Boy is this a dying thread. Did anyone else see today's episode about extreme makeover and plastic surgery. I missed most of it but did manage to see the segment with Kathy Griffin. I cannot believe how much plastic surgery she's had and admits to for that matter. And I also can't believe she's had liposuction, twice. I read somewhere years ago she was a size 4. I'm a size 9, she'd think I was a cow.

I saw it, missknowitall. I was a little surprised at how much work Kathy Griffin's had done, too. I don't think she's a size 4 though. When I saw her on Celeb Mole last year, she was in her swimsuit at one point. She had an average woman's body. Not too big and not too small. I thought she looked to be about a size 10.

I saw the Kathy Griffin debacle first time it aired a month or so ago.

Stupid stupid people. Ever notice the tight lips on a lot of Hollywood folks? And the lines running from their lips to their ears--the sucked in cheeks look?

It makes me think of how crazy Hollywood must be and abnormal.

When will the natural look come back in? I saw Calendar Girls the other day and it was such a relief to see nice looking older natural women. And even if they have had some minor work done--it was not "catwoman" obvious.

I used to love Kathy Griffin for her bold humor--and she was cute! Now she is nuts for succumbing to the same old Hollywood look--big lips, surprised eyebrows, unnatural body. What kind of industry makes people hate themselves so much?

I don't say this very often, but WORD to your entire post, Tosia. You hit the nail on the head. At one point in my life, there were a few things I might've wanted to change. Now, not a chance. People are beginning to look alike and not in a good way. I'd rather look like me than some doctor's "vision" of perfection.

Damn, I watched the makeover show until Oprah said "and coming up next a celebrity that has gone through an amazing transformation" or something like that. I turned it off thinking it would be Charlize Theron talking about Monster (I'm sick of hearing about it already). I like Kathy Griffin. Did they show before and after pics of her?

When do new episodes start, anyway? I don't remember Oprah taking such long breaks over the holidays before.

Honestly, despite all her procedures, I think Kathy looks pretty much the same before and after. Her face has that taut, overly-tight, overly-botoxed look now, but otherwise there isn't much difference. She also had her hair chemically straightened, but I've always liked it curly, so even that isn't much of an improvement.

The new eps start today, queasy. The promo I've seen features Randy Jackson talking about his weight-loss surgery. I'll probably skip today's show.

It was another one of those Frankensteinian hybrid episodes: Gastric-bypass surgery! And Oprah at the People's Choice Awards!

The latter was an obvious excuse for her to wave around her award for Favorite Talk-Show Host.

Very funny...this has become my BIGGEST pet peeve with the show this year. If you want to have a variety show, have one. Or else, shut up, stop name dropping Madonna and pick a frickin' topic. Just one. Not two halves. That's two. Pick one.

I like Oprah(not too many women in her business who look like her would ever be photograghed w/o makeup) but please stop gushing about how happy you are to get free stuff.Like a full tray of pricey sunglasses. I don't envy wealth. I think there are two ways to get wealthy. Be born rich or work really, really hard and Oprah weren't born rich. It just irritates me some how.

And can we please stop asking overweight people if they are emotional eaters? Between Oprah and Dr Phil this seems to be the only reason people are overweight. Randy Jackson said he ate too much of the wrong foods and hated to exercise. Not every one who is fat (me included) has emotional problems. The emotional problems may come as a result of being fat but are not necessarily the cause.

I really hated today's show. That teenage girl who had bypass surgery because she read in her "beautiful" sister's diary that she was ashamed of her fat sister? Oprah or somebody with a brain should have told that girl;

• You are way too young to resort to life changing surgery.
• Your 'beautiful" sister has an ugly face. Skinny and beautiful are not the same thing.
• Try healthy eating and exercise.
• Being stared at by high school jocks is not a great goal.
• Study hard and someday you'll be far away from these shallow people.

I can't believe Oprah didn't say any of these things but held that girl up as someone other young women should admire.

That segment bugged me for some reason.

