Yes. Yes he is. He really is. And one for the road.

Yeah, Supes really shouldn't be portrayed as so jealous and bitter, but they've been going that way with Supes/Bats/GL all season (kidnapping Green Arrow when he wouldn't answer their invite).

No wonder Aquaman's not crazy about the JL! Yikes.

Hahhaha!! Those covers are funny, Perfect Xero. I especially liked the Jimmy Olsen covers because I honestly never liked his character that much anyway! (snicker)

But just so people who have never read comics don't get the wrong idea, those covers were designed to attract people's attention and read it just to find out why the hero is acting weird. Superman does actually do some of stuff that's shown on the covers, but the cover blurb totally screws up the context of what happens in the story. Basically, they're "Psych!" covers.

I wonder if it was meant as a joke. Some of Superman's past potrayals have been very corny, so having him complain that the Ultimen are "corny" is like having The Question complain that someone is a crazy conspiracy theorist.

Could someone give a rundown of the also rans this ep? There were a ton of them, and I am so not up on my DC continuity. Thanks!

Methings the JLU is getting a little too big for its britches. If I were General Arlen, I'd want to talk about that orbitting weapon of mass destruction too. Can't say I'd play around with that shady alien tech though, but I'm not a member of the government.

Good thing that black goo wasn't toxic, or the Atom would be in serious trouble.

I hope they explore where the alien tech came from. This ep was pretty good, not great. We got to see more than the core 3 in action and their teamwork, which was nice. Oh, and it was also nice of them to rebuild Red Tornado.

Some great one liners:

Atom: "I'm going to lay here for a while, Katie. I'm old, and I get tired."

Bats: "I could use some air support, since I can't fly...at all. [nearing a splat-down] Now would be good."

WW: "Ready?"
Atom: "Just don't queeze."

And the cleavage shot?

I am 12.

I was so happy to see him standing there at the end.

I like that one. Sure it's a cartoon show but it's one adults can understand and relate to among other things:

If the goo had been toxic, I'm sure Ray wouldn't have minded going out like that.

These are just some of the ones I saw (and remember):

Atom-Smasher, Booster Gold, Black Canary, Blue Devil, Ice, Huntress, Crimson Avenger, Crimson Fox, Dr. Fate, Dr. Mid-Nite, Fire, Elongated Man, Green Arrow, Nemesis, Red Tornado (Yay!), Rocket Red, Starman, Steel, The Ray, Vibe, Vixen, Vigilante and Wildcat.

Okay...that was good. Thank you, Warren Ellis.

Waaaaaay too many heroes on the JLU. Can't they par it down to twelve and call upon reserves in situations like this? Also...how does Batman feel about heroes wielding guns? Seriously...Nemesis AND Vigilante? Bruce ain't happy.

General Elling...in comics continuity, that guy's a bastard. Surprised he didn't chat up Captain Atom, since those two go back.

Placement of Atom...um, Diana? Ever think of securing him on the tiara? I mean, way to fuel the fanboy wet dreams.

Warden...you missed Stargirl and S.T.R.I.P.E. At least we can see where the Cosmic Rod went. I still miss Jack Knight.

Are the end teasers always different? I saw Vixen's power use...you can see the animals she embodies. Kinda cool, actually

This episode was really "meh" for me. There was nothing for me to really grab hold of, no character development, nothing besides lots of shiite being blown up (futilely, even!). And the whole "government about to step in" on the JL is starting to grate. It's obvious they're building to something big, but you can leave little hints about it instead of the government rep being all "We're going to get y'all one day!" ::cue episode end:: (not that exactly, but it always feels like that to me). Some of the lines were great, I'm not going to shortchange that. Bat's line about needing air assistance? So droll it got a big chuckle out of me. But I really expected more from Ellis.

Speaking of droll, Wonder Woman's "Strength in numbers...and all that". Just the way she delivered it was like, "Yeah. Whatever". Loved it.

And yes I giggled like a 12 year old when Atom was peeking out from the WonderRack.

