Yay, topic! I'll be looking forward to Monday's show also. At least with syndication, no matter who testifies/has a parade/needs to give a speech in the Rose Garden, I get to see some Shill.

timeonmyhands


Hee! Watch out there now.

I think I will cut my gym time short to be home in time for Monday's show!



Works well when your 3-4 year-old child is having a tantrum.

Does the Dr. Phil show repeat on Oxygen like Oprah?
Babyplant's bed is in the master bedroom next to ours (Our comforters do not match and he's only 2) We plan to move him into his own room this year. We started that arrangement because he sometimes wakes up in the night and wanders around the house and we were afraid we would not be able to hear him. I know since I work outside the home I feel guilty leaving him on the weekend and I miss him so I want to spend a lot of time with him. But sometimes he doesn't want to be bothered by me or his father, he justs wants to play with his hot wheels. All we want is to raise a happy well-adjusted person who loves us even though we get on his nerves sometimes.

I swore I was never watching this show again, but mainly because of all of you, dear posters, and your comments, I keep coming back.

Following this thread about SAHM and Working Mothers has been very fascinating. I like to think I'm a progressive-minded person and everyone has a choice to do as they please unless that decision is harmful to the chirrun. However, what really irks me about the SAHM vs Working Mother debate is that there seems to be little support for women who have no choice. Women who must work, the ones who cannot under any circumstance, enjoy the benefit of staying home (single parent families, low wage earners, etc.)

It's a wonderful world we live in that we CAN go to work and have families and live in beautiful mansions or stay home while hubby makes a wage to support a family and still bitch and moan about it. But I come from a single parent home, and I know many others who grew up in similar situations in which the parent/s could not stay at home. I would love to hear some conversation from Dr. Shill or hell, even a book that talks about the consequences on families that are not afforded these privileges. (And not Naomi Wolfe, she can suck it! I read her piece of pretentious bullshit book about motherhood and I can't even tell you how hard I wanted to punch her in her pretty feminist self-righteous face. I don't even have kids and I thought she gave a very one-sided view of motherhood.)

*Hee*
Hi all, I've been reading your posts and they are fascinating. I haven't seen the good *cough* Doctor since I went back to work after my surgery but from what I've read here he's turned into quite the pompous asshat.

The Momism posts reminded me of something. I don't have any kids and don't want any. Recently I started watching Style Court on the Style Network and there's a disturbing pattern. You have these women brought in by friends and or family who are SAHM's who look like absolute crap. Unwashed unstyled hair. Seemingly unable to wear anything other then sweats constantly, that type of thing. They all claim they do it because it's comfortable; let me tell you comfort gets a bad rap on that show because everyone who claims to be comfortable looks rough. Then the Mothers begin their tale of woe: my child/children take up sooo much of my time that I can't shop for clothes. I spend 24/7/365 taking care of my children because it's the most important job in the world (no argument). One woman even said that she couldn't wear contacts because her child had some medical problem, which I can't remember now, and would get up at night so the mother never got a full nights sleep and needed the glasses so she could whip them on at a moments notice.

I, being childfree, felt terrible for these poor women. Seriously, I did. Until one day a thought popped into my head: They managed to find the time to be on the tv show and get a makeover. Much like the frazzled women who can't clean their house or handle the kids but find the time to appear on DP.

And it dawned on me that since their little darling wasn't in the audience that obviously someone was taking care of them while Mom was on tv. And if that person could do it that day, couldn't Mom make arrangements to have the child looked after once a week, or even once a month so they had a chance to rest? If you're stressed, tired, frazzled and overworked how much of a favor are you really doing for your kid? because if Momma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy. And who's going to take care of Momma when she's too sick to function?

Oh, I see the topic waving frantically trying to get my attention. Does Dr Doolittle ever suggest to the Mommy People that they arrrange for someone to watch their child for an afternoon once a week or so? Even if they trade babysitting with another Mom it's something. While he's handing out money for IVF does he tell anyone "Hey, I've arranged an Au Pair or Mother's Helper to come by once a week or so to help you out and give you a break?" Does he buy them some time at a KinderCare or something? Hell, does he refer them to any books or websites (like Flylady) to help them get their shit together? Or does he help them have more kids and book them for a return visit in the future when they've practically lost what little sanity they started out with?

Monday:
My parents would of laughed at me and that would of been the end of it.

Hee. My mom would've laughed at me, then my brothers and my sister would've kicked my ass. That's messed up.

Totally randomly, the DP.com message board is scary yall. Actually, the whole website is a piece of messy crap. I couldn't find my way to anything if my life depended on it. Someone needs to get Trump over there to fire...somebody.

My parents always had those lovely clear boundaries Dr. Phil is always going on about, but you know, they worked. It never would have even crossed my mind to attempt asking for something like that because I knew it would never get me anywhere.

Snarkitty, I am not entirely sure what you were implying with your earlier post, but I can assure you I am a real person, the incident I referred to was a real one, and I have only ever posted here under one name.