And why did Randy Jackson say that he'll be a better judge on American Idol this season because he lost weight? I missed that part.

Oprah did make a point of asking the teen to itemize the weight-loss options she'd previously tried, and it sounded like she'd pretty much "done it all." Nevertheless, surgery seems a drastic choice for someone her age, who was "only" in the range of 200+ pounds.

I interpreted her reaction to the sister's diary entry simply as being what Oprah would call her "light-bulb moment." At the risk of being catty, I didn't think the sister was all that with a side of fries.

Just a comment about the very sad story about the 12-year-old abducted by her uncle, and subsequently sexually assaulted and killed. I sympathize with the mother, but this event did not occur because her daughter was 12. It happened because she had a sick, sick man as an uncle.

The other daughter (now 15) isn't allowed to be alone ever? I feel this is an overreaction.

I can't imagine the horror that family went through but it seems they are blaming the act on leaving a 12-year-old home alone. I don't know the details but I imagine this man could have done the same thing to a female at the age of 16, 21 or 30. It doesn't matter. I hope they do not continue to blame themselves. What a sad story.

The weird thing is, the last talk show I watched that talked to a teenaged girl considering getting the surgery was the Sharon Osbourne show. Sharon, who has had the surgery herself, was emotionally supportive of the girl that she had talked to and seemed to be actually leaning towards telling the girl that she shouldn't get the surgery. Yet here was Oprah, a woman who lost a large amount of weight through diet and exercise, talking to a girl who had already gone through with the surgery and seemed to praise the girl for having the "courage" to go through with it. That just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

You know slaughteredlamb, you make a very good point. Oprah has turned into a sell out. She knows bypass stories get great ratings because most of America is overweight and a lot of people are considering this surgury and want to know as much about it as they can.

Really? I didn't know that. Also, Sharon was only -- at most -- 30 to 40 pounds overweight at her heaviest. I can't believe she even got a surgeon to do it.

Sharon O. has not had gastric bypass. She explained in great detail on the View that she has a band put in around her stomach(?)--so it is removable I think also.
Sharon looks great IMHO, but photos from years back from baby weight make her look a little tubby.

The show about the kids staying home alone was just sad. The moms are sad, regretful, but trying to be optimistic. It's a tough world for single moms.

I wish Oprah would have focused a bit more on building support systems with other single moms or families or with the schools in the area the family lives.

But from teaching single moms in work programs I know there is a pervading sense of distrust for any one except family towards caring for kids. They are very distrustful of day care and the like. And I imagine the areas some of them live in are not too good.

When, oh when will they start teaching reality parenthood in high school?

I agree that not allowing your fifteen year old to be home alone is excessive. I can understand not wanting to leave her alone overnight, but during the day - no biggie. What does that lady do if she has to go somwhere on her own, hire a babysitter for her 15 year old? The babysitter will probably be younger than her daughter!

The fifteen year old girl, Danielle, dating the 17 year old guy? Who is she kidding and what sort of morons are her parents. Thongs, piercings, all that crap at fifteen? Her face was awfully made-up, even for being on television. The mom was way in denial and way too permissive with Danielle. I wasn't sure if the virginity issue was ever cleared up, but one look at the boyfriend and I knew there's no way she could be a virgin.

I never understood those shows with girls who dress too provocatively. Parents, they're called scissors, use them on your daughter's clothes every time she comes home with another skanky set of them.

IIRC, Danielle said on the video something like, "I tell my mom I'm a virgin," when she asks. Oprah et al. seemed to interpret that statement as meaning that she is. I interpreted it as the kid lying through her teeth to Mom.

Ah, thanks for clearing that up. That's the impression I got as well.

I came here to post during the Danielle segement, but I'm still just so irritated with her parents, I can't put it into words.

It horrifies me that oral sex is no big deal to kids. And it horrifies me further that the girls are always the one's giving, to make boys like them. They're being used and don't even realize it.