OK, thanks to my TiVo, here's what I think is a reasonably complete list of all the heroes seen in this episode: Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, J'onn J'onnz, the Atom, Ice, Crimson Avenger, Green Arrow, Nemesis, Elongated Man, Vixen, Shining Knight, Supergirl, Captain Atom, Steel (John Henry Irons), Doctor Fate, Doctor Light, Red Tornado, Stargirl, S.T.R.I.P.E., Booster Gold, The Ray, Atom Smasher, Starman (Prince Gavyn), Vigilante (Greg Sanders), Aquaman, the Huntress, Rocket Red, Aztek, Blue Devil, Fire, Wildcat, Vibe, Steel (Hank Heywood), Dr. Mid-Nite, Gypsy, Hawk, Obsidian, and Crimson Fox. There's one hero I can't positively identify, seen standing being S.T.R.I.PE.'s left shoulder and next to Ice in the group pose at the very end of the ep. My educated guess is that it's Hourman, but I can't say for sure. Incidentally, some of the heroes seen earlier in the episode aren't in the glamour shot at the end: Green Arrow, Aquaman, the Crimson Avenger, and Steel (Hank Heywood). Casualties?

There were a couple of extra-geeky comic book references I particularly enjoyed. In one scene, we see Vibe, Steel (Hank Heywood), and Vixen fighting in close proximity; all three were in the short-lived and not-at-all-fondly remembered JLA-Detroit. (Gypsy may have been there too, using her camouflage powers.) And in the very next scene, we see Vigilante get rescued by the Shining Knight; both were members of the Golden Age Seven Soldiers of Victory.

B.o.r.i.n.g. Nothing but one big and dull fight scene. Fighty fight fight. WonderBoobies. Comic geek porn in the backgrounds. Fight some more. Boring. Expected better from Ellis, though why I'm not sure. Except for Planetary I haven't been that impressed with anything he's done.

Well ... Yeah. It was okay, not really great, but it was worth watching. I mean, Atom's resolution seemed kind of silly ... this thing can generate a robo-spider from scratch but it can't whip up a few when Atom is trying to give it a 'heart attack'?

As for the Wonder Boobies ... yeah, convenient that the female hero in the 'low cut' outfit was the one carrying Atom, eh? I mean, sure, on the way there he was hanging out in Supes ear, but I guess any excuse to give us a gratuitous cleavage shot will do ... Of course you'd never see that situation with a male hero.

Superman: "Atom, I need both my hands." [Tucks Ray into the front of his pants to 'keep him safe' while we get a gratuitous close-up].

Oh, and where was Flash? Wouldn't he be the logical choice to send across the country to pick up the urgently needed hero.

Tea all over my damned monitor. You owe me for replacement. I'll send my minions for payment shortly. ;-)

Yes. Welcome to the heterosexual male-dominated world of mainstream comics. How I cope? Make up imagery like the scene you just mentioned.

The Atom was never a favorite hero of mine. Till tonight's 'sode. ;)
Actually the nano bot deal wasn't so far fetched....except everything would turn into grey goo.

Atom looking at the nanite beast: "He's bigger than my car now, Katie. Personally, I blame you."

Katie: "How could you possibly blame me?"

Atom: "Because otherwise it would be my fault. That can't be right, I'm a professor."

I laughed at that for 2 straight minutes!

And the calm, cool and collected Batman as he plummets to his death was pretty funny too.

In many ways the Atom can be one of the most valuable members of the League due to his intellect and his unique powers. I’m glad he got a spotlight episode.

I have to say this was the worst episode todate; particulary all the hype involving Ellis penning it and all.

It was a meaningless slugfest that GL, Dr. Fate, and Supes could ahve easily handled by themselves. All these heroes is becoming too distracting and good storylines and development is suffering.

Where Dark Heart failed, The Return succeeded because the cause was justified with JLU going up against Amazo. Here they go up against replicating nanobots!? Please! This episode as much of JLU season has been about showcasing all these "obscure, most haven't-even-heard-of or-seen-before" because BT has an ego.

I dunno why they thought having so many heroes was gonna equal better stories when X-Men(both incarnations) and Spider-Man did some episodes like this and the result was less than stellar. Its hardly worth my effort to switch to see if a new epsidoe of JL is on anymore. They should have ended it at season 2, IMO.

All I want for the JLU this Christmas it's them to shorten the number of members to 12 (Morrison Style) and go for the Maggedon Saga for season four.

Keep the original seven and add (IMO) Green Arrow, Aquaman, Steel (John Henry Irons), Long Shadow and Vixen (just to see if CN gets away with a love triangle on this show).

But since the chance of that happening is the same of the Flash getting some valuable screen time this season, I might as well wish for a decent theme for the intro.

I thought the opposite. The Return didn't work for me, premise-wise, because AMAZO had no reason to fight the League; all he had to do was turn invisible or teleport, and BAM! He bypasses the League entirely. While the replicating Nano-Bots weren't the most original idea in the world, it didn't break suspension of disbelief.