Kinda like when my 10-year-old son informed me he wanted to fly first class last weekend to the tournament he was attending? And I said, "Feel free to grow up, get a good job, pay your bills on time and use any and all extra money on flying first class anyplace you want. 'Til then, say 'thank you' that you're not going Grayhound."

I'm not real clear why people think they need Dr. Phil to tell their kid no. It's very easy and often fun: "NO!" (And, despite what I thought as a child, "because I said so" is a perfectly valid reason.)

Sing it clichekitty my friend! Pretty Miss Naomi slouched smugly on Oprah's couch, pontificating about how we should support each other, until some poor audience member would disagee with her and then she'd go all red faced and spluttery. I was a card carrying feminist (member of NOW till they all went berzerk) while Naomi was a spoiled little girl reading her Free to be Me book and I don't need her to explain it all.

Stay at home, go to work, have kids, don't have kids, wear sweats, dress-up - femininism is about CHOICES!

And I can't stand to have Shill and Robin trying to make it about scented candles and "girl time"!
Katymo that board is a nightmare - post something at the 300th point and never see it again unless you're willing to tab through from number one or back from number 2458.

percolata, can I be your kid?

My mother, a supposed "feminist" herself, has told me in the past that a "woman isn't a real woman unless she has children."

*cough*

Sisters, we have come too far in this male-dominated society to turn on one another now and undercut eachother for the choices we have made. My idea of feminism is best illustrated by Marlo Thomas in Free To Be You And Me (we 70s kids lived, and loved, this stuff): the song about what all the things a mommy can be...a police officer, a doctor, a mommy who stays home...it's all good. It's all about having choices in this life. And I like to think that women can take the choice right down to whether or not a woman has children at all.

Robyn and her superficial girly-girly ridiculous "scented candle baths" and other such nonsense really trivializes the very real issue of stressed-out moms and their need for some solitude. Uh, Shill and Robyn? Not all problems can be solved by a trip to the Houston Galleria. Don't get me wrong...maggiegault is down with the shopping and the smell-welly baths, but it ain't a panacea to what is becoming a very real issue in our society. I'd love to see a more in-depth analysis, along with some real solutions, for the overworked mother phenomenon. How does her quality of life suffer? That of her husband, if there is one? How about the children? What elements of our society make this so prevalent? What steps can be taken to alleviate, if not eliminate, the problem?

No, Robyn, all the Eucalyptus-scented candles in the world burning all at once won't eliminate the problem. In fact, your inane "solutions" and propensity to trivialize a woman's issue (although ultimately it is EVERYONE'S issue) are a big part of problem to begin with. How can we women be taken seriously when the media is filled with bints like Robyn?

Good lord, I take a couple of days off and get so far behind on the terrific posts!

DrCher, congrats! And "cry-it-out" is (IMO) appropriate only after 6-8 months or so; I assume you're talking about crying to sleep? Prior to that, mommies really are providing security first and foremost. Baby Hex just spent his first night in the nursery, in a crib and out of his co-sleeper on Saturday night, at a little under five months old. We have a monitor in case he wakes during the night, but he seems to be a good sleeper like his momma, who sometimes must be dislodged from dreamland with C-4.

An excerpt from the book we briefly mentioned earlier on momism can be found here . I think these gals are on the right track regarding the whys behind why so many women are a) whining on DP and b) judgmental of other women. Or, if not on the exact track, within trainspotting distance.

borokat, although I'm on the edge of ETMI, where the E stands for entirely, at least for the first few months, plan on foreplay being foreshortened to they following: "Hey, while the baby is napping......" (The most romantic words you will ever hear will be: "I'll take this feeding, why don't you get some sleep.")



Sacrilege!

(I don't know if the following is against the rules or not, but it does parallel the famewhore mentality of so many of DP's guests.) I quit attempting to read the DP site board since it seemed to be a constant stream of:
A: I really like that show, it was so much like [anecdote from my life, that only vaguely pertains to show at hand].

B: I didn't totally agree with that show, since [contradictory anecdote from my life].

A: How dare you attack me personally? [Even though I'm posting my personal life stories to a mass of people who don't know nor would ever care to know me and yet somehow from which I expect total acceptance and validation.]

B: You misunderstood me. [Since I'm not really reading your stories, I'm busy posting my own.]

A: So now I'm stupid? Let me tell you my anecdote all over again.

Ad nauseum.

When I was a stew for a major airline, some people would let their kids stand up in their seats during severe turbulence. Or, the kids didn't want to wear their seatbelts. I would tell them that we couldn't leave until they were buckled in. The parents would say, "YOU tell her! She doesn't want to wear it!" Who is in charge? Grrrrr....

[O/T] So glad some of you have visited Flylady! For those of you who don't know, it's a website about keeping your house neat, but not perfect, plus a lot of good advice [/O/T]

The word "asshat" always cracks me UP!