I found this annoying as well. I wish she would have given some examples as to what single mothers or parents who left their children at home could do as alternatives, instead of warning us that leaving children at home alone would only ultimately result in disaster.
Also, as tragic as I found the story of the young woman who was kidnapped while babysitting, I did not think it really fit in well with the segment. It really sounded like a horrible incident, however I could not really see Oprahs point with discussing it in this segment...

The segment about the family who went to outer Mongolia was interesting. Predictable (we didn't know it would be that hard) but interesting. I'm curious as to how someone would arrange such a trip. They were being filmed so I wonder if it was sponsored by a TV program. Was it set up by Oprah? I would be more interested to know how the Mongolian family reacted to the excesses of North America.

Royvacthe family that went to Mongolia went as part of National Geographic's World's Apart. They send American families to other parts of the world. She did a similar show about a family that went to Africa. I think the show is on Mondays at 8, but I could be wrong. But what bugged me was that when she had the show featuring the family that went to Africa they said that they couldn't invite their host family to America because it would be too much of a culture shock. So what changed?
The show was interesting and we got to see Phil! Gorgeous yummy Phil and his accent!

Phil's segment didn't do much for me (it could have been that awful shot of him with no shirt on! He's definitely prettier clothed.). But Elisa Donovan's switch with the lady from Louissiana had me rolling on the floor. Elisa's gym experience was priceless!

Sori, that gym in Louisiana and then Elisa's reaction had me in hysterics. I had no idea there were gyms like that. Those women cracked me up with their make-up, heels, and those bumpy things they were leaning on to improve circulation.

I cracked up when the mom mentioned a couple of times that she'd "never milked a yak before." Somehow she sounded as though Oprah and the audience might expect that she had.

I'm extremely curious to know how a nomadic family from outter Mongolia leaned to speak English so well.

There was a Gloria Marshall salon in the downtown where I grew up. I had no idea they still existed. My mom rented one of those spooled gizmos that "improve circulation". They're noisy as hell.

gemneye Thanks for the clarification. I need to start listening better.
Another thing that struck me was the beauty of the Mongolian clothing. They have no running water yet there clothes are immaculate and gorgeous. I wish I could keep my familys' clothes with all the modern conveniences.

Trompe L'Oeil, I was really impressed by their English, too, though it seemed to be the young woman who was doing most of the talking. From what little we saw of the family there on the stage, they came across as remarkably composed, considering that they must have felt like they were on Mars. I'd probably have been standing there looking like a yak in headlights.

Well, Oprah has announced her new Book Club book today: Gabriel Garcia Marquez's "One Hundred Years of Solitude". I totally called it as soon as she put up the quote from the New York Times, lol.

Does anyone else but me feel that Oprah's "approval" of these classic books (as opposed to her selecting more contemporary authors for the previous book club) somehow "cheapens" the experience? Forgive me if I sound bitter here, but that is actually one of my favorite books and has been for some time, yet when Oprah announces it, it's as if it's something new and everyone jumps on the bandwagon to read the selected book. I also don't care for those huge stickers on the newer editions that hide half of the cover in lieu of a huge "Oprah Book Club" sticker. The sticker for "East of Eden" said, "The book that brought Oprah's Book Club back!"

I've always felt this way about her book club and I was kind of disappointed that she decided to do a classics club. The whole thing just seems highly capitalistic for books that should be regarded as works of art. Am I alone in feeling this way?

I expect Oprah might have experienced a lot of pressure to whore current works (and thus give a previously unknown author "Oprah's seal of success") and she'd had her fill of it.

I know, I know. It's sort of like being a huge fan of a (relatively) unknown band and then they become huge. You're like, "That was mine!!! You can't have it, you poseur!!!"

On the upside for the books, at least it gets people reading the classics, and I no longer have to hear about how "She's Come Undone" is the "best book" someone has ever read.

Today's show on Extreme Breakups.....wow!

