse his power. He knows it was Clark running rampant in Metropolis a few years ago, so he's come back to find out how Clark managed to reign in his baser impulses. Or if he has.

I'd love it if they'd bring back Kyle! He's just about the only kryptofreak who didn't seem to be noticeably insane, and there really ought to be something that a future Superman could learn from him!

I was always disturbed by how Kyle made Bob kill himself, and then remarked, "I always was the better salesman." I mean, damn! Making people commit suicide was Bob's modus operandi. So I thought Kyle had some darkness of his own and that the two of them were more alike (like Clark and Lex) than Kyle realized. If Kyle came back and Clark found out that he'd been doing a little more "convincing" of people-- "But all of them were bad guys, I promise!" -- how would he react?

I'd love for Kyle to come back. Of all the FOTW, he was the one who reminded me most of a X-files caliber freak. Fascinating character.

I found some old speculations that came true on the thread and I thought I'd bring them up. cyb seems to have the gift of prophecy. So cyb, care to tell us what will happen in S5? But, be careful what you say, b/c your predictions keep coming true. :D

Tropical geko 1/11/04

Here's a little speculation that has been briefly thrown around in the spoilers thread. Suppose sometime this season Clark gives Chloe an unplanned superpowers display, but instead of the usual memory loss on her part (see "Rush"), something happens and he's the one who dosn't remember that she's seen anything? The thinking in the other thread was that she woulden't tell Clark that she knew and would keep all knowledge to herself so as to preserve the friendship. What does everyone in here think?

See: Pariah and Blank.

Cyb - 5/9/04

3. Lex decides friends are nice but hot one night stands are pretty nice too, and proceeds to spend some time in Metropolis hooking up with WB-stable wanabees. He sheds his shirt a lot. Sorry, MR, but this requires a lot of shaving.

See: Bound

Stina 5/9/04
I would love to see Wally West (aka The Flash) make an appearence on the show...maybe to plant some ideas in Clark's head about being a superhero, since the Flash had been doing the undercover hero bit since he was a teen.

Plus, they could have him and Chloe really hit it off and he'd share his secret with her, which would show Clark that it *is* possible to balance his secret with having open, honest love.

See: Run

Cyb 5/18/04

We'll find out that Lana's actually the one who'll be evil in the future, if she's not already. 500 years ago the Kawatche looked into the future and heard her talking about "Sekreth" and lies and it got written down as "Segeth". She is, in fact, Clark's enemy.

See: Spell and Sacred (different cave symbol, but add in French witch and it works)

Bedlam 5/20/04
The only way at all that works is if Lionel was planning on blowing up Chole, Lex found out about it, and then set it up so the Sullivans could escape.

See: Gone