I say after their little experiment and storyline that will play out and wrap up next season they narrow the league down to the original core 7 plus atom and green arrow. And i know that only makes two females, but have supergirl in a supporting role and there you go. That way we can get back to quality stories, and damnit bring back the Flash, I know he's out there somewhere.

Wow! The Wonder Twins two weeks in a row!

Tee hee! I'm twelve too!

Now see that was and really still is my biggest complaint about comics today, but espically about the old superman comics, which I happen to collect because I love the corny stories. They'd promise you one thing, the death of superman was always a big one, and then they'd tottally cheat you in some way. I always wonderd if I could have sued the companies for false advertising, saying that hey I bought the comic because the cover said that superman killed lois lane and yet inside it turns out is was her evil bizzaro clone only dressed up to look like her. Sue them for every penny I say

BWAHAHA! Next time open the comic up in the sssssssstore firsssssst before purchassssssssing it!

I think I enjoyed "Dark Heart" better the second time. The first time I couldn't really concentrate on the story 'cause I was playing "Spot the Obscure Hero" too much! I've been reading comics for years and I didn't have a clue who some of those people were! I hope episodes like that with TOO many heroes are few and far between.

I'm really looking forward to the Black Canary/Huntress episode written by Gail Simone. Anyone know when it airs?

Wish JLU would use Aquaman's new/old look he's currently sporting in the comics, with the short hair and orange shirt and all that.

But deep down you know Supes would never kill anyone. Superman's lily-white/choir-boy/boy-scout persona is the one that made him stand out from the bunch of Batman-esque heroes.


Darn. Missed this week's ep. Ah well.

If the series needs to do one thing they need to cut out those damn watchtower scenes. They take up time doing NOTHING. Boring cameos.

Keep in mind that Batman is also one of those guys who doesn't kill. This point was made in Kingdom Come: take everything else away and Batman is a guy who doesn't want to see anyone die. Otherwise he would have done the intelligent thing and killed the Joker a long time ago. Also, the comics Superman has killed before (some Kryptonian villains), so it's not like he won't do it.

Well if we didn't have the watchtower scenes we wouldn't have MM, b/c god knows Jonn isn't good enough to actively participate in battles, he is just the big, green, alien babysitter of millions of superheroes. I guess phasing, shape-shifting, strength, flight, and heat vision eyes aren't what they used to be in the superhero game but other crappy powers like Hawk & Doves are.

In the first year of his comics existence Batman was running around throwing people off buildings and being true to his vigilante origins. Then they added Robin and he stopped that.

I finally saw this ep yesterday. Not too bad, IMO. Though I really really miss Flash. They grab practically the entire Justice League again and he's nowhere to be seen. Right.



Plus they have to show us that the JLA has a huge weapon of mass destruction pointing at Earth. Good thinking.

I saw the Supergirl, Arrow, Question team up episode again today. Odd that it came on the same day I was watching an episode of Bubblegum Crisis were the encounter an evil genetically engineered clone by the name of Galatea. Heh.

Also, Dirty old Ollie made a wet-dream joke to Supergirl and Question used logic to save the day. Is that his power? cause, he didn't appear to have any.

So, does anyone know exactly why Michael Rosenbaum hasn't been appearing? I'd guess that he's busy with Smallville, except he's done both Smallville and JL in previous seasons. I guess money could be another issue. Perhaps he doesn't think it's worth his time to appear on a show if he only appears every once in a while? Still, it's kind of sad that we've seen and heard more of Supergirl than we have of the Flash.

That pretty much is the only power The Question has. He's trained in some martial arts and has that nifty mask, but that's about it really.

In the comics, the Question's martial arts ability is pretty close to Batman's. But his primary power is his sharp, analytical mind.

Wow.

So Amazo's the monochromatic space traveller with disgusting amounts of power to complete the Fate/Aquaman/Grundy poker table.

It was nice to see Hawk Girl again, but I didn't like the episode that much. A few cheesy parts ("Is that my destiny, to betray another friend?").

And did I see Superman knock Grundy into traffic, causing several vehicles to explode?

I think it was a parking lot but if it were cars on the street, they would have been abandoned due to Grundy's rampage.

Grundy's rampage reminded me of a green skinned monster in another comic universe who had lost all semblence of himself and just became a vessel of rage and destruction. Once Grundy was able to stand up to Supes, I knew he had to have been resurrected by magicks.

If there's one thing I learned from watching Buffy, if a pretty girl is holding a weapon and she tells you to close your eyes, GET THE HELL OUT OF THERE!

Lines I liked:

Vixen: Aren't all zombies by definition dead?