Although I am against cosleeping involving older (read: beyond infant) children, I totally support and encourage co-napping like the poster way upthread, who who sleep for a few hours with her baby after nursing it. Get that rest, mama!

Spoiled kids-should be a doozy...I was spoiled a bit while growing up, but we didn't have a lot of money, so I appreciated being able to work from age 11 as a babysitter to earn money for school trips, school clothes, albums, etc. It gave me such a feeling of independence and self-sufficiency- loved it. Plus, I learned to really appreciate the value of an article of clothing or an experience (like a trip). I am now an adult with a credit score of over 700- thanks Mom and Dad.

Plus, Mom and Dad were a united front- no playing them off one another and "negotiating."

Hexele, congrats on the new development in your household! Your analysisi of the DP boards was spot on and hilarious!!

OH yes!
DrCher, I agree with whoever said that the cry-it-out method would be better for slightly older babies (at night). Sometimes, there just isn't anything you can do when they're upset at night. So you go back to bed, lay there with your eyes wide open until they cry themselves back to sleep. No guilt; it's the only way to get your sleep sometimes. With young babies, IMO, crying it out isn't such a great idea. They need to know that you're around whenever they need you. Yes, it sucks to get up in the middle of the night for 8 months straight. And that memory will keep me from having baby number 3.

I'm going to miss today's show on the spoiled brats! ARGH. When I was 16, I actually thought that logically, it was time for my parents to buy me a car. I picked out one that I wanted (some 1k-dollar used car) and told my dad about it. He laughed. He cracked up. No free car for yours truly. Until I was 20 and paid for it myself. End of anecdote.

RE: Today's Episode/Spoiled Kids.

I love my BabyDrCher, but there is no way in hell that I'll go into debt and get a 2nd mortgage so she can have a Lexus or Caddy that we can't afford and that she doesn't even appreciate.

Borokat's first car: 1982 black firebird. Year: 1993 It looked like the Smokey and the Bandit car, and I was alternately proud and horrified of it. All the girls and their cutesy 4 door Nissans were like, ew! But the guys liked it! :) I probably would have liked it more too if it actually consistently ran, but.... it was a lemon. Mr.B. had a 1000 dollar Charger that he bought himself from bagging groceries. That is one of the things that I love about him- that he came from nothing- no money and was the first one to go to college in his immediate family- and he is now a rocket scientist. A kid has no business driving a new car, especially with how prone they are to wrecking new cars. I myself had incidents with bushes, a streetlight, a minivan, a sedan, my Grandmother's fence, two different cars on campus- all before I was 23. Thankfully, since 23, I have been accident free- knock on wood.

I do not even comprehend these parents' reasoning on today's show.

I think our foremothers may have had more help in the form of extended family than many women today do. I know when my mother was pregnant with my Great Aunt Katherine, who had just retired from GE, moved in to help care for me and my brother when he arrived, paying $50.00 a month for the privilege of sharing a room with an infant, and before that she lived with my grandparents and helped with my father who was the youngest of 8 born when my grandmother was 47 and before that she adopted a nephew whose mother, her sister, died in childbirth and helped raise him with her remaining sisters and extended family. Now that we've become a nation of pink collar migrant worker that extended family unit is becoming a rare thing. My husband and I worked opposite shifts so someone could be home with our children but that meant taking a lot of low-wage, low-prestige jobs that probably particularly harmed me as a female member of the workforce. My mother, by the way, a factory worker, never cooked unless she was looking to get married and would beat us kids if the house wasn’t clean. I also disagree with the poster who took issue with a woman being overwhelmed saying they were a SAHM and that's their "job." Well, any "job" that involves working 24 hours a day, 365 days a year isn't a job, it's slavery.

I cannot tell you guys how mad today's show made me! The girl who looked up to Paris & Nicole needed a slap in the face. They're skanks who spend their daddies' money! She seemed to think that because she was going to get a degree (with C's in school!), she'd automatically be rich. The first girl made me the maddest, she truly didn't appreciate jack shit that her parents did for her at all. Those parents should be damn ashamed, it is all their fault. It gave me great ideas of what not to do as my niece grows up.

I don't remember ever thinking that a movie or something on TV defined me or what I would do, even as a teenager as fads come and go. Is media different only these few years later? Who knows, but it does not look good.

I'm ashamed that I have something in common with Dr. Phil. My first car (which I still have to drive sometimes) doesn't go in reverse and I have to find a good hill to get it going. Hee!

She also had fake LV and tried to pass it off as genuine LV. Stay in school, girl!

Maggie's Mum, Spring 1986:

"If you want Guess? button fly jeans, babysit and save up your money until you can afford them."

My first car was the family 1982 Honda Accord. We kids had to share it.

OT: Please send prayers and vibes to the soldiers in Iraq, whether you agree with the war or not. Things have gone from terrible to disastrous over there. I just read that insurgents are ambushing Humvees and slaughtering the occupants. My brother's job over there is Humvee Driver.