I really felt bad for the Fireman's wives. While it was great that their husbands survived 9-11, it must have totally sucked to lose them to the widows. I read about that situation in the paper. The husbands claimed that their actions had nothing to do with 9-11; if so, then was they sleeping with their teammate's wives beforehand?

One husband left his wife and 4 kids to move in with the widow with 4 kids! How fucked up is that?

As heartbreaking as the extreme break-ups were, I spent most of time annoyed with the attitudes of Oprah and the psychologist.

The victims were berated with questions like "Did you have problems in your marriage?" "Were you emotionally disconnected?" "Were you ignoring signs?"

All of this gives the Other Woman & the Cheating Man ammunition. They can rationalize their behavior, as in "Gee, what we did was wrong, but see, there were problems in the marriage beforehand."

Some people will cheat no matter how strong the marriage. Some people won't cheat no matter how bad the marriage. It's a question of character, and some people are just immoral. The state of the marriage is completely irrelevant. Cheating is wrong.

Oprah assured the victims that she wasn't blaming them, but sorry, that's precisely what she was doing.

ITA. It was clear some of the women felt attacked (by Oprah and the psychologist). Even on the Oxygen show, Oprah kept repeating that she wasn't blaming them, but I felt that just brought to everyone's attention.

I usually feel like the guests aren't being blamed *enough* (that sounds terrible and it would make more sense if I could think of a specific example, but I can't), but I agree that a couple of the wives were getting it pretty hard. The wife whose husband left her for her best friend seemed particularly upset (and good Lord, her kids broke my heart!). It was all on her to identify the problems in her marriage and fix them? Un-uh. I don't think so.

I couldn't muster up sympathy for the wife with the best friend. Her whole "well, he should have known I loved him because I took care of the kids and the home and I did that because I loved him" was so naive. I did like how she stood up to Oprah when Oprah was badgering her about emotional disconnection though.

Diane Farr's "single" announcement after her fiancee broke off the engagement was great. I hope I never have to send those out, but totally will if I have to.

tigerlion, I'm still giggling over Elise being flung around on that electric bike!

Yesterday's show was heartbreaking. You are a NYC firefighter's wife who survives 911 just to have your husband stolen by a widow. You come on national television to reveal your pain. And Oprah sits there and insists that you must not have had a very good marriage anyway! The nerve. That is the oldest excuse in the book-"if you had been taking care of your man, he wouldn't have strayed". Bullshit.

And that last woman? That was some fresh pain she was feeling. I wanted to cry for her and those poor kids. She may have been living in 1950s fantasyland, but she has a point...she cooks, she cleans, she raises five kids for him....and he repays her by publicly humiliating her, sleeping with her best friend and leaving his own family for the family around the corner? That's low. The worst part was imagining him kissing the other woman on Main Street, in front of his wife and children. She put it well when she said he chose his own happiness over his children's.

I thought it was a little tacky to have a very somber segment about the wives being cheated on...and ending it all with sad music, only to have "Friday! Charlize Theron!" flashed on the screen, still accompanied by the heartstring stylings.

I felt bad for the wife who was waved away dismissively by her husband. He said "Not now, Debbie, I'm on a date." A kneeing in the crotch would have been in order. Date THAT, bucko.

No kidding. Debbie's cheating husband is lucky he didn't have me for a wife.

I think Oprah's intention was for these women's experiences to serve as a collective cautionary tale, but that wasn't articulated as clearly or adeptly as it should have been. The thing that got under my skin while watching was the recollection of Oprah's fawning behavior with Sting a few months back, when she gave him a complete pass about his infidelity with Trudie Styler when he was still married to his first wife. He was all moony-eyed in the recounting and "blahblahblahedestinycakes," and she just sat there and nodded. Made me want to throw up.

That "single" note was terrific!

On the show today about the woman whose family doesn't believe that she's gay I was mentally begging Oprah to just look that Mom straight in the eye and say "Look, I know you love your daughter and want what's best for her, but she is gay, she was born gay, it's natural, it's normal, and she's never going to change." I don't understand how some people think that there is wiggle room and refuse to believe the biological facts. Oy!

