» 6-15: "Remember When" 2007.04.22 (recap) Options

[marty118]

Would an FBI agent actually have sex with Tony Soprano just to get information?

An FBI informant would, definitely.

An FBI agent might, although I believe that since the late 1980s they've been told not to. (There were a couple of court cases in the 1980s involving women who were government investigators who had affairs with men they later testified against.) CIA agents do, but supposedly not within the US, and Tony's never been a CIA target that I know of.

But again, the simplest thing would be for the FBI to enlist an existing sex worker and use her as an informant.

[TeresaDee]

Chase describes Janice as the only sociopath on the show--I'd have to add Paulie to the list, no conscience whatsoever.

And Tony...on the boat, I felt how it took every ounce of the little self control he has to not wack Paulie. When he looks at the knife--Yikes!

Also...Phil definately called the hit on Doc in my book--Butchie was driving the getaway car.

[SuperDayv]

. I wish we knew if him and his Mom made peace.

When he went and watched TV with her, I took that to mean that they'd made up.

[mauratv]

Man! I have been reading TWOP (and loving it) for years, and I have never felt compelled to register. And then I read this:

I am starting to think that Tony may have the early stages of some type of mental disorder. He was acting so strange this episode. NOTHING HAPPENED. If it weren't the for the fact that I love Paulie and Jun this might qualify as the worst episode ever!

Are you kidding me?

- the Feds are suddenly concerned about a murder that occurred in 1982. Might that indicate that they're getting ready to finally come after Tony?
- Tony *seriously considers* killing Paulie. Paulie!
- Paulie is well aware that this was the case, and wonders cryptically whether he'll "stand up".
- Junior comes back to his senses!
- Junior figures out a way to get out of the hospital, decides against it because he's comfortable, becomes decidedly UNcomfortable, and we last see him brooding with a cat....
- The latest "hair apparent" to the New York boss role is killed.....
- .... presumably by Phil Leotardo!

jeez. what would you need to happen for an episode to be interesting?!?
Sorry the *Russian* didn't come back....

[Chloe1253]

Chase describes Janice as the only sociopath on the show--I'd have to add Paulie to the list, no conscience whatsoever.

And Tony...on the boat, I felt how it took every ounce of the little self control he has to not wack Paulie. When he looks at the knife--Yikes!

Not only the knife, but the axe too. I think he was longingly thinking of the end of Cleaver and visualizing it embedded Paulie's skull. If nothing else, Paulie is really disgusting him.

Paulie is a peculiar person for sure. I remember how he looked on in sympathy and distress when Tony was administering one of the regular and vicious beatings he gave Georgie..or maybe just looking relieved that it wasn't him on the receiving end!

This post has been edited by Chloe1253: Apr 22, 2007 @ 11:13 pm.

[marty118]

Chase describes Janice as the only sociopath on the show--I'd have to add Paulie to the list, no conscience whatsoever.

A sociopath is someone who has no feelings for anyone else, who views other people as objects to be used to further their own desires.

Paulie clearly had real (if weird) feelings for NotMa. He also seems to need to be part of a social group, which Janice does not.

Janice seems to fit the definition pretty clearly:

Sense of entitlement; Unremorseful; Apathetic to others; Unconscionable behavior; Blameful of others; Manipulative and conning; Affectively cold; Disparate understanding; Socially irresponsible; Disregardful of obligations; Nonconforming to norms; Irresponsible

Paulie has some of this, but does not have a cold affect and isn't really "apathetic to others." Even in this episode, Paulie's interactions with the guy in the buffet line and the young women at dinner is not typical of a sociopath. Also it could be argued that his literal fear of the ghosts from his past shows a dormant sense of guilt.

It's also interesting to note that many psychologists distinguish between a sociopath and a psychopath by saying that a psychopath is born that way, where a sociopath is created, usually through poor parenting or childhood abuse.

This post has been edited by marty118: Apr 22, 2007 @ 11:32 pm.

[usmc5855]

I thought the whole episode could be summed up in my friends bumper sticker "Kill your Idols"

The Asian guy being let down by Junior.

Tony starting to fear if Paulie is becoming a liability.

[lstormus]

A member of my immediate family was taken from us this week in the VATech thing, and I debated on whether or not I wanted to watch Sopranos tonight (ultimately I did since I'm a grown man and can realize that this is fiction). I did find the young asian male to be terrifyingly similar to what I envisioned the man who murdered my cousin to be, so it did weird me out for most of the episode. I just kept telling myself that I was overreacting because it's barely been a week, so this is one of those episodes I'll probably have to wait a while to rewatch. I'm sure it was unintentional, just unfortunate timing.

After the fact EDIT: I'm sorry, my main point in this post was to express that my proximity to the tragedy caused me to be oversensitive to the slight similarities between the character in this episode and the person I compared him too.

This post has been edited by lstormus: Apr 24, 2007 @ 11:48 pm.

[Jarret]

There is an old cartoon from about 40 years ago. A King is sitting alone in his throne room, musing to himself: "I know I'm paranoid, but am I paranoid enough?"

Even paranoids have enemies ...

In the words of Dr. Johnny Fever..."When everybody's out to get you, paranoia is just good thinking!"

[usmc5855]

did find the young asian male to be terrifyingly similar to what I envisioned the man who murdered my cousin to be,

I am very sorry for your loss, and glad you have an outlet for your grief.

Although shockingly similar, reading accounts of the actual VT attacker the character on the Sopranos is only similar in regards to being Asian.

I do wonder if there was some discussion at HBO in regards to editing chages in to soften the portrayal.

This post has been edited by usmc5855: Apr 22, 2007 @ 11:26 pm.

[Uncool]

Tonight there was the parallel stories of Tony and Paulie vs. "Anthony" and Junior.

Rudolf, your analysis really helped me. I kept trying to find the larger connection between the two stories.

[rudolf]

lstormus, please accept my and I'm sure everyone else's condolences concerning your cousin. I'm not sure you're overreacting. I think most of us, even with no direct link to the horrific shootings, felt a little uncomfortable watching tonight. Whether fiction or not it was reminiscent enough of what happened to serve as a memory cue for an event that is probably hard to stop thinking about even without direct reminders. Again, sorry for your loss.

This post has been edited by rudolf: Apr 22, 2007 @ 11:35 pm.

[CasualWatcher9]

Would an FBI agent actually have sex with Tony Soprano just to get information?

This is why I date FBI agents exclusively.

They are curious by nature...

[DuckyinKy]

I have never put my hands up to my mouth and shit my knickers over simply tossing a can at someone. I don't think I took one breath while they were on the boat.

Yeah, Paulie is getting to be your typical old guy - talks non stop, to every one who comes along. Seeing him on the edge of the bed watching and laughing at the TV just struck me as very childlike. Paulie will never flip though, it's in the contract.

I remember the young Asian from Rush Hour.

[mauratv]

Istormus, I am so sorry for your loss. It has actually been heartening for me to see that other people have mentioned the "unfortunate timing" of the episode, because that is the same thought I had while I was watching (although I didn't say it aloud at the time). As a general comment, I think that you (and other viewers) had that reaction because we live in a racist society (not because you, or I, or any particular individual is racist) and as a result, even though we tuned in specifically to watch a show about aggressive men... we were surprised to see an aggressive *asian* man. Which is unfortunate. It's unfortunate that we were surprised because of the events of this week, it's unfortunate that we were surprised at all.
Again, it's no one's fault, but I'm sorry that your hour of escapism was spoiled.