"We'll not fade out too soon...not in this finest hour...whistle your favorite tune...we'll send the card and flower...saying It's a Mistake..."

Adenoid mom and adenoid kid got on my last nerve. Eleven years old and she wants Tiffany earrings? Diamond, yet? Are these parents insane? I won't go into how many miles I walked through the snow barefoot but I have to say that this CANNOT be the norm! It must be DP's way of once again, boosting ratings. Asshat. (Thanks to THAT coin-phraser.)

These parents, all of them, were absolutely fucked. I'd give each of these 3 brats a gift certificate for $50 a month to shop at K-mart and that would be the sum total end of their shopping excursions. Other than, of course, the extra cash they made for lawn mowing jobs and their volunteer work as a candy-striper at the local hospital caring for elderly people.

Why in bleedin' hell didn't Dr. Puke suggest that they need to see the OTHER side of life in order to appreciate what they have? That's not a question!

Brat #1: You graduate valedictorian and THEN you get to go to college!
Brat #2: Your 11 and NO, you can't go to the mall today.
Brat #3: Get over yourself.

Parents #1: A class in parenting a healthy child without guilt.
Parents #2: Psychoanalysis for the mother first!
Parent #3: Demand that 1/2 of this kid's wages go to a college fund!

Me: Blood pressure skyrocketing!

How did we (ex & moi) raise 4 great kids with great values who are "normal" in every respect, loving and caring individuals? It wasn't that long ago! What has happened to the parents of today that are raising these materialistic kids?

Where in hell happened to common sense?

ETA: Did you see the gold necklace on the 11 yr old? Jeebus in the sky!

maggiegault:


He's on my list. Take good care.

maggiegault - keeping your brother in my prayers. If you don't mind, I will add him annoymously to a big prayer list for soldiers that we have going.

Re the first parent - Wha' happened to being an adult? There is no way in hell I would refinance my house twice to buy stuff for kids. I would be so ashamed to have this kid for my child. Where are her priorities? What good does she contribute to society? Even teens can volunteer or donate part of their allowance.

I guess it comes from being an old hippie, but don't parents tell their kids about the evils of buying into consumerism any more? I'm not anti-corporate. I just don't think you have to buy into a commercialized life style. Lord knows I do my share of consuming, however, I also know, and inculcated in my son, about how commercials try to get you to buy products that you don't need and that your self-worth as a human comes from within, not what stuff you have or where you bought it.

I wonder if these parents ever talk about politics or morality or ethics around the dinner table? Doesn't seem like it. Now that my son is grown, I know he is a mensch, not a brainless consuming idiot. I wonder what this girl will be like in 10 years? I don't think she'll be someone people will want to know.

I used to bag on my parents a lot, as do most kids...but when I see programs like this one, I realize what a fantastic job my mum and dad with raising the three of us. We did not have it easy by any stretch of the imagination, but we all had a nice life and we three see why mum and dad did some of the things they did, things we loathed them for at the time.

We were pretty poor in the 70s, when I was just a young maggie, so there were no extras. We found other ways to have fun. We went on walks and played in the park. We listened to music and learned about the world. We went to the library and checked out books. We played in the sprinklers (remember doing that)?

Here's an anecdote for you: when I was 8 years old, I stole a Milky Way candy bar from the local Village Pantry (convenience store in Indiana). I was caught, and the manager called my mother. Mom came to the store, made me apologize, and handed me my Princess Leia bank. I paid for that candy out of my bank, and of course I was not allowed to eat the treat. I was sobbing and ashamed, but that was nothing like what I got at home...a spanking, plus I had to tell my father what I did (cue dastardly music). I'll never forget what he said and did: he hung his head and said, "I didn't raise you to be a thief. I'm so ashamed."

You goddamn better believe I never stole anything again.

I cannot help but think the piss-poor excuses for parents on today's show would yell at the store manager, blame the child's stealing on his ADHD, and sue the convenience store chain. Anything but admit that Bratzilla is less than perfect.

I'm not being patronizing when I say this to the mums and dads of this forum: when I see shitty parents like that, I really feel bad for you. It's not right for wastes of molecules like that and their spawn to give good parents with good children a bad name.

Tiffany earrings. At 11 years old. Only recently did Mr. Maggie and I begin a tradition at Christmas: I get one piece of Tiffany jewelry of my choosing. Under $150.00. I'm 33, have been married for eight years, and feel that I might like some real jewelry. 11 years old. I am so dating myself, but what 11 year old knows about stuff like that?



What dinner table? I'll lay odds that families like this one haven't sat down to dinner together since...well, ever. It's probably take-out Thai while piling into the SUV with the DVD. We had a family rule that we all sat down to dinner together and ate a meal. This is with both of my parents working full time. We kids helped with the meal and we did the dishes. Your son is no doubt a mensch, and has made some lovely girl a nice partner, I'll bet. I have to wonder about who Consumerella will wind up. Whoever it is, she has a very fucked-up view of the world.