I wonder if Esera Tuaolo has a whole lot of contact with that rat bastard teammate that basically said, "If you can have the mental clarity to accept and admit that what you are disgusts me and makes me want to beat the shit out of you, then I guess I could maybe lower myself to be your friend." Really? I mean, I'm not surprised that a square jawed football player would be a homophobe but who would think that they could look good on TV saying that? Then he said that if Esera hadn't had the good grace and smarts to retire first, this teammate would definitely have been one of the name callers in the locker room. Nice, dude, really really nice.

I did like that Oprah had the guts to have a masculine, un-femmy gay male couple on her show. It's more courage than most shows are able to muster when they address the issue of homosexuality in this culture. I also liked that they seemed like a very happy couple without being fake about it.

Wow! Todays show was gut wrenching. The search for Angela Shelton had me in tears. How brave was the brother to accept what he did, understand why he did it, and do his best to heal himself. I know it happens all too often, but it always shocks me that a parent can be abusive to their child.

It surprised me that Oprah is so naive about the gay issue. The fact that it was included in an episode about family secrets should have been a clue. No matter how many TV shows that deal with it, it is still an issue that is a long way from being accepted. Gay marriage is a huge hot button politically in North America. I can't imagine a pro athlete coming out of the closet while still working. Maybe there is one that I don't know about.

On yesterday's show, my heart broke for Bridget, and I thought it was so typical how the husband didn't want his lying, cheating-ass face to be shown. I was like, "Oh, Sami-Lite, don't cry!" And girl had to be spoonfed after he left her. She was pregnant, for Christ's sake. Selfish prick.

I agree with you and wish Oprah would've said someting like that, too, but with high profile people like on-again, off-again lesbian Anne Heche around, I can also understand why people do believe homosexuality is something you can control.

I, too, was surprised that Oprah would think there isn't anybody 'in the closet' anymore. I know things are getting better, but in some ways, lately, I've sensed a growing demand from society to conform to the majority, be that with being gay, a different religion, not having kids, etc, etc, etc. Maybe it's just me.

As far as the 'Extreme Breakups', I know that it's natural when something bad happens to someone (or even sometimes to yourself) --be that rape, the breakup of a marriage, a car accident, whatever -- that you want to find some reason to blame the victim, or however you want to put it. It's a defense mechanism b/c if you can figure out what that person did "wrong" then you can avoid that "mistake" and it won't happen to you. But, that's a bunch of crap. Bad things happen and sometimes it's not the victim's fault. Sorry. I know it's hard to accept, but life's like that. So, trying to find what was "wrong" with those women's marriages before was sort of annoying to me.

Wordy, word, mcword, LisaLyn!
Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Bad things do happen.

I think Ruthe was saying that there are bad marriages all over the place and they stay together. Hers wasn't so bad. She had 4?(5?) frickin kids to take care of and was involved in that. It's tough to have a "couples" night or lunch or anything without making an extreme effort. And I think that's a relatively new concept--like the last 10 years or so--so it hasn't filtered out into the mainstream completely yet. But it's natural to blame or look for reasons after the fact. Oprah needed to back off. And I love Oprah. It is hard to see the forest for the trees in everyday life.

Yeah, we disconnect from time to time, and come back together. It's an ebb and flow, and how about blaming the husband? Where was his part in all of this? Where was his emotional connection? It wasn't like she was shutting his efforts out --or we don't know--but it doesn't sound like he was trying either.

Did anyone hear what Oprah said right before the credits rolled on the "Extreme Break-Ups" show? After this really intense show where everyone is left feeling pretty raw (including myself), she says something like, "Well, I'm gonna go start my day now." Did I hear that right? I hope i heard it incorrectly because her delivery of that statement was pretty appalling. It seemed like she was all ,"well, now that we have talked about your pain, I gotta get a pedicure." It just seemed incredibly callous and insensitive to me.