Aquaman: I get better conversation from the android.
Amazo: You are aware that I'm in the room?

I saw the Christmas episode again today and it was just as awsome as it was the first time. I seriously miss the times when it was just the origional group. Hawkgirl and Flash were my favorites and now they're gone and they've left an obvious hole in the potential enjoyment I get from each episode.

Damn...I missed the Xmas ep. Did it air on CN? Would it air again?

It was a good ep. Only one extraneous hero in Vixen, and she was pretty good. But are her and John supposed to be an item? I would find it wrong on the grounds that John's supposed to lust after alien women. In old-school comics canon, Grundy was a tough mofo, taking on the JLA and JSA during at least two "Crisis" events. I think absorbing energy was one of his various gimmicks.

Oh, Shayera...I missed her. Missed the yelling, missed the hard hitting, missed the attitude. missed the anger. She rocks.

Also...since when did the credits NOT give the episode away? I liked.

Since they added Shayera to them, perhaps? Not that I'm complaining either, mind you.

First thing that popped in my mind.

Wasn't sure exactly what Vixen's superpower was. Some kind of talisman that gives her the power of different animals?

Not a bad ep, I was expecting some kind of bitchy comment from Vixen about Hawkgirl.

Dammit! I missed tonight's ep. Can someone please direct me to a place where I can find out when it will air again, and or a place that has a detailed synopsis. Thanks.

CN usually replays Saturday's episode on Sunday at 5/4 Central.



My thoughts exactly, heh. Though that took me to a dark place. Shayera/Grundy... buh.

I didn't even catch that. Good call SideshowJed. Someone at JLU really must have loved The Defenders when they were younger.

This episode was okay. Nice to see Hawkgirl again, though I think they might have overdone her conflcit over fighting Grundy. I thought the show did a real nice job with Vixen's powers.

Okay, so we;ve had Vixen and Bwana Beast now. Do the producers have something against Animal Man?

Also notice that the android was called "Amazo" for the first time. I know that in his debut, he was labelled "A.M.A.Z.O." on a blueprint. Wonder what that stands for? And they mentioned Nth metal for the first time.

Seeing the end credits...showdown at the Old West? Kinky.

Yep. Good to see Hawkgirl again. So I guess Grundy killed the nerds who used the spell to bring him back, huh? I liked it.

Nth metal was mentioned in Star-crossed ... J'onn and the female Thanagarian talk about it.

The episode was pretty good, simply for the return of Hawkgirl. Still doesn't make sense that the entire freakin' League wasn't sent down to stop Grundy. You'd think that J'onn would've, at the least, sent Wonder Woman to help ... Ya know, on account of her being really strong.

One of the things I have to mention, however, is that the 'world' of JLU seems much more Marvel than DC. You've got government agencies working on methods to defeat muta ... Super Heroes and keep them 'in check', a public that doesn't instantly trust anyone in a cape, the Defenders ...

Dr. Fate's little "niche" of superheroes definitely remind me of the Marvel group from the 70's:The Defenders. Dr.Fate(Dr. Strange), Aquaman(The Sub-Mariner), Amazo(The Silver Surfer), Hawkgirl(The Valkyrie) and Solomon Grundy is the Hulk!

My own little geek moment happened when GL and Dr. Fate combined
their powers to briefly trap Grundy in a magic and science based bubble.
That brought me back to reading a story in the Starman series
about when the original GL and Fate did the same thing. Nice move on
the writers' part.

So now we know how the Hawkgirl vote turned out. If John Stewart abstained and Superman broke the tie in favor of her, then I assume that Martian Manhunter and Flash voted to keep her and Batman and Wonder Woman voted against.

Anyway, there's something that bugged me about this episode. I was willing to accept that both of the JLA members who voted against Hawkgirl were conveniently absent, that a bunch of amateur spellcasters were able to inadvertently resurrect Grundy and bestow him with cosmic level power, that a character designed to fight evil magic users is useless when chaos magic is involved, that a nearly omnipotent character was also useless, that this nearly omnipotent creature didn't join Dr. Fate to fight the nano-creatures even though he's willing to help the JLA, that Aquaman actually goes to Dr. Fate's pad to socialize, and that he knows about Hawkgirl's chess games with Batman even though he wasn't an official JLA member back then. But I just can't believe that Hawkgirl regularly beat Batman at chess.

How's this for a far-fetched explanation?

Batman allowed Hawkgirl to beat him at chess, so that he could analyze her strategic thinking? Or see if she had any at all besides "Whaling on the enemy with her HONKING HUGE MACE?"