Applause for the posts of Maggiegault, talullababe and aliymeador regarding the demanding kids on DP's show today!!

"Where is common sense these days!" Amen to that!!

Our son grew up without having a sense of 'entitlement' and he knows the value of working for what he wants. I can't imagine having a demanding Bratley or Bratney!

LOL @ "adenoid mom and child" comment.....


Maggie, your brother will be added to my prayer list. God bless him and all others who serve our country.

I'd be proud maggiegault! Good thing I didn't have a daughter during my feminist rage years, I might have created a monster like Naomi.

Word to all on the material girls gone wild. Those parents were getting what they deserved with their only value seeming to be "hard working." "We deserve designer every thing because we work hard and she's a good girl because she works hard and working hard to get more and more stuff is the whole meaning of life." Blech.

And Miss Tongue Stud who thinks she's going to be a billionaire designer because she can scribble a hot tub and a couch on a piece of scratch paper? Sad.

[prayers for all our troops]

Heh, I noticed that too. Who was she trying to fool?

I was hesitant about watching this show b/c I was a little afraid it would hit too close to home. I'm 19 and a little spoiled, I know. My parents are wealthy, but they worked very hard for their money and I am proud of them. I have a few Tiffany items, a pretty substantial Kate Spade collection, and I went to a ritzy private school. I have never wanted for anything, but I honestly believe that my slight materialism is based on a learned appreciation for quality rather than a desire to "look cool". When I was younger, I refused to buy Abercrombie & Fitch and I still refuse to own Louis Vuitton or Ugg boots (come on, that stuff is only cool because someone says it is-- so ugly!). I, however, never stopped appreciating what my parents were giving me and I truly feel grateful and fortunate. My mom was always up for a trip to Target or something and I appreciate a good bargain. I also know that as soon as I finish school and get a job (in the Art History field, too, so not that fruitful financially) I will have to pay for things on my own, and I want to. I guess I just wanted to share that you can be spoiled and not necessarily a brat as well.

I am still wondering -- what WAS the mom of Rich Girl #1 doing on the show? I don't think anything DP said made it into her thick skull, and I'll bet Mom & Dad will be buying things and going into debt for their spoiled daughter for years and years to come. Sheesh. I kept waiting for DP to suggest she go to work in a battered women's shelter or soup kitchen or something. That whole segment was just SO f'ed up.

I must admit that I was a total material girl myself when I was a young teenager... I loved designer jeans, Izod "alligator" shirts (this was back in the preppy 80s), etc. Of course, my parents, NOT BEING INSANE, were not inclined to shower me with cash and luxury goods. When I finally did get those Gloria Vanderbilt jeans (on sale!), they meant a lot to me. I certainly didn't develop the "I deserve it" attitude of the girls on the show. And now that I'm an adult, spending my own money, I'm extremely thrifty and $0 in debt. I get along great with my parents, too. If these parents think they're buying love, I fear they're sadly mistaken. The only thing they're really "giving" their kids is a sense of entitlement and unrealistic expectations.

(OT) Hoping for your brother's safe return, maggiegault. (/OT)

It's shows like this that make me shake my head and wonder, "WTF is happening to my generation?" I'm seventeen, like the first and third girl, and I would never even ask, let alone expect, to get super expensive designer clothing and cars and the like. My parents don't have all the money in the world, and unlike these girls featured today, I realize and understand that. Would I like to have nice clothes? Jewelry? A car of my own? Of course I would. We all would. But it doesn't work that way. And for whatever reason, these kids aren't getting that. They don't seem to see that just because one wants something, they don't automatically get it. You have to work to get things in life, kids. There's no way around it, and if they don't see that then they need to grow the fuck up.

ETA: Sorry if this makes no sense, I've had a long day. And hurrah! I'm a Channel Surfer!

Word Infinity.



I'm with you, Maggie! I just got a pair of diamond earrings for my birthday this year. I am 32! There is no way in hell I would have even thought to ask for something real expensive from my parents. (I think I got a Barbie doll I wanted at 11.)

I think I will call my mother and thank her for raising me into a normal human being.

Ugh! That show today was just plain disturbing. What parents like the first ones fail to see is that they are not doing their children any favors by giving them everything they want. They really, really aren't. It may look like it. It may feel like it, but you're just not. Teaching them some real values and what is truly important in this world would be doing a lot better by them.

But, I'm trying to console myself by thinking that I was pretty materialistic when I was a teen and did grow out of it. All of a sudden, it was like I'd been smacked in the head and none of that stuff seemed to matter at all anymore, so maybe there's hope ... :)

Delurking to say
WORD. You can't let commercial-laden mass media raise your kids and then expect them to be immune to its effects. That's why it's parents' job to say "NO." As in, "No, you can't have those jeans that so-and-so wore in that movie." As in, "No, you can't have the car that so-and-so drove in that movie."

Hell, I watched a ton of TV as a kid (still do, when I can), but when I was a kid my parents taught me the majorly important difference between wanting things and needing things. I always had everything I needed. The sad thing is, the kids on today's show don't; they need parents who will act like parents and set some damn limits.

Oh, and maggiegault, here's hoping all good things for your brother and everyone else serving overseas (Don't think that we don't know/Don't think that we're not trying/Don't think we move too slow/It's no use after crying/Saying it's a mistake)

I actually felt sorry for the girls on the show today, because I doubt that they will ever be happy if all they focus on is more and more stuff. That said, spoiled girl #1 was a bitch. If my parents gave all that kind of stuff when I was her age you can bet that I would be damn greatful, and the thing about it was she totally blamed her parents for her being a brat. Her attitude was I'm a little bitch who gets whatever she wants, but it's my parents fault for buying it and not telling me it was causing them to go into debt. She wrecked a mustang and got a new one one week later. WTF!!!! Her parents honestly do need some therapy. I wanted Doc to just slap them all. It was ridiculous. I am so glad I didn't grow up like that, I may not have a closet full of designer clothes, but I bet I'm a lot happier with what I have than those girls could ever be. [OT]God bless your brother and all of our soldiers maggiegault he is in my prayers.

maggiegault, I am praying for your brother's safe return. When it gets to be too much, turn off the news. It is so negative and biased, it makes it sound like all hell is breaking loose over there, and while it is super serious, I still have faith that our military knows what it is doing. He will be OK.

I felt like DP was being too soft on the families on the show today. I am a firm believer in quality but not paying out the wazoo for it. TJ Maxx, etc. is a great place for this. These people were equating a price tag with worth. I am lucky to have a nice house that people compliment me on- I love to interior decorate- but most of our furniture has come from a factory store. Do people know that we did not order it from Pottery Barn? Hell, no. Our 1500.00 bedroom set was featured in a Havertys foldout for 5 grand, and that made me so friggin happy. Why aren't these "Hard Working" parents teaching their kids the value of a buck?

Maybe it is because I grew up amidst the consummerism of the 80s when if you did not have a credit card you were not normal. Debt was good. I believed that until I saw where it got my parents. In a financial mess. I am now a loyal follower of Dave Ramsey, and I wish I could tell those snot nosed punks that debt free feels a hell of alot better than that Fendi bag. Trust me, I know.

You know, I don't think its really a generational thing so much as a some-people-are-stupid thing. If DP's pervious incarnation had a talk show a hundred years ago, it would be Niles and Harriet Olson talking about how much they've spoiled Nellie and Willie. There have always been awful parents and good ones in the world, just now a days the bad ones get to go on tv in the name of psuedo therapy so that we can all point and ralf at them.

Maggiegualt- adding your brother to the prayer list of service men and women we know of over there. God bless your family.

That's what today's show was all about; it was a freak show, like the 600 pound woman. Dr. Phil really didn't give the parents any advice. The whole show could've taken 30 seconds:

Parent: Dr. Phil, my daughter is so spoiled! What shall I do?
Phil: Stop spoiling them!

Gee, thanks, Dr. Phil. I guess seeing these brats makes us all feel better that we weren't raised that way, or aren't raising our children that way.

I loved how the second Mom kept trying to shift the blame to "popular culture" and "the media" as if she had nothing to do with raising a materialistic little label whore. Your child is 11. You still control her access to the media. Stop shopping so much, and start taking your little princess to a soup kitchen or something. Damn.

I'm reminded of Christmases and birthdays when I was a kid, when after all the presents were opened, and I was in the midst of my sugar induced haze my folks would tell me, "OK, now pick out three things that you'd be willing to give up for charity."

My friends thought it was harsh of my parents to do this, but I'd been taught from an early age that there were kids out there with a helluva lot less than what I had, and it got to a point that I actually looked forward to picking things out to donate. Would I give up my absolute favorite things? Absolutely not, I wasn't that good of a kid, but I didn't have a problem with giving some of it up either.

How much do you want to bet that this is a concept that these parents have never thought of? And even if they had, they'd never want to make their spoiled brats give up anything that they didn't want to.

It's shows like this that just reinforce how happy I am that I got my tubes tied.

And maggie, I'll keep your brother, and all my brothers and sisters over there in my thoughts. Trust me, they're never far away...

Glad I'm not the only one who's blood pressure was rising during this mess! I kept hearing the oompa loompa song all through this show. I loved the audience members' faces - sheer disbelief.

A huge thank you to all you fine parents out there. As a teacher, I had parents just like these yahoos. One woman told m her 9-year old wouldn't do homework because when she told him to turn the TV off, he wouldn't. What do I say to that?

Someone mentioned upthread about the "entitlement" issues. Values? Humanity? Common sense? Bueller? Anyone?

argh.

ETA agree with masked_spangler. I'm kind of anti-Gameboy, so both my kids had to buy their own. They knew I wouldn't buy it, no matter how badly they wanted them. They knew I'd let Santa know he couldn't bring them either. It took my 8-year old a long time, and all his birthday and Christmas money to do it, and now, when he wants something else, he knows it will have to wait until he "raises" more funds. I wasn't thrilled about how they spent their money, but it was theirs to spend, and they made their own decisions.

I was a bit surprised Dr Shild id not try to make a connection with this kids on the connection between work and things. I know that as a kid it was very instructive for me to finally make the connection between one night of babysitting equalling two paperback novels, which was my big spendthrift weakness in high school. Makes you think about whether two more sweet valley highs is really worth 6 hours with your little cousins.

Oh yeah, Masked Spangler - I used to spend all my baby sitting money on magazines. Seventeen was a big glossy, thick thing back then just chock full of the "good grooming tips" and "what boys like" information I needed to have in order to become the femme fatale I am today. Diamond earrings were something the guy bought for you after you took his breath away with your shiny, lemon rinsed hair.

Maggie, thoughts and prayers for your brother - and hope that all our soliders and their families know that being anti-war or anti-Bush doesn't mean being anti-soldier.

I simply could not believe those kids today, but even more I couldn't believe their parents. Like someone upthread said, we always had everything we needed growing up and truthfully, we had many things we wanted, too, but Mom and Dad didn't just open the wallets and tell us to go to town. We also learned what was a reasonable request. At 11, I would know that a Barbie or a record or a game or a book was a reasonable request for Christmas - Tiffany diamond earrings, no way in hell would I have even asked and if I had, I would have been greeted with laughter! We got an allowance, but it was dependent on our doing chores and keeping our grades up (definitely higher than a C) and we had to use that for most of our purchases, which taught us the value of a dollar and about budgeting. I think a big problem is that kids today don't understand that wanting something doesn't immediately lead to getting it. In 1980, my first car was the 1970 Buick Estate Wagon that my parents had put about 200,000 miles on - and even then, it wasn't really my car and so my parents would have taken the keys if my grades fell or I got a 'tude. It was affectionately nicknamed by my brother and cousin the Grossmobile because it was a seriously fugly automobile. Oh, and the radio didn't even work. However, as the other choice for getting around would be riding the school bus or walking, although I really wanted a camaro or a corvette, I was damned glad to have the Grossmobile and didn't bitch about it. And, if I had wrecked the Grossmobile (nearly impossible as that thing was a tank), I would be back to riding the bus and walking.

These parents are so insane to indulge their children's every whim. What happens when the kid moves out and the only job they can get, even with that design degree, is a minimum wage job. If they have those fancy tastes they are either (a) not going to pay boring bills like the rent so they can have indulge themselves, (b) going to run up ginormous credit card debt which will haunt them for years, or © expect mom and dad to continue to support them in the style to which they have become accustomed. How many mortages can they take out to finance their kids oppulent lifestyles? And why do they not have a problem with their kids wanting to be Paris, Nicole or Jessica and taking it to the point of acting like them? If my daughter wanted to be like one of those bimbos, I'd be scheduling an intervention.

The older I get, the more I thank God that my mom had the cajones to be a mom and demand/earn my respect instead of trying to be my bestest friend and buy my affection.

SiameseCatLady,

Heh, I'd be scheduling a lobotomy.

tallulahbabe a lobotomy would turn your kid INTO Jessica or Nicole...

God bless and protect maggiegault's brother!

So glad to see a lot of posters had some good money sense instilled in them ! It seems that a lot of our parents, whom I'm certain would've given us the world if possible, really empowered us in withholding trinket of the week, week after week-and I'm sure we were all a loud bunch!

I agree with the posters lamenting the anticlimactic adulthood that follows a "stuff" laden childhood. What is there to aspire to, to look forward to?

I think that might have been what got those twits in that state to begin with!

My first car cost $5000, half was money I had saved up from when I was as young as 12 and the other half was a "reward" from my parents for saving that money. With that reward came something else. My parents sat me down and said "You're 16, you have your own car so you have no reason not to be working now. Now that you can work, and get yourself to work, we won't be buying you anything else.". Food and shelter, that was pretty much it. (Christmas and birthdays still brought presents of course.) I had to buy all my own clothes, make up and even things like shampoo and stuff. (I had expensive tastes at the time.) Back then I thought it was harsh but now I'm glad my parents did it. When I moved out at age 19 I knew the value of a dollar and I knew how to budget.

I was just thinking back to one of the best presents my brother and I ever got for Christmas. My parents put together a big "Make-Believe Box" filled with dress up clothes and stuff for us to play "office" or "grocery store" or all kinds of stuff with. Looking back now I bet the whole thing cost less than $20 but we loved that box! We added to it and played with it for years. This was during the "spend crazy" 80's but somehow my parents managed to keep up from getting caught up in that. How did they do it? Hard to say but I do know this: My kids will be getting "Make-Believe Boxes" and not diamond earrings for Christmas not matter how much money I find myself having.

ETA: Opps marillion, great minds think alike!

timeonmyhands LOVE the Make Believe Box gift! I remember playing grocery store, too!

Goes to show these unchallenged kids don't need trinkets, they need tools to stimulate their bored brains!

Speaking of spoiling, do you all think DP is spoiling Jay by letting him come on his show and give advice? I really don't "mind" Jay that much, but I hate that smirky look he has in the opening credits (I'm certain this has been mentioned upthread, so I apologize).

Lurker coming out from the shadows here.

Now, I’m not a therapist nor do I play one on TV (*snerk*), but I was shocked that DP said absolutely nothing about just how wrong it is to aspire to be a person like Paris Hilton (he actually condoned it by saying “a lot of girls do”). I’d understand if she said something like “Golly, it’d sure be neat to be Paris Hilton for a day/week!”, but to actually aspire to be her?

Why didn’t DP bring up the fact that her job is basically to sit around and wait for Daddy (or whoever it is) to kick the bucket so she can inherit his money (now, I may be wrong here, she may have a job - my knowledge of Paris Hilton’s biography is not up to scratch)? Why didn’t DP bring up the fact that she must have some serious self-esteem issues, seeing as she does nothing but try to seek out attention (both positive and negative) from the media? Does she actually have a reason to get up in the morning? Despite Paris Hilton’s enormous fame, how many people would actually care if she dropped off the face of the earth tomorrow? Is that really the life this girl wants?

I’m the same age as that girl, and I couldn’t imagine living like Paris Hilton for the rest of my life. Hell, even the most materialistic, shallow party girls in my class have some sort of actual career aspirations. Yeah, it’d be nice to never have to worry about money or anything but I couldn’t live my life knowing that my only purpose on the planet is to a) provide gossip fodder for tabloid columnists and b) make people laugh at my expense. As for Nicky Hilton getting rich designing purses? Why didn’t DP tell her that Nicky didn’t get rich designing purses? Nicky Hilton was already loaded, she just designs purses, I'm assuming, because it's something she enjoys doing.

I know someone who designs purses. I think they’re really cool, and that she should be getting rich off them. But she’s not. She gets up at 4:30 every Saturday morning to sell her purses and other things at the local market. On a good day, she sells four of them. On top of that, she has two housekeeping/babysitting jobs and she runs a small cleaning business with her husband. Even though they both work so hard every single day, they still just live in a small apartment. That’s the reality of the design business. But despite having little in terms of material possessions, the people in this family are among the happiest people I’ve ever met because they love what they do. They don’t need the money to make them happy. I don't think that the girl on the show left with the idea that designing purses does not equal instant bling/status/fame.

If that girl on the show today was my friend, while I'd certainly commend her for wanting to get into business (the world can always use more female entrepreneurs) I’d be telling her to snap out of it every single time she brought up being rich like Paris Hilton. Certainly not condone it, a la DP.

But then again, I’m not the one “Ph. D” at the end of my name.

Timeonmyhands, it almost sounds like we were raised by the same parents! Except I saved up for a trip to Germany instead of a car, and took the bus to work instead. Unfortunately, when I moved out, even though my folks had made me save a ton of money, I soon realized that it wasn't enough to pay for college/apartment/transportation, and blew through it in a year. My dad bailed me out once, and only once, and from then on I made sure to be a lot thriftier with the cash flow. Oh, and I got a second job.

The first girl, Leah, part of the problem lies with her dad. He said that whatever she wants, she gets, and that's the way it is going to be until she gets married. Then her husband will have to take care of her. Yeah, good luck with that theory.

The 11 year old was very articulate and should have been acknowledged as knocking Stacy's daughter off the America's Sweetheart throne, for all the gushing Phil did. I bet she goes to a very fine private school with other kids who get whatever they want. This was not addressed, of course. All the fine parenting and avoiding the media can be negated by spending five days a week in an environment of entitlement.

Phil missed a good opportunity when the third girl said she did not need math, because she would hire an accountant to take care of her money. When my mom started to teach me how to clean the house, I balked and said that I didn't need to know how, as I was going to have a maid when I grew up. My very wise mom replied that that was a very good goal, but that I would have to know how to clean as I may have to train the maid and I would also need to know if the maid was doing a good job.

I rolled my eyes when the 11-year-old's mom claimed to be thrifty because she shopped at Lohman's. Had she said she shopped at Wal-Mart, she would've been more believable.

Girl #3 needs to wake up and hit the books right now. C average won't get you into a good college and college doesn't automatically mean rich (especially if you have student loans to pay off after you graduate).

Oy. The first girl's parents deserve everything they get. If they're stupid enough to mortgage their house to spoil their child, it's their own damned fault.

Watch for these parents to be on a future show, lamenting how their 30-year-old children refuse to move out and support themselves.